Head to Head: Mizuno MP-5, PXG 0311T and Titleist 716 AP2 irons
A few months ago, GolfWRX Members voted for the three irons they most wanted to see tested head-to-head. The winners were: PXG 0311T, Mizuno MP-5 and Titleist 716 AP2. Today, the results of my test are in.
I do a lot of these head-to-head equipment test videos on my YouTube Channel, but for this video I stepped it up. Each of the three irons were tested with the same shafts of the exact same length, and all the clubs had the same grips, lofts, lies and swing weights, courtesy of Tour X Golf fitters.
Make sure to watch the video and vote for the three irons you want to see me test in my next video. As always, post your comments and questions below.
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19th Hole
Vincenzi’s 2024 PGA Championship betting preview: Rising star ready to join the immortals at Valhalla
The second major of the 2024 season is upon us as the world’s best players will tee it up this week at Valhalla Golf Club in Louisville, Kentucky to compete for the Wanamaker Trophy.
The last time we saw Valhalla host a major championship, Rory McIlroy fended off Phil Mickelson, Henrik Stenson, Rickie Fowler and the creeping darkness that was descending upon the golf course. The Northern Irishman had the golf world in the palm of his hand, joining only Tiger Woods and Jack Nicklaus as players who’d won four major championships by the time they were 25 years old.
Valhalla is named after the great hall described in Norse mythology where the souls of Vikings feasted and celebrated with the Gods. The course is a Jack Nicklaus-design that has ranked among Golf Digest’s “America’s 100 Greatest Courses” for three decades.
Valhalla Golf Club is a par-71 measuring 7,542 yards with Zoysia fairways and Bentgrass greens. The course has rolling hills and dangerous streams scattered throughout and the signature 13th hole is picturesque with limestone and unique bunkering protecting the green. The 2024 PGA Championship will mark the fourth time Valhalla has hosted the event.
The field this week will consist of 156 players, including 16 PGA Champions and 33 Major Champions.
Past Winners of the PGA Championship
- 2023: Brooks Koepka (-9) Oak Hill
- 2022: Justin Thomas (-5) Southern Hills
- 2021: Phil Mickelson (-6) Kiawah Island
- 2020: Collin Morikawa (-13) TPC Harding Park
- 2019: Brooks Koepka (-8) Bethpage Black
- 2018: Brooks Koepka (-16) Bellerive
- 2017: Justin Thomas (-8) Quail Hollow
- 2016: Jimmy Walker (-14) Baltusrol
- 2015: Jason Day (-20) Whistling Straits
- 2014: Rory McIlroy (-16) Valhalla
In this article and going forward, I’ll be using the Rabbit Hole by Betsperts Golf data engine to develop my custom model. If you want to build your own model or check out all of the detailed stats, you can sign up using promo code: MATTVIN for 25% off any subscription package (yearly is best value).
Key Stats For Valhalla
Let’s take a look at five key metrics for Oak Hill to determine which golfers boast top marks in each category over their past 24 rounds.
1. Strokes Gained: Approach
Valhalla will play as a true all-around test of golf for the world’s best. Of course, it will take strong approach play to win a major championship.
Strokes Gained: Approach Over Past 24 Rounds
- Shane Lowry (+1.25)
- Scottie Scheffler (+1.09)
- Jordan Smith (+1.05)
- Tom Hoge (+.96)
- Corey Conners (+.94)
2. Strokes Gained: Off the Tee
Valhalla will play long and the rough will be penal. Players who are incredibly short off the tee and/or have a hard time hitting fairways will be all but eliminated from contention this week at the PGA Championship.
Strokes Gained: Off the Tee Over Past 24 Rounds:
- Bryson DeChambeau (+1.47)
- Scottie Scheffler (+1.11)
- Keith Mitchell (+.90)
- Alejandro Tosti (+.89)
- Ludvig Aberg (+.82)
Strokes Gained: Total on Nickalus Designs
Valhalla is a classic Nicklaus Design. Players who play well at Nicklaus designs should have an advantage coming into this major championship.
Strokes Gained: Total on Nicklaus Designs over past 36 rounds:
- Jon Rahm (+2.56)
- Scottie Scheffler (+2.48)
- Patrick Cantlay (+2.35)
- Collin Morikawa (+1.79)
- Shane Lowry (+1.57)
Strokes Gained: Tee to Green on Very Long Courses
Valhalla is going to play extremely long this week. Players who have had success playing very long golf courses should be better equipped to handle the conditions of this major championship.
Strokes Gained: Total on Very Long Courses Over Past 24 Rounds:
- Scottie Scheffler (+2.44)
- Rory McIlroy (+2.24)
- Will Zalatoris (+1.78)
- Viktor Hovland (+1.69)
- Xander Schauffele (+1.60)
Strokes Gained: Total in Major Championships
One factor that tends to play a large role in deciding major championships is which players have played well in previous majors leading up to the event.
Strokes Gained: Total in Major Championships over past 20 rounds:
- Scottie Scheffler (+3.14)
- Will Zalatoris (+2.64)
- Rory McIlroy (+2.49)
- Xander Schauffele (+2.48)
- Tommy Fleetwood (2.09)
Strokes Gained: Putting on Bentgrass Greens
Valhalla features pure Bentgrass putting surfaces. Players who are comfortable putting on this surface will have an advantage on the greens.
Strokes Gained: Putting on Bentgrass Greens over Past 24 Rounds:
- Ludvig Aberg (+1.12)
- Denny McCarthy (+1.08)
- Matt Fitzpatrick (+0.99)
- Justin Rose (+0.93)
- J.T. Poston (0.87)
Strokes Gained: Total on Zoysia Fairways
Valhalla features Zoysia fairways. Players who are comfortable playing on this surface will have an advantage on the field.
Strokes Gained: Total on Zoysia Fairways over past 36 rounds:
- Justin Thomas (+1.53)
- Will Zalatoris (+1.47)
- Xander Schauffele (+1.40)
- Brooks Koepka (+1.35)
- Rory McIlroy (+1.23)
2024 PGA Championship Model Rankings
Below, I’ve compiled overall model rankings using a combination of the key statistical categories previously discussed — SG: Approach (25%), SG: Off the Tee (22%), SG: T2G on Very Long Courses (12%), SG: Putting on Bentgrass (+12%), SG: Total on Nicklaus Designs (12%). SG: Total on Zoysia Fairways (8%), and SG: Total in Major Championships (8%).
- Brooks Koepka
- Xander Schauffele
- Rory McIlroy
- Scottie Scheffler
- Bryson DeChambeau
- Shane Lowry
- Alex Noren
- Will Zalatoris
- Cameron Young
- Keith Mitchell
- Hideki Matsuyama
- Billy Horschel
- Patrick Cantlay
- Viktor Hovland
- Adam Schenk
- Chris Kirk
- Sahith Theegala
- Min Woo Lee
- Joaquin Niemann
- Justin Thomas
2024 PGA Championship Picks
Ludvig Aberg +1800 (BetMGM)
At The Masters, Ludvig Aberg announced to the golf world that he’s no longer an “up and coming” player. He’s one of the best players in the game of golf, regardless of experience.
Augusta National gave Aberg some necessary scar tissue and showed him what being in contention at a major championship felt like down the stretch. Unsurprisingly, he made a costly mistake, hitting it in the water left of the 11th hole, but showed his resilience by immediately bouncing back. He went on to birdie two of his next three holes and finished in solo second by three shots. With the type of demeanor that remains cool in pressure situations, I believe Ludvig has the right mental game to win a major at this point in his career.
Aberg has not finished outside of the top-25 in his past eight starts, which includes two runner-up finishes at both a “Signature Event” and a major championship. The 24-year-old is absolutely dominant with his driver, which will give him a major advantage this week. In the field he ranks, in Strokes Gained: Off the Tee, and has gained strokes in the category in each of his past ten starts. Aberg is already one of the best drivers of the golf ball on the planet.
In Norse mythology, Valhalla is the great hall where the souls of Vikings feasted and celebrated with the Gods. The Swedes, who are of Old Norse origin, were the last of the three Scandinavian Kingdoms to abandon the Old Norse Gods. A Swede played a major role in the 2014 PGA Championship at Valhalla, and I believe another, Ludvig Aberg, will be the one to conquer Valhalla in 2024.
Bryson DeChambeau +2800 (BetMGM)
Bryson DeChambeau is one of the few players in the world that I believe has the game to go blow-for-blow with Scottie Scheffler. Although he isn’t as consistent as Scheffler, when he’s at his best, Bryson has the talent to beat him.
At The Masters, DeChambeau put forth a valiant effort at a golf course that simply does not suit his game. Valhalla, on the other hand, is a course that should be perfect for the 30-year-old. His ability to overpower a golf course with his driver will be a serious weapon this week.
Bryson has had some success at Jack Nicklaus designs throughout his career as he won the Memorial at Muirfield Village back in 2018. He’s also had incredible results on Bentgrass greens for the entirety of his professional career. Of his 10 wins, nine of them have come on Bentgrass greens, with the only exception being the Arnold Palmer Invitational at Bay Hill. He also has second place finishes at Medinah and TPC Summerlin, which feature Bentgrass greens.
Love him or hate him, it’s impossible to argue that Bryson isn’t one of the most exciting and important players in the game of golf. He’s also one of the best players in the world. A second major is coming soon for DeChambeau, and I believe he should be amongst the favorites to hoist the Wanamaker Trophy this week.
Patrick Cantlay +4000 (FanDuel)
There’s no way of getting around it: Patrick Cantlay has been dissapointing in major championships throughout his professional career. He’s been one of the top players on Tour for a handful of years and has yet to truly contend at a major championship, with the arguable exception of the 2019 Masters.
Despite not winning majors, Cantlay has won some big events. The 32-year-old has won two BMW Championships, two Memorial Tournaments as well as a Tour Championship. His victories at Memorial indicate how much Cantlay loves Nicklaus designs, where he ranks 3rd in the field in Strokes Gained: Total over his past 36 rounds behind only Scottie Scheffler and Jon Rahm.
Cantlay also loves Bentgrass greens. Six of Cantlay’s seven individual wins on the PGA Tour have come on Bentgrass greens and he also was one of the best putters at the 2023 Ryder cup at Marco Simone (also Bentgrass). At Caves Valley (2021 BMW Championship), he gained over 12 strokes putting to outduel another Bentgrass specialist, Bryson DeChambeau.
Cantlay finished 22nd in The Masters, which was a solid result considering how many elite players struggled that week. He also has two top-ten finishes in his past five PGA Championships. He’s undeniably one of the best players in the field, therefore, it comes down to believing Cantlay has the mental fortitude to win a major, which I do.
Joaquin Niemann +4000 (BetMGM)
I believe Joaquin Niemann is one of the best players in the world. He has three worldwide wins since December and has continued to improve over the course of his impressive career thus far. Still only 25, the Chilean has all the tools to be a serious contender in major championships for years to come.
Niemann has been the best player on LIV this season. Plenty will argue with the format or source of the money on LIV, but no one can argue that beating players such as Jon Rahm, Bryson DeChambeau, Dustin Johnson, Brooks Koepka and Cameron Smith is an unremarkable achievement. Niemann is an elite driver of the golf ball who hits it farther than just about anyone in the field not named Bryson DeChambeau or (arguably) Rory McIlroy.
Niemann is another player who has been fantastic throughout his career on Bentgrass greens. Prior to leaving the PGA Tour, Bentgrass was the only green surface in which Joaco was a positive putter. It’s clearly a surface that he is very comfortable putting on and should fare around and on the greens this week.
Niemann is a perfect fit for Valhalla. His low and penetrating ball flight will get him plenty of runout this week on the fairways and he should have shorter shots into the green complexes than his competitors. To this point in his career, the former top ranked amateur in the world (2018) has been underwhelming in major championships, but I don’t believe that will last much longer. Joaquin Niemann is a major championship caliber player and has a real chance to contend this week at Valhalla.
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In my last post, I explained the basic performance dynamics of “smash factor” and “gear effect” as they apply to your wedges and your wedge play success. If you missed that post, you can read it here.
At the end of that post, I promised “part 2” of this discussion of what makes a wedge work the way it does. So, let’s dive into the other two components of any wedge – the shaft and the grip.
It’s long been said that the shaft is “the engine of the golf club.” The shaft (and grip) are your only connection to all the technologies that are packed into the head of any golf club, whether it be a driver, fairway, hybrid, iron, wedge or even putter.
And you cannot ignore those two components of your wedges if your goal is optimizing your performance.
I’ve long been an advocate of what I call a “seamless transition” from your irons into your wedges, so that the feel and performance do not disconnect when you choose a gap wedge, for example, instead of your iron-set-matching “P-club.” In today’s golf equipment marketplace, more and more golfers are making the investment of time and money to experience an iron fitting, going through trial and error and launch monitor measuring to get just the right shaft in their irons.
But then so many of those same golfers just go into a store and choose wedges off the retail display, with no similar science involved at all. And that’s why I see so many golfers with a huge disconnect between their custom-fitted irons, often with lighter and/or softer graphite or light steel shafts . . . and their off-the-rack wedges with the stock stiff steel ‘wedge flex’ shaft common to those stock offerings.
If your wedge shafts are significantly heavier and stiffer than the shafts in your irons, it is physically impossible for you to make the same swing. Period.
To quickly improve your wedge play, one of the first things you can do is have your wedges re-shafted with the same or similar shaft that is in your irons.
There’s another side of that shaft weight equation; if you don’t have the forearm and hand strength of a PGA Tour professional, you simply cannot “handle” the same weight shaft that those guys play to master the myriad of ‘touch shots’ around the greens.
Now, let’s move on to the third and other key component of your wedges – the grips. If those are not similar in shape and feel to the grips on your irons, you have another disconnect. Have your grips checked by a qualified golf club professionals to make sure you are in sync there.
The one caveat to that advice is that I am a proponent of a reduced taper in your wedge grips – putting two to four more layers of tape under the lower hand, or selecting one of the many reduced taper grips on the market. That accomplishes two goals for your scoring.
First, it helps reduce overactive hands in your full and near-full wedge swings. Quiet hands are key to good wedge shots.
And secondly, it provides a more consistent feel of the wedge in your hands as you grip down for those shorter and more delicate shots around the greens. And you should always grip down as you get into those touch shots. I call it “getting closer to your work.”
So, if you will spend as much time selecting the shafts and grips for your wedges as you do choosing the brand, model, and loft of them, your scoring range performance will get better.
More from the Wedge Guy
- The Wedge Guy: What really makes a wedge work? Part 1
- The Wedge Guy: The easiest-to-learn golf basic
- The Wedge Guy: Golf mastery begins with your wedge game
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19th Hole
Vincenzi’s 2024 Wells Fargo Championship betting preview: Tommy Fleetwood ready to finally land maiden PGA Tour title
The PGA Tour season ramps back up this week for another “signature event,” as golf fans look forward to the year’s second major championship next week.
After two weaker-field events in the Zurich Classic and the CJ Cup Byron Nelson, most of the best players in the world will head to historic Quail Hollow for one of the best non-major tournaments of the year.
Last season, Wyndham Clark won the event by four shots.
Quail Hollow is a par-71 measuring 7,521 yards that features Bermudagrass greens. The tree-lined, parkland style course can play quite difficult and features one of the most difficult three-hole stretches in golf known as “The Green Mile,” which makes up holes 16-18: two mammoth par 4s and a 221-yard par 3. All three holes have an average score over par, and water is in play in each of the last five holes on the course.
The field is excellent this week with 68 golfers teeing it up without a cut. All of the golfers who’ve qualified are set to tee it up, with the exception of Scottie Scheffler, who is expecting the birth of his first child.
Past Winners at Quail Hollow
- 2023: Wyndham Clark (-19)
- 2022: Max Homa (-8)
- 2021: Rory McIlroy (-10)
- 2019: Max Homa (-15)
- 2018: Jason Day (-12)
- 2017: Justin Thomas (-8) (PGA Championship)
- 2016: James Hahn (-9)
- 2015: Rory McIlroy (-21)
Key Stats For Quail Hollow
Strokes Gained: Approach
Strokes gained: Approach will be extremely important this week as second shots at Quail Hollow can be very difficult.
Total SG: Approach Over Past 24 Rounds
- Akshay Bhatia (+1.16)
- Tom Hoge (+1.12)
- Corey Conners (+1.01)
- Shane Lowry (+0.93)
- Austin Eckroat (+0.82)
Strokes Gained: Off the Tee
Quail Hollow is a long course on which it is important to play from the fairway. Both distance and accuracy are important, as shorter tee shots will result in approach shots from 200 or more yards. With most of the holes heavily tree lined, errant drives will create some real trouble for the players.
Strokes Gained: Off the Tee Past 24 Rounds:
- Ludvig Aberg (+0.73)
- Rory McIlroy (+0.69)
- Xander Schauffele (+0.62)
- Viktor Hovland (+0.58)
- Chris Kirk (+0.52)
Proximity: 175-200
The 175-200 range is key at Quail Hollow. Players who can hit their long irons well will rise to the top of the leaderboard.
Proximity: 175-200+ over past 24 rounds:
- Cameron Young (28’2″)
- Akshay Bhatia (29’6″)
- Ludvig Aberg (+30’6″)
- Sam Burns (+30’6″)
- Collin Morikawa (+30’9″)
SG: Total on Tom Fazio Designs
Players who thrive on Tom Fazio designs get a bump for me at Quail Hollow this week.
SG: Total on Tom Fazio Designs over past 36 rounds:
- Patrick Cantlay (+2.10)
- Rory McIlroy (+1.95)
- Tommy Fleetwood (+1.68)
- Austin Eckroat (+1.60)
- Will Zalatoris (+1.57)
Strokes Gained: Putting (Bermudagrass)
Strokes Gained: Putting has historically graded out as the most important statistic at Quail Hollow. While it isn’t always predictable, I do want to have it in the model to bump up golfers who prefer to putt on Bermudagrass.
Strokes Gained: Putting (Bermudagrass) Over Past 24 Rounds:
- Taylor Moore (+0.82)
- Nick Dunlap (+.76)
- Wyndham Clark (+.69)
- Emiliano Grillo (+.64)
- Cam Davis (+.61)
Course History
This stat will incorporate players that have played well in the past at Quail Hollow.
Course History over past 36 rounds (per round):
- Rory McIlroy (+2.50)
- Justin Thomas (+1.96)
- Jason Day (+1.92)
- Rickie Fowler (+1.83)
- Viktor Hovland (+1.78)
Wells Fargo Championship Model Rankings
Below, I’ve compiled overall model rankings using a combination of the five key statistical categories previously discussed — SG: Approach (27%), SG: Off the Tee (23%), SG: Total on Fazio designs (12%), Proximity: 175-200 (12%), SG: Putting Bermuda grass (12%), and Course History (14%).
- Wyndham Clark
- Rory McIlroy
- Xander Schauffele
- Shane Lowry
- Hideki Matsuyama
- Viktor Hovland
- Cameron Young
- Austin Eckroat
- Byeong Hun An
- Justin Thomas
2024 Wells Fargo Championship Picks
Tommy Fleetwood +2500 (DraftKings)
I know many out there have Tommy fatigue when it comes to betting, which is completely understandable given his lack of ability to win on the PGA Tour thus far in his career. However, history has shown us that players with Fleetwood’s talent eventually break though, and I believe for Tommy, it’s just a matter of time.
Fleetwood has been excellent on Tom Fazio designs. Over his past 36 rounds, he ranks 3rd in the field in Strokes Gained: Total on Fazio tracks. He’s also been incredibly reliable off the tee this season. He’s gained strokes in the category in eight of his past nine starts, including at The Masters, the PLAYERS and the three “signature events” of the season. Tommy is a golfer built for tougher courses and can grind it out in difficult conditions.
Last year, Fleetwood was the first-round leader at this event, firing a Thursday 65. He finished the event in a tie for 5th place.
For those worried about Fleetwood’s disappointing start his last time out at Harbour Town, he’s bounced back nicely after plenty of poor outings this season. His T7 at the Valero Texas Open was after a MC and T35 in his prior two starts and his win at the Dubai Invitational came after a T47 at the Sentry.
I expect Tommy to bounce back this week and contend at Quail Hollow.
Justin Thomas +3000 (DraftKings)
It’s been a rough couple of years for Justin Thomas, but I don’t believe things are quite as bad as they seem for JT. He got caught in the bad side of the draw at Augusta for last month’s Masters and has gained strokes on approach in seven of his nine starts in 2024.
Thomas may have found something in his most recent start at the RBC Heritage. He finished T5 at a course that he isn’t the best fit for on paper. He also finally got the putter working and ranked 15th in Strokes Gained: Putting for the week.
The two-time PGA champion captured the first of his two major championships at Quail Hollow back in 2017, and some good vibes from the course may be enough to get JT out of his slump.
Thomas hasn’t won an event in just about two years. However, I still believe that will change soon as he’s been one of the most prolific winners throughout his PGA Tour career. Since 2015, he has 15 PGA Tour wins.
Course history is pretty sticky at Quail Hollow, with players who like the course playing well there on a regular basis. In addition to JT’s PGA Championship win in 2017, he went 4-1 at the 2022 Presidents Cup and finished T14 at the event last year despite being in poor form. Thomas can return as one of the top players on the PGA Tour with a win at a “signature event” this week.
Cameron Young +3500 (DraftKings)
For many golf bettors, it’s been frustrating backing Cam Young this season. His talent is undeniable, and one of the best and most consistent performers on the PGA Tour. He just hasn’t broken through with a victory yet. Quail Hollow has been a great place for elite players to get their first victory. Rory McIlroy, Anthony Kim, Rickie Fowler and Wyndham Clark all notched their first PGA Tour win at Quail.
Throughout Cam Young’s career, he has thrived at tougher courses with strong fields. This season, he finished T16 at Riviera and T9 at Augusta National, demonstrating his preference of a tough test. His ability to hit the ball long and straight off the tee make him an ideal fit for Quail Hollow, despite playing pretty poorly his first time out in 2023 (T59). Young should be comfortable playing in the region as he played his college golf at Wake Forest, which is about an hour’s drive from Quail Hollow.
The 26-year-old has played well at Tom Fazio designs in the past and ranks 8th in the field in Strokes Gained: Total on those courses in his last 36 rounds. Perhaps most importantly, this season, Young is the best player on the PGA Tour in terms of proximity from 175-200 in the fairway, which is where a plurality and many crucial shots will come from this week.
Young is an elite talent and Quail Hollow has been kind to players of his ilk who’ve yet to win on Tour.
Byeong Hun An +5000 (FanDuel)
Byeong Hun An missed some opportunities last weekend at the CJ Cup Byron Nelson. He finished T4 and played some outstanding golf, but a couple of missed short putts prevented him from getting to the winning score of -23. Despite not getting the win, it’s hard to view An’s performance as anything other than an overwhelming success. It was An’s fourth top-ten finish of the season.
Last week, An gained 6.5 strokes ball striking, which was 7th in the field. He also ranked 12th for Strokes Gained: Approach and 13th for Strokes Gained: Off the Tee. The South Korean has been hitting the ball so well from tee to green all season long and he now heads to a golf course that should reward his precision.
An’s driver and long irons are absolute weapons. At Quail Hollow, players will see plenty of approach shots from the 175-200 range as well as some from 200+. In his past 24 rounds, Ben ranks 3rd in the field in proximity from 175-200 and 12th in proximity from 200+. Playing in an event that will not end up being a “birdie” fest should help An, who can separate from the field with his strong tee to green play. The putter may not always cooperate but getting to -15 is much easier than getting to -23 for elite ball strikers who tend to struggle on the greens.
Winning a “signature event” feels like a tall task for An this week with so many elite players in the field. However, he’s finished T16 at the Genesis Invitational, T16 at The Masters and T8 at the Arnold Palmer Invitational. The 32-year-old’s game has improved drastically this season and I believe he’s ready to get the biggest win of his career.
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Tom
Oct 22, 2016 at 1:05 pm
https://youtu.be/8TBR0AcfEGc
Steve
Oct 16, 2016 at 7:11 pm
I know its a little off topic (or, out of bounds?), but I give you my impression of club testing… I walk in to a Golfsmith while killing some time. I jump in the demo booth and pick up a 7 iron (I dont recall the brand). The computer decides I am hitting the ball 195 yards and 5 yds off center. I am a 3+ hdcp that is well aware of my skills (or lack there of) and carry TM R7TPs in my bag and my 7 iron plays between 157 and 163 yds. therefore, I give little credence to reviews until I personally use a club off grass.
Ani
Oct 16, 2016 at 10:41 am
The test shows that PXG is a big loser. 1 yard longer for being 3 times more expensive. Good luck!
Tom
Oct 16, 2016 at 1:17 pm
with one club, imagine what the other seven will do.
Steven
Oct 15, 2016 at 8:44 am
What was the shot dispersion with each of the irons? That should be a major factor in helping decide which one is the best to put in your bag.
Uhit
Oct 15, 2016 at 1:26 pm
You can see the shot dispersion (in about the middle of the video) at 5:04 …
…the smallest shot dispersion has the Mizuno MP-5.
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 3:31 pm
By site it appears to be furthest from the center.
Uhit
Oct 15, 2016 at 6:42 pm
By site he was hitting the Mizuno blade furthest from the center of the clubface…
…however, shot shape is depending from strike.
If you would flatten the lie angle around 1 degree, the draw he plays would straighten, and the shots would be dead center on line…
…good quality forged irons can be bend a few degree without problems.
Uhit
Oct 16, 2016 at 4:53 am
B.t.W.:
If you take into account, that he played the biggest draws with the Mizuno (whilst he had the least dispersion), the Mizuno shots would have been (at least) as long as the other two irons (if the draws would be as straight as with the other two irons)…
…if all is said and done, you come to the conclusion, that in perfect conditions (robot testing), the Mizuno blade would win the test in probably all categories – don´t you think?
Tom
Oct 16, 2016 at 1:43 pm
I’m under the impression draw shots go further. According to the data provided 0311’s had the least deviation from center line.
Uhit
Oct 16, 2016 at 6:40 pm
A big draw becomes a hook…
…a draw, that draws to the center line, is still a draw.
Draw shots only get further, if you generate a considerable part of your clubhead speed with the closing speed of your club face through impact (flipping over)…
…or deloft your club in a helpful degree.
Draw shots are generated by the user – not by the golf club.
With the same ball speed a draw is shorter than a straight shot along the intended line.
You can play draws (and fades), to gap the distance between two golf Clubs.
If you measure the lenght of the flight path, you get an idea, how far a draw (or fade) would have been (approx.) travelled as a straight shot.
Do this in our case and you will find more than a yard distance gain, if you bend the draw from the Mizuno blade to a straight line and use the clubhead speed of the PXG shots.
Greg
Oct 14, 2016 at 8:52 pm
Somewhere along the line I thought that a given shaft might not work optimally in different clubheads. For example the AP1 head may be engineered with different launch and spin characteristics than the mizuno. Therefore a player may get better performance out of a DG shaft in the titleist and a kbs might work better with a mizuno. Is this not true? And if so, would it not impact the comparison if the same shaft is used?
christian
Oct 15, 2016 at 12:38 am
Every brand offers multiple shaft choices. So your theory does not hold water.
Jim
Oct 16, 2016 at 10:26 am
Greg is right…although it’d be measured in microns…It’s more about the strength and technique of the human using the tool…
Christian’s right too..Although they were dragged kicking and screaming into doing so. We used to routinely yank perfectly good un-hit DG’s from Mizuno’s & Titleist irons to install Rifle shafts on the customer’s request Once one big OEM started offering custom shaft selections, they all had to just to be competitive.
Brian
Oct 14, 2016 at 4:41 pm
You’re right…Mizuno are works of art.
Dat
Oct 14, 2016 at 7:17 pm
like those holes in your face?
Tom.
Oct 14, 2016 at 4:39 pm
push mower cut the Mizuno in two
Dave r
Oct 14, 2016 at 4:22 pm
You know what a good golfer can hit any club they want and get the same results. Remember its not the arrow it’s the ……? . You get fitted right and it does not matter what you hit. All the top line clubs are the same the feel might be different but it’s what you prefer. The biggest issue for most is cost . What I would like to see is a pro explain why it’s important for thoese getting into golf to get fitted by someone who knows what their talking about. And explain why it’s best to spend the extra time and have this done.
duffer888
Oct 14, 2016 at 11:04 am
Shots launch higher off a mat than grass. So yes, mat does influence numbers, but it should be the same across the 3.
Most interesting thing I see is 3 different designs, pretty much same result.
Clear winner? No. PGX is longer because it had the lowest dynamic loft. PGX probably has the thinnest face as well, so ball speed is not surprising.
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 1:53 pm
thin face & wider grooves
Uhit
Oct 16, 2016 at 5:11 am
He played the faintest draws with the PXG – if the shot shape with all three irons would be the same, the PXG wouldn´t be longer!
If you take into account, that he played the biggest draws with the Mizuno (whilst he had the least dispersion), the Mizuno shots would have been (at least) as long as the other two irons (if the draws would be as straight as with the other two irons)…
…if all is said and done, you come to the conclusion, that in perfect conditions (robot testing), the Mizuno blade would win the test in probably all categories – don´t you think?
Tom
Oct 16, 2016 at 2:34 pm
conditions for this test were as good as we’re gonna get. ( I have no problem with the results of the testing equipment used, benign indoor conditions,or Rick Shiels. What I think is, 1025 select Boron billet being softer that the others is a detriment.
Uhit
Oct 16, 2016 at 8:30 pm
I think Boron is not involved in this test (at least not in the Mizuno MP-5), but a human…
Boron is AFAIK used in the JPX series – except in the 900 tour.
Whether it is used in the PXG, or Titleist I don´t know, but you seem to like the idea of Boron in a 1025 steel, that is softer without it.
The 900 tour has no Boron in it because the face is thick enough…
…a blade (like the MP-5) wouldn´t benefit from Boron, because it has an even thicker face than the 900 tour on it´s thinnest spot.
Don´t know, what your argument is…
Tom
Oct 17, 2016 at 1:02 am
I stand corrected.
Tom
Oct 18, 2016 at 3:15 pm
my thinking is that the steel used in the MP 5 is softer than the others that could be a detriment.
Uhit
Oct 20, 2016 at 12:01 pm
The data show no detriment in performance versus the others…
…so, why should a softer steel be a detriment?
As long as the steel has no remaining deformation after you hit a ball, you can be pretty sure, that there is no energy loss, that could cause a measurable detriment in ball speed etc…
The ball is that much softer than a soft steel and the blade is thick enough to be not deformed during a hit, that you don´t have to worry.
Jim
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:44 am
Ya can’t change lofts to compare the clubs. 7irA is designed & ground to play with Xloft, and 7irB is designed & grounf to play with Yloft.
It doesn’t matter how “strong” anyone makes the loft of a given iron as long as they’ve been able to maintain a low center of gravity, keep it playable for the intended user(s) so that it produces the appropriate launch angle for the iron in question…
Why would anyone want 4-5 yds roll out with a 7? Using super-ultra-straight-titanium double dozen pack Slazengers from Dick’s? That’s either a bad shaft fitting, OR simply the wrong head for that player! Maybe bumping the loft changed COG too much – whatever…that’s not how irons should be “death match” – head to head tested..
GET THE ROBOT. Same shaft & length, same lie with the factory designated loft…ADJUST the robot for 1, 2 & 3 degree off center hits – both heel & toe side, alter path same way – alter clubhead release angles & do all tests with at least 3 speeds (70, 80 & 90mph)
yeah, it will take all day…but it’s the only way to “PROVE” which is best for each catagory of strike
Jim
Oct 14, 2016 at 12:11 pm
Isn’t building a “better mousetrap” the whole idea? I don’t care if an iron’s loft is 10° “strong” – as long as they were smart enough to compensate elsewhere to maintain appropriate launch & playabilty… it”s governed by rules, size limits and frankly consumer esthetics….
– anyone remember the first gen ALL TITANIUM IRONS? Yeah, they hit the crap out of the ball, but were so big n clumsy they failed… Build it as best ya can! Who cares what the loft/head numbers are
PO
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:41 am
No mention of golf ball, using a matt and NO mention of proximity to the hole ? I thought it was about golf…….. The point of the game is shooting lower scores…..
MP-4
Oct 14, 2016 at 11:30 am
Exactly.
Where’s the workability test.
Where the heck is the distance to the hole data?
No mention of accuracy. lol
The game is all about how far you hit it…hah.
Glen
Oct 15, 2016 at 7:03 am
I guess you didn’t see the offline stas he showed for each club?
Dormie
Oct 14, 2016 at 3:10 pm
If you add a little human factor, he is human after all, and take out the best and worst shot of each, you see what is seen time and time again. The closer you are to a true blade on a precise strike, the closer you are to the hole, distance+line. The further you are from a precise strike with that same club, the further you will be vs. a more perimeter weighted club. And vice versa. Great test nonetheless. Data data data.
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 1:58 pm
Incredible…absolutety incredible! Did ya watch the video on ur cell phone watch in line at a liquor store? PRO V1 !
Blue
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:15 am
Very Interesting. Thank you for performing the test and I think you did a nice job.
I am curious if anyone knows the C.O.R. for the three clubs? The MP5s and AP2 had a S.D. of 1.8 on ball speed however the PXGs had a S.D. of 2.7 on ball speed. The sample size is much too small and impact of human error is too great to draw any real conclusions but these S.D. numbers jumped out at me. The MP5s are the only true forged single piece of steel head. The others are multi-piece clubs and I think there is a possibility of some spring-like effect –albeit small.
I’ve play the MP5s since last fall and love them. Played the AP2 (great club too!) before and really have seen no difference in performance. I just like the Mizuno look better. Actually hit the PXG 0311ts a few times a couple days ago and didn’t see any noticeable improvement in performance –although I thought they felt softer at impact.
My simple take away is there is no discernible difference between the clubs when a good swing is put on them. Which is what I would expect in a players club. If you’re in the market, any of these are great –although the PXGs come with a hefty price. So pick what you like to look at and what sounds best to you at impact.
ButchT
Oct 14, 2016 at 9:17 am
With these results, how could anyone justify the increased cost of the PXGs?
Charlie
Oct 14, 2016 at 9:37 am
When you are trying to impress family, friends, clients, etc.
Jim
Oct 14, 2016 at 5:08 pm
Do robot tests and have it hit off center, thin, little fat… stuff that happens to humans – especially on uneven turf etc…
Mark Moser
Oct 16, 2016 at 12:46 pm
That would make more sense with a game improvement iron and not a players club as the player who will play this club is a mid to low single digit and a good consistent ball striker so miss hits will be a lot less than a 10 or 20 hdcp. If a 20 is playing these then every miss will be exaggerated.
Tom
Oct 16, 2016 at 4:50 pm
BAZINGA!
Joe
Oct 14, 2016 at 9:11 am
Why do so few people understand the concept of statistical significance? If you really want to prove that one club is longer than another, you need to hit more than 10 shots with each. (And probably use a robot – a human is just not consistent enough.)
I also take issue with the conclusion that any of these clubs “won” this test. This data is a real mixed bag. The PXG was the “longest”, but it also had a greater variance of distance. A player of the quality of the guy who did this test doesn’t care about 2 yards with his 7 iron. He wants to control his distance. If you care about maximizing your distance with your 7 iron, you don’t want this style of club anyway.
Jordan
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:19 am
These results are so close you’d need a crap ton of repetitions to gain anything statistically significant. The issue with that is you’ll probably get something statistically significant, but insignificant in terms of real world impact. No one cares about a club that’s 1-2 yards longer. I think the idea of this article is to show that there’s little difference between any of these clubs and you can sufficiently do that with just 10 iterations.
Blue
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:19 am
Agree. Although I don’t think he’s claiming any stat sig. My take away is there is no difference between the clubs and that is what I would expect w/a players club. Players clubs should provided consistent performance with a consistent swing. All of these clubs provide this.
Mr Muira.
Oct 14, 2016 at 8:56 am
Some guys like their girls fat, some like em skinny…pick your ball buster.
Blade Junkie
Oct 14, 2016 at 8:03 am
So basically there is no real-world difference between any of these clubs LOL. So do I buy the AP2s for £700 .. or the MP5s for £750 … or the PXGs for £2,500 … ?
Mark Donaghy
Oct 14, 2016 at 6:49 am
I think this was a great head to head test. I’ve watched Rick do many of these and he is usually very honest / balanced in his findings. He was not pushing any of these clubs. What it show me was that there is very little between all three, which is what I would have thought from the start. Some of you purists out there will quibble about the details ad infinitum, but to me a lot of this will come down to an individual’s preference for visual looks, feel and brand loyalty. The Mizzy guy will always pick Mizzy. I think if a club is fit properly to the player, the margin of difference is very little in terms of distance, flight and dispersion.
erkr
Oct 14, 2016 at 12:17 am
Pretty similar data I must say.
He didn’t hit so many shots so, just hitting the PXG slightly harder/better can explain the difference in club and ballspeed.
I’d like to hear more about the differences in how they feel and how they play (high/low trajectory, perfor on Mishima etc)
Gary
Oct 13, 2016 at 11:10 pm
To be fair the Mizuno chosen to be run against those other two should have been the JPX 900 forged
Jason Schneider
Oct 14, 2016 at 9:48 am
Why? The mp5s are a better iron
Blue
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:28 am
The JPX 900 forged perimeter weighting is more similar to AP2 and PXG.
Tom
Oct 18, 2016 at 11:56 am
https://youtu.be/8TBR0AcfEGc not cracked up to what they made out to be.
Tom.
Oct 14, 2016 at 1:49 pm
“A few months ago, GolfWRX Members voted for the three irons they most wanted to see tested head-to-head. The winners were: PXG 0311T, Mizuno MP-5 and Titleist 716 AP2. Today, the results of my test are in”
Brian
Oct 14, 2016 at 4:45 pm
I thin the JPX 900 Tour would be more appropriate than the forged.
lhex
Oct 13, 2016 at 10:44 pm
robotic testing will justified everything!
its good to see a dual cavity irons can produce a very close number with a muscles back design iron
nice head to head test men,
Philip
Oct 13, 2016 at 9:23 pm
Since club lofts are tweaked to maximize the characteristics of the club design bending the AP2 and MP-5 7i from 34 to 32 degrees in order to match the PXG club will definitely have an effect on the results. In addition after the lofts were adjusted, the bounce for the PXG stayed at 7 degrees, whereas the bounce for the MP-5 was just 1 degree and the AP2 would have been 3 degrees (if same bounce as prior model since the website not longer lists bounce). I wouldn’t call them identical clubs and the sample size is just oo small for any meaningful conversation – but that it just me.
Dave S
Oct 13, 2016 at 11:04 pm
Always club test truthers.
Craven
Oct 14, 2016 at 10:24 am
I agree about strengthening the lofts. To be fair, he should have repeated the test with the PXG weakened to 34 degrees. Would it have suffered in performance? Then again, looking at the numbers, the differences are far too small to deem the test statistically significant. In essence, they are all the same. Choose whichever one suits your eye or wallet.
Dan
Oct 14, 2016 at 11:39 am
This makes sense to me. Also can explain why the Mizuno was hit a touch higher on the face. impact conditions with 7° bounce versus 1° biunce can definitely change.
Tom.
Oct 14, 2016 at 12:49 pm
https://www.mitchellgolf.com/news/bending-golf-clubs-facts-fallacies/
dan
Oct 13, 2016 at 9:15 pm
Decent “attempt” at a controlled experiment.
Either way it only shows that it just doesn’t really matter which clubs you use.
So you’re telling us that a true blade is slightly (and I mean very marginally slightly) less forgiving than a hollow iron and a CB with tungsten?
Is anyone actually surprised by this??
Find a shaft that fits you and a head that suits your eye and flail away.
Uhit
Oct 15, 2016 at 2:02 pm
Where does your conclusion come from?
In the video at 5:04 you see, that the Mizuno MP-5 blade has the smallest dispersion circle, which corresponds (at least in my book) with most forgiving.
In this test, the Mizuno blade wasn´t struck as well as the others (3-4 mm higher above center than the other two – on average) – and (despite this) it had the smallest dispersion!
In my opinion it also shows, that you should grab the golf club, that looks and feels the best and get fitted – forget the bells an whistles and what the majority tells you.
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 2:57 pm
Uh huh… Bob. I’ll take the red circle for 100
/
Uhit
Oct 15, 2016 at 7:03 pm
You know, you can get anything you want, at Alice’s Restaurant…
Tom
Oct 16, 2016 at 1:21 pm
roflmao
John
Oct 13, 2016 at 9:04 pm
When your 7 iron launches like a 6 iron it is time to go to a weaker shaft. Playing a c taper 130x with those numbers is a joke.
KK
Oct 13, 2016 at 9:25 pm
3 to 5 yards of roll-out with a 7 iron is pretty good.
Someone
Oct 13, 2016 at 11:00 pm
Why are you getting roll out with your 7i? That’s an approach shot that shot come down relatively close to steep and settle. If I’m hitting a 7i into a green, the last thing I’m looking for is roll out. If I’m hitting a 7i as hard as I can to eke out some extra distance with a rollout, I’d rather play the 6i.
Charlie
Oct 14, 2016 at 8:28 am
Agreed. But with a push draw, it’s difficult to go softer without hooking the ball. My swing is a lot like his. I can understand why he plays that shaft.
Dylan
Oct 13, 2016 at 8:47 pm
I’d say Mizuno gets the win here, a straight up blade against two players cavity back irons? And it performed only slightly worse off of mis-hits? Very impressive Mizuno, you should be proud.
gwillis7
Oct 13, 2016 at 9:55 pm
agree, Mizuno did fantastic and I would imagine it would be the least forgiving. seems pretty dang forgiving for a blade.
I wish the ping i-blades would have been in the competition!
Jack
Oct 13, 2016 at 11:41 pm
I would agree. His clubhead speed was actually lower for the MP5. I don’t think clubs affect clubhead speed really? That’s really the golfer. The dynamic loft was also higher on the MP5 as well. With it being the same loft, that is really not a consistent strike. I don’t believe that if the Mp5 was swung the same way there would be really much difference at all.
And this is because Rick is a pretty good golfer. I would imagine that the MP5 would perform worse on off center hits compared to the other two. Making this test not as useful as it could have been. Rick should probably try delofting the Mp5 more when he was testing then it would have been fairer. What made him deloft and swing the other two clubs 1 mile slower than the PXG we don’t know. And apparently neither does he. But really this tells me once you rule out the loft differences the three clubs are really quite similar.
Tom
Oct 16, 2016 at 2:42 pm
From Mizuno Corp. Traditionally irons have fallen into blade or cavity type categories but Mizuno insist the MP-5’s are neither, but rather a revolutionary “Channel Back”… end that quote!
R
Oct 13, 2016 at 8:11 pm
Rigged to the moon
Matt
Oct 13, 2016 at 6:54 pm
Hardly seems fair that the PXGs were hit on the screws and the Mizzies were all bonked. Delivering half a club extra of dynamic loft with MP-5s as well, probably the high hits causing deflection (also explains the low spin). NEW TEST! Account for strike this time.
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 2:38 pm
250+ think it’s fair compared to the 53 hat don’t.
Uhit
Oct 13, 2016 at 6:25 pm
Interestingly the Mizuno blade had the least dispersion and the other numbers were very close, despite the Mizuno blade was hit on average on the least favourable position on the club head (within the tested bunch of three golf clubs).
3 to 4 mm higher hit point on average on the clubface of the Mizuno blade in comparison to the others, which could indicate that the mat could have been hit (slowing the golf club down) and / or explaining the higher average launch angle.
Tom
Oct 13, 2016 at 8:13 pm
so now the “mat” comes into question on testing?
J
Oct 13, 2016 at 8:50 pm
Ball contact does come into question, which is what he’s implying. Contact higher on the face=higher launch with less spin and lower ball speed. No need to be pejorative, it’s an astute observation that could affect the results.
Uhit
Oct 14, 2016 at 6:05 am
Thank you. You are spot on!
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 4:09 pm
look at and compare AoA data provided for more info.
Uhit
Oct 16, 2016 at 4:49 am
Think about it…
…you can hit off center strikes independent of the AoA…
Tom
Oct 19, 2016 at 8:32 pm
I’m thinkin if the if the sole of the club came into contact with the mat, the club would have skipped and contact would be lower on the face. Why didn’t it happen on the other two? Does Rick Shiels that poor of a swing?
Someone
Oct 13, 2016 at 11:03 pm
He’s saying that the mat comes into play if it is hit, whilst the others were cleaner strokes on the ball with mat interaction after hitting the ball. Hitting the mat first could cause the ball to bounce up a tad and hit higher on the club face.
Uhit
Oct 14, 2016 at 6:14 am
In any case, I wouldn´t have expected that the pure Mizuno blade would have the least dispersion AND the other numbers in the same ball park.
My conlusion is – according to the provided data – that the simple blade in this test has no obvious disadvantage in comparison to the high-tech irons…
…which really surprises me (as a gear head), but not really as a Golfer, who loves look and feel.
Tom
Oct 14, 2016 at 9:09 am
SOOooo user error?
Uhit
Oct 14, 2016 at 3:20 pm
The given data show 3 to 4 mm higher (on average and above center) golf ball strike positions on the club face of the Mizuno blade in comparison to the other two tested golf clubs…
…what could it be?
Have you an argument against the given data, or what do you want?
Golfy Golferton
Oct 13, 2016 at 6:06 pm
Anyone getting redirected to pipview for some stupid gift card or is it just me,
Read it was a problem with this site
Someone
Oct 13, 2016 at 11:04 pm
I’m having the same problem. It only happens on golfwrx…their site must be generating hits or one of their ads has an embedded code.
TitleistJunky
Oct 13, 2016 at 5:37 pm
I think the better test would be the distance and accuracy on off center hits. Pure shot for pure shot there really shouldn’t be a difference with any club considering all these equal factors.
CashMoney
Oct 13, 2016 at 5:06 pm
How much did Parsons pay you for this, Rick? Man have you sold out to fame, or what, now that you have found yourself on videotube.
JThunder
Oct 13, 2016 at 10:20 pm
Maybe I don’t get your comment; are you suggesting PXG “won” this shootout? 1 yard more distance at 170 yards is 0.5%. Another 10 balls and that averages to 0 most likely.
Bob Parsons wouldn’t pay anyone a penny to prove his irons fly 0.5% further than irons 1/3 the price.
J Zilla
Oct 14, 2016 at 1:45 am
Pay for what? At best, PXG barely outperformed clubs that cost a third less. Based on cost vs performance ratio, PXG got slaughtered in this head to head.
MIZUNOnumeroUNO
Oct 13, 2016 at 5:04 pm
MY WHOLE LIFE IS A LIE
CashMoney
Oct 13, 2016 at 5:06 pm
The best answer, evah!
Forsbrand
Oct 14, 2016 at 5:11 am
Ha ha ha genius!!
Hippocamp
Oct 13, 2016 at 4:58 pm
There is no way that, with 10 strikes per club, any of those differences lie outside the margin of error. To say that PXG *won* is going way beyond what the data can support. In fact, the performance of the three clubs seems to be incredibly similar.
JThunder
Oct 13, 2016 at 10:11 pm
I would go so far as to say the data is “identical”, if 30 balls were hit with each, that slight variation would likely shrink more.
Also, I’d say the clubhead speed and attack angle of the PXG suggest it was being hit with more confidence/aggression – and while that would be interesting to note, it does suggest the results would be even closer (as if the Mizuno were being “swept” but the PXG “driven” … even so, only the slightest difference.)
I’d be interested to see any 1 of these heads hit with 12 different shafts – weights, flexes, etc.
JD
Oct 13, 2016 at 4:57 pm
Walls closing in on all the Mizuno folks out there…
Tom.
Oct 13, 2016 at 4:55 pm
I see we already have a Mizuno players vote….roflmao
MakeTigerGoodAgain
Oct 13, 2016 at 4:54 pm
The only true blade in this comparison is the Mizuno. Thought the golfwrx readers would vote for some better matching irons to be compared. So not your fault Mr. Shields. In that respect the Mizzy did surprisingly well! Seems like perfect strikes all the way so not much in between those clubs. Would therefore be interesting to see the difference in length on off center hits.
Matt
Oct 13, 2016 at 6:56 pm
Dude, check out the strike average again. PXG was way closer to center than Mizuno. If he was nutting those MP-5s I guarantee they’d spin more than those hollow pieces of junk.
Tom
Oct 15, 2016 at 2:35 pm
Don’t think so; PXG has wider grooves. Good thing MP 5’s have a large sweet spot…..coulda been really disastrous.
JThunder
Oct 13, 2016 at 10:17 pm
I would think the whole point was to compare a more-or-less “true” muscleback (not blade) to irons with more “tech”, but unlike OTR, making all the specs identical. OTR, most MBs are weaker lofted, sometimes shorter shafts, and often heavier and stiffer shafts that their GI/SGI counterparts.
I’d have liked to see MB/CB/GI/SGI, all spec’d the same. That would be way more interesting, but all such comparisons not likely to win much favor from advertisers and sponsors… These “differences” in numbers are so small as to be considered nothing; another 10 balls with each and that 1 yard difference between the AP2 and PXG might disappear. And that 1 yard difference on 170 yard shot is less than 1%…
Tom.
Oct 13, 2016 at 4:36 pm
Ewww this is gonna be good