19th Hole
The eternal debate: What would PGA Tour pros shoot on average golf courses?
It’s fitting that in the same week that the PGA Tour (somewhat curiously) revealed its new slogan, “Live Under Par”/#LiveUnderPar, GolfWRX member borker brought up one of the age-old questions in golf: Just how much better are the pros than us average duffers And further, what would the average PGA Tour pros shoot, should he find himself pegging it at the local muni?
Saying that a Tour pro’s handicap is +5 may not be as striking as, say, this nugget from borker, “John Rahm played Canyon West somewhere in Texas [and shot 59]. Looks like it is rated 72.6/136 from the back .” He included an image of Rahm’s score, but here’s a better shot c/o Compleat Golfer.
59 watch as Jon Rahm ???????? shot the magic number during practice for the #DellMatchPlay (via @Tengolf) pic.twitter.com/fNvrZxx0HP
— Compleat Golfer (@CompleatGolfer) March 19, 2018
But GolfWRX member niccho has done one better with his comment, pulling a 2007 Washington Post article by Eli Saslow from the archives wherein Steve Marino (not the Tour’s most accomplished golfer) tees it up with a scribe at a Washington, D.C. muni.
From that piece…
“[Marino] shot a 68. Make that an ugly 68…The par-4 first hole was emblematic of Marino’s round. He crushed a drive 320 yards down the right side of the fairway, almost all the way to the green, only to find the ball settled in a pile of twigs. Marino wasted his next shot chopping the ball out into the grass, and then he pitched his third shot to within 12 feet of the pin. He struck what felt like a pure putt, but the ball ran over sand and stopped a few inches short of the hole. Marino stood on the green and shook his head. “Ridiculous. Just ridiculous,” he said. Then he tapped in for bogey.”
As many members point out in the thread, it’s difficult to hole a ton of putts at ye olde muni, and canning anything from distance is out of the question. Thus, even if a pro finds 18 greens in regulation, expecting him to make even half the putts is unrealistic.
Marino himself spoke to this in the WaPo article
“It’s just kind of like you hit it and guess where it goes on this course,” Marino said. “I don’t think I’d ever shoot over par on a course like this, but I’m not sure I could ever go really low. On nice courses, you know when you hit a good shot that you’re going to get rewarded for it. So if you’re playing great, you score great. Here, you just never know.”
Returning to the subject of Rahm’s 59 at Canyon West, wcbjr says this
“There is nothing difficult about Canyon West. Being from the area, I’ve played it a dozen times or so. But that is still a ridiculous score with the current course condition. Greens and Bermuda coming out of dormancy, and I believe it was very windy that day.”
That said, Rahm was certainly putting on better greens than Marino was in ‘07 at East Potomac.
What say you, GolfWRX members? Ever played with a pro at a pristine country club track under normal conditions? What do you think a PGA Tour card holder would shoot at the roughest muni in your next of the woods?
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19th Hole
Brandel Chamblee has a surprising new take on the PGA Tour-LIV stand-off
One of the more outspoken analysts throughout the LIV Golf vs. PGA Tour saga has been Golf Channel’s Brandel Chamblee.
This week, Chamblee reversed course, saying he believes the PGA Tour should strike a deal with Saudi Arabia’s Private Investment Fund (PIF).
Golf Channel Brandel Chamblee in his biggest about-face since the Framework Agreement on June 6, now says that making a deal with the PIF "is the better end of the bargain."
He says:
"The PGA Tour is in this pickle like it or not, but, do you want to compete with someone (LIV… pic.twitter.com/XDZaC1I6B8
— JCAGOLFReport (@JCAGOLFReport) May 10, 2024
“The PGA Tour is in this pickle like it or not, but, do you want to compete with someone who’s not going to go away, who can outspend you”.
“Every move they make that makes their tour better deletes your tour and causes more division within the tour. So the time is now, to Rory’s point about making a deal, I wouldn’t have said that a year ago… but it is the better end of the bargain.”
Chamblee’s new stance seems to be in line with that of Rory McIlroy, who reportedly wanted to rejoin the PGA Tour board with hopes of pushing a deal with the PIF closer to the finish line.
Chamblee will be in the booth for next week’s PGA Championship which has 16 LIV players in the field.
More from the 19th Hole
- Phil Mickelson drops big retirement hint; Says LIV will grow the game “on a much more global basis”
- 2-time major champ announces shock retirement from the sport at age of 33
- Tiger explains why golf has “negative connotations” for daughter Sam
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19th Hole
Xander Schauffele explains free drop ruling during round one of Wells Fargo Championship
During Thursday’s opening round of the Wells Fargo Championship, Xander Schauffele blasted his tee shot in the woods to the right of the fairway on the par-4 8th hole.
The ball was almost not found, but Xander’s group managed to track it down just before the three-minute time limit was reached.
When the ball was found, it was just beyond the penalty area close to a fence. In the moment, it seemed incredibly unlikely that Schauffele would be able to hit the ball through the trees towards the green.
However, through the woods and above the fairway, there was a hanging wire from a ShotLink tower that Xander claimed was in his way. He was then granted relief, and two club lengths from the spot positioned him all the way out of trouble. He played his ball onto the front of the green and two-putted for par.
Here is the full video of the interaction between Schauffele and the rules official.
??? #WATCH — The full video of the Xander Schauffele #DropGate situation ?
— NUCLR GOLF (@NUCLRGOLF) May 9, 2024
After the round, Xander said he “got really lucky.”
“Got really lucky multiple times, on 1 with Wyndham finding it, 2, being able to move the rocks, and 3, the ShotLink tower being in like my only shot line possible. To walk out there with sort of a no breeze 4 with what I thought was almost out was a really good break.”
“Yeah, I hit it in the trees. My ball was probably like a foot, two feet from the fence. If I — ball was here, fence was kind of here, hitting back this direction.
“If I went towards the green, the fence kind of worked this way so I had what I could hit, a 4-iron or something low and just kind of run it through. If it gets stuck, I’ll just kind of hit my next one out. But I brought the rules official in there with me because I was like, you’ve got to be OK with this because this is literally the only shot I can hit.”
“So Austin [Kaiser] and I moved two massive rocks that weren’t embedded and then I got relief out of the junk and then hit a pretty good shot on the green from there. What was a very stressful moment turned into a pretty stressless par.”
Schauffele finished the round at seven under, which gives him a three-shot lead going into Friday’s second round.
More from the 19th Hole
- Phil Mickelson drops big retirement hint; Says LIV will grow the game “on a much more global basis”
- 2-time major champ announces shock retirement from the sport at age of 33
- Tiger explains why golf has “negative connotations” for daughter Sam
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19th Hole
Report: Tiger Woods voted against Rory McIlroy returning to policy board; Will be the only player negotiating directly with Saudis
According to a report from The Telegraph, the relationship between Tiger Woods and Rory McIlroy has soured.
Last week, reports surfaced that McIlroy, who was a member of the PGA Tour policy board during most of the past few years, was looking to rejoin the board, presumably taking Webb Simpson’s seat.
However, on Wednesday, McIlroy revealed that he will not be rejoining the policy board, due to people on the board being “uncomfortable” with that “for some reason.”
Here's Rory McIlroy talking about the PGA Tour policy board and the "subset of people on the board that were maybe uncomfortable with me coming back on for some reason." pic.twitter.com/0skNOwtWxz
— Patrick McDonald (@pmcdonaldCBS) May 8, 2024
The Telegraph has reported that Tiger Woods was among the players who voted against McIlroy returning to the policy board.
The divide is apparently due to McIlroy pushing for the game of golf to unify, whereas Woods, reportedly, believes the PGA Tour is in a fine position where it currently stands.
The Associated Press added another wrinkle to the situation, reporting that Woods is the only player who will be negotiating directly with the Saudis.
The other members of the committee are PGA Tour commissioner Jay Monahan, board chairman Joe Gorder, John W. Henry of Fenway Sports Group, and Joe Ogilvie, who was a former PGA Tour player.
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