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Rifle 6.5 Flighted Shaft Help


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#1 LongBomber12

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:24 PM

Hi fellow GolfWRXer's,

I have been searching these forums for the last few days trying to get the correct info but I feel like my questions have not been fully answered. Maybe I am crazy but I want a definitive answer before I get my club guy to do the work.

I found a great deal on a set of Rifle 6.5 flighted shafts and I know these are old but I am a lowball hitter and need to get my launch up. I have read multiple threads saying these shafts feel awesome and fly/spin higher than kbs and PX. I am looking to take these Rifles 6.5 shafts and soft-step them once so they don't feel as stiff. I read soft-stepping usually takes about .3 off the cpm which would put it right around 6.2 or so and the launch/spin will raise as well which I am fine with. I plan on putting these shafts in some Titleist AP2 712's. These are used pulls out of Mizuno MP-30 irons which played standard length and decrease by .5" increments. I also read somewhere something about tip trimming instead of butt trimming? Isn't that only for hard-stepping shafts? The thread mentioned Rifles came pre-tipped? This probably doesn't matter as they are pulls but I wanted to know anyways.

My main questions are:

1. Will soft-stepping these shafts change anything major other than launch and spin
2. Will these shafts that played standard in Mizuno MP-30s play standard length in my Titleist's (Obviously I am soft-stepping so the length will be a tad shorter but maybe Mizuno standard is a tad longer than titleist?)

Thanks for any help in advance!


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#2 Grumpy bumpy

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 01:44 PM

Hi. You probably will not find a difference by soft stepping once.  Soft step 2 times and you will find  the difference noticeable.
Your titleist standard length is 1/4 inch longer than the mizuno mp30 standard length.
Rifle makes flighted shaft sets and then they sell rifle blanks, out of which we can create flighted sets,  based on trimming specs.
Tip trimming is for creating the proper flex and for trimming the shaft to the corresponding club head so that the flex, frequency slope, is correct.


#3 LongBomber12

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:12 PM

Gotcha. Thanks for the reply. So you don't think soft-stepping the shaft only once will net a huge difference? Sounds like I have to get some blank rifles since the lengths will be off and I am not a fan of adding extensions

#4 Howard Jones

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:38 PM

View PostLongBomber12, on 31 December 2013 - 01:24 PM, said:

Hi fellow GolfWRXer's,

I have been searching these forums for the last few days trying to get the correct info but I feel like my questions have not been fully answered. Maybe I am crazy but I want a definitive answer before I get my club guy to do the work.

I found a great deal on a set of Rifle 6.5 flighted shafts and I know these are old but I am a lowball hitter and need to get my launch up. I have read multiple threads saying these shafts feel awesome and fly/spin higher than kbs and PX. I am looking to take these Rifles 6.5 shafts and soft-step them once so they don't feel as stiff. I read soft-stepping usually takes about .3 off the cpm which would put it right around 6.2 or so and the launch/spin will raise as well which I am fine with. I plan on putting these shafts in some Titleist AP2 712's. These are used pulls out of Mizuno MP-30 irons which played standard length and decrease by .5" increments. I also read somewhere something about tip trimming instead of butt trimming? Isn't that only for hard-stepping shafts? The thread mentioned Rifles came pre-tipped? This probably doesn't matter as they are pulls but I wanted to know anyways.

My main questions are:

1. Will soft-stepping these shafts change anything major other than launch and spin
2. Will these shafts that played standard in Mizuno MP-30s play standard length in my Titleist's (Obviously I am soft-stepping so the length will be a tad shorter but maybe Mizuno standard is a tad longer than titleist?)

Thanks for any help in advance!

I will try to make this short, its been explained down to details earlier, so just use search to fill in if you need more.

RIFLE uses a "standard" for HEAD specs, so a Rifle 6.5 was made to play to FCM 6.5 in a head with those specs.
If the head specs is different than RIFLE "standard", flex will NOT be 6.5
This goes for ANY shaft on the marked, but most folks dont know. A DG X 100 DONT play to FCM 6.8 no matter what head, but thats the common understanding.

Its correct that soft stepping mostly changes feel at SS1 and a difference to launch will be way more visible at SS2, but thats NOT correct when we deal with RIFLE.

RIFLE 6.5 flighted is a mix of flexes with exchanged tip trim, and the easiest way to explain what they are is this way.

LONG irons - 2-3-4 is Soft stepped 7.0 shafts
MID irons - 5-6-7 is standard 6.5 shafts
SHORT irons - 8-9-PW is Hard stepped 6.0 shafts

To raise launch in the long, we have used a 5 CPM stronger flex and SS1 who gets them 4 CPM softer, plus, we changed tip trim where we took 3/16 LESS from the tip, and then we get a total flex drop of 5 CPM, making a 7.0 shaft, play to 6.5, but now its HIGH Launch.

Short irons is Hard stepped 1x Plus 3/16 extra tip trim, making 6.0 shafts to play as LOW launch 6.5

So. you will end up with EXTRA HIGH launch long irons - HIGH launch MID irons, and standard flight short irons, but if thats what you need, and what feels right, do it. When you go SS1, they become 0.5 longer, so try them strait in first.

Edited by Howard Jones, 31 December 2013 - 02:46 PM.


#5 LongBomber12

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:21 PM

THANK YOU! I needed to see this. Now I am in between because I found a set of Regular Rifle 6.0s that were pulled from some Mizunos that play 1in long; so these can be butt-trimmed to play standard in my Titleist heads. I realize now what is done to make the Rifles "flighted." I think I may just go with the Regular 6.0's so no soft-stepping is needed and launch would be a little more consistent through the set. I am a +1 index but hit the ball low. In Florida I get away with it except when behind trees, there is no trouble in the sky and I only want my ball to move 3ft front or back (more predictable).  Knocking down shots is easy for me in the wind I just want my ball to soar so there can be no pin hidden and no tree I cant go over. Am I on the right track? This is an experiment and Im in between which shafts to play. any thoughts on the 2?

Edited by LongBomber12, 31 December 2013 - 03:22 PM.


#6 Howard Jones

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 03:53 PM

View PostLongBomber12, on 31 December 2013 - 03:21 PM, said:

THANK YOU! I needed to see this. Now I am in between because I found a set of Regular Rifle 6.0s that were pulled from some Mizunos that play 1in long; so these can be butt-trimmed to play standard in my Titleist heads. I realize now what is done to make the Rifles "flighted." I think I may just go with the Regular 6.0's so no soft-stepping is needed and launch would be a little more consistent through the set. I am a +1 index but hit the ball low. In Florida I get away with it except when behind trees, there is no trouble in the sky and I only want my ball to move 3ft front or back (more predictable).  Knocking down shots is easy for me in the wind I just want my ball to soar so there can be no pin hidden and no tree I cant go over. Am I on the right track? This is an experiment and Im in between which shafts to play. any thoughts on the 2?

Dont forget that Rifle is descending to start with, and Flighed will be even more descending weight since we use the most heavy shafts as long, and the lightest as short. WEIGHT is VERY important, so if 6.0 is good for you, go for them, and forget flighted.

Now,you have a option since they are 1 above your need (dont take that for granted, Bottom of bore to ground might be different), but if you DONT cut down the short to playing length before you have tested them, here is a trick.

RIFLE uses 3/16 tip trim to gain 1 CPM, and the slope as a hole is a bit weaker than DG.
If flight gets to high in your PW (test it before cut down, just take a lower grip) you have this option.

Instead of taking it all from the butt, you can take it partly from tip, to make them slightly stronger from long to short, to keep ball flight down in the short if you want that. Thats the way we make the new Flighted RIFLE, its a different flex slope, its not a mix of shafts any more.

Get them home if weight is right, assemble the longest and the shortest strait in, test them by gripping to the right length, and judge by feel and flight if you want changes. If you want the math for making a "new model" flighted based on those 6.0, just let me know, and from what shaft we should start.

We CANT raise launch, or make a High launch, we can only go lower, based on that 6.0 set, but please measure the shaft and head with a ruler, or compare net shaft length with your old ones before you use "1  above standard" in the math, they might be different from that because of a different BBGM in the heads.

#7 LongBomber12

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:20 PM

Howard , I cant thank you enough for this info. I know the weight is a HUGE part of the build and something to be weary of. I have never tried Rifle shafts, I currently play TT black gold in x flex, also have a set of I20s with CFS x, and I played PX 6.5 but the PX felt a little stiff than what I am used to. I am trying to slow down my swing as I have realized I have all the distance I need and need to swing more controlled to score. Everyone thread I have seen has pointed me to the aerotech Steelfibers or the older Rifles. For the money and the feel aspect I wan the Rifles. PX 6.0 felt good and S300 feels good as well so I figured these regular rifles would be right in the middle. I will install just the pw and 4 iron (can't find a 3 iron non-flighted shaft) and see how they feel, work etc. I like the idea of tip trimming a tad if I want to lower the flight. I messaged the guy who was selling the shafts and he said they were ordered stock from Mizuno as 1" over std; but I do understand how length can be different. I will message you for that formula based off the 6.0s, is the sequence much different than what you explained the flighted set is made of in the above post? Once again, thank you for all of your help and I can not wait to try these shafts.

#8 Howard Jones

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:07 PM

oops...Rifle 6.0 is NOT in your league, they are softer over all than DG S400
I use them as a softer and lighter option to S300/S400 because Profile is equal, but over all a tad softer

You NEED to hard step this set, and that means 0.370 bore in all heads.
Never mind if they are tapers, they become parallels further up, so all tapers started their life as parallel, they where just trough "standard" tipping, and then they was swageed to tapers.

Describe your experience in terms of feel and flight of the shaft you mention above. From the hips, you need HS2 to get up in the area as those you mention here, so it seem slike NO Butt trim, ALL from the tip, if you go Rifle 6.0
Remember that Rifle Profile starts strong, and gets weaker against the tip compared to DG.
Rifle 7.0 is softer than DG Black Gold S flex is we judge the profile as a hole....only BUTT is stronger

NEVER MIND Butt / 41 - (both is butt , with different tip weight)
- we cut off most of that part when we play "standard" length.
10 Cpm at butt, is 1 flex class, while 10 CPM at tip is "tolerance" or "nothing"
Compare differences shaft to shaft at the same zone as a difference in %
Rifle Px to black.PNG

Specs is from Tom Wishons fantastic shaft profiling software

#9 Howard Jones

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 05:17 PM

RIFLE 6.0 would be 6.8 but LOWER flight than 7.0 strait in

#10 LongBomber12

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 11:40 PM

And it would be 6.8 if I hardstep it twice? To be honest, I got the shafts for $50 bucks shipped. Instead of messing with the heads I can just pick up a different shaft. This is more of an experiment as I have never really been able to launch the ball very high right away. It's probably  in my swing but equipment is so good these days I'd rather fit the equipment to my swing. I want to see just how high I can get the ball up there and see what its like to never have a pin hidden behind a mound or stuck behind a trap, etc..Plus, I LOVE trying new golf equipment. I've learned more about these shafts today with your posts and I appreciate that! I used to play S300 and my ego got the best of me. I'm trying to slow down rather than feeling like I'm going after every shot with the stiffer shafts. I hit the black golds very well matched with my I20s; accurate and mid launch. I liked the progressive weighting of the shafts and they feel very good.


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