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Leading with the right elbow


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#1 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 12:21 PM

I talk a lot about this on the forum.  Here is the visual.  




Did you see him smacked up
And cracked up
With his tongue on his chin
And his club in his hand,
Swinging from the rafters
Like a real RocknRolla

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#2 dynamicsl

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 12:27 PM

 MonteScheinblum, on 06 September 2013 - 12:21 PM, said:

I talk a lot about this on the forum.  Here is the visual.  



Perfect.  I have often seen it written that the right elbow must be in front of the right hip coming down but couldn't visualize what that meant.  This clarifies what is supposed to be done and I now understand how that should look.  Many thanks for another fine video, Monte!

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#3 ej002

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 12:35 PM

FYI to people who have a hard time with this, I recently had a lightbulb go off that may help SOME.  I was opening up the face trying to shallow on the backswing.  What I was actually doing was rotating just the forearm part of the arm.  So the elbow had no structure and wandered behind me (like a lawnmower action).  If you rotate the entire upper part of the right arm, there is a torque in the shoulder that forces the right elbow to point down (feels like pitching in baseball).  This full arm rotation and torque help me get the elbow more in front.   Dont over do it, you dont want to hurt yourself.

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#4 GeoffDickson

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 10:00 PM

For someone whose shoulders swing horizontal to the ground during the downswing, is a leading right elbow a logical way of lowering the right shoulder during the backswing

Edited by GeoffDickson, 06 September 2013 - 10:00 PM.


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#5 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 10:32 PM

Yes

Did you see him smacked up
And cracked up
With his tongue on his chin
And his club in his hand,
Swinging from the rafters
Like a real RocknRolla

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#6 Atyler

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 10:45 PM

I feel like the club face is WIDE open when I try this.   Is this a normal result?

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#7 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 10:57 PM

 Atyler, on 06 September 2013 - 10:45 PM, said:

I feel like the club face is WIDE open when I try this.   Is this a normal result?

Yes.  Forces you body to rotate.
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And his club in his hand,
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#8 sblack5

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:02 PM

I tried this thought at one point in my journey and ended up under plane with mega hooks and a way inside out path....thoughts professor??  I like the idea but need an education

Edited by sblack5, 06 September 2013 - 11:03 PM.

hit is with so much authority
that when you find it
and it sees you, it is trembling.

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#9 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:07 PM

 sblack5, on 06 September 2013 - 11:02 PM, said:

I tried this thought at one point in my journey and ended up under plane with mega hooks and a way inside out path....thoughts professor??  I like the idea but need an education

1.  Everything can be over done.

2.  Some of the greatest swing ideas don't work for everyone.

This is specifically good for those that snatch the club too much and get it steep....which is a HUGE section of golfers.

If I lead with the right elbow, I can hit it right of Rush Limbaugh.
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And his club in his hand,
Swinging from the rafters
Like a real RocknRolla

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#10 Timanator

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:07 PM

This is good stuff, Geoff taught me this a year a go and it's still apart of my swing thought.

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#11 Hoganstriker

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:07 PM

Nice Monte.  The what is definitely there. Good call.
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#12 Atyler

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:11 PM

I haven't given up on it.  I know it will take some serious range time. Body rotation instead of flipping with hands.

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#13 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:13 PM

 Atyler, on 06 September 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

I haven't given up on it.  I know it will take some serious range time. Body rotation instead of flipping with hands.

If you do it right you will have a few weeks of nasty play.  Blocks and snap hooks galore.  Your body will get sick of it.  The hips will start rotating, as will the left arm and you will be 3-5 shots better than you've ever been.

This is a big issue for you, as you know.
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And his club in his hand,
Swinging from the rafters
Like a real RocknRolla

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#14 MizunoLaxer40

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:18 PM

god I really suffer from the shaft pull. I get a case of the shanks about once a month at this point, I can't stand it anymore. going to try this ASAP. thanks monte
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#15 miguelgolf

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM

But how do we do it?

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#16 Atyler

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:34 PM

 MonteScheinblum, on 06 September 2013 - 11:13 PM, said:

 Atyler, on 06 September 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

I haven't given up on it.  I know it will take some serious range time. Body rotation instead of flipping with hands.

If you do it right you will have a few weeks of nasty play.  Blocks and snap hooks galore.  Your body will get sick of it.  The hips will start rotating, as will the left arm and you will be 3-5 shots better than you've ever been.

This is a big issue for you, as you know.

I will gladly take 3-5 shots better.

Edited by Atyler, 06 September 2013 - 11:36 PM.


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#17 Paul E

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:37 PM

 MonteScheinblum, on 06 September 2013 - 11:07 PM, said:

 sblack5, on 06 September 2013 - 11:02 PM, said:

I tried this thought at one point in my journey and ended up under plane with mega hooks and a way inside out path....thoughts professor??  I like the idea but need an education

1.  Everything can be over done.

2.  Some of the greatest swing ideas don't work for everyone.

This is specifically good for those that snatch the club too much and get it steep....which is a HUGE section of golfers.

If I lead with the right elbow, I can hit it right of Rush Limbaugh.

1. Yes, that's true.
2. True again!

When I consciously lead with the right elbow I can pull it or usually wipe it miles right. Right of Rush, right of Saturn and right of a woman I once knew who insisted on drinking tequilla and firing shotguns off in the backyard (at the same time). But I look just like Hogan, especially if I'm wearing a cardigan and the moment of impact is captured in a sepiatone still photo.

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#18 MizunoLaxer40

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:40 PM

 miguelgolf, on 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

But how do we do it?

I'd like to know this also. what's the sensation we should feel when doing it? literally just leading with the elbow instead of the hands or handle?
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#19 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:44 PM

 miguelgolf, on 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

But how do we do it?

Like anything else, you start on 20-30 yard wedges and MAKE AN EFFORT ON EVERY SWING.

A week...nothing.  A month, a slight gain.  6 months, you're shallow and somehow shooting lower.

It's no different than people saying, "BUT I can't shorten my swing."

They go to the range, try it 5 times, the swing isn't shorter and they move on.
Did you see him smacked up
And cracked up
With his tongue on his chin
And his club in his hand,
Swinging from the rafters
Like a real RocknRolla

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#20 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 06 September 2013 - 11:44 PM

 MizunoLaxer40, on 06 September 2013 - 11:40 PM, said:

 miguelgolf, on 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

But how do we do it?

I'd like to know this also. what's the sensation we should feel when doing it? literally just leading with the elbow instead of the hands or handle?

Yes

Did you see him smacked up
And cracked up
With his tongue on his chin
And his club in his hand,
Swinging from the rafters
Like a real RocknRolla

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#21 MizunoLaxer40

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 12:28 AM

View PostMonteScheinblum, on 06 September 2013 - 11:44 PM, said:

View Postmiguelgolf, on 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

But how do we do it?

Like anything else, you start on 20-30 yard wedges and MAKE AN EFFORT ON EVERY SWING.

A week...nothing.  A month, a slight gain.  6 months, you're shallow and somehow shooting lower.

It's no different than people saying, "BUT I can't shorten my swing."

They go to the range, try it 5 times, the swing isn't shorter and they move on.

LOL it's the truth. can't wait until it's too cold to play so I can really start trying to implement some swing changes. well actually I can wait, but you get my point.
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#22 miguelgolf

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 12:32 AM

View PostMonteScheinblum, on 06 September 2013 - 11:44 PM, said:

View Postmiguelgolf, on 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

But how do we do it?

Like anything else, you start on 20-30 yard wedges and MAKE AN EFFORT ON EVERY SWING.

A week...nothing.  A month, a slight gain.  6 months, you're shallow and somehow shooting lower.

It's no different than people saying, "BUT I can't shorten my swing."

They go to the range, try it 5 times, the swing isn't shorter and they move on.

Thanks.

Any preparatory actions to do this, if any?
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#23 MizunoLaxer40

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 12:58 AM

alright awesome. one more annoying question quick... does it feel like we're pulling the right elbow to our right hip? toward the ball? where exactly? sorry for the dumb question. just want to be clear for tomorrow's range session. thanks again!
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#24 Rafared

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 06:50 AM

View PostMonteScheinblum, on 06 September 2013 - 11:44 PM, said:

View Postmiguelgolf, on 06 September 2013 - 11:33 PM, said:

But how do we do it?

Like anything else, you start on 20-30 yard wedges and MAKE AN EFFORT ON EVERY SWING.

A week...nothing.  A month, a slight gain.  6 months, you're shallow and somehow shooting lower.

It's no different than people saying, "BUT I can't shorten my swing."

They go to the range, try it 5 times, the swing isn't shorter and they move on.

That is probably the truest post ever made Monte. It takes much more time than people think to ingrain a change and make a lasting difference. It does happen but my god is it a gradual thing.
It took me 8-9 months to shorten my swing to the point that it is really noticeable on video.
I'm working on steepening the backswing plane and working the tailbone away from the ball on the way down as per your last Swingfix advice and it too is getting better........the plane in particular and I'm getting more open at impact with the body as a bonus. The early extension problem is probably half what it was, not totally eliminated but its getting there.

Still think the shaft is a bit steep in transition so going to work on this right elbow move as well to see if that helps. The pieces are starting to fall into place though, scores are much better and playing partners know that something is different even if they cant work out what it is.
Keep them coming Monte.

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#25 sblack5

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 07:50 AM

I think a point should also be made that steepening the shaft by steeping on the gas in transition is easy to do...as in it doesn't require a lot of effort to a accidently steepen the shaft and have to compensate on the rest of the way down

hit is with so much authority
that when you find it
and it sees you, it is trembling.

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#26 Sean2

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 08:31 AM

This is too funny Monte. This is exactly what I've been working on. I came up with all by my lonesome. I was trying to come up with a swing thought that worked for me, and I find that it does. It's only been about a week though.

I was afraid to say anything because I thought people would just say he's a 10 HI, what the heck does he know?
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#27 bilbry57

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 02:58 PM

My issue is OTT caused primarily being across line at top.  It's getting Better at top this leading with right elbow is next step feels like I am going to hit everything dead right. ( not case so far) got a thought  another video Monte has on his Utube Right arm in golf swing.
Right elbow follows belly button like that feel

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#28 dairic

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 03:58 PM

Loosely related but important to know. Leading pitch right elbow can get you seriously under plane if not careful.


Edited by dairic, 07 September 2013 - 04:12 PM.


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#29 BeautifulNice

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 05:45 PM

View Postdairic, on 07 September 2013 - 03:58 PM, said:

Loosely related but important to know. Leading pitch right elbow can get you seriously under plane if not careful.



But if you close the window, I think it minimizes that risk. Fun stuff!  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ok3LX7ZqeQE
My cleek is sometimes peevish.

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#30 miguelgolf

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Posted 07 September 2013 - 07:31 PM

View Postdairic, on 07 September 2013 - 03:58 PM, said:

Loosely related but important to know. Leading pitch right elbow can get you seriously under plane if not careful.



Not under plane if you've set the max uncock limit of L wrist at address already.

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