18 replies to this topic

[cap217]

Why offset?  I really hate it, its a mental thing but what is the purpose?

I want cavity backs with as little offset as I can get and my only options are blades....

WHY?

[thenewbie]

its the same as an offset for a driver. . .its just meant to help you hit it straight and not fade it, since most people don't get the face all the way back to square on impact.  your right, basically every game improvement iron has atleast a little offset. . .the same way that almost all retail drivers set up atleast a couple degrees closed.  anybody know any cavity backs with less or no offset?  I'm at a loss on this one.

[dfung]

Kind of interesting.  I've seen this description of the purpose of offset (to allow your hands to lead the clubhead a little) but it seems kind of hard to believe that's really the purpose.  Even at slow swing speeds, the difference of 1/8" can't be more than hundredths of a second - it hardly seems like the clubhead would come around much at all in that time.

I've often wondered if this is more to improve stability as you move through ground contact.  Although that offset doesn't make for much time to rotate your hands, it does cause the leading edge of the club to trail your hands as the sole makes impact with the ground.  Maybe that helps keep the swingpath straighter.  If you think about the modifications for high-handicappers, then you're normally talking about perimeter weighting (to improve MOI), bigger head (larger sweet spot), a wider sole (less digging) and offset.  Perhaps the wide sole and offset were intended to keep the head moving straight when you have non-optimal ground contact.

Callaway X-Tour irons have a pretty deep cavity/undercut and very little offset.  They also have really tiny heads from heel to toe, even shorter than a lot of modern blades, I think.

[Trxjw]

 thenewbie, on Apr 7 2007, 12:54 AM, said:

its the same as an offset for a driver. . .its just meant to help you hit it straight and not fade it, since most people don't get the face all the way back to square on impact.  your right, basically every game improvement iron has atleast a little offset. . .the same way that almost all retail drivers set up atleast a couple degrees closed.  anybody know any cavity backs with less or no offset?  I'm at a loss on this one.

Pretty much what he said.  Essentially the offset just allows your hands extra time to square up to the ball at impact.  However, there are some great clubs out with little to no offset.  More and more companies are releasing "in-between" sets of irons which offer most of the advantages of a blade, with some of the forgiveness of a cavity back. Try out the Mizuno MP60's, they're a big hit with a lot of players as are the TM R7TP's,  Callaway X-Forged and Titleist 755.    There's also combo sets like the Titleist 735.CM, Bridgestone J33c's and Nike Pro Combo's that offer a blending of blades, cavity and muscle backs all in one set.

Most irons are going to have a very slight amount of offset, but in most of those sets I listed it isn't overpowering or annoying.

Edited by Trxjw, 07 April 2007 - 12:17 AM.

[cap217]

I play 735cm's and the offset is driving me crazy...  I just took them out today for my MP 32's which are a lot better...  but I would like a cavity back.

I looked at all the clubs and most have offset, besideds blades....  The X-Forged have a lot, TP's have way too much and a thick topline...

I would like a thin topline and little/no offset and cavity backs, I dont think they are made b/c I have looked at every option I could.  What do you think>>?

[abc123tyler]

Scratch golf??  Pretty sure they do a zero offset iron.

[Gxgolfer]

There are many player's cavity backs out there today.  The key word is "players".  It really depends on the consistency of your swing and what you consider too much offset.  Callaway X-20s, X-forges don't seem to have too much offset.  If you can adjust to the small size of the head, tourstage MR-23s are probably one of the best cavity backs with smallest offsets made.  Some would say they are less forgiving than some blades.  695.CBs don't seem that bad as well.

Really depends upon your budget and eye for offset.

[TeeBonZ]

I'm not a fan of offset at all.  It looks very odd to my eye.  My last set of irons were 681's which had virtually none.  I've looked at alot of clubs and what looks minimal to others still looks like alot to me...hell I think the MP-32's look quite offset.  Anyway, I'm currently playing Bridgestone J33CB's bent one weak (48* PW) and they look near perfect...easily the least offset I have seen in a CB and I've looked at a bunch.

[dispatch096]

i thought it was to help get the ball in the air. i have hit blades and huge cavity backs and found no difference in righ to left action.

[spk74]

Don't mean to shift the thread...well...yes I do.  I have a conspiracy theory about offset irons that is based on watching my dad adjust to cavities over the last few years (after playing Kroyden blades since childhood).  Offset irons make hitting onset woods very difficult.  If you groove your swing with an offset 7 iron and move up through to a very offset 3-iron... by the time you switch over to driver (with negative offset), if you keep your grooved swing consistent, you're hosed.  It's almost like offset irons set you up to slice a driver.

Perhaps this is preposterous.  Can anyone else identify?

[jboyd1]

the 695cb has the same offset as the mb's      Only difference is loft and bounce.       I just got these last week and they are awesome.

[cxissi]

 cap217, on Apr 6 2007, 10:59 PM, said:

Why offset?  I really hate it, its a mental thing but what is the purpose?

I want cavity backs with as little offset as I can get and my only options are blades....

WHY?

Try the cobra carbon cb's they have very little offset for cb irons. Less than the r7tp,755, 735,
or any mizuno cb's. Nice feel as well.
gb

[KammaQwazi]

 spk74, on Apr 7 2007, 11:42 AM, said:

Don't mean to shift the thread...well...yes I do.  I have a conspiracy theory about offset irons that is based on watching my dad adjust to cavities over the last few years (after playing Kroyden blades since childhood).  Offset irons make hitting onset woods very difficult.  If you groove your swing with an offset 7 iron and move up through to a very offset 3-iron... by the time you switch over to driver (with negative offset), if you keep your grooved swing consistent, you're hosed.  It's almost like offset irons set you up to slice a driver.

Perhaps this is preposterous.  Can anyone else identify?

Thats kind of how my dad does it.  My irons have a huge amount of offset(Tommy armour 845 fs's) and I hook the bejezus out of them.  When I get to my driver, I still hit a high draw, so I must just have a draw swing.  For some people like my dad who don't have draw swings they probably do have to adjust.

[diablojoe]

"Addtional time to square the face" is one of golf's great myths. It's a couple of millimeters, for goshsakes!!! You can't even line up the ball that accurately between any two swings. Know how much time goes by when an iron travels 2mm going 70mph (or 31,300 mm/sec)? That would be 0.000064 seconds. Is that really enough time to "have more time to square up the clubface?" C'mon, folks. Put on your thinking caps.

Offset causes the shaft tip to flex more. It moves the COG farther away from the shaft axis. Every clubhead has some degree of COG-shaft axis offset, and this causes the toe of the head to drop, and the loft to increase, as the club is swung fast. More offset merely increases the effect and, hence, helps less-skilled golfers who have trouble getting the ball up and trouble squaring the face.

All drivers have offset (a lot, in fact). All irons have offset. It's a matter of degree.

[hobbes]

Thanks for the explanation diablojoe, I've always heard it was about getting the ball up but never knew how.

[aglove]

No doubt they help you get them up in the air.  However I've always fought a big draw/hook with my rac OS2's, and recently played a full round with a friend's set of r7 TP's.  To my surpirse I rarely hooked them and even left a few out to the right.  Went straight to the range after my round with my rac OS2's and the big draw was back.  Club or offset?

[herkyjerk]

All good explanations.  Don't mean to threadjack, but is anybody else not bothered by off-set in short irons but hates it in long ones?  I cannot stand how my 5 iron looks at address but the gap wedge sits wonderful to my eye.  I know most people build combo sets doing the opposite of this, but the longer the club it bothers me.  On a wedge I don't even see it.  Weird?

[hardten]

I guess its in the eye of the beholder.I have played 15 sets of top of the line forged CBs over the last 18 years and blades be fore that and don,t think Xforged and R7tps have a lot of offset.And thick top line?? Frankly if you think they have a lot off offset and thick toplines you might as well get some butterknifes.

[drpurpell]

I always thought that offset allows the COG to be pushed back further therefore helping to get the ball in the air.