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Updated 2013 Trackman PGA Tour Averages


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#1 QMany

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:06 AM

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#2 DNice26

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:13 AM

-1.3 attack......huh....would have thought it would be more positive.  Launch angle average is also sort of lowish I would think...

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#3 scratchswinger

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:30 AM

Thanks for posting this... I am essentially below average...

Edited by scratchswinger, 18 April 2013 - 10:30 AM.


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#4 geesecougar2

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:36 AM

-5 for the PW? That seems really shallow to me.

Maybe that's why I take dinnerplates with my PW
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#5 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:36 AM

View PostDNice26, on 18 April 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

-1.3 attack......huh....would have thought it would be more positive.  Launch angle average is also sort of lowish I would think...

Thanks for posting.

Plus angle with driver might be technically optimal for distance, it is not necessarily and likely not for accuracy.

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#6 sonofagunn

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 10:46 AM

So I'm one club shorter than PGA average. Not bad considering...

Biggest difference is my launch is much higher, yet vertical descent isn't as steep with irons. Less backspin. Not suprising, and it validates what I'm trying to work on.

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#7 QMany

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:00 AM

I'm essentially right on most of the PGA Tour averages. Admittedly, I probably overswing. LOL

Depends a little on lofts too.
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#8 Lefty Light HItter

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:05 AM

View Postgeesecougar2, on 18 April 2013 - 10:36 AM, said:

-5 for the PW? That seems really shallow to me.

Maybe that's why I take dinnerplates with my PW
Yea I feel like my swing really sucks now.  Did a fitting last week and averaged -9.2* with a 7i.
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#9 tembolo1284

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:12 AM

Ugh I need to work on my launch numbers. I'm throwing away my swing speed by hacking down on it too much.

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#10 bruinsPATSirish

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:15 AM

Well my numbers match up pretty solid, too bad my game only matches up with them about once a month...

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#11 mgranato

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 11:26 AM

Do you have a link to that chart?  I believe this might be old data... 3 wood - PW numbers are identical to 2009 numbers across the board.  The driver data is fractionally different compared to the 2009.  Cannot imagine every club, down the the exact spin rate, has not changed in 4 years.  Swing speeds HAVE NOT been the same since 2009 according to other TM data.

Edited by mgranato, 18 April 2013 - 11:27 AM.


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#12 andre112

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:40 PM

only driver and hybrid have different numbers comparing to the old chart

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#13 midweston

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 04:52 PM

I wonder what the average roll out numbers are on the driver?

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#14 kekoa

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 05:05 PM

I'm a good 1 club short on everything.  Especially from 5i - down. :(

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#15 mallrat

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Posted 18 April 2013 - 05:23 PM

I'd like to see path numbers


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#16 QMany

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 08:53 AM

View Postmgranato, on 18 April 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

Do you have a link to that chart?  I believe this might be old data... 3 wood - PW numbers are identical to 2009 numbers across the board.  The driver data is fractionally different compared to the 2009.  Cannot imagine every club, down the the exact spin rate, has not changed in 4 years.  Swing speeds HAVE NOT been the same since 2009 according to other TM data.

The PDF is available on their website. You just have to signup (free).

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#17 Asleep

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 09:08 AM

So, I'm only 4 clubs shorter than Gary Woodland. Cool. :beach:
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#18 InaSilentWay

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.

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#19 Evil Ecstasy

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:01 AM

too bad we dont see roll

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#20 nikuk

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 03:11 PM

View PostInaSilentWay, on 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.
if thats positive than you have an incredible flip.

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#21 bph7

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 04:59 PM

View PostInaSilentWay, on 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.

I don't think its a big secret that shallower attack angles lead to more consistent contact and more controllable ball-flight.  Especially if going into the wind, hitting way down into it is just gonna balloon it up into the air.  Also, the steaper AOA's inherently will lead to more thin/fat shots when the ball is not struck exactly in the right place.  If you have a shallow angle, its not quick as important to be as precise in where along the path you contact the ball, as the clubhead is in an "acceptable" area to produce at least passable contact for more of its path.  Finally, pivot and body-release driven swings, which are more repeatable usually, tend to have shallower AOA's and a lot of tour players, who dont rely on their hands as much to square the face, would tend to have characteristics like this in their swings.

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#22 highergr0und

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 05:18 PM

Those numbers are awesome.  So consistent.  Look at the shot heights....  for everyone that wants to hit driver low it's tied with 7 iron for the highest apex of all the clubs.  

Just remember that these guys play for control.  You can deloft the heck out of a high lofted club and dump it into the ground at a severe angle, but can you do it the same every time?

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#23 Yepyukon

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 05:36 PM

Thanks for posting this.

Odd, my hybrid - 6iron carry distances are about the same but I am about a club shorter with Driver, 3 wood, and 7iron - pw

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#24 Golfrnut

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Posted 19 April 2013 - 11:46 PM

View Postbph7, on 19 April 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

View PostInaSilentWay, on 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.

I don't think its a big secret that shallower attack angles lead to more consistent contact and more controllable ball-flight.  Especially if going into the wind, hitting way down into it is just gonna balloon it up into the air.  Also, the steaper AOA's inherently will lead to more thin/fat shots when the ball is not struck exactly in the right place.  If you have a shallow angle, its not quick as important to be as precise in where along the path you contact the ball, as the clubhead is in an "acceptable" area to produce at least passable contact for more of its path.  Finally, pivot and body-release driven swings, which are more repeatable usually, tend to have shallower AOA's and a lot of tour players, who dont rely on their hands as much to square the face, would tend to have characteristics like this in their swings.

Hitting down "more" does not increase launch.
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#25 bph7

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 04:37 PM

View PostGolfrnut, on 19 April 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:

View Postbph7, on 19 April 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

View PostInaSilentWay, on 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.

I don't think its a big secret that shallower attack angles lead to more consistent contact and more controllable ball-flight.  Especially if going into the wind, hitting way down into it is just gonna balloon it up into the air.  Also, the steaper AOA's inherently will lead to more thin/fat shots when the ball is not struck exactly in the right place.  If you have a shallow angle, its not quick as important to be as precise in where along the path you contact the ball, as the clubhead is in an "acceptable" area to produce at least passable contact for more of its path.  Finally, pivot and body-release driven swings, which are more repeatable usually, tend to have shallower AOA's and a lot of tour players, who dont rely on their hands as much to square the face, would tend to have characteristics like this in their swings.

Hitting down "more" does not increase launch.

I guess I wasn't clear enough.  You are right that hitting down more doesn't increase launch directly.  But a more negative AOA for a constant dynamic loft is going to result in a higher spin loft.  This will increase spin and decrease ballspeed.  This is why the ball balloons up in the air into the wind more if you hit down more into it.


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#26 radiman

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 10:08 PM

Interesting data.  Makes me feel a little better being close to the tour average on most clubs. :)  Thank God dispersion isn't listed, that would just kill my buzz.
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#27 Golfrnut

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Posted 20 April 2013 - 10:41 PM

View Postbph7, on 20 April 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

View PostGolfrnut, on 19 April 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:

View Postbph7, on 19 April 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

View PostInaSilentWay, on 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.

I don't think its a big secret that shallower attack angles lead to more consistent contact and more controllable ball-flight.  Especially if going into the wind, hitting way down into it is just gonna balloon it up into the air.  Also, the steaper AOA's inherently will lead to more thin/fat shots when the ball is not struck exactly in the right place.  If you have a shallow angle, its not quick as important to be as precise in where along the path you contact the ball, as the clubhead is in an "acceptable" area to produce at least passable contact for more of its path.  Finally, pivot and body-release driven swings, which are more repeatable usually, tend to have shallower AOA's and a lot of tour players, who dont rely on their hands as much to square the face, would tend to have characteristics like this in their swings.

Hitting down "more" does not increase launch.

I guess I wasn't clear enough.  You are right that hitting down more doesn't increase launch directly.  But a more negative AOA for a constant dynamic loft is going to result in a higher spin loft.  This will increase spin and decrease ballspeed.  This is why the ball balloons up in the air into the wind more if you hit down more into it.


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#28 PutterKilledTheDream

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 12:23 AM

View Postbph7, on 20 April 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

View PostGolfrnut, on 19 April 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:

View Postbph7, on 19 April 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

View PostInaSilentWay, on 19 April 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

How on earth does one get a -5 degree aoa with  a PW? I wouldn't be suprised if mine was 20-30 degrees.

I don't think its a big secret that shallower attack angles lead to more consistent contact and more controllable ball-flight.  Especially if going into the wind, hitting way down into it is just gonna balloon it up into the air.  Also, the steaper AOA's inherently will lead to more thin/fat shots when the ball is not struck exactly in the right place.  If you have a shallow angle, its not quick as important to be as precise in where along the path you contact the ball, as the clubhead is in an "acceptable" area to produce at least passable contact for more of its path.  Finally, pivot and body-release driven swings, which are more repeatable usually, tend to have shallower AOA's and a lot of tour players, who dont rely on their hands as much to square the face, would tend to have characteristics like this in their swings.

Hitting down "more" does not increase launch.

I guess I wasn't clear enough.  You are right that hitting down more doesn't increase launch directly.  But a more negative AOA for a constant dynamic loft is going to result in a higher spin loft.  This will increase spin and decrease ballspeed.  This is why the ball balloons up in the air into the wind more if you hit down more into it.
  That statement is a bit misleading in that there really is no 'constant' dynamic loft with a change in AoA. More negative AoA usually leads to decreased dynamic lofts, hence no real change to the spin loft.

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#29 bph7

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 09:02 AM

View PostPutterKilledTheDream, on 21 April 2013 - 12:23 AM, said:

That statement is a bit misleading in that there really is no 'constant' dynamic loft with a change in AoA. More negative AoA usually leads to decreased dynamic lofts, hence no real change to the spin loft.

You know more about this than me, so a question:  Couldn't you be coming down at a steeper angle, but have the club more even with your hands (like if you were flipping), so the difference between dynamic loft and AoA would still be greater than if you were in a better impact position, with your hands ahead of the ball and a shallower AoA?  I understand that AoA will lower dynamic lofts, but is it really ALWAYS going to lower dynamic loft by the EXACT amount of the change in AoA such that spin loft won't ever be affected? If this is so, then what is the point of measuring spin loft?  Wouldn't dynamic loft be the only piece of information you need to figure out spin info, if spin loft isn't gonna change as AoA changes?

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#30 PutterKilledTheDream

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Posted 21 April 2013 - 12:23 PM

Really good question. The answer is no, there is no perfect scenario where for every 1* down you lose 1* of loft. A higher handicap player could potentially flip and hit down more, but the better player typically has significant shaft lean. Even further, the more you hit down the more you increase the chance of catching the ball lower on the face which causes the clubhead to roll over the ball ( i.e. vertical gear effect) which reduces the dyamic loft even further. Spin is mostly a result of clubhead speed, impact location, ball type, and quality of grooves....spin loft is more a measurement of compression or energy transfer to the ball.  The higher the number the more 'glancing' the blow and less direct of a hit.

dynamic loft- attack angle really translates to mean the effective energy of the angle of the club ( loft) pulling the ball up the face working against the energy of the clubhead moving downward trying to pull the ball down. Opposing 'energies' working different directions causes slower ball speed, more spin, less carry distance. In my experience with Trackman, ball type affects spin rates more than changes to spin loft.


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