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Callaway fitting session... driver, fairway, irons...


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#1 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:53 PM

I am in the market for some new clubs, and was kindly set up to go and see Callaway's new range today.

A bit of background first.... 33 years old, 0.2 handicap, usual driver swing speed around 120-125mph. My bad shot is usually a high block. I used a Callaway Hex Black Tour ball for all of the shots.

My current driver is a Ping i20 9.5 with a GD AD DI-6x shaft, my fairway is a Ping G20 16.5 with a GD AD DI-7x, and my irons are Callaway X Forged '09 with PX Flighted 6.0.

Below is an average of my 10 best shots...

Driver

Ping i20 9.5 with a GD AD DI-6x shaft.
Average based on 10 shots
- Club Speed MPH: 122.7
- Ball Speed MPH: 183.4
- Smash Factor: 1.49
- Launch Angle: 13.7
- Back Spin: 2282
- Carry Distance: 296.2
- Total Distance: 314.6

I wasn't too displeased with these figures, as this was the first club I hit and was a bit cold. I hit he i20 well, and think of it as one of the best heads out there.



Callaway X Hot Pro 9.5 with a Project X Velocity 6.5 (stock) / AD DI-6x / Motore Speeder 6.2 Tour Spec-x / Matrix Black Tie 7M3x / Oban Kiyoshi Purple 65x / Diamana Kai'li 60x
- Club Speed MPH: 126.3 / 127.1 / 125.6 / 123.1 / 125.5 / 126.0
- Ball Speed MPH: 183.4 / 192.2 / 185.4 / 180.5 / 185.1 / 189.9
- Smash Factor: 1.45 / 1.51 / 1.48 / 1.47 / 1.47 / 1.51
- Launch Angle: 15.9 / 14.8 / 14.1 / 13.8 / 15.7 / 14.4
- Back Spin: 2835 / 2024 / 2518 / 2318 / 3014 / 2608
- Carry Distance: 299.4 / 309.8 / 304.1 / 298.6 / 284.5 / 306.2
- Total Distance: 308.9 / 325.6 / 320.3 / 318.1 / 299.2 / 321.8

At this point I was salivating at the X Hot Pro/AD DI-6x combo..but I was equally underwhelmed by the Kiyoshi Purple. The X Hot Pro is a great looking driver, sounds great and feels really hot off the face. I was sold... until I tried the Razr Fit Xtreme...


Callaway Razr Fit Xtreme 9.5 with Aldila Trinity x, Matrix Black Tie 7M3x, AD DI-6x,  Motore Speeder 6.2 Tour Spec-x, Diamana Kai'li 60x
- Club Speed MPH: 125.1 / 123.8 / 128.9 / 127.5 / 127.1
- Ball Speed MPH: 188.9 / 185.4 / 196.7 / 191.0 / 190.6
- Smash Factor: 1.51 / 1.50 / 1.53 / 1.50 / 1.50
- Launch Angle: 15.9 / 14.7 / 15.1 / 14.9 / 14.5
- Back Spin: 2408 / 2299 / 1956 / 2064 / 2108
- Carry Distance: 301.9 / 299.8 / 316.8 / 308.2 / 306.5
- Total Distance: 317.4 / 316.5 / 338.8 / 325.1 / 320.2

Holy &%*% the Xtreme with any shaft is a rocket launcher, but with the AD DI it takes it to a whole new level. I have NEVER seen spin figures that low on one of my drivers, and haven't seen ball speeds like that since before the COR was restricted back in 2007 . I kept hitting it harder and harder, and the spin didn't increase by more than 100rpm. Needless to say, I now have a Razr Fit Xtreme on order.


Fairways (off the deck)...

Ping G20 16.5 with AD DI-7x
- Club Speed MPH: 116.7
- Ball Speed MPH: 174.4
- Smash Factor: 1.49
- Launch Angle: 15.8
- Back Spin: 3396
- Carry Distance: 274.6
- Total Distance: 283.2

I knew that my 4 wood spun a bit too much, but I didn't realise that it would be quite as bad as the trackman indicated.

I hit the X Hot and X Hot pro fairways, but I'm not going to lie... I didn't like them. I didn't like the colour, the feel, but most importantly they were WAY too light, sprayed the ball everywhere and spun far too much for me. However, I did try the Razr Fit Xtreme 3 wood...

Callaway Razr Fit Xtreme 3 wood with Trinity, 7M3, AD DI-7x, Diamana Kai'li
- Club Speed MPH: 116.7 / 113.1 / 118.4 / 118.7
- Ball Speed MPH: 174.4 / 170.9 / 178.4 / 181.0
- Smash Factor: 1.49 / 1.51 / 1.51 / 1.52
- Launch Angle: 14.8 / 14.4 / 15.2 / 15.7
- Back Spin: 3496 / 3220 / 3151 / 2980
- Carry Distance: 282.6 / 281.0 / 285.7 / 288.3
- Total Distance: 293.4 / 293.8 / 296.3 / 300.2

The Xtreme & Kai'li combo is mindblowing. It's the best feeling fairway wood I have hit, and has SUCH a hot face. I had it set closed to increase the loft up to 16 degrees. Again... it's ordered!


Finally, we got to the irons (6 iron)...

Current irons - Callaway X Forged '09 with PX Flighted 6.0
- Club Speed MPH: 98.8
- Ball Speed MPH: 142.8
- Smash Factor: 1.45
- Launch Angle: 17.9
- Back Spin: 4789
- Carry Distance: 201.1
- Total Distance: 212.4

I really like my irons, although they do occasionally get caught up in the wind. Originally I only wanted to try the new X Forged...

Callaway X Forged 2013 with PXi, PX non-flighted, PX95, KBS Tour, KBS C-Taper
- Club Speed MPH: 100.1 / 98.9 / 99.2 / 98.1 / 97.5
- Ball Speed MPH: 145.5 / 143.5 / 144.9 / 142.8 / 141.0
- Smash Factor: 1.45 / 1.45 / 1.46 / 1.46 / 1.45
- Launch Angle: 18.0 / 17.5 / 17.8 / 17.6 / 16.9
- Back Spin: 4206 / 4064 / 4360 / 4589 / 3937
- Carry Distance: 206.0 / 206.1 / 202.7 / 199.7 / 194.4
- Total Distance: 217.5 / 215.2 / 212.0 / 207.7 / 204.5

Overall I was very impressed with the new X Forged. They go a bit further and spin less than my existing irons, although this is probably more down to the grooves. I really like the PXi shafts, but was unimpressed by the KBS offerings.

Finally I tried the X Hot Pro irons...

X Hot Pro with PXi, PX Non-flighted, PX95
- Club Speed MPH: 101.1 / 100.3 / 100.9
- Ball Speed MPH: 149.9 / 148.8 / 149.2
- Smash Factor: 1.48 / 1.48 / 1.48
- Launch Angle: 16.1 / 15.7 / 16.4
- Back Spin: 3956 / 3894 / 4028
- Carry Distance: 220.7 / 217.4 / 214.0
- Total Distance: 231.3 / 228.4 / 222.8

The X Hot Pro are RIDICULOUSLY GOOD. I am totally in love with the look, the feel, and the performance. They are 20+ yards longer than my X Forged, spin less and launch lower. I don't know how Callaway have managed it, but they have created probably the best set of irons ever. Normally I wouldn't even think about using a cast iron, but these are too good to ignore.

I would have gone for them with the dreamy feeling and looking PXi shaft, but unfortunately it's not available in the X Hot Tour due to the tip type. Instead I went with the non-flighted PX.

All in all, Callaway have struck gold this year IMO.

Sorry for the long post...

Bullet Hollowpoint Driver 8.5
Howson Hippo 3 wood
Nike Slingshot Irons
Bronty Chipmaster Mk.III
Alien Sand Wedge
TM Nubbins Putter

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#2 jay65

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:12 PM

Sounds like you have all bases covered there!

#3 mjwidell

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:18 PM

Wow, impressive numbers! Amazing to see how much better the AD DI fits you than any other driver shaft.
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#4 JustTheTips

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:23 PM

If you are hitting your  6 iron over 200 yards, shouldn't you be worried strictly about dispersion and the ability to generate the shots you want? Given this is a classic case of comparing a 6 iron (hot pro) to a 5 iron (x forged), it always seem to me that the concern is how well do you hit the 3 (xforged) versus 4 (x hot pro. Unless you think you can game that 3 iron) as that would be you longest iron. And how you  like the gaps with the 8-PW.

Those woods are just crazy. If you get anything like that on the course, you might not hit a 6 iron on a par 4 all season.....

#5 rondre3000

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:34 PM

Did you compare 6 iron of X Forged (30*) vs 6 iron of XHot Pro (27*), or did you compare comparable lofts?


#6 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:46 PM

View Postrondre3000, on 05 February 2013 - 02:34 PM, said:

Did you compare 6 iron of X Forged (30*) vs 6 iron of XHot Pro (27*), or did you compare comparable lofts?

I compared 6 iron to 6 iron, and on a standard set there would be a pretty large loft discrepancy, but my irons are 2 degrees strong, so it is less of an issue. To be honest, additional distance isn't the reason I bought them... they look gorgeous, are ridiculously easy to hit, accurate, launch low, and don't spin too much.
Bullet Hollowpoint Driver 8.5
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#7 rondre3000

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:51 PM

Thank you for clarifying...hope you enjoy the new sticks.

#8 PingDrv00

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:39 PM

I was just wondering were you able to try the PXI due to the test club being a Demo head in the XHot Pro?  I was really wanting that combo as well in the X-Hot.  I was quite surprised how easy the X-Forged were to hit though, but now you have me thinking about the Pros.
Driver. RBZ Tour TP 9 Kaili 70x
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#9 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:43 PM

View PostPingDrv00, on 05 February 2013 - 03:39 PM, said:

I was just wondering were you able to try the PXI due to the test club being a Demo head in the XHot Pro?  I was really wanting that combo as well in the X-Hot.  I was quite surprised how easy the X-Forged were to hit though, but now you have me thinking about the Pros.

Yes, the X Hot Pro 6 iron was a demo, so any shaft could be screwed in to it. Apparently the PXi is a taper tip, whereas the retail X Hot Pro irons only accept parallel tips (or I may have that back to front... I can't remember due to rolling my eyes so much at the time of being told).

Definitely try the Pros... I thought being cast they would be harsh, but they are actually buttery soft. They are a revelation!
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#10 PingDrv00

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:27 PM

I hate to hear that on the PXi's.  I was really looking at them as the shaft for my next set.  I wish they would work in the XHot's.

Driver. RBZ Tour TP 9 Kaili 70x
Three Wood: RBZ Tour TP 14.5 RIP Beta 70
Hybrid: Adams Super LS 19 Kuro Kage
Irons: TaylorMade 2014 CB 4,5, MC 6-PW
Putter: Odyssey Protype Black #9
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#11 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:31 PM

View PostPingDrv00, on 05 February 2013 - 04:27 PM, said:

I hate to hear that on the PXi's.  I was really looking at them as the shaft for my next set.  I wish they would work in the XHot's.

Yeah I know. It just seems ridiculous that all of their irons aren't either all parallel or all tapered. There's no reason for it... the fitter struggled to come up with an explanation too.

I have just seen on the US Callaway online store that PXi are available in the X Hot Tour irons... but I guess that's either a mistake or they use a crowbar to make them fit.
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#12 jaskanski

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM

Where did you get these readings?

#13 PingDrv00

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:

View PostPingDrv00, on 05 February 2013 - 04:27 PM, said:

I hate to hear that on the PXi's.  I was really looking at them as the shaft for my next set.  I wish they would work in the XHot's.

Yeah I know. It just seems ridiculous that all of their irons aren't either all parallel or all tapered. There's no reason for it... the fitter struggled to come up with an explanation too.

I have just seen on the US Callaway online store that PXi are available in the X Hot Tour irons... but I guess that's either a mistake or they use a crowbar to make them fit.

It shows it as an option on the main site, but you cannot build it in there shop that way.  I am going to give them a call and see what I can find out.
Driver. RBZ Tour TP 9 Kaili 70x
Three Wood: RBZ Tour TP 14.5 RIP Beta 70
Hybrid: Adams Super LS 19 Kuro Kage
Irons: TaylorMade 2014 CB 4,5, MC 6-PW
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Wedges: Vokey 53/10 and 59/7

#14 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

Where did you get these readings?

From the Trackman at Callaway HQ.
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#15 setter02

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:46 PM

Had my fitting yesterday and getting a Razr Fit with the GD DI AD-7X (like the weight) and the X Hot Pro's (4-PW) with the PX 95 7.0's.  The Pro's are really good looking irons!  Can't wait for them to come in to hit outdoors.

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#16 Sean25rp

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:53 PM

Mark, you are a beast with those numbers! Callaway range looks great this year! Enjoy the new toys!

#17 jaskanski

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:54 PM

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

Where did you get these readings?

From the Trackman at Callaway HQ.

Do you think 1.45 smash factor for a 6-iron is reasonable? And would 4000rpm of spin be enough to hold a green from 200 yards?
I'm not calling your results into question, but alarm bells usually start ringing when (a) the theoretical smash factor is exceeded for a driver and 6-iron (compared to professional tours and with a forged iron) and (b) there is no comparative data with the same shafts in any other heads or vice versa.

Edited by jaskanski, 05 February 2013 - 04:55 PM.


#18 Sean25rp

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:55 PM

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

Where did you get these readings?

From the Trackman at Callaway HQ.

In the UK?

#19 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:02 PM

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:54 PM, said:

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

Where did you get these readings?

From the Trackman at Callaway HQ.

Do you think 1.45 smash factor for a 6-iron is reasonable? And would 4000rpm of spin be enough to hold a green from 200 yards?
I'm not calling your results into question, but alarm bells usually start ringing when (a) the theoretical smash factor is exceeded for a driver and 6-iron (compared to professional tours and with a forged iron) and (b) there is no comparative data with the same shafts in any other heads or vice versa.

I see no reason why Callaway would try to "juice" the LM when I am directly comparing Callaway irons, and I'm pretty sure Trackman is just about the most accurate LM out there.

4000rpm is plenty enough spin to hold a green... it all depends on the trajectory of the shot. I hit the ball high, so it lands softer than most.
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#20 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:02 PM

View PostSean25rp, on 05 February 2013 - 04:55 PM, said:

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

Where did you get these readings?

From the Trackman at Callaway HQ.

In the UK?

Yes, Surrey.

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#21 jaskanski

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:06 PM

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 05:02 PM, said:

View PostSean25rp, on 05 February 2013 - 04:55 PM, said:

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

Where did you get these readings?

From the Trackman at Callaway HQ.

In the UK?

Yes, Surrey.

The indoor one?

#22 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:07 PM

Yes, the performance centre.
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#23 AmazinBlue

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:12 PM

WOW!  Ummm... Those numbers are somewhat staggering.  I am impressed how one shaft stands out so much from the others in each case of driver, 3w, irons.  With 6-iron numbers like that, you're gonna need a lot of wedges.

I'm happy that you defined why you like the Xtreme over the Xhot/pro woods.  No one has mentioned that weight was a factor as to why they chose the Xtreme.

I'm curious, did you find a draw bias with the Xtreme weighting with the 13-gram weight in the heel, or did you move or change them.

Thanks for the detailed review it's very helpful.  Now I can't wait for my Xtreme to show up on the doorstep.
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#24 jaskanski

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM

Please understand that we're not calling your golfing ability into question Mark, but it has to be noted that the Trackman readings are unusual. Increased ballspeed outside of the optimal 1.37 for a 6-iron can sometimes denote (gulp) off-centre strikes. A decent fitter would probably pick up on these numbers pretty quickly. I'd be inclined to take those numbers with a pinch of salt until you could compare them with validity in the real world - ie outside with confirmed yardages.
But hey - you're out demoing clubs. It's certainly better than most.

Edited by jaskanski, 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM.


#25 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM

View PostAmazinBlue, on 05 February 2013 - 05:12 PM, said:

WOW!  Ummm... Those numbers are somewhat staggering.  I am impressed how one shaft stands out so much from the others in each case of driver, 3w, irons.  With 6-iron numbers like that, you're gonna need a lot of wedges.

I'm happy that you defined why you like the Xtreme over the Xhot/pro woods.  No one has mentioned that weight was a factor as to why they chose the Xtreme.

I'm curious, did you find a draw bias with the Xtreme weighting with the 13-gram weight in the heel, or did you move or change them.

Thanks for the detailed review it's very helpful.  Now I can't wait for my Xtreme to show up on the doorstep.

I had a bit of a play around with the weights, and settled for 13 in the toe and 1 in the heel in the end.

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#26 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:18 PM

View Postjaskanski, on 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

Please understand that we're not calling your golfing ability into question Mark, but it has to be noted that the Trackman readings are unusual. Increased ballspeed outside of the optimal 1.37 for a 6-iron can sometimes denote (gulp) off-centre strikes. A decent fitter would probably pick up on these numbers pretty quickly. I'd be inclined to take those numbers with a pinch of salt until you could compare them with validity in the real world - ie outside with confirmed yardages.
But hey - you're out demoing clubs. It's certainly better than most.

It's ok Jaskanski... no offense taken. Every single LM session readout gets questioned on here, so there's no reason mine shouldn't be too.

I don't really care what the smash factor says... what I do care about is that they felt good and went straight... anything else is just a pleasant bonus.
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#27 jaskanski

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:23 PM

feeling good is good enough

#28 AmazinBlue

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:25 PM

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

View PostAmazinBlue, on 05 February 2013 - 05:12 PM, said:

WOW!  Ummm... Those numbers are somewhat staggering.  I am impressed how one shaft stands out so much from the others in each case of driver, 3w, irons.  With 6-iron numbers like that, you're gonna need a lot of wedges.

I'm happy that you defined why you like the Xtreme over the Xhot/pro woods.  No one has mentioned that weight was a factor as to why they chose the Xtreme.

I'm curious, did you find a draw bias with the Xtreme weighting with the 13-gram weight in the heel, or did you move or change them.

Thanks for the detailed review it's very helpful.  Now I can't wait for my Xtreme to show up on the doorstep.

I had a bit of a play around with the weights, and settled for 13 in the toe and 1 in the heel in the end.
Mark, did you find that having the 13 in the toe made the driver flight much straighter?  I just ordered an Xtreme with the Trinity in stiff, my SS is about 106 with a smooth transition and my biggest concern is the extreme (no pun intended) weighting difference between the 13 and 1 gram weights.  I definitely don't want or need any draw bias in my driver.  I was thinking about getting a weight kit also so I could balance them better, but I don't want to waste $40 if I don't need to.
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#29 MarkFromTheUK

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:31 PM

View PostAmazinBlue, on 05 February 2013 - 05:25 PM, said:

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

View PostAmazinBlue, on 05 February 2013 - 05:12 PM, said:

WOW!  Ummm... Those numbers are somewhat staggering.  I am impressed how one shaft stands out so much from the others in each case of driver, 3w, irons.  With 6-iron numbers like that, you're gonna need a lot of wedges.

I'm happy that you defined why you like the Xtreme over the Xhot/pro woods.  No one has mentioned that weight was a factor as to why they chose the Xtreme.

I'm curious, did you find a draw bias with the Xtreme weighting with the 13-gram weight in the heel, or did you move or change them.

Thanks for the detailed review it's very helpful.  Now I can't wait for my Xtreme to show up on the doorstep.

I had a bit of a play around with the weights, and settled for 13 in the toe and 1 in the heel in the end.
Mark, did you find that having the 13 in the toe made the driver flight much straighter?  I just ordered an Xtreme with the Trinity in stiff, my SS is about 106 with a smooth transition and my biggest concern is the extreme (no pun intended) weighting difference between the 13 and 1 gram weights.  I definitely don't want or need any draw bias in my driver.  I was thinking about getting a weight kit also so I could balance them better, but I don't want to waste $40 if I don't need to.

It went pretty straight in either configuration. With the 13 in the heel I tended to hit 7-12 yard draws, but with it in the fade bias configuration with 13 in the toe the draw was reduced to around 3-5 yard draws.
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#30 AmazinBlue

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:36 PM

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

View PostAmazinBlue, on 05 February 2013 - 05:25 PM, said:

View PostMarkFromTheUK, on 05 February 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

View PostAmazinBlue, on 05 February 2013 - 05:12 PM, said:

WOW!  Ummm... Those numbers are somewhat staggering.  I am impressed how one shaft stands out so much from the others in each case of driver, 3w, irons.  With 6-iron numbers like that, you're gonna need a lot of wedges.

I'm happy that you defined why you like the Xtreme over the Xhot/pro woods.  No one has mentioned that weight was a factor as to why they chose the Xtreme.

I'm curious, did you find a draw bias with the Xtreme weighting with the 13-gram weight in the heel, or did you move or change them.

Thanks for the detailed review it's very helpful.  Now I can't wait for my Xtreme to show up on the doorstep.

I had a bit of a play around with the weights, and settled for 13 in the toe and 1 in the heel in the end.
Mark, did you find that having the 13 in the toe made the driver flight much straighter?  I just ordered an Xtreme with the Trinity in stiff, my SS is about 106 with a smooth transition and my biggest concern is the extreme (no pun intended) weighting difference between the 13 and 1 gram weights.  I definitely don't want or need any draw bias in my driver.  I was thinking about getting a weight kit also so I could balance them better, but I don't want to waste $40 if I don't need to.

It went pretty straight in either configuration. With the 13 in the heel I tended to hit 7-12 yard draws, but with it in the fade bias configuration with 13 in the toe the draw was reduced to around 3-5 yard draws.
Do you normally hit a draw anyway?  Not to go by what the pros do, but Phil M has a 5gr in the toe and 3gr in the heel.  One of main reasons for getting the driver is how incredibly straight it seems to go.  My favorite drive of the last several years in the Cally RHT and I played that with the RIP Alpha and loved it, but for some reason I want find something longer and straighter.

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