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Pace of play. Will it filter down?


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#1 Willie Malay

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:48 AM

If the PGA actually succeeds in speeding up the pros(which I doubt will even happen), will it have any effect on the local muni? I say it won't do a thing but then again I've been wrong before.


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#2 bscinstnct

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:55 AM

View PostWillie Malay, on 05 February 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

If the PGA actually succeeds in speeding up the pros(which I doubt will even happen), will it have any effect on the local muni? I say it won't do a thing but then again I've been wrong before.

If the average golfer shoot 30 shots more than the average pro, so let's see

thats an extra 5 minutes a shot or something, so let's see thats

an extra 150 minutes, extra 2.5 hours and then there are 4 golfers, so lets see thats and extra

10 hours

Considering the pros are taking like 5 hours, it's amazing the average golfer does not take, lets see...

15 hours.

Edited by bscinstnct, 05 February 2013 - 10:58 AM.


#3 Willie Malay

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:40 AM

I sure hope you don't do the National budget :)

#4 _MS22_

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 11:59 AM

Zero chance it'll work.  Zero.  Not a 0.000001% chance.

On the off chance the PGA speeds up the pros enough to make the commentators and viewers take note (highly unlikely), we'd need 100% of all players to acknowledge it as well as put it in to practice.  It only takes one slow group to screw the pace of play.  

Simply put a trickle-down effect is not possible whatsoever.

My club instituted a policy where any players running over 2:05 for 9 holes, yes all of our rounds are put on the clock from tee off to green, are given a warning, a written warning, and finally the inability to book times during the "busy hours" on weekends.  That worked for the majority of players.  However that can't be done at 95% of courses.  People don't understand politely asking, rewarding positive behavior, etc.  They need to have privileges removed or be penalized; until a system like that can be put in place rounds will continue to be 4+.
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#5 Willie Malay

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:04 PM

Here's what I would do. Identify the slow players(they already know who they are). Put them in the last group of the day one day and start them 1 hour before on their early round(first 2 days). After that, there isn't much you can do but maybe the embarrassment would do something to help.


#6 buckeyevalley

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:13 PM

I believe it was Peter Kostis that suggested the tour time the amount of time it takes for each round.  If the average round takes longer than a predetermined amount of time, the total purse is cut by 10% and given to charity.  You would see the slow players being called out by their peers.  The slow play issue would be solved on the pro level in a matter of weeks.

#7 HoosierMizuno

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:27 PM

another thought, how about eliminating television coverage for the slow players completely unless they play in last group on the weekend.

first, this would make viewers happy not having to watch the keegans step up and back away from the ball multiple times.

second, this would probably upset the players sponsors enough that they may get the players to speed up by withholding sponsorship dollars for the slowest players.
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#8 golfing_penguin

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 12:46 PM

Something we do at out golf course is aim for a 4h30 round, but have the marshall time groups to 4h15, just so we can virtually guarantee being under 4h30 for even societies of not so great golfers at the weekends. Seems to work pretty well

#9 kwelifan

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:22 PM

View PostHoosierMizuno, on 05 February 2013 - 12:27 PM, said:

another thought, how about eliminating television coverage for the slow players completely unless they play in last group on the weekend.

first, this would make viewers happy not having to watch the keegans step up and back away from the ball multiple times.

second, this would probably upset the players sponsors enough that they may get the players to speed up by withholding sponsorship dollars for the slowest players.

It doesn't really seem that Keegan takes any longer than anyone else though.  Once he steps in, he hits immediately.  

What drives me nuts is:
The guy who marks a ball that's 5 inches from the cup, cleans it, lines it up again and knocks it in.  
Having caddies pace off a 160 yard shot.  Just give the guy a rangefinder and be done with it.
Also having to remind photographers/fans on EVERY SHOT to shut up and stop moving.

I do like hitting these guys in the wallet to get them to pay attention

#10 bunter101

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:25 PM

View Postbuckeyevalley, on 05 February 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

I believe it was Peter Kostis that suggested the tour time the amount of time it takes for each round.  If the average round takes longer than a predetermined amount of time, the total purse is cut by 10% and given to charity.  You would see the slow players being called out by their peers.  The slow play issue would be solved on the pro level in a matter of weeks.

You think you would see them calling out Tiger?

You would see the time coming back down if the Pro's were to quicken up. Just as 5 hours became common when the pro's started taking that long.


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#11 bunter101

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:31 PM

View Postkwelifan, on 05 February 2013 - 01:22 PM, said:

View PostHoosierMizuno, on 05 February 2013 - 12:27 PM, said:

another thought, how about eliminating television coverage for the slow players completely unless they play in last group on the weekend.

first, this would make viewers happy not having to watch the keegans step up and back away from the ball multiple times.

second, this would probably upset the players sponsors enough that they may get the players to speed up by withholding sponsorship dollars for the slowest players.

It doesn't really seem that Keegan takes any longer than anyone else though.  Once he steps in, he hits immediately.  

What drives me nuts is:
The guy who marks a ball that's 5 inches from the cup, cleans it, lines it up again and knocks it in.  
Having caddies pace off a 160 yard shot.  Just give the guy a rangefinder and be done with it.
Also having to remind photographers/fans on EVERY SHOT to shut up and stop moving.

I do like hitting these guys in the wallet to get them to pay attention

Hitting them in the wallet with measly fines? These guys know they're going to be making money and a good living. They should be cut shots taking them out of contention or endangering them missing the cut is the way to do it. No matter who it is or whether they're first out or in the last group on a Sunday.

#12 bscinstnct

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 01:44 PM

[

View Postbunter101, on 05 February 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

View Postbuckeyevalley, on 05 February 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

I believe it was Peter Kostis that suggested the tour time the amount of time it takes for each round.  If the average round takes longer than a predetermined amount of time, the total purse is cut by 10% and given to charity.  You would see the slow players being called out by their peers.  The slow play issue would be solved on the pro level in a matter of weeks.

You think you would see them calling out Tiger?

You would see the time coming back down if the Pro's were to quicken up. Just as 5 hours became common when the pro's started taking that long.

Tiger is for penalizing strokes>

http://www.golfchann...rld-difference/

#13 bunter101

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:32 PM

Yep i heard that a couple of weeks ago while he won and was behind a the slow group.
What I was pointing out is Tiger ain't all that fast out there.
Would the PGA have the gall to go penalise Tiger? Or his peers tell him to get a move on?

#14 kellygreen

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:43 PM

View PostWillie Malay, on 05 February 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

If the PGA actually succeeds in speeding up the pros(which I doubt will even happen), will it have any effect on the local muni? I say it won't do a thing but then again I've been wrong before.

Having recreational players tee the ball forward will have a much bigger effect on the speed of play than anything that the pros are doing.
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#15 bscinstnct

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:58 PM

View Postkellygreen, on 05 February 2013 - 02:43 PM, said:

View PostWillie Malay, on 05 February 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

If the PGA actually succeeds in speeding up the pros(which I doubt will even happen), will it have any effect on the local muni? I say it won't do a thing but then again I've been wrong before.

Having recreational players tee the ball forward will have a much bigger effect on the speed of play than anything that the pros are doing.

Or better yet, the courses should just do it.

Just move the boxes up until they see the average guy with a 7i approach on the average par 4 instead of a 5 wood.

Probably could move the average regular par 4 tee up 100 yards.

Then if you want to play from farther back, you show proof you can break 90 from those tees.

Then, everyone would be more confident and hit more within themselves on tee shots, get better with scoring clubs and have a goal to move back a tee box.

Most people will be confused at first but get used to it fast and will enjoy themselves much more. The only issue now is no guy wants to play the "ladies" tee or whatever.

Ha!

Game day bucket go Boom.

Edited by bscinstnct, 05 February 2013 - 03:13 PM.


#16 fairways4life

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:41 PM

Things that I feel contribute to slow pace of play at typical public courses...

1.) Playing from too far back. If you want to play the tips you need to keep a certain handicap and show it to the starter before going back to that tee box. In some countries they don't even let you on the course without a handicap card. We need to adopt this policy or a similar policy.

2.) Par 5's. Joe Top Flite will hit his driver 210 yards off the tee. He'll then wait for the green to clear when he's 230 yards away. He finally hits after they're off the green and rolls his ball up 30 yards short of the green. Not sure what can be done about this problem but I'm sure there must be something.

3.) Halfway houses/beverage carts. I know this won't sit well with some people but I say get rid of them both. How many times do you play a fairly quick front nine and then get to the 10th tee and there's 2 foursomes there stuffing their faces with hot dogs? Seriously, you can't go 4 hours without eating? If you need to eat, bring a granola bar or some crackers or trail mix or something with you. Would you really rather spend 11 bucks for a hot dog and a gatorade? But I know courses will never get rid of halfway houses because it's a good money-maker for them. And they won't let better pace of play interfere with making more money.

4.) Tee time intervals. Some courses separate tee times by as little as 7 minutes. That's ridiculous. After all 4 guys in the group hit 2 shots apiece with their first-tee mulligans they are taking 5 minutes to get off the tee. After 7 minutes, they are still in the fairway hitting shots and picking up their other tee shots. You're on the tee behind them and waiting already. Your round hasn't even started yet and it's already backed up. Again, this is so courses can maximize their profits so it's another thing that will never change.

5.) Lack of ESC. Post a sign on the first tee that says a triple bogey or double par or whatever max will be strictly enforced. Pick the damn thing up already. This ties in with reason #1 about having handicaps. People who keep handicaps understand ESC and they know what their own ESC number is. People who don't have handicaps generally have no concept of this idea and will hack away at it 12 or 13 times if they need to.

6.) Lazy cart riders. I'm not calling people who ride lazy. I'm calling out the ones who drive to one ball and sit in the cart while that guy gets out and hits. Then he gets back in and they drive to the other guy's ball --- 15 yards away! Park it where you can both get out and go hit.

Unfortunately none of these things are a result of a trickle down effect from televised golf. The PGA Tour can do all they want to try and speed things up but it won't do anything to change these 6 things.

Edited by fairways4life, 05 February 2013 - 03:47 PM.


#17 bscinstnct

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:54 PM

great post fairways4life!

Also, If I ride, I drop off or get dropped off and per where I am, grab a wedge, putter etc.

But

It would be funny to see you come over to us with your Cliff Bar while we are eating Hot Dogs! and make faces at us.

We'd be like

"You gotta problem, string bean?"

:drinks:

Edited by bscinstnct, 05 February 2013 - 03:54 PM.


#18 ozarkshooter

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 03:57 PM

"Play it Forward" doesn't work for two reasons: 1) no guy will move forward to the "ladies tees" - or at least not enough to make a difference; 2) teeing it forward doesn't address bad play.  Most golfer on the local muni don't have the skill to keep it in the short grass.  Even if they move up to the front tees, they are still looking in the woods/creek/weeds for their ball - which still means a 5 hour round.

The only way to address it at the local muni level is to have the course enforce a set pace of play.

And I agree with the the comments above, the pros won't change until you hit them with stroke penalties.  Look what happened on the LPGA tour last year in the match play event with Aza and Morgan.

And I believe that the AJGA has it right: you are put on the clock if your group is slow and then penalized with strokes if you don't catch up.  Plus, I belive they have the rule that the first person to putt out immediately goes to the next tee box - no lingering around the greens.  The PGA may have something similar, if so, they just need to enforce what is in place.

#19 fairways4life

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:03 PM

View Postozarkshooter, on 05 February 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

"Play it Forward" doesn't work for two reasons: 1) no guy will move forward to the "ladies tees" - or at least not enough to make a difference; 2) teeing it forward doesn't address bad play.  Most golfer on the local muni don't have the skill to keep it in the short grass.  Even if they move up to the front tees, they are still looking in the woods/creek/weeds for their ball - which still means a 5 hour round.

The only way to address it at the local muni level is to have the course enforce a set pace of play.

And I agree with the the comments above, the pros won't change until you hit them with stroke penalties.  Look what happened on the LPGA tour last year in the match play event with Aza and Morgan.

And I believe that the AJGA has it right: you are put on the clock if your group is slow and then penalized with strokes if you don't catch up.  Plus, I belive they have the rule that the first person to putt out immediately goes to the next tee box - no lingering around the greens.  The PGA may have something similar, if so, they just need to enforce what is in place.

I've caddied in several junior tournaments for U.S. Kids (slightly different governing body from AJGA I believe) and they do the green card/red card policy. Start the round with a green card and then you have checkpoints every couple holes. If you don't make it to a checkpoint in time you have to trade in your green card for a red and you have until the next checkpoint to get back into position and get your green card back. When you're on a red card it's ready golf, player who putts out goes to next tee and tees off (no honors). For the most part it works pretty well. Of course you still have the problem of one slow group backing up the rest of the course but I'd say the majority of these tournament rounds are completed faster than the average American casual round.

Edited by fairways4life, 05 February 2013 - 04:03 PM.


#20 cpomustang

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 04:30 PM

View Postfairways4life, on 05 February 2013 - 03:41 PM, said:

Things that I feel contribute to slow pace of play at typical public courses...

1.) Playing from too far back. If you want to play the tips you need to keep a certain handicap and show it to the starter before going back to that tee box. In some countries they don't even let you on the course without a handicap card. We need to adopt this policy or a similar policy.

2.) Par 5's. Joe Top Flite will hit his driver 210 yards off the tee. He'll then wait for the green to clear when he's 230 yards away. He finally hits after they're off the green and rolls his ball up 30 yards short of the green. Not sure what can be done about this problem but I'm sure there must be something.

3.) Halfway houses/beverage carts. I know this won't sit well with some people but I say get rid of them both. How many times do you play a fairly quick front nine and then get to the 10th tee and there's 2 foursomes there stuffing their faces with hot dogs? Seriously, you can't go 4 hours without eating? If you need to eat, bring a granola bar or some crackers or trail mix or something with you. Would you really rather spend 11 bucks for a hot dog and a gatorade? But I know courses will never get rid of halfway houses because it's a good money-maker for them. And they won't let better pace of play interfere with making more money.

4.) Tee time intervals. Some courses separate tee times by as little as 7 minutes. That's ridiculous. After all 4 guys in the group hit 2 shots apiece with their first-tee mulligans they are taking 5 minutes to get off the tee. After 7 minutes, they are still in the fairway hitting shots and picking up their other tee shots. You're on the tee behind them and waiting already. Your round hasn't even started yet and it's already backed up. Again, this is so courses can maximize their profits so it's another thing that will never change.

5.) Lack of ESC. Post a sign on the first tee that says a triple bogey or double par or whatever max will be strictly enforced. Pick the damn thing up already. This ties in with reason #1 about having handicaps. People who keep handicaps understand ESC and they know what their own ESC number is. People who don't have handicaps generally have no concept of this idea and will hack away at it 12 or 13 times if they need to.

6.) Lazy cart riders. I'm not calling people who ride lazy. I'm calling out the ones who drive to one ball and sit in the cart while that guy gets out and hits. Then he gets back in and they drive to the other guy's ball --- 15 yards away! Park it where you can both get out and go hit.

Unfortunately none of these things are a result of a trickle down effect from televised golf. The PGA Tour can do all they want to try and speed things up but it won't do anything to change these 6 things.

I get your comment about hitting 30 yds short on a second or third shot, but you also need to address the guys on the green having a hissy fit when it happens.  I know when I can't reach the green so I will take a shot when I am ready.  I generally play alone and I've had groups try to rip my head off for dropping the ball 25 yds from the green because I was "too f!3$&ing close!"  After a few times of that happening you'll forgive me if I just don't want to put up with someone else's BS when I've taken a day off to play!

Edited by cpomustang, 05 February 2013 - 04:49 PM.


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#21 Jim Clark

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 07:32 AM

Tour slow play is a different animal than public course slow play. Tour players take a long time preparing for each shot and they obviously don't play ready golf. Public tracks send out 4-somes of high handicap players every 8 mins, it only takes one group to get slow and the whole course is backed up. Happened to us recently at a public course we played because our club was closed. Some public courses do make an effort to keep it moving.

Our club does 10 min tee times and the members do a pretty good job of policing each other (sometimes marshaling is required) but you usually don't have a problem telling fellow members to move their asses.

#22 nuthin but a hacker

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 07:56 AM

View Postcpomustang, on 05 February 2013 - 04:30 PM, said:

View Postfairways4life, on 05 February 2013 - 03:41 PM, said:

Things that I feel contribute to slow pace of play at typical public courses... 1.) Playing from too far back. If you want to play the tips you need to keep a certain handicap and show it to the starter before going back to that tee box. In some countries they don't even let you on the course without a handicap card. We need to adopt this policy or a similar policy. 2.) Par 5's. Joe Top Flite will hit his driver 210 yards off the tee. He'll then wait for the green to clear when he's 230 yards away. He finally hits after they're off the green and rolls his ball up 30 yards short of the green. Not sure what can be done about this problem but I'm sure there must be something. 3.) Halfway houses/beverage carts. I know this won't sit well with some people but I say get rid of them both. How many times do you play a fairly quick front nine and then get to the 10th tee and there's 2 foursomes there stuffing their faces with hot dogs? Seriously, you can't go 4 hours without eating? If you need to eat, bring a granola bar or some crackers or trail mix or something with you. Would you really rather spend 11 bucks for a hot dog and a gatorade? But I know courses will never get rid of halfway houses because it's a good money-maker for them. And they won't let better pace of play interfere with making more money. 4.) Tee time intervals. Some courses separate tee times by as little as 7 minutes. That's ridiculous. After all 4 guys in the group hit 2 shots apiece with their first-tee mulligans they are taking 5 minutes to get off the tee. After 7 minutes, they are still in the fairway hitting shots and picking up their other tee shots. You're on the tee behind them and waiting already. Your round hasn't even started yet and it's already backed up. Again, this is so courses can maximize their profits so it's another thing that will never change. 5.) Lack of ESC. Post a sign on the first tee that says a triple bogey or double par or whatever max will be strictly enforced. Pick the damn thing up already. This ties in with reason #1 about having handicaps. People who keep handicaps understand ESC and they know what their own ESC number is. People who don't have handicaps generally have no concept of this idea and will hack away at it 12 or 13 times if they need to. 6.) Lazy cart riders. I'm not calling people who ride lazy. I'm calling out the ones who drive to one ball and sit in the cart while that guy gets out and hits. Then he gets back in and they drive to the other guy's ball --- 15 yards away! Park it where you can both get out and go hit. Unfortunately none of these things are a result of a trickle down effect from televised golf. The PGA Tour can do all they want to try and speed things up but it won't do anything to change these 6 things.
I get your comment about hitting 30 yds short on a second or third shot, but you also need to address the guys on the green having a hissy fit when it happens. I know when I can't reach the green so I will take a shot when I am ready. I generally play alone and I've had groups try to rip my head off for dropping the ball 25 yds from the green because I was "too f!3$&ing close!" After a few times of that happening you'll forgive me if I just don't want to put up with someone else's BS when I've taken a day off to play!

My thoughts exactly. Either the group ahead will be mad or the group behind will be. You just can't win. Seems like golf courses now days are full of people just looking for a reason to be mad about something.
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#23 spitfisher

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 08:21 AM

Trickle down? No chance
Leave the purse and begin strict no BS enforcement of slow play, strokes being the penalty and cash.

Public improvements including the ones mentioned above, increase the tee time between groups, on known days where there will be maximum capacity on the course avoid the placement of tough pins,

#24 MizunoMan37

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 08:24 AM

I think the tour just needs to do a better job of enforcing the rules they already have in place. With the tour, there is a fine line between a "regular" round and a "long" round.

We all know guys on tour are going to take longer to play a round of golf because they have more things to focus on. I'm sure we all know it...but it's not like they just say, "I'm 156 to center of green, give me a 9 iron." No, they want distances to front of green, carry yardage, back of green, wind, etc...all of that takes time to calculate, and when you're possibly playing for upwards of $1.3 million...you better believe I would take time to figure out as much as I can.

With that said, and what I said before...the tour just needs to do a better job of enforcing. If a group is falling behind...give them a warning and then actively follow up with that same group to see if they've improved. If they haven't...then they get strokes added; it's pretty simple I think.

The other thing to consider is sponsorhips. Everything is about money and sponsors would rather have their products being telivised for 5 hours versus 4 hours.

The other thing the tour could experiment with is increasing the time between groups. Say it's 10 minutes now...make it 12 minute intervals and see if that helps.

Just my $0.02.

#25 fairways4life

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 08:54 AM

This is from an article in the NY Times from last spring...


Another solution that is gaining supporters is a checkpoint system. Groups are required to reach each checkpoint hole (two to four a round) in the allotted time or within 15 minutes of the group ahead. When a group is out of position at any checkpoint, the players are liable to be penalized. (A warning is issued for the first miss.)

“The beauty is it puts the onus strictly on the players and not the officials to come time a group,” said Mike Davis, the executive director of the United States Golf Association.

In the first year the system was put into effect at the 2006 United States Amateur, pace of play improved by 48 minutes a round during the stroke-play portion of the competition. But the U.S.G.A. is not eager to introduce checkpoints to the pro championships it administers.

“It’s such a different policy, and given that we see these players one week a year, we’re hesitant to be the ones to do it,” Davis said.

Not much has changed since October 1965, when Golf Digest’s lead article was “Slow Play — Crisis in America.” At the 1966 United States Open at San Francisco’s Olympic Club, the site of this year’s Open, the U.S.G.A. experimented with some of the magazine’s suggestions: each player putted continuously until he holed out, and the ball could be lifted for cleaning on the green only before the first putt.

The pace of play for the last group improved more than an hour in the first two rounds in threesomes and an average of 45 minutes in the last two rounds played in pairs. The leaders played the final round in a brisk 3:29.

Edited by fairways4life, 06 February 2013 - 08:55 AM.


#26 mikpga

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 09:05 AM

View PostWillie Malay, on 05 February 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

If the PGA actually succeeds in speeding up the pros(which I doubt will even happen), will it have any effect on the local muni? I say it won't do a thing but then again I've been wrong before.

Simple answer is NO.  It's all about Education and Enforcement.

#27 highergr0und

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 09:11 AM

In order to enforce something, someone must have the authority and the balls to do so......

Unfortunately, most public courses gave up on those type of people long ago, and the ones that still have them are the ones guys always come on here whining about.  "I was minding my business and this ranger came up and told us to speed up.  I told him to f&%k off because I'm a local golfing deity and there's no way I was moving slow.  That group ahead of us just cleared the green here and must've run straight to the next green without teeing off".

#28 TJCDAS

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 09:40 AM

The PGA Tour should management should do zero to speed up Tour players speed.

It is up to the PGA Tour players to solve this problem themselves, if they want faster play it will happen if not it is their own damn fault and they have no one to blame but themselves.

The PGA Tour has failed to speed up play and the players whine, at least the fast players.  I like the idea of prize money cuts based on average time adjusted to the course as some courses take more time.

Slow play hurts every player on the course except the slow player, which is very selfish but this is the me first world we live in.

Zero reason that a 4 some can't finish in 3 1/2 hours. I think a 4 hour target is targeting slow play.

#29 lutomrSC

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 10:26 AM

Slow play is a complex issue. The first big problem is people don't budget the proper amount of time into their day for playing a round of golf. Everyone wants to make a tee time, show up to the course late and go play in 3 hours for a 4 some. Guess what? Golf takes a long time to play a full 18 holes. If you can't spend 4-4.5 hours on the golf course everytime you want to play, then either play just 9 holes or find another sport to take up.

A lot of people give me grief for being slow, but here is what they fail to realize. Most everyone at my course plays the regular men's tees. I play the back tees all the time. I'm a longer hitter and I have to wait longer on the tee for the landing area to clear before I can tee off. Most people can't hit it to the spots where I'm hitting it to so even while the group infront of me is still in the fairway most people can just go hit without fear of hitting into that group. But I can't. I have to wait till the group is completely clear of the fairway before I can hit. So by the time I get to my ball in the fairway, the group ahead of me has usually left the green and it looks like I'm being slow but it's because of the amount of time I have to wait on the tee.

Golf carts were supposed to have solved the "pace of play issue" and we built golf courses that expand over huge acres of land and though big housing developments. Then we made courses longer and more difficult. Golf carts have done nothing but slow down play. It's a great revenue stream for the proshop but they'll never give it up. Everyone in a 4 some with 2 carts is always waiting at a single players ball, then they all drive to the next person's ball and wait and then so on and so on. I think everyone should walk again to their own ball and be ready to hit when it's their turn. Or everyone gets their own golf cart, why not? Everyone is paying the same price for one whether or not they have to share it. There isn't going to be one solution that fixes this issue.

It doesn't start with the pro's either. I did like the data someone showed earlier about how many more shots the average golfer takes than the pros. And naturually someone who shoots in the 90's is going to take longer to play 18 holes than someone who shoots in the 70s. it's just common sense. you're taking more shots and each one of those shots is extra time you're spending on the course.

#30 ozarkshooter

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 10:58 AM

I don't think you're going to find any muni or local club increase tee time slots from 8 min segments to 10 min.  That means fewer rounds per day, which equals fewer dollars flowing in.  With golf courses already struggling with a sluggish economy, this won't happen.  Heck, even in a good economy, the course is then encouraged to still increase the bottom line even more...so I don't see when this will ever happen.

PGA will probably not make any real changes, because a longer round means even more airtime for sponsors.  Tiger playing for 6 hours means more viewers for a longer period of time than Tiger playing for 4.5 hours.

Bottom line...it's all about the money.  And we will still be watching.

The only reason this is such a hot topic is with the shortened round at Torrey Pines.  When they resumed play on Monday, they had very few golfers remaining on the course - so, less time to fill with other players, more time to focus on Tiger just standing around.  Sure, play was slower, but on a normal broadcast, we (viewers at home) would not have noticed it, because while Tiger is waiting, we would see some low-level golfer holing out from a bunker somewhere else on the course.


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