184 replies to this topic

[tylerdurden]

I don't understand this at all. He's been really impressive with irons and driver is just awful. What gives? any ideas? Please don't tell me it's equipment.

[QMany]

Wasn't he leading in driving distance and fifth in driving accuracy?

[jay65]

Personally I would like to see him with a heavier shaft in his Driver.

[MonteScheinblum]

The swing pattern he is using is too steep and his arms don't have enough room.

I criticized his swing on my blog and got lots of haters after the results this week.

You can hit the driver 50-100 yards off line at Torrey Pines and still shoot low.  Tiger judges himself on majors and he won't win majors with this swing because driver will not hold up under major pressure.

Edited by MonteScheinblum, 28 January 2013 - 03:12 PM.

[Jamboy72]

I don't know that his driver has been awful...wasn't he at (near) the top in total driving over rnds 1 and 2???

[HappyGolf]

I'm not enjoying seeing him try to hit fades from a square stance... too easy to sneak the face closed and pull 'em, would rather see him 20 degrees open (lined up down the left side).

[MonteScheinblum]

HappyGolf, on 28 January 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

I'm not enjoying seeing him try to hit fades from a square stance... too easy to sneak the face closed and pull 'em, would rather see him 20 degrees open (lined up down the left side).

Good call.  Especially he way he is swinging.

[tylerdurden]

In terms of the stats on his driving, I don't buy it for 2 reasons. 1, he is amazing with stinger irons and 3 woods. Hits them a mile, doesn't miss them as much, so it inflates his stats. and 2, generally really good drivers don't miss it off the map and on both sides so often. Not even using Hogan as a benchmark, but I think Jack was much last likely to spray his driver than tiger, and tiger is probably a better iron player. But by can't drive it, I mean with his driver, not with 3 iron or 3 wood which he can mash.

topekareal, on 28 January 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

I don't know that his driver has been awful...wasn't he at (near) the top in total driving over rnds 1 and 2???

[Jamboy72]

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:13 PM, said:

HappyGolf, on 28 January 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

I'm not enjoying seeing him try to hit fades from a square stance... too easy to sneak the face closed and pull 'em, would rather see him 20 degrees open (lined up down the left side).

Good call.  Especially he way he is swinging.

I don't know enough about the swing to answer my own question, so I'll toss it out there...Maybe Monte has some good insight....if his swing is ill-suited to drive it straight consistently, what does he need to do to fix it?

[FairwayGolfUSA.com]

You really realize how good Tiger is when his not playing his best and leading the field by 6 strokes. I am really enjoying seeing him leading tournaments again.

RYAN

[tylerdurden]

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:09 PM, said:

The swing pattern he is using is too steep and his arms don't have enough room.

I criticized his swing on my blog and got lots of haters after the results this week.

You can hit the driver 50-100 yards off line at Torrey Pines and still shoot low.  Tiger judges himself on majors and he won't win majors with this swing because driver will not hold up under major pressure.

Monte, could you do a video on Tiger and why the pattern has so many issues with the driver? I'd love to see it. I'm sure we could all learn from it. I'll check out your blog too, I didn't realize you had one.

[tylerdurden]

FairwayGolfUSA.com, on 28 January 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

You really realize how good Tiger is when his not playing his best and leading the field by 6 strokes. I am really enjoying seeing him leading tournaments again.

RYAN

DITTO, I'm a huge Tiger fan, I just wish he could hit the big stick consistently strait because he'd be a world beater and I'd love to see Brandel's reaction and Wayne D make a told-you-so video lol.

[tembolo1284]

tylerdurden, on 28 January 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:09 PM, said:

The swing pattern he is using is too steep and his arms don't have enough room.

I criticized his swing on my blog and got lots of haters after the results this week.

You can hit the driver 50-100 yards off line at Torrey Pines and still shoot low.  Tiger judges himself on majors and he won't win majors with this swing because driver will not hold up under major pressure.

Monte, could you do a video on Tiger and why the pattern has so many issues with the driver? I'd love to see it. I'm sure we could all learn from it. I'll check out your blog too, I didn't realize you had one.

Will cost you 5K and hook him up with a hot model. Only being fair.

[HappyGolf]

This is the way to do it... aimed at the left bunker and sliding it off of it.....

[ej002]

He was hitting his driver really well days one and two and round three. Not many stingers or 3 woods at all.  He looked good, also his misses were minimal.  I am not sure how you get terrible from that.  As of about mid-way through the 3rd, he was 1st in overall distance and 5th in accuracy.   I think he  would take that any day.   It seems like when he sets up to hit a draw, he loses his rythem and messes him up for a few holes.  Stick with the fade and leave it alone.

[MonteScheinblum]

topekareal, on 28 January 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:13 PM, said:

HappyGolf, on 28 January 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

I'm not enjoying seeing him try to hit fades from a square stance... too easy to sneak the face closed and pull 'em, would rather see him 20 degrees open (lined up down the left side).

Good call.  Especially he way he is swinging.

I don't know enough about the swing to answer my own question, so I'll toss it out there...Maybe Monte has some good insight....if his swing is ill-suited to drive it straight consistently, what does he need to do to fix it?

I have said this for a few years.  He has always had the driver face coming in open to the path, the path often to far in to out and that's because his left arm is under rotated.  When he stalls and flips, it's left, when he continues through you get that sword twirling block off the planet.

Now his angle of attack is steeper, so rotating the left arm would steepen the shaft and maybe make things worse.  That being the case, he needs way more secondary tilt at impact to make room for his arms and allow him to rotate that left arm from the top.

All of this would minimize the affect of how much he squats in transition, which I also say is too much.  His head would probably drop to the same position if he tilted more than squatting, but his arms would double the amount of room they have.

So it's not about his head level that the talking heads complain about...it's how he is getting o hat level.

[naj959]

tylerdurden, on 28 January 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:09 PM, said:

The swing pattern he is using is too steep and his arms don't have enough room.

I criticized his swing on my blog and got lots of haters after the results this week.

You can hit the driver 50-100 yards off line at Torrey Pines and still shoot low.  Tiger judges himself on majors and he won't win majors with this swing because driver will not hold up under major pressure.

Monte, could you do a video on Tiger and why the pattern has so many issues with the driver? I'd love to see it. I'm sure we could all learn from it. I'll check out your blog too, I didn't realize you had one.

+1 I'm a Tiger fan but I don't know how anyone could call him a great driver of the ball and keep a straight face. Seems like when the pressure is on the driver gets very unpredictable. A video on why things get bad with the big stick would be very informative.

[chirotennis]

Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...

[Jamboy72]

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:47 PM, said:

topekareal, on 28 January 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 03:13 PM, said:

HappyGolf, on 28 January 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

I'm not enjoying seeing him try to hit fades from a square stance... too easy to sneak the face closed and pull 'em, would rather see him 20 degrees open (lined up down the left side).

Good call.  Especially he way he is swinging.

I don't know enough about the swing to answer my own question, so I'll toss it out there...Maybe Monte has some good insight....if his swing is ill-suited to drive it straight consistently, what does he need to do to fix it?

I have said this for a few years.  He has always had the driver face coming in open to the path, the path often to far in to out and that's because his left arm is under rotated.  When he stalls and flips, it's left, when he continues through you get that sword twirling block off the planet.

Now his angle of attack is steeper, so rotating the left arm would steepen the shaft and maybe make things worse.  That being the case, he needs way more secondary tilt at impact to make room for his arms and allow him to rotate that left arm from the top.

All of this would minimize the affect of how much he squats in transition, which I also say is too much.  His head would probably drop to the same position if he tilted more than squatting, but his arms would double the amount of room they have.

So it's not about his head level that the talking heads complain about...it's how he is getting o hat level.

Perfect. Thanks !

[MonteScheinblum]

chirotennis, on 28 January 2013 - 04:20 PM, said:

Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...

All the more evidence he is too steep.

[Reif]

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

chirotennis, on 28 January 2013 - 04:20 PM, said:

Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...

All the more evidence he is too steep.

Steeper makes/allows you to hit it further?

[russc]

Reif, on 28 January 2013 - 05:11 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

chirotennis, on 28 January 2013 - 04:20 PM, said:

Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...

All the more evidence he is too steep.

Steeper makes/allows you to hit it further?

Generally the more shallow your approach the faster that you can rotate and generally the faster that you can rotate ,the faster you can swing..A golfer who is steeper has to have more lateral motion in their downswing or else  when they rotate they will not be on an  inside approach to the ball.

[MonteScheinblum]

Reif, on 28 January 2013 - 05:11 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

chirotennis, on 28 January 2013 - 04:20 PM, said:

Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...

All the more evidence he is too steep.

Steeper makes/allows you to hit it further?

It can, but in a bad way.  Less loft at impact.

10 years ago I had more speed than Tiger at the Titleist center.  I can still hit north of 130 mph on a Trackman and no one had over 129 on tour last year.  I cannot hit a 5 iron 245 without steepening the club AoA to a severe angle.  Heck, I can't hit it 225 without doing that.

Edited by MonteScheinblum, 28 January 2013 - 05:51 PM.

[swingdoc80]

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 05:46 PM, said:

Reif, on 28 January 2013 - 05:11 PM, said:

MonteScheinblum, on 28 January 2013 - 04:44 PM, said:

chirotennis, on 28 January 2013 - 04:20 PM, said:

Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...

All the more evidence he is too steep.

Steeper makes/allows you to hit it further?

It can, but in a bad way.  Less loft at impact.

10 years ago I had more speed than Tiger at the Titleist center.  I can still hit north of 130 mph on a Trackman and no one had over 129 on tour last year.  I cannot hit a 5 iron 245 without steepening the club AoA to a severe angle.  Heck, I can't hit it 225 without doing that.

Maybe your just getting old monte.  Anybody any ideas what tigers aoa is with driver ?

[MonteScheinblum]

[quote name='swingdoc80' timestamp='1359415351' post='6317567']
[quote name='MonteScheinblum' timestamp='1359413179' post='6317299']
[quote name='Reif' timestamp='1359411075' post='6317051']
[quote name='MonteScheinblum' timestamp='1359409488' post='6316883']
[quote name='chirotennis' timestamp='1359408052' post='6316683']
Just crazy to see that ball fly, with all of his struggles I almost forgot what it looked like to see Tiger strike the ball like this...  244 yd 5i, unbelievable...  And to see that bunker shot, makes me sick...
[/quote]

All the more evidence he is too steep.
[/quote]

Steeper makes/allows you to hit it further?
[/quote]

It can, but in a bad way.  Less loft at impact.

10 years ago I had more speed than Tiger at the Titleist center.  I can still hit north of 130 mph on a Trackman and no one had over 129 on tour last year.  I cannot hit a 5 iron 245 without steepening the club AoA to a severe angle.  Heck, I can't hit it 225 without doing that.
[/quote]

Maybe your just getting old monte.  Anybody any ideas what tigers aoa is with driver ?
[/quote]

You are definitely right about that.

I would like to know that too.

[Pinsplitter59]

Looks like a good call Monty
 tiger-norman-downswing.jpg   61.77K   21 downloads
Is the cause this silly over the top-hit left thing he always practicing?

[swbyps]

I dont know but hes not alone in his struggles. I do know this...."why can I hit my irons well but cant hit my driver" is just about as common a question as "how can I fix my slice".

[swbyps]

Pinsplitter59, on 28 January 2013 - 06:36 PM, said:

Looks like a good call Monty
tiger-norman-downswing.jpg
Is the cause this silly over the top-hit left thing he always practicing?

Not that I know what im talking about but it looks like his right hip is too high. Shouldnt it be lower when hes at this position?

[360_CS]

So steepen you mean arm plane and shaft plane? His hands look well higher at the top now then when he was with Hank.

[Ghost_Orchid]

You guys are getting too technical on the swing, to simplify, I think he swing too darn hard.  It seems whenever he takes a big rip, sometimes it goes straight and sometimes it goes all over the place.

Forget swinging steep, coming too far from inside, hitting fade with square stance...blah blah, just hit it at 80%.  He doesn't need to swing so darn hard.

And that my friends, is my simple way of looking at it.