Jump to content

Welcome, Guest. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at GolfWRX such as viewing all the images, interacting with existing members and access to certain forums. Join our community today and enter into a chance to win a free regular giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE GolfWRX account here.

- - - - -

Pipe dream but want opinions...golf shop


  • Please log in to reply
40 replies to this topic

#1 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 08:42 AM

Okay, since some are affiliated with/own golf shops in their respective areas I wanted to get some opinions.  And obviously this idea is just in the "I wish" process but wanted to get some public opinion.  I am in an area where the market is fairly untapped as far as golf sales go.  Most of the major retailers are atleast an hour away, the only think close to here is one smaller golf store, with rediculous prices, but the business still seems to go okay for them.  He has most of the reps availalbe to him, as well as a large fitting equipment selection(mizuno fitting cart, TM, Ping, etc) as well as a vector monitor.  Not a bad setup but I feel someone with the right angle could be a pretty good competitor in this area.  Biggest thing they have going for them is the longevity of the store and past business with everyone around here.

So myself and a possible interested parter have an idea that might be able to start and might actually have a chance at surviving.  Provided we could get a good location, we would like to try opening a golf repair/retail shop that would have minimal inventory(onlty one or two of your more common sets) as well as having a larger assortment of demo clubs with a refined direction towards club fitting.  Smaller on-hand inventories w/ most orders being placed directly from the companies itself.  Would even like to be able to fit the person for special all the way down to the grips according to what a maker has available.  Now I realize that fitting/repair experience is a prime driver here.  As well as something that betters what's available, meaning being able to aquire/use something such as trackman.  It's all in the thought process at this point, but it is on the table.

I know one of the even larger hurdles here is getting manufacturers to buy into something like this in a market that is already struggling.  Starting with nothing with basically no prior affiliation is a large, and maybe impossble hurdle to cross.  I know makers like to see their products displayed all over, but at this point a business may be better off not holing onto large inventories and onle placing orders as needed except for what is needed for advertisement purposes and to get poeple interested.  I already know some companies that do this here locally(no in-stock invertory), Bridgestone and cobra's irons come to mind.

In short, basically looking at a small business area, full golf repair capability, hitting bay with trackman, putting green and fitting area, and just enough inventory to get visablilty as well as a few sale items.  From there, could build into some trade-in equipment and work from there.

I know I saw a post from a few years ago where this kinf of idea worked, unfortunately the guy that posted some good words about it is long since gone from here.

What are everyone else's thoughts?  Seen anything work, survive, and become prosperous doing something like this?

Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

Remove This Advertisement Viewing As Guest

    GolfWRX Forums

    Advertisement


You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at GolfWRX such as viewing all the images, interacting with existing members and access to certain forums. Join our community today and enter into a chance to win a free regular giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE GolfWRX account here.

#2 bhj83

bhj83

    Advanced

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 298 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 180138
  • Joined: 05/10/2012
  • Location:Kansas City, MO
  • Handicap:11.6
  • Ebay ID:jamisonhp02
GolfWRX Likes : 15

Posted 16 January 2013 - 08:52 AM

First thing that popped into my head is that your prices would have to be really competitive with the online marketplace. Or else you might go through what Best Buy is having a major issue with these days. People go in to try out electronics and then go home and order from Amazon because it is cheaper. Shipping would have to be fast too. Usually when I go into a store it's because I don't want to wait on shipping and I'm willing to pay a little extra to get it now.

#3 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:31 AM

All very good points.  Unfortunately I have no idea what kind of options are out there as far as what the purchasing costs from the manufacturers would be.  Can't say I am not guilty of it also.  The thought process would be to keep the overhead costs to a minimum, so prices would be cheaper on the comsumer.  There are a lot of unknowns to all this for sure.  In those kind of instances, I am not sure how the manufactures treat an owner that can't sell X numbers of clubs per quarter, year, etc.  They wouldn't be losing clubs to sitting on a shelf if they are ordered on demand.  I would see it as free advertising just having signs in the store, but manufacturers may not see it that way.

Atleast by offering club repair and fitting, some of that can help offset a lot on the back end.  Whether it's fitting a current set that someone has or for a new set.  Fittings can be applied to store credit, etc.  And even if you charged X number of dollars per fitting and they choose to not buy clubs, you are still getting income there and atleast that person leaves with an idea of what they need, and it's done using very good equipment.  Not as greedy as I probably need to be, but it's kind of how I think of it.

And yes, impulse buyers are also a thought that's in there as well.  I don't know what ratio of buyers of golf equipment are impule, but I would dare to say it's a fair amount, specailly when the word "sale" is plastered right above the rack.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#4 bppry

bppry

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,239 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 116337
  • Joined: 10/18/2010
  • Location:Detroit, Mi
GolfWRX Likes : 33

Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:34 AM

The key will be to find a nitch that allows you to be special and that makes you money. Just fitting and ordering a set from an OEM is not going to pay the bills, especially if you have to match internet pricing. I know of a shop pretty similar to what you are saying. Now he has accounts with all the shaft manufacturers, carries miura and other high end Japanese clubs and also has a PGA instructor and titleist fitness center in the building. He gets tour issued product as well from the likes of taylormade and Adams and more. The shop is withing 30 miles of two top 100 stores but yet still doing very well.

#5 Hateto3Putt

Hateto3Putt

    Smoking Makes You Look Cool!

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,997 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 17461
  • Joined: 08/04/2006
  • Location:Pittsburgh
GolfWRX Likes : 591

Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:44 AM

I think that serious golfers would appreciate your business model and buy from you.

I also think that most golf club equipment hard goods sales are to consumers who just want to pick the items up and carry home.

So I think the question is for your market, "Are there lots of serious golfers?"

I can think of two small shops in my area who have a business plan similar to your description. I think they both stay alive by being in spaces where the rents are reasonable. They don't carry any "high end" OEMS, but they make their nut on service, accessory sales and club fitting/repair.

Neither shop owner is a gazillionaire by any means.

Best of luck!

Edited by Hateto3Putt, 16 January 2013 - 09:44 AM.


#6 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:48 AM

Agreed.  I don't think the market around here would really support the high end stuff(JDM etc).  I could go back and fourth on tour issue gear, that's kind of a targeted market and I am not sure how many crazies(aside from me) there are around here.  It's definetly not an offering around this area, but buying that stuff comes at a pretty high cost as well.  Of course expansion is always an option, but that isn't even a thought at this point.  Baby steps, so I wouldn't lose my a** on something like this.

Your post is atleast a positive one, atleast there is someone out there still surviving.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#7 jabroni23

jabroni23

    I understand the way this game is played....

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,388 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 76647
  • Joined: 03/03/2009
  • Location:Rochester, NY
  • Ebay ID:jabroni231
GolfWRX Likes : 93

Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:50 AM

A friend of mine is a top 100 master club fitter that was working for another custom shop.  He went off on his own and opened his own custom fitting studio with Vector Pro, projection screen, and had accounts to purchase components from Adams, Fourteen, Scratch, Matrix, and so on.  He had enough components there to build something and fit someone, but didn't carry any retail clubs.  He believes that if you have a consistent swing, he can fit you into something to help you improve.  He recently closed his studio after a couple of stressful years.  Early on things went well as most of his clients flocked to him, understanding the importance of a true fitting.  What ended up happening is Joe Schmo coming in, going through a complimentary hour fitting, then coming back a few days later wanting him to beat Dick's price for an off the shelf club versus an expertly fitted club accounting for length, swingweight, and with an aftermarket shaft, grip, etc.  He was turning away good customers for these guys because there were only so many hours in the day.  If you live in a community that is absent of the big box stores and has the serious golfing population to sustain the business and that understands the value of what you're giving them, I would say you have a shot.  If you're in the midst of stores that will beat your price for standard OEM stuff versus your custom work, I would say you might have a tough go of it.  The guy I know now works for a major OEM but still does all repairs and work for nearly every country club in the area, so he was able to keep doing part of what he loves, but I know he misses the personal interaction and the satisfaction from helping put a smile on a client's face.

Edited by jabroni23, 16 January 2013 - 09:56 AM.

Cobra ZLE 9.5 w/ UST Mamiya Attas T2 6x
Callaway X Hot Pro 15* w/ Matrix Code 8x
Nike VR Pro LE 19* 5W w/ Kuro Kage 80x
Mizuno MP H4 4-PW w/ True Temper DG X100
Mizuno MP-R12 50*,54*,60* w/ DG X100
Scotty Cameron Studio Select Laguna 2

#8 jj9000

jj9000

    Major Winner

  • ClubWRX Charter Members
  • 1,194 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 99079
  • Joined: 11/23/2009
GolfWRX Likes : 592

Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:58 AM

OP...if I were in your position I would do some serious Marketing Management graduate level research.

I'd bet the farm that there is a graduate level Case Study floating out there which has many of the same elements that you've described.

I remember doing a case study on Keurig prior to it being offered into the Retail environment (whether to take Keurig to Retail...or...keep it in the Commercial market only).

Then, once you find the Case Study, it's a math exercise.

Edited by jj9000, 16 January 2013 - 09:58 AM.


#9 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 10:10 AM

View PostHateto3Putt, on 16 January 2013 - 09:44 AM, said:

So I think the question is for your market, "Are there lots of serious golfers?"

Million dollar question there...

One of the biggest areas of concern is just getting the foot in the door, not only from a manufacturer's retail standpoint and having access to the equipment, but also getting the draw in from the consumers.  As stated before, I am a little late to the party to an established(although I believe it could use some variety as far as competition) area where the same golf shop has been servicing customers for a number of years without competion except from the course pro shops.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#10 WUGolfer3118

WUGolfer3118

    Thank You Troops/Vets!

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 521 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 121363
  • Joined: 01/30/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 23

Posted 16 January 2013 - 10:26 AM

You mention that the big box stores are an hour away, which begs the question 'is your market big enough for you and your competitor?'. If so, then you have a chance. If it's either you or him, you'll have to either out-price him or out-service him. If you go the price route, it'll be a race to the bottom with him winning based on his built up relationships over the years. If the market is one that isn't too price sensitive and appreciates quality service then you may win out. I'd do more research on your market and competitor first before you get too far along.


Remove This Advertisement Viewing As Guest

    GolfWRX Forums

    Advertisement


You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at GolfWRX such as viewing all the images, interacting with existing members and access to certain forums. Join our community today and enter into a chance to win a free regular giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE GolfWRX account here.

#11 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 10:37 AM

View PostWUGolfer3118, on 16 January 2013 - 10:26 AM, said:

You mention that the big box stores are an hour away, which begs the question 'is your market big enough for you and your competitor?'. If so, then you have a chance. If it's either you or him, you'll have to either out-price him or out-service him. If you go the price route, it'll be a race to the bottom with him winning based on his built up relationships over the years. If the market is one that isn't too price sensitive and appreciates quality service then you may win out. I'd do more research on your market and competitor first before you get too far along.

The larger retailers for golf equipment(Dicks, GG, GS) are all over an hour a way.  We are kind of surrounded by them, but they are all outside the area.  The local area is pretty sustantial with a large surrounding area of courses that all seem to stay afloat, so the golfers are here, it's just about tapping into their business.

Like I say, it won't be easy to break into the market here bacause the owner of the other shop pretty much has a lock and has had zero compettion around here.  I think it's possible, but I have to find something to appeal to everyone here to make it all happen.

And I think everywhere these days is price sensitive.  Most people everywhere are watching their spending because of the instability of the economy.  Just how it is these days.  But people are still buying golf clubs, see brand new ones every day at the range.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#12 apprenti23

apprenti23

    Major Winner

  • ClubWRX Charter Members
  • 1,135 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 40702
  • Joined: 10/11/2007
  • Location:Chicago, IL
  • Ebay ID:tourpro15
GolfWRX Likes : 170

Posted 16 January 2013 - 10:51 AM

If you don't have it in stock, people will go online and order it from someone else bc they save ten bucks for free shipping. The initial overhead and costs associated will be rough. Plan on working a lot of hours and not making any real money for at least a year. If you can offer an extremely high level of customer service and competitive pricing you may survive the initial few years it would take to build a clientele. Giving them incentives for being a customer such as rewards programs are needed considering all of the big box stores do it as well.

Very very rough business. The Internet and big box stores have killed the golf equipment business. I wish you luck!

#13 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 11:05 AM

View Postapprenti23, on 16 January 2013 - 10:51 AM, said:

If you don't have it in stock, people will go online and order it from someone else bc they save ten bucks for free shipping. The initial overhead and costs associated will be rough. Plan on working a lot of hours and not making any real money for at least a year. If you can offer an extremely high level of customer service and competitive pricing you may survive the initial few years it would take to build a clientele. Giving them incentives for being a customer such as rewards programs are needed considering all of the big box stores do it as well. Very very rough business. The Internet and big box stores have killed the golf equipment business. I wish you luck!

Like I say, nothing more than a thought at this point.

The overall goal would be to limit the overhead, that's how the internet dealers and everyone else stole the market.  That's where the highly difficult parts come in, finding the right balance on what you have and can't sell and what you need on the shelf to make a sale.

You also need to be able to sell people on being fit too.  I would wager that a very large part of retail sales come from the big box stores fitting buyers into what they have off the shelf, same day, and out the door as to not lose a sale by having to fit and order.

Also of mention, to try and get backing for this, neither one of us have any sort of marketing degree so we have that going for us in terms of finances and trying to sell the idea.  Seems almost impossible to make all the puzzle pieces line up, but I haven't dropped the idea yet.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#14 Graymulligan

Graymulligan

    Tour Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 996 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 215421
  • Joined: 12/11/2012
  • Location:Sodus, NY
  • Handicap:9ish
GolfWRX Likes : 267

Posted 16 January 2013 - 02:33 PM

From a golf standpoint, this discussion makes a lot of sense.  From a business case study standpoint, we're not paying attention to a lot of the other variables.  

What are the costs going to be to start up?  (I'm not asking you to post them here...just running with a thought process)
Where will the business be located?  
What's the traffic like in that area?  Lots of drive by traffic?  Potential walk-in traffic?
What's the population density within 50 miles or so?  How likely is it that you can pull those people in?
Will people accept the idea of waiting for clubs, rather than grabbing them off the shelf and going to play?

Then there are some basic economic questions that are way more important than anything else..
If you're going to quit your current job to do this, can you make it for a year without any income from the business?  
Who's going to do the work?  (accounting, club fitting, repair, etc)?

Most small business fail because of poor planning, and poor research before they open.  A lot of people try to open a business that just isn't going to succeed at the level they need it to to stay afloat because "it's what they want to do".  I'm all for entrepreneurs opening businesses, but I think you have to be very careful about managing market demand and your own ability to stay afloat without a lot of income, if any.  

Personally, I don't think your plan is a good idea, from what you mention in your first post.  It sounds like the location isn't ideal, because you mention the big retailers being an hour away.  That leads me to think there's not a lot of people located where you're going to open.  

The other shop that exists in the market has a lot of their business from prior customers.  To get that business away from them, you're going to have to be cheaper than they are.  If you're cheaper than they are, can you still make enough to justify the business?  

Just my 2 cents, rounded down for inflation.  I don't think you shouldn't follow your dream, I would just maybe follow it in a better situation/location.
Blue Biocell, Aldila NV
Jetspeed 3 wood
Mizzy JPX800 pros, x100 shafts
Mizzy JPX 54/58
Futura X

#15 coffee-cup

coffee-cup

    Advanced

  • Unregistered
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 274 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 80290
  • Joined: 04/16/2009
GolfWRX Likes : 11

Posted 16 January 2013 - 03:18 PM

View PostGolfrnut, on 16 January 2013 - 09:31 AM, said:

The thought process would be to keep the overhead costs to a minimum

Sorry, but I just dont see this working.

You want to keep costs low, but you want a 15-20k Trackman?


#16 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 04:17 PM

View Postcoffee-cup, on 16 January 2013 - 03:18 PM, said:

View PostGolfrnut, on 16 January 2013 - 09:31 AM, said:

The thought process would be to keep the overhead costs to a minimum
Sorry, but I just dont see this working. You want to keep costs low, but you want a 15-20k Trackman?

Overhead meaning monthly costs for rent, insurance, and many of the other funds that accrue and repeat on a monthly basis.  You are correct, somthing like a trackman would be a huge chunk of the startup money, and you have to justify the customer's needs and requirements before dumping the cash into something when you may get by with less.  I am just looking at options to get leverage to make it lucrative.  As we kind of went back and forth on before, in order for someone here to pull in customers, I have to be able to offer them something that they cannot get anywhere else.  I have to be able to stand out and appeal to the crowd of folks that already frequent somewhere else.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#17 jwclubbie

jwclubbie

    Tour Winner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 851 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 115811
  • Joined: 10/05/2010
GolfWRX Likes : 40

Posted 16 January 2013 - 04:19 PM

I opened my own shop in October, and ONLY do Club Fitting and Repair. I have very low overhead, a small shop and a tour trailer. I have OEM Accounts which helps, brand recognition sells clubs. The fear of having overhead and not selling clubs and other goods is why I chose this model in stead of a traditional shop.


Things I value as a new business-
Services that others cannot offer
one on one interaction with a customer is INVALUABLE.

Edited by jwclubbie, 16 January 2013 - 04:21 PM.


#18 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 04:26 PM

View PostGraymulligan, on 16 January 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

From a golf standpoint, this discussion makes a lot of sense. From a business case study standpoint, we're not paying attention to a lot of the other variables. What are the costs going to be to start up? (I'm not asking you to post them here...just running with a thought process) Where will the business be located? What's the traffic like in that area? Lots of drive by traffic? Potential walk-in traffic? What's the population density within 50 miles or so? How likely is it that you can pull those people in? Will people accept the idea of waiting for clubs, rather than grabbing them off the shelf and going to play? Then there are some basic economic questions that are way more important than anything else.. If you're going to quit your current job to do this, can you make it for a year without any income from the business? Who's going to do the work? (accounting, club fitting, repair, etc)? Most small business fail because of poor planning, and poor research before they open. A lot of people try to open a business that just isn't going to succeed at the level they need it to to stay afloat because "it's what they want to do". I'm all for entrepreneurs opening businesses, but I think you have to be very careful about managing market demand and your own ability to stay afloat without a lot of income, if any. Personally, I don't think your plan is a good idea, from what you mention in your first post. It sounds like the location isn't ideal, because you mention the big retailers being an hour away. That leads me to think there's not a lot of people located where you're going to open. The other shop that exists in the market has a lot of their business from prior customers. To get that business away from them, you're going to have to be cheaper than they are. If you're cheaper than they are, can you still make enough to justify the business? Just my 2 cents, rounded down for inflation. I don't think you shouldn't follow your dream, I would just maybe follow it in a better situation/location.

My intention was just to get a feel for the idea, believe me, there would be many, many, many months down the road before something like this could/would happen.  I just wanted to bounce the ideas I had off of folks and get some opinions.  In no way has this idea been though out full circle to the point where I am coming here throwning out my business plan.  Even startup costs are unknown at this point because we haven't even come to a final plan as to what exactly we would like to have availalable.  This is nothing more than a collection of ideas that I am bouncing off people for feedback.

And we are talking about a rough county population of 110K+.  Not huge by any means, but there are enough of the population to keep a number of courses in the general area up and running.



I liked the morning crowd of thread posts, you afternoon guys are really negative.  :)  :)  :)
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#19 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 04:31 PM

View Postjwclubbie, on 16 January 2013 - 04:19 PM, said:

I opened my own shop in October, and ONLY do Club Fitting and Repair. I have very low overhead, a small shop and a tour trailer. I have OEM Accounts which helps, brand recognition sells clubs. The fear of having overhead and not selling clubs and other goods is why I chose this model in stead of a traditional shop. Things I value as a new business- Services that others cannot offer one on one interaction with a customer is INVALUABLE.

Now see this is the position I would like to see myself in.

How much of your past experiences and do/don't are you willing to discuss?  I would like to hear the kind of market your in, how you were able to get some OEM folks on board with you, what you are operating out of(shop, garage, renting, etc).  Previous professional club building/fitting experience? It's perfectly okay if you reluctant to share...

Edited by Golfrnut, 16 January 2013 - 04:33 PM.

Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#20 jj9000

jj9000

    Major Winner

  • ClubWRX Charter Members
  • 1,194 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 99079
  • Joined: 11/23/2009
GolfWRX Likes : 592

Posted 16 January 2013 - 05:21 PM

View PostGolfrnut, on 16 January 2013 - 04:26 PM, said:

View PostGraymulligan, on 16 January 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

From a golf standpoint, this discussion makes a lot of sense. From a business case study standpoint, we're not paying attention to a lot of the other variables. What are the costs going to be to start up? (I'm not asking you to post them here...just running with a thought process) Where will the business be located? What's the traffic like in that area? Lots of drive by traffic? Potential walk-in traffic? What's the population density within 50 miles or so? How likely is it that you can pull those people in? Will people accept the idea of waiting for clubs, rather than grabbing them off the shelf and going to play? Then there are some basic economic questions that are way more important than anything else.. If you're going to quit your current job to do this, can you make it for a year without any income from the business? Who's going to do the work? (accounting, club fitting, repair, etc)? Most small business fail because of poor planning, and poor research before they open. A lot of people try to open a business that just isn't going to succeed at the level they need it to to stay afloat because "it's what they want to do". I'm all for entrepreneurs opening businesses, but I think you have to be very careful about managing market demand and your own ability to stay afloat without a lot of income, if any. Personally, I don't think your plan is a good idea, from what you mention in your first post. It sounds like the location isn't ideal, because you mention the big retailers being an hour away. That leads me to think there's not a lot of people located where you're going to open. The other shop that exists in the market has a lot of their business from prior customers. To get that business away from them, you're going to have to be cheaper than they are. If you're cheaper than they are, can you still make enough to justify the business? Just my 2 cents, rounded down for inflation. I don't think you shouldn't follow your dream, I would just maybe follow it in a better situation/location.

My intention was just to get a feel for the idea, believe me, there would be many, many, many months down the road before something like this could/would happen.  I just wanted to bounce the ideas I had off of folks and get some opinions.  In no way has this idea been though out full circle to the point where I am coming here throwning out my business plan.  Even startup costs are unknown at this point because we haven't even come to a final plan as to what exactly we would like to have availalable.  This is nothing more than a collection of ideas that I am bouncing off people for feedback.

And we are talking about a rough county population of 110K+.  Not huge by any means, but there are enough of the population to keep a number of courses in the general area up and running.



I liked the morning crowd of thread posts, you afternoon guys are really negative.  :)  :)  :)

I understand if you think his post was negative, however, from a Marketing perspective it touches on the salient points you need to consider.

Each one of the Variables he lists are elements of a Marketing Business Case analysis.

I mentioned earlier that you should be able to search the Internet for a Golf Store related Business Case and apply some of the variables and assumptions to your particular scenario.

Once you define all of the variables that may potentially affect the business, it really is just a math (and judgement) exercise.


Remove This Advertisement Viewing As Guest

    GolfWRX Forums

    Advertisement


You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at GolfWRX such as viewing all the images, interacting with existing members and access to certain forums. Join our community today and enter into a chance to win a free regular giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE GolfWRX account here.

#21 jwclubbie

jwclubbie

    Tour Winner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 851 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 115811
  • Joined: 10/05/2010
GolfWRX Likes : 40

Posted 16 January 2013 - 05:30 PM

View PostGolfrnut, on 16 January 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:

View Postjwclubbie, on 16 January 2013 - 04:19 PM, said:

I opened my own shop in October, and ONLY do Club Fitting and Repair. I have very low overhead, a small shop and a tour trailer. I have OEM Accounts which helps, brand recognition sells clubs. The fear of having overhead and not selling clubs and other goods is why I chose this model in stead of a traditional shop. Things I value as a new business- Services that others cannot offer one on one interaction with a customer is INVALUABLE.

Now see this is the position I would like to see myself in.

How much of your past experiences and do/don't are you willing to discuss?  I would like to hear the kind of market your in, how you were able to get some OEM folks on board with you, what you are operating out of(shop, garage, renting, etc).  Previous professional club building/fitting experience? It's perfectly okay if you reluctant to share...

I do not want this discussion to go off topic, as certain sponsors pay to advertise on this site, and this could be deemed research lol. So I will not name any specifics as to where I am located, business name or things like that.

I am in a midsize market
I have a brick and mortar shop, where customers can come to
I fit using ball flight + technology
Have a tour trailer for my fittings outdoors and club repair when I am at courses (plan to do this 2 days a week, does not include tournaments etc.)
My shop is under 700 sq feet. Rent is $250 a Month. Trailer is the bigger cost obviously. I am the only employee at this time, although I am sure I will have to hire someone this year. Only overhead is rent, trailer payment, Cable/Internet for the shop, Card Processing Terminal, and other incidentals. The start up cost is not cheap, you will assume debt. Do not plan on making money your first year as a prior poster stated. I am In my first year, and will be hitting my first "season" coming up. It's been a learning experience for sure.

#22 jwclubbie

jwclubbie

    Tour Winner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 851 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 115811
  • Joined: 10/05/2010
GolfWRX Likes : 40

Posted 16 January 2013 - 05:32 PM

View Postjj9000, on 16 January 2013 - 05:21 PM, said:

View PostGolfrnut, on 16 January 2013 - 04:26 PM, said:

View PostGraymulligan, on 16 January 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

From a golf standpoint, this discussion makes a lot of sense. From a business case study standpoint, we're not paying attention to a lot of the other variables. What are the costs going to be to start up? (I'm not asking you to post them here...just running with a thought process) Where will the business be located? What's the traffic like in that area? Lots of drive by traffic? Potential walk-in traffic? What's the population density within 50 miles or so? How likely is it that you can pull those people in? Will people accept the idea of waiting for clubs, rather than grabbing them off the shelf and going to play? Then there are some basic economic questions that are way more important than anything else.. If you're going to quit your current job to do this, can you make it for a year without any income from the business? Who's going to do the work? (accounting, club fitting, repair, etc)? Most small business fail because of poor planning, and poor research before they open. A lot of people try to open a business that just isn't going to succeed at the level they need it to to stay afloat because "it's what they want to do". I'm all for entrepreneurs opening businesses, but I think you have to be very careful about managing market demand and your own ability to stay afloat without a lot of income, if any. Personally, I don't think your plan is a good idea, from what you mention in your first post. It sounds like the location isn't ideal, because you mention the big retailers being an hour away. That leads me to think there's not a lot of people located where you're going to open. The other shop that exists in the market has a lot of their business from prior customers. To get that business away from them, you're going to have to be cheaper than they are. If you're cheaper than they are, can you still make enough to justify the business? Just my 2 cents, rounded down for inflation. I don't think you shouldn't follow your dream, I would just maybe follow it in a better situation/location.

My intention was just to get a feel for the idea, believe me, there would be many, many, many months down the road before something like this could/would happen.  I just wanted to bounce the ideas I had off of folks and get some opinions.  In no way has this idea been though out full circle to the point where I am coming here throwning out my business plan.  Even startup costs are unknown at this point because we haven't even come to a final plan as to what exactly we would like to have availalable.  This is nothing more than a collection of ideas that I am bouncing off people for feedback.

And we are talking about a rough county population of 110K+.  Not huge by any means, but there are enough of the population to keep a number of courses in the general area up and running.



I liked the morning crowd of thread posts, you afternoon guys are really negative.  :)  :)  :)

I understand if you think his post was negative, however, from a Marketing perspective it touches on the salient points you need to consider.

Each one of the Variables he lists are elements of a Marketing Business Case analysis.

I mentioned earlier that you should be able to search the Internet for a Golf Store related Business Case and apply some of the variables and assumptions to your particular scenario.

Once you define all of the variables that may potentially affect the business, it really is just a math (and judgement) exercise.

You and the poster are very right. Prior to me opening I analyzed my market, and other than the big shops, their are no independent shops and builders in my area. Their was a Business that was regional called Z Golf that went out of business a handful of years ago. I researched what the big shops do not have or offer, and am attempting to use it to my advantage. The county I live in has a population of about 350K, this does not include surrounding counties obviously as well.

Edited by jwclubbie, 16 January 2013 - 05:41 PM.


#23 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 05:56 PM

View Postjwclubbie, on 16 January 2013 - 05:30 PM, said:

View PostGolfrnut, on 16 January 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:

View Postjwclubbie, on 16 January 2013 - 04:19 PM, said:

I opened my own shop in October, and ONLY do Club Fitting and Repair. I have very low overhead, a small shop and a tour trailer. I have OEM Accounts which helps, brand recognition sells clubs. The fear of having overhead and not selling clubs and other goods is why I chose this model in stead of a traditional shop. Things I value as a new business- Services that others cannot offer one on one interaction with a customer is INVALUABLE.
Now see this is the position I would like to see myself in. How much of your past experiences and do/don't are you willing to discuss? I would like to hear the kind of market your in, how you were able to get some OEM folks on board with you, what you are operating out of(shop, garage, renting, etc). Previous professional club building/fitting experience? It's perfectly okay if you reluctant to share...
I do not want this discussion to go off topic, as certain sponsors pay to advertise on this site, and this could be deemed research lol. So I will not name any specifics as to where I am located, business name or things like that. I am in a midsize market I have a brick and mortar shop, where customers can come to I fit using ball flight + technology Have a tour trailer for my fittings outdoors and club repair when I am at courses (plan to do this 2 days a week, does not include tournaments etc.) My shop is under 700 sq feet. Rent is $250 a Month. Trailer is the bigger cost obviously. I am the only employee at this time, although I am sure I will have to hire someone this year. Only overhead is rent, trailer payment, Cable/Internet for the shop, Card Processing Terminal, and other incidentals. The start up cost is not cheap, you will assume debt. Do not plan on making money your first year as a prior poster stated. I am In my first year, and will be hitting my first "season" coming up. It's been a learning experience for sure.

I knew it would be a touchy subject as far as your business is concerned, so there was no hard feelings at all if you didn't say a word.  I appreciate what info you did give as to your situation.

I think what you have there is a really good idea and much of what I have been thinking about is closely in line to what you have done.

I am financially stable enough to take on an income hit, so it's very much in consideration, but not a deal breaker.  It seems to be a general concensus that it takes time to build any kind of income and I do not challenge that one bit.


I don't think you would have any restrictions on answering this but I do not know your position.  Did you have any prior club building/fitting experience going into this?  I kind of do my own stuff but am considering possibly throwing some more education into it(even if I don't persue the shop) as far as getting lined up with some of the classes Mitchell has to offer and possibly venture out from there to gain experience.  I know a bunch of certificates do not get you near as far as experience though.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#24 casey_0507

casey_0507

    Tour Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 564 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 121944
  • Joined: 02/08/2011
  • Location:IN
GolfWRX Likes : 75

Posted 16 January 2013 - 06:31 PM

golfrnut,

The best advice I can give you is do some marketing research.  If you have no experience (it's a very tricky subject especially when forming surveys and analyzing results, etc, etc), I would recommend hiring someone to do this for you.  It will give you the best idea on who your customer is (demographically), what their needs/wants are, what competitors there really are (online, local, semi-local, etc), and what the demand for products or services you are wanting to offer really is.  It might not be a cheap process but I'll liken it to getting a home inspection before buying a house.  Best of luck!!!

Edited by casey_0507, 16 January 2013 - 06:32 PM.

Cobra BCP w/ Tour AD DI 7s
Bio Cell + 3-4, 5-7
Titleist 910h 21* w/ Tour AD DI 85x
Cobra Amp Forged 5-GW w/ C-taper stiff
Vokey SM2 56.14 and Scor 59*
Machine M2A Converter Fat Back

#25 esketores

esketores

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,725 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 120324
  • Joined: 01/10/2011
  • Location:Land of the "Mogs"
  • Ebay ID:Hbarrel
GolfWRX Likes : 257

Posted 16 January 2013 - 06:33 PM

Earlier this week someone made a posting asking where to go buy, to spec, new Mizuno's. I said go to a local shop and let them make some money. EVERYONE else said go to Discount Dan's or some other online club discounter. One person even brought up the point of saving X% in sales tax.
Service will only take you so far. And if you live in an area where the possibility of selling high end goods (= higher profit margin) is not in the cards then you will struggle.
After opening the shop, buying supplies, Mitchel bender, etc. how long can you survive on what is in your bank account? Profitablity will be limited for quite some time.

Draw up a business plan.
Write down your capital outlay to just open the doors. (take into account everything, don't be conservative)
Projected monthly overhead. (gas, electric, rent, insurance, signage, et al) (are you planning to take a salary?)
Accountant costs. (the largest reason new business fails is because they did not pay their taxes.)
How much in sales at what % of profit will it take to cover the projected overhead.
Are you going to be a sole proprietorship, LLC, partnership, etc?

My dad always said everyone should at least once in their life have to own their own business. Especially politicians and their aides.

PING G25 12 degree w/S+ @ 45"
Titleist 910F 17 / 910h 24 & 27
Titleist 913Hd 20
PING G25's 6-U KBS Tour - V
Queen B Model 3 putter
Cleveland RTX 53 / 588 56

#26 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 06:55 PM

View Postcasey_0507, on 16 January 2013 - 06:31 PM, said:

golfrnut,

The best advice I can give you is do some marketing research.  If you have no experience (it's a very tricky subject especially when forming surveys and analyzing results, etc, etc), I would recommend hiring someone to do this for you.  It will give you the best idea on who your customer is (demographically), what their needs/wants are, what competitors there really are (online, local, semi-local, etc), and what the demand for products or services you are wanting to offer really is.  It might not be a cheap process but I'll liken it to getting a home inspection before buying a house.  Best of luck!!!


That is in the cards as well.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#27 jwclubbie

jwclubbie

    Tour Winner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 851 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 115811
  • Joined: 10/05/2010
GolfWRX Likes : 40

Posted 16 January 2013 - 07:10 PM

OP-

I had experience building, and decided to go to Mitchell to further my learning, which you (IMHO) always are learning. You have to keep up with equipment trends, the current golf market as a whole.
Do market research as prior posters have said.

#28 Golfrnut

Golfrnut

    Major Winner

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,629 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 132818
  • Joined: 07/12/2011
GolfWRX Likes : 272

Posted 16 January 2013 - 07:16 PM

How was that school BTW?  Any prior credentials required prior to taking either one of them?  I looked into it the other day and it was actually a lot cheaper than I expected it would be to be honest.  Not a killer drive so it's definetly doable with a little vacation time.

But yes, market research for the area is realistically my next step.

And I know I haven't said it directly, but I appreciate everyone's imputs and ideas thus far.
Taylormade SLDR 9.5 w/ stiff Speeder 57
Callaway 3 Deep 14.5 w/ PXv 6.0
Stage 2 18.5/21.5  rescue w/ Steelfiber
Bridgestone J40 CB 4-PW w/ Steelfiber
Scratch 53/58 wedges w/ Steelfiber i80
Odyssey Protype 2-Ball

#29 Pepperturbo

Pepperturbo

    De oppresso liber

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 11,350 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 14656
  • Joined: 05/09/2006
  • Location:Midwest and Southwest
  • Handicap:Low
GolfWRX Likes : 723

Posted 16 January 2013 - 07:19 PM

I know a great deal and had considerable success starting businesses from scratch, and making them profitable over time.  There is NO quick easy answer for someone that wants to be a success.  Develop a thorough business plan that could be presented to a commercial banking loan officer or investors.  Only then will you and your partner be able to see just how practical and fiscally sound your idea is.  Course, if you don't care if you lose money, go for the "you can make a difference" and make notes on toilet paper or bar napkins.  :)

Edited by Pepperturbo, 16 January 2013 - 07:21 PM.

SLDR TP 9.5 PX6C12 Tour Issue
SLDR TP 15* Diamana Blueboard 83
2-PW '06' X-Forged - PX6.0
Miura 53* PX6.0-E0 / 59* DGS200-E0
ProV1x
SC California Monterey

#30 Fade

Fade

    Advanced

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 421 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 212785
  • Joined: 11/24/2012
  • Location:New England
GolfWRX Likes : 82

Posted 16 January 2013 - 07:36 PM

Is taking over the other fellow's golf-store an option?


Remove This Advertisement Viewing As Guest

    GolfWRX Forums

    Advertisement


You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at GolfWRX such as viewing all the images, interacting with existing members and access to certain forums. Join our community today and enter into a chance to win a free regular giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE GolfWRX account here.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

GolfWRX Sponsors