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High launch, low spin shaft for a 3wood?


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#1 Ajlepisto

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:40 PM

I've got YS6+ xstiff in both my 3w and driver.

I hit them both nice and high, but I can't control them well enough. The ball also spins so much it just falls straight out of the sky at around 240. I'd like to be able to get some run out on it, instead of a drop, but still get some height on the shot so I can split the difference a bit and get it to land a little more vertical.

I really sweep my 3w well and barely take a divot, so my AoA is really shallow.

Being that I am not a long hitter, I need to get some distance with my 3w, especially into par 5's so I can start scoring better, as well as start being able to drive some par 4 greens. I've got a nasty gap between the driver and my 3w and without any rollout, it makes it even worse.

I'm thinking of putting a ProLaunch red of some sort or maybe a V2 into my driver to see if that helps bring down my trajectory and give me some more punch. I'd like to get the same, or similar ball flight from my 3w, but I don't want to launch it too low so that I can't control the distance at all. I'm just looking to reduce the spin so I can get it out to the longer holes I am on and keep it out of the wind a bit more.

Thanks!


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#2 J.W.

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

High launch and low spin does not exist in a shaft with that said ProLaunch red is a nice cheap shaft that really performs.  The new SpeedCoat version is excellent too.  Just reading your post I would go that route before V2.
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#3 Ajlepisto

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:57 PM

Even in a 3w? I worried it would turn into a low bullet machine. I'm trying to keep similar flight and launch is possible...but just reduce the spin. I've thought about switching balls, but I don't think that would get me all the way there.

Or is that just needless worry?

What are your typical angles of descent on the 3w?

Edited by Ajlepisto, 07 January 2013 - 10:00 PM.


#4 JJensen

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 11:24 PM

same launch with less spin would be the AD-DI 6X or 7X but only if you want to dish out the $$$

Edited by JJensen, 07 January 2013 - 11:25 PM.

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#5 tomg1969

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 11:45 PM

I've had pretty good luck with the Matrix RUL in my fairways. Nice launch and does a good job keeping spin reasonable. Another cheap experiment that you may want to try is a Dynamic Gold steel shaft


#6 hbear

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 11:46 PM

A lot of people have had success with the Fubuki.
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#7 JB lefty

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:20 AM

Maybe try the PX blue shaft line.
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#8 Thrillhouse

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:23 AM

Low launch low spin shaft in a 17 degree head rather than your 3 wood.

You can't get high launch low spin out of a shaft, those two things don't go together.

#9 Ajlepisto

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:25 AM

View PostThrillhouse, on 08 January 2013 - 01:23 AM, said:

Low launch low spin shaft in a 17 degree head rather than your 3 wood.

You can't get high launch low spin out of a shaft, those two things don't go together.

Really interesting...I hadn't even thought about that.

You think that even with the higher loft, if I keep the spin and launch down I will keep the distance and get the roll at the end?

#10 Thrillhouse

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:27 AM

View PostAjlepisto, on 08 January 2013 - 01:25 AM, said:

View PostThrillhouse, on 08 January 2013 - 01:23 AM, said:

Low launch low spin shaft in a 17 degree head rather than your 3 wood.

You can't get high launch low spin out of a shaft, those two things don't go together.

Really interesting...I hadn't even thought about that.

You think that even with the higher loft, if I keep the spin and launch down I will keep the distance and get the roll at the end?

Oh yeah, you might need to get one of the hotter heads like the Adams or the rbz to get the distance out of it, but you can get what you are looking for out of the correct head/shaft combo.


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#11 Ajlepisto

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:30 AM

That's a great idea. I am going to seriously consider that. Will I be looking to keep the 17* shaft length, or do I just try to keep the length around 43 like my 3w and effectively just swap the head?

Edited by Ajlepisto, 08 January 2013 - 01:31 AM.


#12 isaacbm

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:40 AM

View PostThrillhouse, on 08 January 2013 - 01:27 AM, said:

View PostAjlepisto, on 08 January 2013 - 01:25 AM, said:

View PostThrillhouse, on 08 January 2013 - 01:23 AM, said:

Low launch low spin shaft in a 17 degree head rather than your 3 wood.

You can't get high launch low spin out of a shaft, those two things don't go together.

Really interesting...I hadn't even thought about that.

You think that even with the higher loft, if I keep the spin and launch down I will keep the distance and get the roll at the end?

Oh yeah, you might need to get one of the hotter heads like the Adams or the rbz to get the distance out of it, but you can get what you are looking for out of the correct head/shaft combo.

I couldn't agree more.  I'm using a 17 degree RBZ with a board of a shaft.  I swing about 105-107 with driver and with that "3" wood, I carry it 250 easy and it rolls out a bit too, especially on a draw.

I also have a 13 degree RBZ spoon and I hit that thing literally 6-8 yards short of my driver, nearly 160 ball speed!

I never liked Taylor much before but these RBZ 3 woods are goofy.

Get a 17 degree TP head and then put a x stiff low launching 3 wood length shaft in it.  Saw a head go on Ebay for $60 and the pro launch you're talking about is about $50.

If you don't like it, sell it to me!

#13 jmcdonald

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 08:01 AM

Shell out the money and get a Kiyoshi...you will thank me later!! Haha....AD DI spins way more than Kiyoshi.

#14 bluedot

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 12:36 PM

Unless I'm missing something, you never posted your swing speed.  240 is really good carry distance; are you certain that there are more yards to be had?

If you have access to a Trackman, it might save you time and money to at least get the launch numbers for the stuff you are playing now before you start throwing money at new stuff.  There is a big, big difference between WANTING to hit the ball farther and being ABLE to hit the ball farther.  And if you are able to hit it farther, you'll still need some LM numbers to give you an idea of whether the best way to accomplish that is through more carry or more roll.

Beyond all of that, there is the issue of dispersion.  If you get a 3W that you can hit 5 yds. farther, but you hit it an average of 10 yds. more off line, is that acceptable progress?

All of the advice given to you so far has been people telling you what THEY use and like.  You don't know their numbers, and they don't know yours.  This is a recipe for a lot of money being spent and a lot of rounds being wasted.

Get some numbers and then post 'em.  You'll get much, much better and more useful advice.  And it'll be way cheaper...

#15 Thrillhouse

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:15 PM

View PostAjlepisto, on 08 January 2013 - 01:30 AM, said:

That's a great idea. I am going to seriously consider that. Will I be looking to keep the 17* shaft length, or do I just try to keep the length around 43 like my 3w and effectively just swap the head?

Since you are looking for distance out of it you could play it at 3 wood length.


#16 Ajlepisto

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 01:31 PM

I'm not looking to hit it further in the air. I'm looking to bring down, or keep similar launch characteristics and reduce spin, so that I get a little rollout.

This wasn't really about more distance via more power, it was about getting a ball flight that would stay out of the wind a bit and keep it's forward momentum when it comes down.

I don't have a reliable way to verify swing speed, because the launch monitor I've used a bit at Golfsmith (a CG2) is way off on swingspeed and ballspeed numbers, and gives some really weird distance calculations. I'm going based on the ball flight I see on the course. For example, the Mizuno DNA thing gives me 92ish mph 6i, but on the CG2 I get something like 76mph...and it gives me 100mph swing speed with 265ish carry. There is no way that number is correct, but 265 carry is what I get on the course on a reasonable swing, so I just usually rule out the swingspeed and ballspeed numbers from that. No way to try out a trackman around here that I know of?

But again, I'm not looking for more distance due to swing speed...I just want some roll out when the ball comes down so I can roll it up to some of the longer greens.

Edited by Ajlepisto, 08 January 2013 - 01:35 PM.


#17 isaacbm

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 04:57 PM

View Postbluedot, on 08 January 2013 - 12:36 PM, said:

Unless I'm missing something, you never posted your swing speed.  240 is really good carry distance; are you certain that there are more yards to be had?

If you have access to a Trackman, it might save you time and money to at least get the launch numbers for the stuff you are playing now before you start throwing money at new stuff.  There is a big, big difference between WANTING to hit the ball farther and being ABLE to hit the ball farther.  And if you are able to hit it farther, you'll still need some LM numbers to give you an idea of whether the best way to accomplish that is through more carry or more roll.

Beyond all of that, there is the issue of dispersion.  If you get a 3W that you can hit 5 yds. farther, but you hit it an average of 10 yds. more off line, is that acceptable progress?

All of the advice given to you so far has been people telling you what THEY use and like.  You don't know their numbers, and they don't know yours. This is a recipe for a lot of money being spent and a lot of rounds being wasted.

Get some numbers and then post 'em.  You'll get much, much better and more useful advice.  And it'll be way cheaper...

Actually I did give him my numbers and I assumed from the "240 carry with too much spin" that his swing speed would be pretty close to mine.

He's since confirmed that I was correct to assume those were his numbers.

A person doesn't necessarily need trackman to know what their ball is doing.  I realize it can be a help but if a guy is saying that he's spinning it a little too much and simply wants a flatter flight with a bit of roll out, he doesn't necessarily need a $25000  machine to tell him what club he needs.

Just my opinion.  I get that this site is full of trackman obsessed people so flame away....

#18 bluedot

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 05:31 PM

View Postisaacbm, on 08 January 2013 - 04:57 PM, said:

View Postbluedot, on 08 January 2013 - 12:36 PM, said:

Unless I'm missing something, you never posted your swing speed.  240 is really good carry distance; are you certain that there are more yards to be had?

If you have access to a Trackman, it might save you time and money to at least get the launch numbers for the stuff you are playing now before you start throwing money at new stuff.  There is a big, big difference between WANTING to hit the ball farther and being ABLE to hit the ball farther.  And if you are able to hit it farther, you'll still need some LM numbers to give you an idea of whether the best way to accomplish that is through more carry or more roll.

Beyond all of that, there is the issue of dispersion.  If you get a 3W that you can hit 5 yds. farther, but you hit it an average of 10 yds. more off line, is that acceptable progress?

All of the advice given to you so far has been people telling you what THEY use and like.  You don't know their numbers, and they don't know yours. This is a recipe for a lot of money being spent and a lot of rounds being wasted.

Get some numbers and then post 'em.  You'll get much, much better and more useful advice.  And it'll be way cheaper...

Actually I did give him my numbers and I assumed from the "240 carry with too much spin" that his swing speed would be pretty close to mine.

He's since confirmed that I was correct to assume those were his numbers.

A person doesn't necessarily need trackman to know what their ball is doing.  I realize it can be a help but if a guy is saying that he's spinning it a little too much and simply wants a flatter flight with a bit of roll out, he doesn't necessarily need a $25000  machine to tell him what club he needs.

Just my opinion.  I get that this site is full of trackman obsessed people so flame away....

I'm not "Trackman obsessed" and I have no interest in flaming you or anybody else.  The only thing I see in rereading the thread is what you say your numbers are, and you say that you are carrying a 17* club 250 with roll.  He says that he is carrying his driver 240 with no roll.  He says that he can't seem to get reliable numbers, but whatever they are I don't see any reason to consider them comparable to yours; the two examples above just don't bear that out.  I assume your swing speed must be significantly higher than his, and there may be other differences as well with launch angles, etc.

The reason I asked the question about his actual swing speed is that we all tend to become obsessed with a little more distance.  The OP thinks he can get this by some roll out that he isn't getting and that may be true.  Or it may not be...

The advantage of getting accurate numbers is that you don't have to throw money at your bag with no reasonable hope of achieving better results.  If his swing speed is 100, for instance, he might find that he gets his best overall results from 240 carry and whatever roll out happens.  But he'll never know until he either tries a bunch of combos on the course (expensive), or gets accurate numbers with his current setup and posts them here (much cheaper).

#19 grochol17

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 07:05 PM

I agree with bluedot that without some more specific numbers about your shots, people on here are just telling you what they like and guessing that it will work for you.  A good example of this is your comment about hitting it 240.  bluedot thought you were talking about your driver and I assumed 3 wood.  I noticed in the original post you didn't specify which one goes 240.  

That aside, I've never hit the YS6+, but according to Titleist's web site, it is mid launch, mid spin (http://media.titleis....html#/4/zoomed).  So, you've got a lot of shaft options to bring the spin down.  But, as stated above, and many times on golfwrx by club fitters, high launch low spin in a shaft is a myth.  You can see on that chart that as launch goes up, so does spin.  

A couple of other things to consider:

1) is the problem with your ball flight really from too high spin?  The reason I ask is that I've seen some articles on here where fitters talked about people thinking their ball was dropping out of the skip because of too much spin, which in fact they didn't have enough spin for their ball speed to keep the ball airborne.  Obviously, I know nothing about your game, so I'm not saying you're wrong, just throwing that out there since no one else has mentioned it.

2) do you have a swing that will even benefit from shafts with different launch angles/spin rates?  Tom Wishon has a nice article on here about shafts and one thing he points out is that unless you have a fairly late release, you won't really benefit shafts with different launch angles.  When I was looking to buy a 910 Fd, I hit the ahina, PX Blue and RIP alpha and got identical numbers with all three, but I've seen plenty of posts on here where people said that found a big difference between those three.

Particularly for reason #2, blindly buying the shafts suggested on here could be expensive and not even work for you.

Edited by grochol17, 08 January 2013 - 07:06 PM.


#20 Ajlepisto

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 08:52 PM

I guess I should have clarified...but I thought I was clear.

I carry my 3w currently around 240. I doubt that I am not generating enough spin with the YS. If it didn't spin enough it wouldn't be so high and then just drop. It would tend to come down sooner, or never elevate properly. Moving to X100SL in my irons fixed my weak ballflight issues there, so I am now bleeding that over into my woods as well.

I hit my driver with the same shaft around 265 carry, and not much rollout. I hit a prolaunch red that solved that issue, which is why I am now looking for a 3w shaft option that would duplicate that flight...but I was concerned it would become too difficult to elevate, so I wanted some other options.

Thrillhouse was great and gave me a really good idea about the 17* head with a different shaft combination that seems to make sense and would seem to solve my issues.

So maybe there isn't a high launch low spin shaft...but there can still be a high launch low spin option that will get me the same result...which is what I was looking for initially. I thought I gave enough detail about what I was using, and where I wanted to go to get some ideas.

Thanks!

Edited by Ajlepisto, 08 January 2013 - 08:54 PM.


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#21 isaacbm

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 11:05 PM

View Postbluedot, on 08 January 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

View Postisaacbm, on 08 January 2013 - 04:57 PM, said:

View Postbluedot, on 08 January 2013 - 12:36 PM, said:

Unless I'm missing something, you never posted your swing speed.  240 is really good carry distance; are you certain that there are more yards to be had?

If you have access to a Trackman, it might save you time and money to at least get the launch numbers for the stuff you are playing now before you start throwing money at new stuff.  There is a big, big difference between WANTING to hit the ball farther and being ABLE to hit the ball farther.  And if you are able to hit it farther, you'll still need some LM numbers to give you an idea of whether the best way to accomplish that is through more carry or more roll.

Beyond all of that, there is the issue of dispersion.  If you get a 3W that you can hit 5 yds. farther, but you hit it an average of 10 yds. more off line, is that acceptable progress?

All of the advice given to you so far has been people telling you what THEY use and like.  You don't know their numbers, and they don't know yours. This is a recipe for a lot of money being spent and a lot of rounds being wasted.

Get some numbers and then post 'em.  You'll get much, much better and more useful advice.  And it'll be way cheaper...

Actually I did give him my numbers and I assumed from the "240 carry with too much spin" that his swing speed would be pretty close to mine.

He's since confirmed that I was correct to assume those were his numbers.

A person doesn't necessarily need trackman to know what their ball is doing.  I realize it can be a help but if a guy is saying that he's spinning it a little too much and simply wants a flatter flight with a bit of roll out, he doesn't necessarily need a $25000  machine to tell him what club he needs.

Just my opinion.  I get that this site is full of trackman obsessed people so flame away....

I'm not "Trackman obsessed" and I have no interest in flaming you or anybody else.  The only thing I see in rereading the thread is what you say your numbers are, and you say that you are carrying a 17* club 250 with roll.  He says that he is carrying his driver 240 with no roll.  He says that he can't seem to get reliable numbers, but whatever they are I don't see any reason to consider them comparable to yours; the two examples above just don't bear that out.  I assume your swing speed must be significantly higher than his, and there may be other differences as well with launch angles, etc.

The reason I asked the question about his actual swing speed is that we all tend to become obsessed with a little more distance.  The OP thinks he can get this by some roll out that he isn't getting and that may be true.  Or it may not be...

The advantage of getting accurate numbers is that you don't have to throw money at your bag with no reasonable hope of achieving better results.  If his swing speed is 100, for instance, he might find that he gets his best overall results from 240 carry and whatever roll out happens.  But he'll never know until he either tries a bunch of combos on the course (expensive), or gets accurate numbers with his current setup and posts them here (much cheaper).

It was my understanding that he carried his 3 wood 240 because that's what the thread is titled and that's what he's asking about.  I was saying that with a certain head and shaft, he would be able to carry his 3 wood 250 and still have a little roll as well.

I wasn't trying to be a d^&k, I just think that the advice was relevant to his situation.  If he's currently carrying his 3 wood 240 with  a lot of spin, it would be pretty easy to carry it 250 and have a little roll out with the club head and shaft combo I was talking about.

I hear what you're saying though.  I hate it when guys say things like: " My uncle got that club and he loves it.  You should get it too."  My point was that a higher lofted 3 wood with a lower launching/stiffer shaft might be something to consider.

I'm sorry to bring up the Trackman obsession.  It wasn't intended to be aimed at you personally.  I just get a little tired of hearing about it so much on this site.  A good player with a good eye for ball flight will often be able to get the launch conditions pretty close just by looking at the ball flight.  To me, it's more important what the flight of the ball looks like and exactly how the ball reacts when it hits the ground, then it is to know the exact numbers.  Just my opinion....

#22 bluedot

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 10:13 AM

In retrospect, I guess I should have assumed that the OP was talking about his 3W all along.

I think I assumed that since you were talking about a 240 yd. carry, that you must've been talking about your driver.  That you are carrying a 3W 240 yds and asking questions about how to get more out of it is not something with which I can identify.

Sorry...

#23 Ajlepisto

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:19 PM

It's an Adams Speedline 12, so it's a pretty hot face. It's nearly a driver replacement...

But that said, I had a gapping issue where I would hit my driver 265ish carry and get no roll. Around 240 carry no roll with the 3w. However I am going to a ProLaunch Red style low spin shaft that gives me a boost in roll with my driver, which can significantly increase my distance, now that I can get some roll in fairway conditions.

I needed to make the same jump with my 3w, or another fairway wood, so I wouldn't have an awkward gap at around 240, where I can't hit a shot that really has any roll once it comes down. I don't hit my 3w into greens as much as I hit toward greens...so having some more aggressive descent on the shot and maybe getting some rollout (maybe 10 yards or something) would be more idea. That's the difference between pitching and chipping in many cases, for me.

So it's not really maximizing distance via power...it's more like maybe getting a little more due to the ball characteristics once it lands.

What blows my mind are the guys who can carry it 270. That's nuts.

#24 isaacbm

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:03 PM

View PostAjlepisto, on 09 January 2013 - 12:19 PM, said:

It's an Adams Speedline 12, so it's a pretty hot face. It's nearly a driver replacement...

But that said, I had a gapping issue where I would hit my driver 265ish carry and get no roll. Around 240 carry no roll with the 3w. However I am going to a ProLaunch Red style low spin shaft that gives me a boost in roll with my driver, which can significantly increase my distance, now that I can get some roll in fairway conditions.

I needed to make the same jump with my 3w, or another fairway wood, so I wouldn't have an awkward gap at around 240, where I can't hit a shot that really has any roll once it comes down. I don't hit my 3w into greens as much as I hit toward greens...so having some more aggressive descent on the shot and maybe getting some rollout (maybe 10 yards or something) would be more idea. That's the difference between pitching and chipping in many cases, for me.

So it's not really maximizing distance via power...it's more like maybe getting a little more due to the ball characteristics once it lands.

What blows my mind are the guys who can carry it 270. That's nuts.

I think you're correct in wanting to even out the distance gap.  The reason I'm hitting a 17 degree fairway wood is because my 14.5 goes too close to my driver.  And like I said, I have a 13 degree tour spoon too that is really a 2 wood.  I want to carry driver 270, 4 wood 250 and 5 wood/2 iron 230.  Having a 20 yard gap works great for me.

If you really want to have a club that chases up to greens, then I would consider having an extra wood in your bag.  Get a spoon/2 wood and then put a 4 wood in there too. You'll have to give up something at the other end.  I went from 47//52/56/60 to 47/53/59.  I'm more comfortable with the bigger gap in my wedges and now I  can have a max distance fairway wood and a high launch fairway wood at the same time.

I can hit the 2 wood 270, the 17* 250 and the 20* fairway wood/2 iron 230.

The reason I was talking specifically about the Taylormade stuff is that they're getting close to or even over the max core allowance.  Most good players I know are having to adjust their set make up if they're playing taylormade.   But the RBZ tour spoon has to be the longest fairway wood in the world.  I'm getting ball speeds 4 mph less than my driver with that thing.  So If you need a roll up club, that might be one to consider.

Another option is to change the lofts of your longer irons so that you have a strong 6 say and a week 4 and then don't have a 5 iron.  That gives you room to have and extra wedge or fairway wood.

One of the best things about all the adjustable loft options is that you can get perfect gaps in your longer clubs now.




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