26 replies to this topic

[maverick]

In 2000 I was putting with a Scotty Cameron Putter and loved the putter but came across a Bettinardi. I was fascinated by the precision and one piece technology. I called the factory and the VP of the company sold me my first Bettinardi. He gave me info and was immensely helpful. I got to know him and the tour fitter; Glenn who sold me several putters one out of the van. I have talked to RJB a few times and he is always a gentleman.

With the Studio open, the VP and tour fitter gone, I now talk to the person in charge whoever that is now. All the Studios are in the mid-west. BTW, there IS golf west of the Rocky Mountains. LOL So now I am just another customer. For years I defended Bettinardi on forums etc. and I got flamed all the time from Cameron lovers/Bettinardi haters.

Big success has come to Bettinardi and I can wait in line for one at top dollar just like anyone else. So the customers who believed in this company and supported it with both purchases and on forums are not appreciated at all. After 13 years I am sorry to say I am now just another customer or number.

Here are a few I have had and most I still have. :-(

BB-42-H
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v669/dennisaa/newBB-42-H.jpg
BB-2H Custom DASS
http://img.photobuck...SAmbruso4-1.jpg
SS#6 weighted to 350 grams
http://img.photobuck...tinardiSS6a.jpg
BB1-MS-H
http://img.photobuck...isaa/BB1-MS.jpg
1st Run Baby Bee
http://img.photobuck.../BabyBeeBSG.jpg
Very early Bettinardi 'Andrews' Putter
http://img.photobuck...rdiS1eBay-4.jpg
MC-360 Proto
http://img.photobuck.../360Mproto1.jpg
BB8-H
http://img.photobuck...nisaa/bb8-H.jpg
BB1-H
http://img.photobuck.../BB1-Hdig-1.jpg


Plus a BB2 350 gram 3 slot no pic. and a few Bettinardi/Mizunos which are gone.

[KDMullins]

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

Edited by KDMullins, 01 January 2013 - 07:35 PM.

[xxio]

When was the last time you called? I'm sure if you ask for someone specifically and they are available they would talk to you, otherwise you get the person whose job and training is to answer your questions. I don't think Bettinardi is anywhere near the Customer Service Dept/Call Center system as of now.

Edited by xxio, 01 January 2013 - 07:35 PM.

[maverick]

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

[Timanator]

maverick, I understand where you are coming from, thats why I go to this old guy in town for all my golf work. It's something familiar, we chit chat, tell stories and always have a good time and end up with something that works. He used to play on the tour so he's got plenty of cool stories.

When he passes or retires, I guess I will be learning to do it my self or go to the box stores.

[KYMAR]

It sounds to me like you are resentful that you've lost your ability to drop little tid bits like "You know i was conferencing in RJB and the tour fitter the other day...." right before you 3 jack it from 18ft during your Sunday morning four ball. What is it you want out of this, or any, company? Quality products, good service, and timely responses? Are you still getting that? Because what you are doing, is taking their success as some personal slight against you and it's not. "forgeting old customers" is not delivering on promises, missing ship dates, sending a putter with the wrong specs, or color, or grip. Not some turnover in their customer service department, nor lack of availability of some higher ups.  I don't own a Bettinardi, and i don't anticipate that I will any time soon. But your complaint sounds way more like sour grapes than a case of them failing to meet a reasonable expectation. You don't have your own personal tour fitter now? Awwwww. Sorry, but this is ridiculous and if anyone is doing anything contrary to the spirit of your long term relationship, it's you, with this thread.

Edited by KYMAR, 01 January 2013 - 09:16 PM.

[highergr0und]

So maybe you just have to establish the relationship with the new guy?  Sounds like you're annoyed that they don't know you, but how about a trip down to meet the new crew?  You obviously have a history, but you expect them to drop everything for you?

Customer service is a fickle thing.  I've run into old customers of various places I used to run who complain about the same thing.  It's a two way relationship.  You sometimes have to start over.

[KDMullins]

maverick, on 01 January 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

I get what you're saying, but the guys at Bettinardi are about as accessible as you can possibly be for a company that size and with that much going on.  Jimmy and/or Nick can pretty much get you whatever you want and help you however you need to be helped.  I really don't recall asking either one of those guys to do something that they didn't at least try and, way more often than not, make happen.  You can also go straight to the Studio for fittings, to pick out your putter, and they'll bend it and grip it all right there.

[chickenpotpie]

maverick, on 01 January 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

I'm still confused...they have a tour fitter that is still there, named Ben Bradbury.  A damn good one too...

Mike Orvis, who does the fittings at the Studio in Tinley Park is top notch as well.  Not sure what you are griping about?  In either case, you aren't simply talking to someone in a call center who knows how to read a brochure.  And if the relationship with this "tour fitter" was so important to you, why did you stop calling them at some point, and lose the ability to form a relationship with the new guy?  Why not just call Bob himself?

[stage1350]

OP, what were you looking to discuss with the shop?  I've owned as many Bettinardis as you have and the only time that I needed to speak to someone in detail was to have a putter refurbished.  For that, I spoke at length to Glenn Z.  I've spoken to RJB, but only in passing.  Never in great detail.

I think you have better access to a lot of putter makers than you think.  I've had good dialogues with Byron Morgan through email.  I cherish the conversations and chatted at length to pick the brain of Tad Moore.  You can call Tom Slighter or LaMont Mann and get the personalized service you want as well.

Sure, Bettinardi has gotten bigger and you may not be able to spend an hour with one-on-one time with their Tour fitter.  But unless you want some real custom options, Nick and Jimmy can probably do a lot of things to take care of you as well.

[the man with no aim]

Brad, OP & Mike

I too think its sad that Glenn Z has gone & I think it'll be a very chilly day in hell before he returns, he had a way about him that was most definately unique in a great way & I can possible see that Ben has a very big pair of shoes to fill but, give him a go, you'll never know if you don't try him.  Mike Orvis has said some impressive things and time will tell if he can deliver on those promises, I for one hope he can.

However, the products seem to go from strength to strength, true the retail line up doesn't have the uniqueness you may desire but, form a new relationship with either Jimmy or Nick and you should be able to get want you want, sadly the Custom Programme won't be available ever again but, at certain times of the year, you can get a different neck put on an unusual head in just the right position to give you your prefered hang and normally choose the finish too.

I dunno what Bob and the team will put out next PGA Show but when I saw those DASS necked Copper putters last year or the year before I was like F... that can't be done welding copper and DASS but, hats off they did it, this year's social they put out a 3/4 (or mini if thats your terminology) mallet Fn hell its less than 3" heel to toe, who the hell else does that kinda thing.

Bettinardi may have moved on but, compared to what else is available they will always be my first port of call for putters.

Regards
T

[maverick]

KYMAR, on 01 January 2013 - 09:13 PM, said:

It sounds to me like you are resentful that you've lost your ability to drop little tid bits like "You know i was conferencing in RJB and the tour fitter the other day...." right before you 3 jack it from 18ft during your Sunday morning four ball. What is it you want out of this, or any, company? Quality products, good service, and timely responses? Are you still getting that? Because what you are doing, is taking their success as some personal slight against you and it's not. "forgeting old customers" is not delivering on promises, missing ship dates, sending a putter with the wrong specs, or color, or grip. Not some turnover in their customer service department, nor lack of availability of some higher ups.  I don't own a Bettinardi, and i don't anticipate that I will any time soon. But your complaint sounds way more like sour grapes than a case of them failing to meet a reasonable expectation. You don't have your own personal tour fitter now? Awwwww. Sorry, but this is ridiculous and if anyone is doing anything contrary to the spirit of your long term relationship, it's you, with this thread.

I do no not wrestle with pigs. I only get dirty and the pigs like that. Padding your post count with mindless posts like a troll is a real no-class act. Are you on any medications we should know about?

Edited by maverick, 03 January 2013 - 01:21 PM.

[KYMAR]

maverick, on 03 January 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:

KYMAR, on 01 January 2013 - 09:13 PM, said:

It sounds to me like you are resentful that you've lost your ability to drop little tid bits like "You know i was conferencing in RJB and the tour fitter the other day...." right before you 3 jack it from 18ft during your Sunday morning four ball. What is it you want out of this, or any, company? Quality products, good service, and timely responses? Are you still getting that? Because what you are doing, is taking their success as some personal slight against you and it's not. "forgeting old customers" is not delivering on promises, missing ship dates, sending a putter with the wrong specs, or color, or grip. Not some turnover in their customer service department, nor lack of availability of some higher ups.  I don't own a Bettinardi, and i don't anticipate that I will any time soon. But your complaint sounds way more like sour grapes than a case of them failing to meet a reasonable expectation. You don't have your own personal tour fitter now? Awwwww. Sorry, but this is ridiculous and if anyone is doing anything contrary to the spirit of your long term relationship, it's you, with this thread.

I do no not wrestle with pigs. I only get dirty and the pigs like that. Padding your post count with mindless posts like a troll is a real no-class act. Are you on any medications we should know about?

I'd like to thank you for your observations on what does and doesn't make a "class act". I will give it exactly the amount of weight and consideration it deserves.

[maverick]

stage1350, on 02 January 2013 - 12:03 AM, said:

OP, what were you looking to discuss with the shop?  I've owned as many Bettinardis as you have and the only time that I needed to speak to someone in detail was to have a putter refurbished.  For that, I spoke at length to Glenn Z.  I've spoken to RJB, but only in passing.  Never in great detail.

I think you have better access to a lot of putter makers than you think.  I've had good dialogues with Byron Morgan through email.  I cherish the conversations and chatted at length to pick the brain of Tad Moore.  You can call Tom Slighter or LaMont Mann and get the personalized service you want as well.

Sure, Bettinardi has gotten bigger and you may not be able to spend an hour with one-on-one time with their Tour fitter.  But unless you want some real custom options, Nick and Jimmy can probably do a lot of things to take care of you as well.

I did have Tom Slighter re-finish a BB-2 and he did a fantastic job. I am planning on using him again as his work is amazing and he is available to discuss changes or options. I have called several time and talked to the current staff. Maybe I have the wrong impression but they always just tell me to fill out the form online and send it in so I never get to explain what I would like done as easily as talking to someone. I prefer to do business in person and if not on the phone, not endless emailing.

Example: I have a SS#6 very sought after putter. I have only practiced with it and noticed I somehow got a very small scratch on the back of the putter. I felt the finish was and is amazing so I wanted an original finish with the scratch fixed. I called to explain this but was cut off and just told to, "Fill out the form online and send it in." I was curious about just trying to fix the scratch but did not know if it was possible. My only option was a $165.00 re-finish and a three month wait.

I still have the putter and never did anything yet. As a 12 year + customer don't I deserve a few minutes to try and ask if there were any other options? I feel I should but evidentially not everyone agrees.

I am honestly happy RJB is doing well. I still wish I could get the attention that Tom Slighter has given me but I guess those days are gone.

[the man with no aim]

I too like Tom's work and yeah he's great to talk with, I attach below some photos of a small alteration he did for me.

I don't generally do this in open forum but, I'm F'ed if I know yet how to work personal messages on here & I'm sure Nick is just as good as Jimmy but I haven't used him to know but, If you like the personal touch try Jimmy at Bettinardi LTD.  I've sent putters for loft/lie, refurb/refinishes, reshafts/regrips (most no longing available) and new paintwork/colours, the turn-around times have always been very impressive and I've always found him great to work with.  He's a funny guy too, always joking about but, will always try whatever the requested work even if he doesn't think its something they'll do, has even advised me of when is a quietier time of the year to ask for more unusual work to be done ie. a higher chance of getting it done.

I think though Bettinardi may have got less personal in the way they do business, the LE & Tour model Representatives have got even more personal in the way they do business.  Give them a try you never know what they can make happen unless you ask.  I've had snap shots taken of putters I maybe interested in taken during some poor fellows fitting, I have tour putters sold to me outta the tour bag without the Tour Fitters approval heck, I've even know of putter made for the PGA Show being sold before leaving the Studio B facilities.

Now I can't say all of this can still happen but, I know the LE & Tour model Representatives will get you more of a service than just phoning in as we all used to be able to, might be the change of staff, its more likely to be the change in the Economy but, it is what is so, work the options available.

Attached Thumbnails

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[JGalls]

I've been in the Bettinardi game for about 4 years now post my T.P. Mills relationship.  So not nearly as long as you.  I started using Bettinardi's mainly because the people involved with the Company.  Guys like Keith, Jimmy, Nick, Ben, Mike and Bob himself are down to earth, have a beer and a laugh with great guys.  They were that way to me before I starting using Bettinardis and now when I spend time with them as a customer.

WIth that said, I agree that the Company has changed.  When you started back 12 years ago they were manufacturing for another Company to be sold at retail.  With that comes it's own issues, but not from a customer service end, just supply/manuf.  So a select few guys within the Company or really it's distributor gave you great service but that's all they did.  Buy/sell/distribute.  It's how they made money.  Retained customers like you because they had a smaller customer base and you were a loyal customer.  If you're talking about distributors alone... you'd be hardpressed to find two better guys then Nick and Jimmy.  Service is great and always comes with a laugh or two along the way.  I recommend building a relationship with them like the one you had in the past, regardless if you make a purchase or not.  Very knowledgable putter guys (ex-Cameron collectors and Nick was in a Cameron distrib relationship), that you'll enjoy talking with.

Now in the last 4 years I've personally seen Bettinardi change.  Less micro and more macro.  Soley because they've gone to the retail market on their own,.  It requires more of their time so less goes to the boutique collectors like yourself it sounds or even me.  Concentrating on a larger customer base does not mean they don't care about customers.

My 2 cents.

Edited by JGalls, 03 January 2013 - 02:46 PM.

[maverick]

JGalls, on 03 January 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

I've been in the Bettinardi game for about 4 years now post my T.P. Mills relationship.  So not nearly as long as you.  I started using Bettinardi's mainly because the people involved with the Company.  Guys like Keith, Jimmy, Nick, Ben, Mike and Bob himself are down to earth, have a beer and a laugh with great guys.  They were that way to me before I starting using Bettinardis and now when I spend time with them as a customer.

WIth that said, I agree that the Company has changed.  When you started back 12 years ago they were manufacturing for another Company to be sold at retail.  With that comes it's own issues, but not from a customer service end, just supply/manuf.  So a select few guys within the Company or really it's distributor gave you great service but that's all they did.  Buy/sell/distribute.  It's how they made money.  Retained customers like you because they had a smaller customer base and you were a loyal customer.  If you're talking about distributors alone... you'd be hardpressed to find two better guys then Nick and Jimmy.  Service is great and always comes with a laugh or two along the way.  I recommend building a relationship with them like the one you had in the past, regardless if you make a purchase or not.  Very knowledgable putter guys (ex-Cameron collectors and Nick was in a Cameron distrib relationship), that you'll enjoy talking with.

Now in the last 4 years I've personally seen Bettinardi change.  Less micro and more macro.  Soley because they've gone to the retail market on their own,.  It requires more of their time so less goes to the boutique collectors like yourself it sounds or even me.  Concentrating on a larger customer base does not mean they don't care about customers.

My 2 cents.

Just an FYI between 2000 and 2002 Bettinadi made and marketed the ''Millenium Series' and sold them off their web site and through a few Country Clubs. The BB42-H I own was one of that series thus the Millenium Headcovers all red. If my memory is correct that is just after Cameron went with Titleist. RJB wanted the control to make what he wanted so he made his own line

I have bought a few items from Jimmy and may contact him for future purchases. I 'know' of Nick from his Cameron days and all his posts on this and that other site.  

With the number of pros living in the Scottsdale area I would hope someday a Western Studio will open. It is a bit out of my way to fly to Illinois just for a putter fitting.

I never said anyone at Bettinardi was rude or not kind, they just seemed very rushed. I think this has run it's course. I did not mean to sound so negative on my original post. It was probably frustration that has built up for some time and I had to get it off my chest.

And yes, I do miss talks with Glenn as he was always accommodating and easy to talk with. He occasionally would let me know which pro asked of a particluar putter I was interested in buying. This is not the typical conversation when normally buying a putter and it made the experience sort of exciting.

Edited by maverick, 03 January 2013 - 06:58 PM.

[stage1350]

Phoenix, SoCal, or Vegas would be perfect for another Studio B.  I have to think he amount of cash flowing around sin city that Vegas would be a great place to walk off with a $$$$ putter if you hit it big on the crap tables.

[xxio]

I know you mentioned you don't like emailing. I have gone that route (with pictures) and it worked wonders.

[JayLefty]

JGalls, on 03 January 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

I've been in the Bettinardi game for about 4 years now post my T.P. Mills relationship.  So not nearly as long as you.  I started using Bettinardi's mainly because the people involved with the Company.  Guys like Keith, Jimmy, Nick, Ben, Mike and Bob himself are down to earth, have a beer and a laugh with great guys.  They were that way to me before I starting using Bettinardis and now when I spend time with them as a customer.

WIth that said, I agree that the Company has changed.  When you started back 12 years ago they were manufacturing for another Company to be sold at retail.  With that comes it's own issues, but not from a customer service end, just supply/manuf.  So a select few guys within the Company or really it's distributor gave you great service but that's all they did.  Buy/sell/distribute.  It's how they made money.  Retained customers like you because they had a smaller customer base and you were a loyal customer.  If you're talking about distributors alone... you'd be hardpressed to find two better guys then Nick and Jimmy.  Service is great and always comes with a laugh or two along the way.  I recommend building a relationship with them like the one you had in the past, regardless if you make a purchase or not.  Very knowledgable putter guys (ex-Cameron collectors and Nick was in a Cameron distrib relationship), that you'll enjoy talking with.

Now in the last 4 years I've personally seen Bettinardi change.  Less micro and more macro.  Soley because they've gone to the retail market on their own,.  It requires more of their time so less goes to the boutique collectors like yourself it sounds or even me.  Concentrating on a larger customer base does not mean they don't care about customers.

My 2 cents.

Well said. The types of service you can get from Bettinardi via Jimmy and Nick are outstanding. I have been able to request custom specs and other special request and they are always willing to try to make it work.

More Studio B's would be great, but controlled growth makes sense.

Edited by JayLefty, 03 January 2013 - 10:32 PM.

[mshills]

maverick, on 01 January 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

Since you're not a Tour player any more, what exactly is the issue?

[the man with no aim]

mshills, on 04 January 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

maverick, on 01 January 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

Since you're not a Tour player any more, what exactly is the issue?

Expectation preception gap perhaps

We all look at pretty young ladies and think hmmmmmm, none of us like to be told we getting old or past it & nobody likes losing the respect they've once earned so, whats with the "your not any more" stuff

[maverick]

mshills, on 04 January 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

maverick, on 01 January 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

Since you're not a Tour player any more, what exactly is the issue?

Tour player????????????????????????????

[Bettinardi LTD]

Maverick-
If I can help in anyway please let me know.

Jimmy

[Stu-Co]

maverick, on 01 January 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

KDMullins, on 01 January 2013 - 07:06 PM, said:

Sounds like you're complaining, but I'm not sure what about.  Are you upset they don't have the same employees they had 12 years ago?

No, I do not expect them to stay forever. Maybe I've lived too long. ;-) It was nice to be able to actually talk to someone who was a tour fitter. I would say I am more disappointed than upset. I suppose as a company gets bigger it moves farther from the customer and more into profit.

I think you've found your answer/reason.  My opinion - it's just the nature of business.  

[maverick]

Bettinardi LTD, on 08 January 2013 - 06:35 PM, said:

Maverick-
If I can help in anyway please let me know.

Jimmy

I forgot that you have been of great help a few times so I apologize for you inclusion in this topic. You will hear from me again and thanks.

[lumberman2462]

I grew up using a blade putter - a 1968 Titleist Tour Model Heel Shafted Offset - and used that same putter from about ₁86 until it had just gotten so dinged up that it was beyond repair. I finally switched when  I won a long drive contest in the mid 90s and ended up with a copper Scotty Cameron Napa.  I tried it for a while and then bought a gun blue Napa.  They were great but not the same as    my old Titleist blade.  I then came across the BB2 and ended up with 3 of those babies.  A Double Aged Nitron Stainless, a 360 gram blade with a copper insert in the face and a black 3 slot.  I can putt anymore - which I attribute to age more than anything - but those Bettinardi blade sure are pretty.  They're all three sitting against the wall in my office and all kinds of people come in and putt a little.  Had a few decent offers for each of them.