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Reasonable offer


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#1 dhacker56

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:54 PM

I recently was looking on the BAY for a set of cheap used irons.  I was willing to pay $125 shipped for 5-PW.
I saw a set of the Nike VR irons listed as NEW for $125 initial price at auction.  He was throwing in a USED VR 3 wood with the wrench.
His shipping costs were a little high $33.20  but he was going to ship Priority mail so I figured if I could get the deal for $135 plus the shipping it would be worth it.  So I fired up my handy little snipe program and bid the $135.
Low and behold I won the auction for $130.28.
Fast forward  TEN days.  Still no clubs.   Finally they arrived after 12 days.  He had sent them PARCEL POST.
The irons were NOT new.  There was NO wrench.
So I PM'd him,  NO reply.  PM'd again 2 days later.  NO reply.
So I got his TX number from Ebay and called him.  Left message.  After a day with no reply I contacted Paypal and filed a dispute.
Within FIVE minutes he called me.  I told him my concerns..  I paid dearly for Priority and got PP.
I paid for NEW and got used.  I paid for a wrench and did not get one.
I suggested that he just pay me for difference between the cost of Parcel Post  and what I paid for the shipping.
And since the clubs were not new I requested $35 more and he was to send me the wrench.
He did NOT Paypal me the following Monday as agreed upon.

After 12 days Paypal informed me that I had won the dispute and they refunded my entire purchase and shipping  even though my request was only for the $50.
The seller appealed the paypal decision and tonite I was informed they denied his appeal.
I am not a crook and have no intention of keeping both the clubs and the money.
I offered him the original deal  $100 if he wishes to keep the wrench or $113.48
Do you all think that was a fair offer?  If not, what would you ALL have done?


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#2 daco81se

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 10:40 PM

PP and Ebay both seem (atleast in the 2 cases in the last 10 yrs I've had) pretty fair when the dispute is black and white as yours, that being said, seems that your seller is difficult to deal with, I'd ship them back to him and call the deal done and look for some different clubs.
One question, did PP refund your $ back to you already without proof that you sent the clubs back? That is not normal, they normally agree to refund the $ (I had them refund the amount it cost me to ship back in both my cases) but wait till the tracking # they want provided shows the item has been delivered to the seller.

#3 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 08:14 AM

View Postdaco81se, on 26 December 2012 - 10:40 PM, said:

PP and Ebay both seem (atleast in the 2 cases in the last 10 yrs I've had) pretty fair when the dispute is black and white as yours, that being said, seems that your seller is difficult to deal with, I'd ship them back to him and call the deal done and look for some different clubs.
One question, did PP refund your $ back to you already without proof that you sent the clubs back? That is not normal, they normally agree to refund the $ (I had them refund the amount it cost me to ship back in both my cases) but wait till the tracking # they want provided shows the item has been delivered to the seller.

Paypal refunded my money without me having to send the clubs back.  I have both the clubs and the $$.  I want the clubs but do not fell they are worth the full price I paid since they were used and there was no wrench.  I have no intentions of paying to send the clubs back.  I was not the one who misrepresented them.
My post was to inquire as to what you all would do if these circumstances presented themselves to you.

#4 highergr0und

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 08:56 AM

It doesn't matter if we think it's fair.  The reason you won the full purchase price is because it's not up to paypal to decide what something is worth.  Sure, maybe shipping costs, but only you and the seller can decide on the actual value of the clubs.

Bottom line, maybe he would rather have the full set back and risk another sale to net more money in the end.  I would like to say I would take the deal to offset paying shipping costs back, but I'm an honest seller to start from so I wouldn't be there.  

Did you look at pics of the clubs?  Did they look new?

#5 avgjoe

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:00 AM

you have all the cards now... do what you think is fair/right


#6 goondawg

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:02 AM

You won the paypal dispute and got your money back.  You still have his items.   If he will accept your lower offer fine but if not you need to return his items.    More than likely you will be out of pocket and it sucks.  You can try sending him a paypal invoice for return shipping but more than likely he won't pay it.  After all is said and done put the seller on your ebay block list.  


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#7 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:15 AM

View Posthighergr0und, on 27 December 2012 - 08:56 AM, said:

It doesn't matter if we think it's fair.  The reason you won the full purchase price is because it's not up to paypal to decide what something is worth.  Sure, maybe shipping costs, but only you and the seller can decide on the actual value of the clubs.

Bottom line, maybe he would rather have the full set back and risk another sale to net more money in the end.  I would like to say I would take the deal to offset paying shipping costs back, but I'm an honest seller to start from so I wouldn't be there.  

Did you look at pics of the clubs?  Did they look new?

There was only one picture.  It was hard to tell.  I thought with 100% positive feedback he would know what NEW was.

#8 squishyy

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:17 AM

Ship them back. Leave him negative feedback. Then pat yourself on the back and call it a day.
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#9 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:17 AM

View Postgoondawg, on 27 December 2012 - 09:02 AM, said:

You won the paypal dispute and got your money back.  You still have his items.   If he will accept your lower offer fine but if not you need to return his items. More than likely you will be out of pocket and it sucks.  You can try sending him a paypal invoice for return shipping but more than likely he won't pay it.  After all is said and done put the seller on your ebay block list.  

I thought about this solution.  But nixed it because I refuse to pay for his error or his attempted deceit.  And he offered to pay the amount back and then never followed thru.

#10 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:18 AM

View Postsquishyy, on 27 December 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

Ship them back. Leave him negative feedback. Then pat yourself on the back and call it a day.

And I am supposed to be out $20 for his attempted deceit or his ignorance.  No thank you.


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#11 lander215

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:23 AM

Link to eBay item please so that we can discern for ourselves what you're saying.

Also, if you do not return the items that you didn't pay for, then you are a thief.

#12 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:27 AM

I

View Postlander215, on 27 December 2012 - 09:23 AM, said:

Link to eBay item please so that we can discern for ourselves what you're saying.

Also, if you do not return the items that you didn't pay for, then you are a thief.

I thought it was plain I did not intend to keep the clubs w/o paying for them.
I offered the seller two options:
the originally agreed upon restitution $50 off the full price and I get the wrench or $63 off and he keeps the wrench.

http://www.ebay.com/...cvip=true&rt=nc

Edited by dhacker56, 27 December 2012 - 09:31 AM.


#13 winn0040

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:28 AM

View Postdhacker56, on 27 December 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

View Postsquishyy, on 27 December 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

Ship them back. Leave him negative feedback. Then pat yourself on the back and call it a day.

And I am supposed to be out $20 for his attempted deceit or his ignorance.  No thank you.

Yes, unfortunately that is correct. If you keep the clubs and give him nothing you end up being the one in the wrong.

#14 tjumper78

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:29 AM

no need to be an angel, OP.
ask the seller to compensate for the money you lost in that transaction, and also ask for the return shipping cost.
let him/her know that the clubs will not be returned without your request being met.
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#15 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:33 AM

View Postwinn0040, on 27 December 2012 - 09:28 AM, said:

View Postdhacker56, on 27 December 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

View Postsquishyy, on 27 December 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

Ship them back. Leave him negative feedback. Then pat yourself on the back and call it a day.

And I am supposed to be out $20 for his attempted deceit or his ignorance.  No thank you.

Yes, unfortunately that is correct. If you keep the clubs and give him nothing you end up being the one in the wrong.

That was never my intent.  I did not file the dispute for an entire refund but just the amount HE agreed to pay.
That is what I intend to pay him.  I just wanted to see what you all thought.  Not that it was going to guide my actions.  I am not required to look at any of you when I shave in the morning.


#16 lander215

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:35 AM

View Postdhacker56, on 27 December 2012 - 09:27 AM, said:

I

View Postlander215, on 27 December 2012 - 09:23 AM, said:

Link to eBay item please so that we can discern for ourselves what you're saying.

Also, if you do not return the items that you didn't pay for, then you are a thief.

I thought it was plain I did not intend to keep the clubs w/o paying for them.
I offered the seller two options:
the originally agreed upon restitution $50 off the full price and I get the wrench or $63 off and he keeps the wrench.

http://www.ebay.com/...cvip=true&rt=nc

Yeah, I found the item already, and there were two pictures, one closer up showing the heads. Still because you can't see the face it's hard to tell if they were new from the pictures.

If he agreed to take X dollars for the clubs and you have the clubs and want them for X dollars, then PP him that amount and find a wrench.

Pretty plain and simple.

#17 lander215

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:37 AM

http://www.ebay.com/...=item4d07b9b816, there ya go, $10.95 and you got yourself a wrench.

#18 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:38 AM

View Postlander215, on 27 December 2012 - 09:35 AM, said:

View Postdhacker56, on 27 December 2012 - 09:27 AM, said:

I

View Postlander215, on 27 December 2012 - 09:23 AM, said:

Link to eBay item please so that we can discern for ourselves what you're saying.

Also, if you do not return the items that you didn't pay for, then you are a thief.

I thought it was plain I did not intend to keep the clubs w/o paying for them.
I offered the seller two options:
the originally agreed upon restitution $50 off the full price and I get the wrench or $63 off and he keeps the wrench.

http://www.ebay.com/...cvip=true&rt=nc

Yeah, I found the item already, and there were two pictures, one closer up showing the heads. Still because you can't see the face it's hard to tell if they were new from the pictures.

If he agreed to take X dollars for the clubs and you have the clubs and want them for X dollars, then PP him that amount and find a wrench.

Pretty plain and simple.


Exactly what was done... he still has not replied.

#19 AlexFerSure

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:38 AM

I may be wrong, but why not ship the clubs COD w/ a price you need to be compensated for.  If he doesn't accept, I'd have to say it's his problem.

Not sure if this would work.....Just a thought.

#20 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:42 AM

View PostAlexFerSure, on 27 December 2012 - 09:38 AM, said:

I may be wrong, but why not ship the clubs COD w/ a price you need to be compensated for.  If he doesn't accept, I'd have to say it's his problem.

Not sure if this would work.....Just a thought.


I bought the clubs because I wanted them.  I just want to pay a fair price.  He LISTED them as NEW for his price.
He got MORE than his original price.  They were not new and he should make restitution for that  as well as not shipping ALL that was listed and not shipping them Priority as was listed.


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#21 DJ412

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:48 AM

For the price you paid your being unreasonable. Send the clubs back and good luck on finding a deal with 7 "new" clubs for $130.  Whether he didn't list it right or not. Heck I'd give you $132 right now. Make sure you ship priority to me though.

Edited by DJ412, 27 December 2012 - 09:51 AM.

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#22 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:49 AM

View PostDJ412, on 27 December 2012 - 09:48 AM, said:

Where in the listing does it say new?  For the price you paid your being unreasonable. Send the clubs back and good luck on finding a deal with 7 "new" clubs for $130.

Look at the "category"  It says "NEW in box"

I was not looking for NEW  I was looking for cheap.  My OP is quite plain with that.  But he listed them for 125 why not try for them.  But he listed them as NEW in the box!  They were not.  I would not have paid 160 for used.  But NEW sure.  And these are 4 model years old.

Edited by dhacker56, 27 December 2012 - 09:53 AM.


#23 DJ412

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:52 AM

Yup I caught that.  I shouldn't change a diaper AND read at the same time.
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#24 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:54 AM

View PostDJ412, on 27 December 2012 - 09:52 AM, said:

Yup I caught that.  I shouldn't change a diaper AND read at the same time.


i ma sure your child though the diddy was more important.

#25 AlexFerSure

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:54 AM

View Postdhacker56, on 27 December 2012 - 09:42 AM, said:

View PostAlexFerSure, on 27 December 2012 - 09:38 AM, said:

I may be wrong, but why not ship the clubs COD w/ a price you need to be compensated for.  If he doesn't accept, I'd have to say it's his problem.

Not sure if this would work.....Just a thought.


I bought the clubs because I wanted them.  I just want to pay a fair price.  He LISTED them as NEW for his price.
He got MORE than his original price.  They were not new and he should make restitution for that  as well as not shipping ALL that was listed and not shipping them Priority as was listed.


You took fair price out of play when you accepted PayPal refund.  I'm merely suggesting you look at this option, request the total compensation you're looking for and put the ball in his court.

If he doesn't accept/sign for COD the clubs would then be sent back to you and you end up with the monies received from P/P and the clubs.  If he does accept the shipment, then all I can say is you would receive $ for the pain & suffering plus the P/P remittance.


#26 KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:56 AM

I don't see the problem, you owe him the difference between what you two agreed to and what was refunded. Just figure it out, put a detailed description of the deal in the message column, and send the correct amount to him. Case closed.

Edited by KILLEDBYASHANKEDWEDGE, 27 December 2012 - 09:57 AM.


#27 lander215

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:56 AM

Looking at recently sold items like what you bought, I'd say you got a good deal at $130 plus shipping with the 3 wood thrown in. For instance:

http://www.ebay.com/...=item51a4900899

If he won't respond to your offer, you've no choice but to ship them back.

#28 DJ412

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:03 AM

No idea what a diddy is.  But with the case "he" got me makes it way too easy to pop on some Elmo and read with the kick stand.  Anyway, looks like your looking for reasons to jam this guy up. Don't be that guy.
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#29 dhacker56

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:03 AM

View Postlander215, on 27 December 2012 - 09:56 AM, said:

Looking at recently sold items like what you bought, I'd say you got a good deal at $130 plus shipping with the 3 wood thrown in. For instance:

http://www.ebay.com/...=item51a4900899

If he won't respond to your offer, you've no choice but to ship them back.

I have ALL the choices.  I have the clubs and the $$.
I will send him either the $100 if does not reply and send the wrench or 113.46 if he replies and sends the wrench.
I know I got a good deal  but that is not the point.  HE listed them for what he thought was fair for NEW clubs.
I would not have bought them for 160 if I knew they were used.  HE agreed to refund the $50  That is what I intend to do.
I was just curious as to what you guys thought.
My view is the guy tried to cheat me more than once.  And I am being more than fair to give him what he agreed to.
BUT I will not give him more than that.

#30 dhacker56

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    Tour Winner

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  • 616 posts
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  • Member #: 9177
  • Joined: 12/30/2005
  • Location:Monticello, IN
  • Ebay ID:dhacker5185
GolfWRX Likes : 4

Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:07 AM

View PostDJ412, on 27 December 2012 - 10:03 AM, said:

No idea what a diddy is.  But with the case "he" got me makes it way too easy to pop on some Elmo and read with the kick stand.  Anyway, looks like your looking for reasons to jam this guy up. Don't be that guy.

diidy  I meant  Diaper(diidy)

I have no intentions of "jamming" anyone.  If that was the case I would have kept both the $$ and the clubs.  That thought never entered my mind.
But I am not a nobody and I will not be jammed either!  When someone makes a promise or a contract they are going to honor it (at least with me).


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