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Cleveland, what happened?


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#1 1965

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 12:28 AM

What is going on with Cleveland?  A year ago I swung a couple of Cleveland black irons and really liked them.  I didn't end up buying them then, but am shopping now for a new set.  Is it just me or does it seem Cleveland has shrunk in the market?  Don't see a lot of new, would love to try, new equipment coming up.  Don't see as many shops carrying their product.  Anybody have any insight on what they are up to?  Other than the new wedges any other new equipment coming up that would be worth a look?


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#2 Llortamaisey

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 12:32 AM

I think they forced their CEO to quit.

#3 1965

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 12:53 AM

I had read about the CEO getting shown the door, but I find it hard to believe they have nothing coming up.  Disappointed to hear one guy was the end-all, be-all of the company.  In this fast paced, you get market share or you don't business, I don't know if Cleveland is going to make it.

#4 Lefty94

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:05 AM

Cleveland makes some great stuff, I gamed an entire Cleveland bag for about 4 years, just this year moving to some other gear. IMO their gear is very underrated. Everyone knows about their wedges, but their irons and woods are very nice. I think alot of it comes down to marketing and the fact that they don't market at all. Last year I remember their year of the wedge commercials with the CEO, but other than that I can't remember any marketing they did.....and I was a brand loyalist. Reality is they don't flood the market with products and mind numbing advertising like TM, they don't attract elite and top end young players like Titleist and PING, they don't have the golf ball market cornered like Titleist, and they aren't sweeping the nations youngsters with flashy colors and high profile players like Rickie and Lexi. They are what they are, just a solid OEM who makes classic products that appeal to guys who grew up with more classic understated clubs.

But I do find it odd that we haven't seen really anything for 2013. Last year there was tons of hype about the Classic, which leads me to believe that they don't have anything really big planned for this year.
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#5 Hogan's Cardy

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:27 AM

New Classic woods, irons and (not seen in this clip) putters as well.


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#6 HateTheHighDraw

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:29 AM

Nothing happened, Cleveland/Srixon is damn good.

#7 wigolffan

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:29 AM

The cleveland classic putters are amazing, and the new ones are almost a straight rip off of scottys, they are in my opinion the best putter you can get for under 100 bucks!  Wedges are still solid, but I havwe not seen an iron from them that makes people want to play them for a few years (ta7) Seriously if you dont care about the name on the club try the classic putters, and save yourself over 200 bucks from buying a scotty (ok let the scotty lovers slam me now)

#8 samlax13

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:53 AM

I use Cleveland CG16 Tours...I've really enjoyed them to this point.  People seem to rave about the Cleveland Classic 290 as well.  Also, the classic putters are a hit on this site, for sure.
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#9 Willie Malay

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:56 AM

Just because others buy something more doesn't mean other stuff is bad. In fact many times it's the "lemming" thing. People will follow others right off the cliff and wonder what happened. Lots of parallels to that going on all over right now.
I went to get Mizunos and thought that is what I needed because I played forged irons. Tried them out and they were fine but I also grabbed a Cleveland CG16 just for grins. Wound up going back to it as I tried different clubs and wound up getting them. Very, very pleased with them. The new 588 wedge however, I couldn't come to grips with.
Cleveland makes good stuff, as do lots of manufacturers. Try them out as that is the only way you'll know if they are right for you.

Edited by Willie Malay, 21 November 2012 - 09:57 AM.


#10 bobcat

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:21 AM

I could be wrong, but in the video posted above the new 2013 Black Classic Driver looks to have a shape more akin to the 2012 Classic Tour 310 than the 2012 Classic 290.  If indeed that is the case, I am shocked because the superdeep-faced Classic 290 was by far the more popular head shape for 2012.

Perhaps the adustability has something to do with what shape they are using for 2013 or maybe new Black color just disguises the deep face more.  It is hard to tell for sure from the video even though I have watched it several times now.  Take a close look at the hosel and you will see it is the LONGER hosel, (like the 310), and not the short hosel like that on the 290.

Then again, perhaps there are (2) different headshapes for 2013 just as there was for 2012 with the 285 model being the deepface and the 325 Adjustable being like the 310.  The video may have only featured the new 2013 325 model which is like the 310.

Anyone have more, (better), info about this?

Edited by bobcat, 21 November 2012 - 10:50 AM.


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#11 Son_of_Sahm

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:27 AM

^^^The new stuff looks great in that video.  I can't wait to see the classic 3 wood in stores.

The gi irons looked pretty clean as well.

#12 markp

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:59 AM

Great release info in the video, I have also heard they have a new hybrid coming out as well, should be a great year for cleveland golf
I'm excited to try the new driver as well as fairway and hybrid myself.

#13 flounder

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 12:21 PM

I'm not crazy about the new tour irons in the video having a much wider sole than the cg16s

Edited by flounder, 21 November 2012 - 12:22 PM.


#14 Jack Pearsall

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 12:29 PM

The badgings on the re-release of 588 was not a very subtle effort to emulate the grotty Vokeys' look. Bad move. A very nice forged wedge that needs a return to the older look, which was always so elegant. The Trusty Rusty re-release was also butchered.
They still make some great stuff, but Srixon releases are really where it's at for this Japanese company.
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#15 mizunostaffer

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 05:04 PM

They used to be great now they're more of the same techno geek tripe that has flooded the Market

These days I'd only ever play either mizuno or titleist, possibly ping, the rest is just gimmick ridden and lacking in salt

Having said that ten years ago I could
Happily have had a full set of Cleveland

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#16 Sean25rp

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 05:57 PM

Will they release a 5 wood in the new black classic range?

#17 1965

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 02:57 PM

Thanks for all the comments.....I agree with the sentiment out there.  I bought a classic Cleveland putter last spring and love it. The thing I have noticed in my area the lack of product at shops....Getting more difficult to find demo days, clubs to hit in the store, etc...You look at the Cleveland website and the "dealers" listed, then go to the shop and find all they are basically carrying are Cleveland golf tees.  I am not a fan of buying equipment sight unseen online....

#18 mdgboxx

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 04:07 PM

Did I hear correctly?

The new 3W comes with a Matrix Ozik shaft?

Doesn't Srixon/Cleveland own Miyazaki ? Is Matrix, Cleveland/Srixon owned?

Sounded odd in the clip.

Edited by mdgboxx, 22 November 2012 - 04:08 PM.

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#19 HeadonaStick

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 04:39 PM

View Postwigolffan, on 21 November 2012 - 09:29 AM, said:

The cleveland classic putters are amazing, and the new ones are almost a straight rip off of scottys, they are in my opinion the best putter you can get for under 100 bucks!  Wedges are still solid, but I havwe not seen an iron from them that makes people want to play them for a few years (ta7) Seriously if you dont care about the name on the club try the classic putters, and save yourself over 200 bucks from buying a scotty (ok let the scotty lovers slam me now)

Actually, a number of Classic heads are straight rip offs of TP Mills (which is where Scotty ripped them from) which is fine by me.  Each maker adds something - the Cleveland putters are amazing at the price point.  Try buying a Mills or a Scotty for around 100 bucks!

#20 HeadonaStick

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 04:40 PM

View PostJack Pearsall, on 21 November 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

The badgings on the re-release of 588 was not a very subtle effort to emulate the grotty Vokeys' look. Bad move. A very nice forged wedge that needs a return to the older look, which was always so elegant. The Trusty Rusty re-release was also butchered.
They still make some great stuff, but Srixon releases are really where it's at for this Japanese company.

Except Srixon isn't releasing anything in the US market.  ANd if money is no object you can create a custom Cleveland wedge with stampings that suit your eye...


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#21 hoosiervolunteer

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 10:38 PM

I've always had some Cleveland in the bag.  Right now it's some 588 RTG wedges that I found new.  I loved the Launcher driver and gamed a set of TA3 form forged for 2 years.

One of the problems with Cleveland is that their equipment doesn't really get people excited.  They make great, solid stuff, but it's hard to get that equipment into the hands of the masses.  Everybody wants Taylormade woods.  PING, Mizuno, and Titleist have their brand loyalists.  Callaway is a sleeping giant that has huge name recognition and is one big release from moving back to the front.  Nike is gaining momentum and really trying new designs.

Where does that leave Cleveland?  They don't seem to be pushing design elements.  No loyalists that have been using their products for the last 10 years.  Their marketing is almost non-existent.  Yes, their parent company has lots of cash, but what are they doing with it?  The Srixon brand gets push, but where is Cleveland?

They don't seem to have an identity.  The namesake of the company works and designs wedges for Callaway for Pete's sake!  Callaway is real quick to point out that Roger Cleveland designs their stuff too.  Cleveland would be better off dumping the Cleveland name and going pure Srixon.  At least they could keep the R&D and build excitement for the Srixon brand.

#22 northMSgolfer

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 10:52 PM

The Cleveland 588 irons are as good as anything out there IMO. It's just marketing.

#23 MadGolfer76

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Posted 25 November 2012 - 11:32 PM

It seems to me they are a company at a loss for a design aesthetic. They are literally all over the place, and folks can't identify a club offering year to year. The companies that don't do a lot of advertising are Titleist and Mizuno, and their designs are more of the traditional, elegant nature. I think Cleveland should follow a similar path, because they really aren't keeping up with TM, Cobra, Nike, in that department. No more radical geometry and no goofy aesthetics like other companies, please.

They are a wedge company, more or less. They should focus almost all of their attention on making the best commercially available wedges and knock Vokey off that spot. The new 588's were flimsy and had no grind, stock Cleveland shafts were okay but not an aftermarket model which a good player would want. The Cg series wedges were one-dimensional offerings for the Dick's Sports aficionados. The Zip grooves on some models wore away after a single season. If you wanted the full ride, you had to go pay 200 bucks for their custom shop wedges, which is bs. This isn't stuff associated with a company that prides itself on wedges. Callaway and Mizuno are doing a much better job in their wedge offerings, imo. Wilson, too.

I think they should just ditch "Cleveland irons" and let Srixon take the reigns there. The metals have traditionally been great, but they are stuck on the lightweight schtick and the industry has moved beyond that. Go adjustable or go away. Also, the throwback paint is silly. Keep the design, paint it black or white (or green!) and pull down a PGA bomber to advertise it. It worked, but was too out there...

The Never Compromise putters are nice, but honestly the Cleveland Classic series are pretty much just as good. Why put out that standard in the lower price point and have it compete with the upper deck? Still, the NC putters with the goofy poker themes need to go. No wonder everyone is going for the Classic line.
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#24 Ajlepisto

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 01:43 AM

View PostnorthMSgolfer, on 25 November 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

The Cleveland 588 irons are as good as anything out there IMO. It's just marketing.

Agreed, they are very nice.

The thing with those is...when you compare them for sale at some of the big retailers, you can walk out with new Mizunos for around $100 less and get an extra $100 trade in bonus.

Just didn't seem worth it. I walked in wanting to get a set of the 588 CB's but when I saw the price ($999) I decided it just wasn't worth it when there were other options for less that were just as good. There isn't anything that draws you to them other than wanting the brand.

Edited by Ajlepisto, 26 November 2012 - 01:46 AM.


#25 G N R

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 01:43 AM

View PostMadGolfer76, on 25 November 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

It seems to me they are a company at a loss for a design aesthetic. They are literally all over the place, and folks can't identify a club offering year to year. The companies that don't do a lot of advertising are Titleist and Mizuno, and their designs are more of the traditional, elegant nature. I think Cleveland should follow a similar path, because they really aren't keeping up with TM, Cobra, Nike, in that department. No more radical geometry and no goofy aesthetics like other companies, please.

That's actually really well said and pretty much sums up my sentiments as well.  Every OEM has a certain look about them except for Cleveland.  I don't find any of their new releases particularly appealing and it doesn't all seem to fit.

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#26 1965

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 01:24 PM

Exactly...they have no IDENTITY.  Mizuno:  Better player sticks, Titleist:  Name recognition, Ping:  Crazy shovels, Nike:  We're elite because we're Nike; Calloway:  Everymans clubs, Taylormade:  Cutting edge for the sake of cutting edge.  Cleveland, mmmmmm....pretty wedges?  Maybe a nice driver?  I look at some of the new offerings.....Altitudes?  Really?  

Look at the website and I see 10 different iron sets listed.  How do I as a consumer sort through that?  I go to a Cleveland dealer and they have 3 sets in the store to try.  How about dropping half the products and focus on making the remaining few they best they can be.

#27 mr_divots

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 02:26 PM

Their offerings are pretty good now. Wedges look good. 588 irons look great. Classic Driver is very solid. I see the Classic putters out on the course on occasion, and their wedges (albeit CG15/16's, etc.) They fell into kind of a few different "tiers" of equipment without much differentiation of each. The 588 custom wedge are very "high end" at least in their pricing. They have good exposure on tour. I feel like they are on the verge of a good year, -especially with the Rotex wedges. But their marketing efforts have definitely been disjointed to say the least the last few years. (Hopkins with his argyle sweater vest "year of the wedge," etc.) What a marketing mess. Japanese companies seem to struggle with their American marketing, and also tend to be very conservative in their approach, so it will be interesting to see what SRI does.

Cleveland is a much better name for an American market than Srixon, so I doubt they'll put all their eggs in that basket.
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#28 nova6868

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Posted 26 November 2012 - 02:54 PM

The new 588 Rotex wedges are pretty solid, and I think they will be a hit.

I have a pair with DG Spinner shafts, and honestly I think they might spin too much for me. Hard to get close to a pin when the ball zips back 10-15 feet. Maybe I should just try a different shaft, but regardless... I'm sure lots of people will love them.

#29 john0713

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 09:39 AM

They are struggling. Just fired more reps this week and word on the street is that those staying are going to be independent reps.

#30 markp

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:28 AM

View Postjohn0713, on 29 November 2012 - 09:39 AM, said:

They are struggling. Just fired more reps this week and word on the street is that those staying are going to be independent reps.
That's not a suprising to hear alot of the smaller equipment companies reps are independant, Adams was that way and if I remeber right talkning to the Adams rep here they still are even after they were purchased by TMAG.
I have no concern about Cleveland/Srixon from what the iron offerings coming out looks like they are going back more towards the era when they made all the T.A. lines. the T.A. 7 was a big seller for cleveland when it came out,


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