94 replies to this topic

[J_D]

Honest or No?

[MtlJeff]

i see more threads accusing the general population of this site of being dishonest, then i see where people make ultra impressive claims

I remember a thread with a voting option a couple of years ago called "how far do you hit your 7 iron". A lot of people responded, and the average was 160-170yds. Pretty decent but hardly a gargantuan distance. I think for the most part people are honest here. Especially those who've been members a while.

Start a "what's your handicap" thread (which we've also done) and most of the first responses are "well i'm a 8 unlike everyone else here".

Usually the posts assuming everyone else is a 0 outnumber the people who actually claim to be a zero.

[kg92lefty]

Maybe they are, maybe they arent. All I know is that of the people claiming to be 0 or better that Ive seen or played with, about half actually are.

[TheKid718]

The best to some (and worst to others) part about golf is that it is a game of integrity within yourself. To claim that you are a zero when you shot over par consistently, you're lying not only to everyone, but yourself. Worse case especially when you claim to be a zero, someone wants to golf with you and they see just what a "zero" you are. Happened a lot at our club. Be truthful, to yourself, and save the embarrassment for later! Haha. With that being said, I do play to a zero handicap. Believe me or not, I'll see you on the course for proof.

[hebron1427]

 kg92lefty, on 26 September 2012 - 08:54 PM, said:

Maybe they are, maybe they arent. All I know is that of the people claiming to be 0 or better that Ive seen or played with, about half actually are.

have you taken into account that people dont often shoot their actual handicap? e.g., i'm 1.1. two of my last 4 rounds were played at or below the course rating. before that, maybe one out of 8. the way the numbers work, it doesn't take exceptional play to keep a low cap if you go low every 4 or 5 rounds.

[J_D]

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

[hebron1427]

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

[natural_one]

hebron is right on...

And I do believe the majority on here.

[Jbird33]

I'd believe a guy who said he was 0-2 long before a guy who said he was 10-12...Especially if I had to play them with strokes.

[cheeser]

My question to you is why do you care?  This is the internet buddy.  Where drives and handicaps can't be verified, but are somehow a measure of someone's manlihood.

[mshills]

I definitely believe it.  This site is a sub-sub-set of the overall golfing population, and a sub-sub-sub-sub-subset of the general population.

Lots of good players on here, and many are a lot better than "good."

[MtlJeff]

 hebron1427, on 26 September 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

that's the biggest problem with the handicap system. Most don't really understand it...I was a 0.5 earlier in the year with no under par scores in my 20 last games. My course has a tough slope, i had 7-8 rounds in the 80's....but a few 72's and 73's will do it. Then you play with a guy and shoot 82 and he thinks you are a liar. And probably comes and posts it here as a "passive brag post" (haha, see other thread)

[highergr0und]

Just remember that the base cap is 96% of the average of your best 10 rounds out of the last 20 you play.  Sure to be a 0-2 you've got to be good, but you're not shooting par every round.  You only play to your cap 20-25% of the time.  I'm actually mad at my cap right now.....  Since I haven't really played this year it's way lower than it needs to be.  Got to get some rounds in....

Now having an "I don't care" option in the poll would be nice.  At the end of the day, it truly doesn't matter if someone is lying.  I actually feel sorry for folks who derive happiness out of lying about a skill online.

[J_D]

No I just get mad when a******* tell me I can't go anywhere with an 8 handicap after 16 months at 15 years old.. I could say I'm a scratch prodigy kid, and post my swing, and nobody would disagree, but when I am an 8, I get told that I don't have a future in golf..

[Thrillhouse]

 TheJDMorris, on 27 September 2012 - 11:02 PM, said:

No I just get mad when a******* tell me I can't go anywhere with an 8 handicap after 16 months at 15 years old.. I could say I'm a scratch prodigy kid, and post my swing, and nobody would disagree, but when I am an 8, I get told that I don't have a future in golf..

Don't worry about it, I started at about the same time as you and was just getting to the 5-6 range at the end of the year when I was 15. Keep working at it and play as many tournaments as you can, you'll find yourself on a college team no problem.

You can't go through life listening to the naysayers every time you try to do something because they're always gonna be there. Just ignore it and keep moving forward.

[poizster]

 TheKid718, on 26 September 2012 - 09:43 PM, said:

The best to some (and worst to others) part about golf is that it is a game of integrity within yourself. To claim that you are a zero when you shot over par consistently, you're lying not only to everyone, but yourself. Worse case especially when you claim to be a zero, someone wants to golf with you and they see just what a "zero" you are. Happened a lot at our club. Be truthful, to yourself, and save the embarrassment for later! Haha. With that being said, I do play to a zero handicap. Believe me or not, I'll see you on the course for proof.

0's shoot over par way more then they shoot under. I think you might want to look up how a handicap is calculated.

[Shwagin1066]

 Jbird33, on 27 September 2012 - 07:54 AM, said:

I'd believe a guy who said he was 0-2 long before a guy who said he was 10-12...Especially if I had to play them with strokes.

Haha so true

[Shwagin1066]

 poizster, on 28 September 2012 - 02:12 AM, said:

 TheKid718, on 26 September 2012 - 09:43 PM, said:

The best to some (and worst to others) part about golf is that it is a game of integrity within yourself. To claim that you are a zero when you shot over par consistently, you're lying not only to everyone, but yourself. Worse case especially when you claim to be a zero, someone wants to golf with you and they see just what a "zero" you are. Happened a lot at our club. Be truthful, to yourself, and save the embarrassment for later! Haha. With that being said, I do play to a zero handicap. Believe me or not, I'll see you on the course for proof.

0's shoot over par way more then they shoot under. I think you might want to look up how a handicap is calculated.

Exactly right, especially if you play all or the majority at your rounds at difficult course. When I first got down to 0 I was shooting 72-77 on average at a tough course I played almost all of my round at for a few summers. Rating is 75.3 slope 145.

So yes, a 0.0 index golfer if playing anything but a pitch and putt is shooting over par way more than under.

Edited by Shwagin1066, 28 September 2012 - 02:16 AM.

[jwingen44]

I believe the majority of the people are being honest. I am a +2 and that doesn't mean I always shoot under par. There will be days when I go out and shoot a 77 or an 80 and nobody believes my handicap but then I will go out and shoot a 65 or 66. Just because someone is a scratch or better doesn't mean they always shoot even par or better.

[hebron1427]

 Thrillhouse, on 28 September 2012 - 12:33 AM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 27 September 2012 - 11:02 PM, said:

No I just get mad when a******* tell me I can't go anywhere with an 8 handicap after 16 months at 15 years old.. I could say I'm a scratch prodigy kid, and post my swing, and nobody would disagree, but when I am an 8, I get told that I don't have a future in golf..

Don't worry about it, I started at about the same time as you and was just getting to the 5-6 range at the end of the year when I was 15. Keep working at it and play as many tournaments as you can, you'll find yourself on a college team no problem.

You can't go through life listening to the naysayers every time you try to do something because they're always gonna be there. Just ignore it and keep moving forward.

first off, great post thrill.

more importantly, don't think you have to be good now to get anywhere in golf. when i played in high school, i wasn't near an 8--probably shot 85-86 on a decent day. it took me to college to break 80 (at a stupidly easy course), and i got down to about 6, but no lower. it wasn't really until grad school that i started really dropping the handicap. now i putt a lot better than i ever had, and my ballstriking is now coming back. so i might make it to + by next year

the point is that people get good on different time frames. no one can tell you how good you're going to be....except for you. if someone insults your game, you have two choice: 1) believe it, thereby making it true for you, or 2) prove them wrong. instead of ruminating about what someone says, get out there and show them that they're mistaken.

[hebron1427]

 hebron1427, on 26 September 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

here's my GHIN. as you can see--1.2 (sorry, i was mistaken). there's an 82, 81, and several 80s on there, as well as 78s. there's also a 76 that's a 0.0 differential (course rating 76), a 71, and some other good scores.

Attached Thumbnails

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Edited by hebron1427, 28 September 2012 - 08:31 AM.

[bobfoster]

 MtlJeff, on 27 September 2012 - 06:48 PM, said:

 hebron1427, on 26 September 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

that's the biggest problem with the handicap system. Most don't really understand it...I was a 0.5 earlier in the year with no under par scores in my 20 last games. My course has a tough slope, i had 7-8 rounds in the 80's....but a few 72's and 73's will do it. Then you play with a guy and shoot 82 and he thinks you are a liar. And probably comes and posts it here as a "passive brag post" (haha, see other thread)

This ^^^

A handicap is not an "average". (Well, a USGA handicap ... the R & A is quite different). If a US golfer is "scratch" ... they can be expected to shoot par (on a fairly tough course) only about 1/4 of the time.

And really ... I think the people that ceaselessly complain about bragging on this site really don't do a fair sampling of the threads. In my experience, there's a lot of guys here that are actually pretty honest. Are there a few that brag? Yeah ... no doubt. But in my experience, a surprising number of regular posters here are actually pretty humble (and honest).

Me? I'm totally not scratch (I have been in the past, but I'm at a point in life where I can only play once or twice a week, and have no practice time. I'm proud to have a single digit, but that is mostly because I putt obsessivly in my office, in my house, etc. ... but I can't drive a ball 300 yards ... average is more like 240 - 250 ... my 150 club is a 7i).

And you know what, a good number of the people that posat here a lot ... I find quite believable ...

[Thrillhouse]

 hebron1427, on 28 September 2012 - 08:29 AM, said:

 hebron1427, on 26 September 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

here's my GHIN. as you can see--1.2 (sorry, i was mistaken). there's an 82, 81, and several 80s on there, as well as 78s. there's also a 76 that's a 0.0 differential (course rating 76), a 71, and some other good scores.

Nice 59! I don't care what kind of course it is it's awesome that you can say you've done it!

[kg92lefty]

JD is just mad because hes playing golf swing and not golf, then seeing that you dont need a "tour" swing to shoot low.

[hebron1427]

 Thrillhouse, on 28 September 2012 - 09:20 PM, said:

Nice 59! I don't care what kind of course it is it's awesome that you can say you've done it!

Thanks Thrill, but it takes some of the awesome out when it's a par 62

Anyway, the 76 I shot a few weeks ago was far more impressive. Mr. Snedeker played the course a little better than I did.

Edited by hebron1427, 28 September 2012 - 11:19 PM.

[Thrillhouse]

 hebron1427, on 28 September 2012 - 11:16 PM, said:

 Thrillhouse, on 28 September 2012 - 09:20 PM, said:

Nice 59! I don't care what kind of course it is it's awesome that you can say you've done it!

Thanks Thrill, but it takes some of the awesome out when it's a par 62

Anyway, the 76 I shot a few weeks ago was far more impressive. Mr. Snedeker played the course a little better than I did.

East lake must've been cool. How hard was that long par three over the water? And were you able to have a go at 9 in two?

Edited by Thrillhouse, 28 September 2012 - 11:46 PM.

[Craglyboy]

 hebron1427, on 28 September 2012 - 08:29 AM, said:

 hebron1427, on 26 September 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

here's my GHIN. as you can see--1.2 (sorry, i was mistaken). there's an 82, 81, and several 80s on there, as well as 78s. there's also a 76 that's a 0.0 differential (course rating 76), a 71, and some other good scores.

So have you shot under par in any of those rounds.

In the uk it is seemingly a lot harder to get a lower handicap so you generally have to shoot lower than your handicap to get cut, and at the lower handicaps only get cut .1 per shot under (in basic terms). Also it's hard to raise your handicap as you can only go up .1 regardless what score you shoot. I had friends scratch and better and very rarely did they shoot anything more than 4 or 5 over.

[BuckeyePaul01]

I've played to a 0.0 HC index with an average score of 77!!  Your HC has a lot to do with where you play and the CR................is the course rating from the tees you play 69.1 or 75.1?

Just saying..................I've never cracked below the 0.0 mark in spite of having 3 revisions during the year exactly at 0.0!!!  LOL...a crazy coincidence!  oh well......0.0 stands as my PB.
On my home course.......a 0.4 Index= 0 course HC from the tips.  "Shooting Par"  is not relevant........it depends on the course rating. If you can average 77 from tees rated 75, a scratch HC is in your near future.  

The scratch golfers I question are those who have only 10-15 rounds posted for the year.......How can they be scratch if they only play 10-15 times a year?   (not realistic)  On the other hand, I remember a young AM making the cut and finishing high at Olympic club...........and he barely posted any rounds either, so this could be a double edged sword!!!!!  Just because they don't post doesn't necessarily mean they are Vanity.

Edited by BuckeyePaul01, 01 October 2012 - 01:44 AM.

[hebron1427]

 Thrillhouse, on 28 September 2012 - 11:46 PM, said:

East lake must've been cool. How hard was that long par three over the water? And were you able to have a go at 9 in two?

there are a few par 3s over water, but i'll assume you mean #6. it wasn't playing particularly long the day we played. we played it from where the pros played on sunday, which is about 150. still a pretty daunting shot, but the angle is worse from 150 than from way back where the pros played it earlier in the week. i'm going to go back in a few weeks so i'll try to play it from the back tee box next time, even if the markers aren't back there.

i did go at 9 in two--was right in front of the water off the tee (got a nice kick down the hill on a high draw) but left the 5-iron a little short right in the bunker.

 Craglyboy, on 29 September 2012 - 03:04 PM, said:

So have you shot under par in any of those rounds.

In the uk it is seemingly a lot harder to get a lower handicap so you generally have to shoot lower than your handicap to get cut, and at the lower handicaps only get cut .1 per shot under (in basic terms). Also it's hard to raise your handicap as you can only go up .1 regardless what score you shoot. I had friends scratch and better and very rarely did they shoot anything more than 4 or 5 over.

looking back, i haven't posted an under par 18-hole round in awhile. i shoot under for 9 a lot...in fact, the last 18 i played i went +3, -1 = +2. but "under par" is not the same thing as "scratch."  For example, the 76 i had on a course rated at 76.0 means i shot a scratch score, even though i wasn't under par on either 9. most of the courses i play are rated higher than par, so shooting 74 or 75 is close to scratch.

so, is UK handicapping based solely on score?

Edited by hebron1427, 01 October 2012 - 08:14 AM.

[GooseHook]

 hebron1427, on 26 September 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

 TheJDMorris, on 26 September 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

I'm aware of that but if you post ALL of your scores, and play a good bit, to be a scratch you have to be right on top of it.

It's kind of odd. I have a number of people invite me to tournaments and whatnot because I have a low handicap and I legitimately feel bad when I don't play to it even though I'm only supposed to play to my handicap or better about once every 5-6 rounds. My scoring average is about 78 but I'll shoot 71 some days and show -3 onthe index while shooting 84 and +10 onother days. It still gets me to 1.1.

Handicaps are a crazy thing! It gets even crazier around my range,  in the middle of single digits.  I've had quite a few rounds in the 70s this year (mostly high 70s but some around 74), but also had a few stinkers occasionally in the high 80/low 90 range. One or two rounds with somebody won't give you the full picture of their potential.

Edited by GooseHook, 08 October 2012 - 09:52 AM.