26 replies to this topic

[l DonFlo l]

Hi everyone!

New member, first post, a question.

At some point, is it necessary to buy a new driver?
I'm not saying every year, per se.  But I understand that new technologies make it possible to tailor clubs to different swings.

Here's a general scenario:  Would an eight-year-old titanium driver hit a ball as far as a new titanium driver (everything else the same)

Here's a specific scenario:  Should I change from my R5 Dual N to, say, an R11/R11S?  (the R5 is neutral face, 9*, stiff flex, stock shaft; I can work it left or right; average drive 250 total).

Thanks everyone!
Donald

[Medic]

Hi Donald and Welcome!

I read in a magazine article that generally speaking most golfers tend to replace their "old tech" every 4 years or so.

Having said that, since you got your R-5 there have been lots of advancements. Perhaps the greatest centers on fitting tech. This will mean getting everything in your new driver customized just for you knowing that when you tee it up you will get the best results possible.

So...

I would urge that you consider getting fitted. And then you can make a really well educated decision based on how you perform with a new driver fitted just for you versus your current older one.

Hope this helps!

[FATC1TY]

Only way to tell is to take your driver, which you are comfortable with, and go to a demo day, or fitting and hit it against some new offers. Get a feel for them, as well as looking at ball flight, ability to work it, and numbers on spin/distance if that is possible.

[Medic]

FATC1TY, on 18 March 2012 - 09:26 PM, said:

Only way to tell is to take your driver, which you are comfortable with, and go to a demo day, or fitting and hit it against some new offers. Get a feel for them, as well as looking at ball flight, ability to work it, and numbers on spin/distance if that is possible.

This is REALLY solid advice, Donald.

I could/should have added that one of my regular pards still plays with an R580 he purchased brand new after getting fitted for it several years ago. He drives the ball long and straight with it and, in his words, "no reason to replace it". Proof positive just how valid Fatcity's post is.

[l DonFlo l]

Thanks, guys, for the quick answers!

I've been playing for almost 10 years..and custom-fitting & a formal lesson are the two things I should have done long ago.  I think my swing is pretty sound but I'd love to see if a fitted shaft would make any different.

Thanks again!

[kg92lefty]

A properly fit shaft will add some distance and tighten dispersion.

[Cameron Circle T]

It really depends. Since you're playing a stock shaft, I'd agree with the above posters, go get fitted and see what a proper fitting can bring you. But once you're properly fitted, you don't NEED to change very often. The recent drivers all maxed out CT (new test used for COR/spring like effect). The biggest differences are really forgiveness. If you find something and hit it well, then you don't necessarily even need a new one in 4 years. I got set up on my superquad with an ozik back in late 06 early 07 (first shaft I had installed was phenomenal and broke, replaced it with the shaft I have in it now in 07). I hit it really well and my swing hasn't materially changed in 6 or so years, so none of the newer stuff brings me any better numbers. If it weren't for waning to have a solid backup driver in case my superquad goes, I wouldn't even have another one. But because I like to have an extra, just in case, I just got an i20 with kiyoshi in it.

Go get fitted and play whatever you get fitted for as long as you want.

[jmvargas]

not to highjack this thread but aside from proper fitting would it still make sense to buy new drivers just based on advances in materials  and design.....

i mean--titanium heads and graphite shafts have been around a long time.....

[Cameron Circle T]

Yes up to a certain point. If it's relatively recent, then I'd say no. We're at max CT and max size.

[kitsoasis]

when it comes to golf equipment... the only necessary thing to do is to be fitted. although with a driver like the R5 you might find some marked improvements with the current offerings.

but we all love shiny new stuff, you can't deny the joy of it

Edited by kitsoasis, 19 March 2012 - 01:54 AM.

[Thrillhouse]

every 5 years or so yeah, technology gets better over time and its a good idea to take advantage. Less than that? not really, its just that this is a hobby for most of us so we are always buying selling and trading new stuff.

That being said I pulled a 2 year old tour issue adams 9032 hot melt bent open 4 degrees with a tour ad quattrotech 75x out of the basement today and hit it really straight at the range, so it might find its way into the bag this year. Newer isn't always better.

[verderraul]

Thrillhouse, on 19 March 2012 - 02:08 AM, said:

every 5 years or so yeah, technology gets better over time and its a good idea to take advantage. Less than that? not really, its just that this is a hobby for most of us so we are always buying selling and trading new stuff.

That being said I pulled a 2 year old tour issue adams 9032 hot melt bent open 4 degrees with a tour ad quattrotech 75x out of the basement today and hit it really straight at the range, so it might find its way into the bag this year. Newer isn't always better.

I think a certain Rory Mcilroy would agree with you. Hitting 290 yard bombs with a 5 year old 3 wood cannot be good for marketing....especially when golf digest bombards us with rocktballz every week.

[SurfDuffer]

I'm still playing a 2007 stock Burner Driver.  I have hit a number of new drivers over the past few years.  I also won a Nike VR Pro adjustable driver.  I haven't hit anything that was measurably better than that 07 Burner so it stays in the bag.  I was in a store the other day looking at the new Rocket Ballz Driver and its the same freaking driver as the 07 burner just with white paint and an adjustable hozzle.

Point is drivers really aren't changing much like they were 8 or 9 years ago.

[ecfritts]

New stuff is great & looks good but I just put my Titleist 905R with a stock Aldila 65 stiff shaft back in play & I kill that thing...it's about 7 years old I guess...I'd love a 912 D2 but I don't think I would hit it $349 better...I've learned the hard way.

Great advice about getting fit!

[TomWishon]

l DonFlo l, on 18 March 2012 - 09:02 PM, said:

At some point, is it necessary to buy a new driver?
I'm not saying every year, per se.  But I understand that new technologies make it possible to tailor clubs to different swings.

One of the problems with buying a driver from a retail golf store or pro shop is that golfers can THINK the driver has been custom fit to their needs, where the reality is that it has in NO WAY been fully custom fit to meet their needs.  

At the very least, each one of the following specifications MUST be custom fit and custom built ACCURATELY to each golfer's individual swing characteristics:  

1. Loft
2. Face Angle
3. Length
4.  Shaft Overall Flex
5.  Shaft Bend Profile
6.  Shaft Weight
7.  Total Weight
8.  Swingweight
9.  Grip Style/Size
10.  Clubhead Model

(While Lie and Shaft Torque may be put on the list by some, in reality they're not to worry about nearly as much as these other 10.)  

Bottom line is this - if your current driver has not been accurately fit for each one of these specs to your individual swing characteristics, and then accurately built to have each of those determined specs, then without question you are probably not getting all you can out of your tee shots.  

In any retail store, the spate of adjustable hosel drivers out there sound nice on the surface for achieving custom fitting, but in no way can they come close to what an independent custom clubmaker can do to achieve all ten of these important driver fitting specs.  With the adj hosel drivers you cannot get your loft and face angle independent of each other.  Those adj hosel drivers are all still not just TOO LONG but much too long for at least 85-90% of all golfers.  

This length thing on drivers really does hurt a lot of golfers.  Since 2005, the AVERAGE driver length on the PGA Tour has been 44.5".  Yet the standard driver lengths of all the big golf companies runs between 45.5 and 46.5".  These companies all know that the longer the length, the more inconsistent a golfer will hit the ball.  But they are also betting that these longer lengths will allow golfers to hit that ONE long ball every once in a while that keeps them believing its THEIR SWING and not the club that should be changed to get more consistent results.  It's no lie that at least 85-90% of all golfers would see definite improvement off the tee WITH NO REAL LOSS OF DISTANCE if they were to use a driver length no longer than 44-44.5 for men and 42.5-43 for women.  

With no standards for shaft flex in the industry, how do you know if that shaft flex on that retail store/pro shop bought driver is right for YOU and your swing speed and swing aggressiveness and point of release?  You don't.  

Did you get the total weight or the swingweight customized to YOUR swing force and tempo and timing preference?  Probably not because the stores and pro shops don't do that as a rule.  

Did this driver you bought at store or pro shop get made to really have each of these specs built ACCURATELY?  Bet you more than 50% of the time it didn't because the OEMs are notorious for not building to accurate specs on their custom orders.  

Sorry if some think this is a self serving rant.  It's not.  It's the absolute truth.  The vast majority of golfers who ignore it are never going to play to the best of their ability off the tee.  

TOM

[Medic]

TomWishon, on 20 March 2012 - 10:51 AM, said:

l DonFlo l, on 18 March 2012 - 09:02 PM, said:

At some point, is it necessary to buy a new driver?
I'm not saying every year, per se.  But I understand that new technologies make it possible to tailor clubs to different swings.

One of the problems with buying a driver from a retail golf store or pro shop is that golfers can THINK the driver has been custom fit to their needs, where the reality is that it has in NO WAY been fully custom fit to meet their needs.  

At the very least, each one of the following specifications MUST be custom fit and custom built ACCURATELY to each golfer's individual swing characteristics:  

1. Loft
2. Face Angle
3. Length
4.  Shaft Overall Flex
5.  Shaft Bend Profile
6.  Shaft Weight
7.  Total Weight
8.  Swingweight
9.  Grip Style/Size
10.  Clubhead Model

(While Lie and Shaft Torque may be put on the list by some, in reality they're not to worry about nearly as much as these other 10.)  

Bottom line is this - if your current driver has not been accurately fit for each one of these specs to your individual swing characteristics, and then accurately built to have each of those determined specs, then without question you are probably not getting all you can out of your tee shots.  

In any retail store, the spate of adjustable hosel drivers out there sound nice on the surface for achieving custom fitting, but in no way can they come close to what an independent custom clubmaker can do to achieve all ten of these important driver fitting specs.  With the adj hosel drivers you cannot get your loft and face angle independent of each other.  Those adj hosel drivers are all still not just TOO LONG but much too long for at least 85-90% of all golfers.  

This length thing on drivers really does hurt a lot of golfers.  Since 2005, the AVERAGE driver length on the PGA Tour has been 44.5".  Yet the standard driver lengths of all the big golf companies runs between 45.5 and 46.5".  These companies all know that the longer the length, the more inconsistent a golfer will hit the ball.  But they are also betting that these longer lengths will allow golfers to hit that ONE long ball every once in a while that keeps them believing its THEIR SWING and not the club that should be changed to get more consistent results.  It's no lie that at least 85-90% of all golfers would see definite improvement off the tee WITH NO REAL LOSS OF DISTANCE if they were to use a driver length no longer than 44-44.5 for men and 42.5-43 for women.  

With no standards for shaft flex in the industry, how do you know if that shaft flex on that retail store/pro shop bought driver is right for YOU and your swing speed and swing aggressiveness and point of release?  You don't.  

Did you get the total weight or the swingweight customized to YOUR swing force and tempo and timing preference?  Probably not because the stores and pro shops don't do that as a rule.  

Did this driver you bought at store or pro shop get made to really have each of these specs built ACCURATELY?  Bet you more than 50% of the time it didn't because the OEMs are notorious for not building to accurate specs on their custom orders.  

Sorry if some think this is a self serving rant.  It's not.  It's the absolute truth.  The vast majority of golfers who ignore it are never going to play to the best of their ability off the tee.  

TOM

No reason/need to apologize Tom - yours is the most informative post on this subject I have read since first signing onto this forum.

A follow-up question for you.

Is it unreasonable to go into a fitting session with your list above and let them know up front what your expectations are? (or should they know this already and tell you up front that your fitting will settle all of those issues?)

It has been a couple of years since I got fitted for a driver and, up until I read your post, I honestly thought I was playing the right equipment. I see now that I am going to have to invest into another fitting session. I just want to make sure that I get the absolute most out of it when I go.

Thanks again for sharing your expertise.

[GooseHook]

Medic, on 18 March 2012 - 09:35 PM, said:

FATC1TY, on 18 March 2012 - 09:26 PM, said:

Only way to tell is to take your driver, which you are comfortable with, and go to a demo day, or fitting and hit it against some new offers. Get a feel for them, as well as looking at ball flight, ability to work it, and numbers on spin/distance if that is possible.

This is REALLY solid advice, Donald.

I could/should have added that one of my regular pards still plays with an R580 he purchased brand new after getting fitted for it several years ago. He drives the ball long and straight with it and, in his words, "no reason to replace it". Proof positive just how valid Fatcity's post is.

+1.  Again, PATIENCE AND RESEARCH PAY OFF.Here is a great place to start to get ideas, but you are the decider on what you like.  

Now, your current driver is a little on the older side, but it's not worthless. Still a good stick.  IMO drivers are not really hotter now, but more forgiving and we have many more options available with shafts.  You can find some drivers released in recent years for a song and dance...lots of deals to be had.

[ToysRUs]

Not to double highjack this thread but the fact you are now on GolfWRX means that you are a Golf Ho doesn't it????
Ho's are required by Ho-ing law to relook at their driver at least every 6 months. Every 3-4 months if you hit TaylorMade stuff.
Sorry, but that's the Law..........

[ClarkGrswld4]

you are a member of this site now so yes, it is necessary and required

[puttingmatt]

Do what you want, buy when you want. There are
new clubs all the time. But shafts seem to be
all the rage. Properly fitted , a shaft makes or breaks
most driver purchases. Good Luck !!!

[square]

Searching for more distance out of a driver is a fools game.
If you have a driver you strike consistently straight, keep it in your bag.

l DonFlo l, on 18 March 2012 - 09:02 PM, said:

Hi everyone!

New member, first post, a question.

At some point, is it necessary to buy a new driver?
I'm not saying every year, per se.  But I understand that new technologies make it possible to tailor clubs to different swings.

Here's a general scenario:  Would an eight-year-old titanium driver hit a ball as far as a new titanium driver (everything else the same)

Here's a specific scenario:  Should I change from my R5 Dual N to, say, an R11/R11S?  (the R5 is neutral face, 9*, stiff flex, stock shaft; I can work it left or right; average drive 250 total).

Thanks everyone!
Donald

[rafal]

Since R5 they added 17 yards each year for what, 3 generations now?  That's at least 51 yards right there.

[Jamboy72]

Certainly get fit. Of Tom's list of 10 some of those can be taken care of in a good fitting. But as much as fitting is important you must play it on the course and have confidence in it.

[orangebang]

If you aren't playing something made in the last 2-3 years, you're compromising somewhere.

[cristphoto]

I had a Titleist 905R driver that I loved. Bought it about 6 years ago and after a year or two of use each spring I would go and demo the new drivers that came out (Titleist, Ping, Taylor Made and Callaway). Each year nothing impresed me enough to switch. Last year I demo'd the Titleist 910 D2 and after hitting just a couple balls at the range I was sold. Longer, straighter, and the entire face felt like a sweet spot. I bought it and the matching 3 and 5 woods that very day. The adjustable settings are not a gimmick. I can play any ball I like based on greenside behaviour and feel (I play the Z-Star) and then adjust the driver for best flight and distance. The fine tuning really does get you some extra distance - not just advertising BS. A side note is I like the looks, feel, and sound too.

[amaeyzing]

The inner ho in me says you need one now! and yes to all of the above configurations and models

[l DonFlo l]

Great info guys, especially Tom's.

And, going along with Medic's post, there are alot of pro shops that will fit someone.  In my area alone:  Edwin Watts, David Gates, Masterfit, & Tour Stop at World Golf Village. I just wonder who's going to bs me & who's going to fit me correctly.

Im definitely going to get fitted but can any of you club buffs specify what type of advancements on the actual clubhead there have been since the R5?  (Considering a golfer that already hits it straight with a neutral bias, square face).  Would it just limited to forgiveness or maybe a better CG location?