248 replies to this topic

[dlam]

I m exploring my feel and confidence  part of putting
Bought Rotella DVD "putting out of your mind"
Haven't listen to it yet
Thought everyone I asked to listen to it says it has helped there putting especially in a tournament setting

[danattherock]

I would love to hear your thoughts after listening to it. Heard lots of good things about Bob Rotella.


Feel free to post a mini review of the DVD here as I am sure I am not the only person interested.


Thanks for chiming in man.



-Dan

[HitBall]

Found this just now in a thread on the Instruction sub-forum. Some very insightful comments and I wanted to add it here....


Hitball, whomever you are, welcome to the forum man

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Thank you Dan, glad to contribute anything I can. I am just a 30ish year old golfer trying to figure out what I have been doing wrong for years. Never really had the thought to study golf. Thank God for the internet.

I am working on posting some swing stuff/questions that relates to which shoulder muscles you activate to take the club back (or rather if people are even using their front shoulder at all. Found out the other week I was way overusing the right shoulder to the point of shoulder imbalance, can lead to working it twice, once back, once through). This definitely relates to putting as we have a tendency as humans to pick up bad habits subconscious. Some of you guys might be pulling the putter back with your right deltoid and having less chance to control the club coming through since you are firing the muscle back and then through. I find Geoff Mangum's advice to have pressure on both thumbs helps me balance my shoulders okay although lately I have been favoring the right hand dominating on the through swing. (I am a righty after all!)

In putting you might be overusing one shoulder (deltoid) and affecting your timing etc. I would say if you are worried about the putter face you are left shoulder tension dominant on the take back and if you are worried about arc/path you are more right shoulder tension dominant (on the take back). (Just a hypothesis, no claims to expert status here) I personally am using a dual tension shoulder take back with a right hand push on the through swing.

I would say most people lean towards the dominant hand so maybe check your shoulders'  tension on the putting green next time. I'm also working on swinging on a coronal plane over your center of mass (full swing, keeping your energy towards the middle of your body. This one helped me a lot practicing yesterday. After hitting a hooked drive I thought stay still and centered most importantly and it worked like a charm). Your side to side muscles are VERY strong in comparison to your front to back muscles. (Try trying to/imagining pulling a truck attached to a rope around your stomach straight back leaning back. Now the trucks' behind you and leaning forward. Now literally try pulling sideways. So much easier. This relates to the full swing so much and is a tremendous source of leverage I believe.) Not sure how this could relate to putting yet, but hopefully making sure you are not swaying forward or back in your swing and your mass is centered through the swing would greatly increase consistency of direction. Also tried turning my pelvis slightly before taking the club back for the full swing only obviously and it helped me. Still trying to figure that one out since I felt I swung better right away. I definitely don't claim to be a pro or authority but I like to dig and experiment until I find the game I know I should be playing.

Here is a link to find your dominant eye. It works in 10 seconds. Haven't read everything on how dominant eye relates to putting yet though.
http://www.wikihow.c...ur-Dominant-Eye

Edited by HitBall, 21 May 2012 - 02:06 PM.

[danattherock]

HitBall, on 21 May 2012 - 02:05 PM, said:

I am just a 30ish year old golfer trying to figure out what I have been doing wrong for years.

I love the way you think man.


Hell, I love the fact THAT you think



Glad to have your contributions here.




-Dan

[Naylor09]

I sold my Can't miss putting aid and now with in 2 weeks i go from 27 putts a round to 34. I know its mental but i miss the Can't Miss

[danattherock]

Naylor09, on 21 May 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

i miss the Can't Miss

That is priceless


Maybe you sold it too soon?


Tell me how it helped you, how it worked. I got mine months ago but it is on a shelf.


Honestly, putting so good lately I don't want to tweak it yet. Winter perhaps.


Lately I have been working on the full swing.




-Dan

[Naylor09]

danattherock, on 21 May 2012 - 10:22 PM, said:

Naylor09, on 21 May 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

i miss the Can't Miss

That is priceless


Maybe you sold it too soon?


Tell me how it helped you, how it worked. I got mine months ago but it is on a shelf.


Honestly, putting so good lately I don't want to tweak it yet. Winter perhaps.


Lately I have been working on the full swing.




-Dan

Well I think I did sell it too soon used it all winter and it was working well

instantly right wen i hooked it up it made a difference. It changes your grip pressure and stroke the first time you use it. I never rolled the ball that well. Hopefully I can get it back i usually am a great putter and im shooting under par with 34 putts so thats never bad i just would like to see how well i would shoot with hitting the ball as well as I am with putting how I did during the winter

[danattherock]

Very cool. Makes me want to fire mine up.


As a reminder, coupon code....


The very successful “Peanut Gallery” offer at 50% off will conclude at the end of February 2012.  But The Can’t Miss will continue to honor that coupon code at the new price of $189.  Not only is there still a 30 day money back guarantee, but for a limited time, free shipping worldwide is available!  At checkout, enter coupon code: “Peanut Gallery”

[Eagle006]

I bought the Can't Miss and returned it very promptly. Great idea and maybe I should have given it more of a chance, but it felt like it was creating a totally unnatural and manipulated stroke. I realise that's the opposite of what the device is supposed to achieve but I didn't like it at all. They were very good about giving me a refund however.

[danattherock]

That was one of the concerns I had before ordering mine. Wondering how much their idea of an ideal stroke varies from what I am doing. I saw they had a 'pro' and 'normal' setting depending on the orientation of the gyroscope on the putter. Seems one setting was recommended to use initially, then try the other one later. But as in your case, the more The Can't Miss changes your stroke, the harder a change will be required. The decision to make would be whether a person wanted to change the stroke that much in the first place.

Certainly this can't be a one size fits all training aid. Folks use all kinds of putting strokes and such. It would only seem possible that this gyroscope can only ingrain a particular stroke. However, that doesn't mean the stroke The Can't Miss ingrains is wrong. Eager to find out how/if this training aid improves my putting. Glowing reviews and the 1/2 off offer made me bite. Will see in time I guess.



-Dan

[StevenF]

I may just visit a SAM lab.  My last round really upset me.  Finally striking the ball halfway decent, then completely choking on the greens.  I still managed one birdie.  But I must have had 5 or 6 GIR on the front and shot a 48!!

[danattherock]

SAM putting lab (if done by a qualified person) is money well spent.

Can't fix what you don't know is broken.

Only takes a couple hours and afterwards you will know everything good and bad about your stroke.

[Scotty1140]

SAM lab tomorrow. Sick of looking for the right putter. Averaging about 12 GIR per round this season, but less than 1 birdie per round. I'd be dropping some solid numbers if it weren't for the putting.

[maverick]

Right now I am at 1.65 putts calculated by Skygolf. I found a tip from Tiger Woods to be very effective. Find a place on the green that is about 10-15 ft apart with an incline and straight. Then proceed to putt away. It teaches good fell for up and down hill putts. if you can make a straight putt you can make any putt because you have the ability to get the ball on line. I practice putting about 5 hours a week unless I am having problems; then more.


I have tried putting with one hand and then the other. It is a drill I sometimes do. IMHO a right handed golfer puts the ball in the hole with his right hand and a left handed golfer sinks it with his left. I other words the dominate hand.

Edited by maverick, 22 May 2012 - 09:19 PM.

[ksgolfguy007]

do they have anything like this in the states? SAM putting lab

[blindwillie]

Great thread. Thanks Dan. I have always been one to change putters as soon as I started missing a few putts. After settling on one (GoLo), reading Rotella' newest book on short game confidence, using my old trusty Pelz putting tutor, and developing a sound preshot routine, I'm finally seeing some lasting improvements. Coming from a true putter addict, nothing ever replaces commitment and work on the greens!!

[danattherock]

Your welcome blindwillie. As you found out, changing putters is not the solution to curing putting woes. A lesson we all learn at some point, some sooner than others. Purposeful practice and improving technique is the way to hole more putts. The good thing, putting is fun, it is free, and is the fastest way to lower your golf scores. Seems to me the majority of folks don't give this aspect of their game enough emphasis. I used to be one of those folks myself.

ksgolfguy007, on 23 May 2012 - 08:56 AM, said:

do they have anything like this in the states? SAM putting lab

Talk to some teaching professionals in your area and they should be able to suggest someone. Below is a link to the site of Science and Motion, the folks that sell SAM putting labs. Consider their list a partial list at best of folks that own one. I know for a fact many SAM putting labs in NC are not listed on their site. But it does give you some sort of starting point from which to begin your search.


http://www.samsports...b_Locations.htm




-Dan

Edited by danattherock, 23 May 2012 - 10:55 AM.

[QWKDTSN]

I finally figured something out.  I have good alignment with my driver and with approach shots.  I stand 15-20 feet behind the ball and take my grip on the club while I pick my target and an intermediate aim spot, walk around the ball, lining up to that intermediate spot, and let it go.  I have become a very straight hitter of the ball by using this preshot routine and trusting it.

With my putter I have been trying to set up the putterhead to face the line I want to roll the putt on by stepping in from the side and then rolling the ball.  Well, I've determined that just doesn't work for me.  I can't aim the face.  I started following some advice I heard from Jackie Burke, something he told Lee Trevino.  "Be yourself on the green".  I haven't been using a method that works for me... I've been trying to make a method work.

I have started standing 10-15 feet behind the ball, checking the line, and taking my grip while lining up an intermediate target.  I then walk around the ball and set up towards that intermediate target USING MY BODY.... I don't even look at the clubface... because I have learned I can't reliably aim the face.  I use my proprioception to know that I am aimed properly.  I glance down at the blade just to make sure the sweetspot is lined up, look at the hole, burn it into my mind for the distance, look back down at the ball and give it a stroke.  The whole time I am going through this routine I keep my grip pressure constant at a nice medium level.  All of a sudden I am starting to make putts again... I am doing something that I am already comfortable with and trust and applying it to my putting.  This is allowing me to let it go without stressing about the outcome... something I always tell myself I need to do but have a very hard time doing on the greens.  When putts miss I have a better idea of WHY I missed (didn't read the putt properly, bad distance control, whatever) and can apply that to my knowledge bank rather than trying to check and re-check my aim and never feeling confident.

The thing I am feeling best about is that I have picked up an old TP Mills Spalding putter for next to nothing and put all of my other putters in the closet.  I have promised myself I am going to commit myself to my routine and really get to know this gem of a putter.  I have tried way too many kinds of putters and finally zeroed in on this shape, offset, etc.  I am not going to pull another putter out of the closet no matter what.  The last thing I need is for the putter to be an ever-changing variable in my game.  I have been very guilty of changing putters every other round in an attempt to find magic.  No longer!

Edited by QWKDTSN, 27 May 2012 - 02:55 PM.

[customgolfer]

Go to home depot buy a straight line laser practice putting with it and your stroke will get better real fast

[BTO]

Putting off the toe of my napa style putters from 4' and closer. I always was an ok putter with this style but struggled on the short ones. Since I started putting off the toe for whatever reason I am dropping them way more consistently.

[3 Jack Par]

I think I've made something of a breakthrough.  I posted a few weeks ago about how I had switched to a belly, and was practicing a lot and hitting 3-footers like it was my job.  After playing about a dozen rounds with the belly, my putting stats had actually been getting worse.  I was making fewer putts outside of 5 feet and missing more inside 5 ft.  It so happens that I was playing a qualifier for our state amateur with a buddy of mine, who told me after the round that it looked like I was taking it back quickly and kind of stabbing at the ball.  He mentioned Loren Roberts' method, which involves a long, slow backstroke and a smooth, down the line through stroke.  Since he showed me that, I've really concentrated on slowing down my stroke -- first with the belly for a few rounds, but I wasn't seeing the results that I was hoping for, though it was an improvement over what I had been seeing.  I decided to give my standard-length putter another try using this new approach, and the improvement is amazing.  It's like I became a good putter overnight.  The longer stroke is giving me a much better feel for distance, and it seems like I'm getting the ball started on line most of the time.  I played a 54 hole tournament (27 per day) over the weekend, and my putts per nine holes went like this:  16, 14, 18, 15, 14, 14.  The nine with 18 putts was the third nine of the day, after two rain delays, and I had lost some of my focus, and got a little quick with my routine and with my stroke on a few putts, which resulted in a couple of frustrating misses.  Over the two days, I had two 3 putts, and missed only two putts inside 5 feet.  For me, that's significant progress.
The second day, I really focused on sticking to the smooth stroke and to my routine (mark ball, read putt, replace ball with alignment line pointed where I want to start it, confirm read/alignment,  as many practice strokes as needed to get the feeling of the length of the putt and the smooth stroke I want -- usually 2-4, step up and pull the trigger), and it was probably the best putting round I've ever had -- certainly the best one in competition.  My playing partner even got visibly exasperated with me a couple times after I had dropped several putts in the 7-15 foot range.  Unfortunately my iron game was way off all weekend and my chipping was atrocious (though I still got up & down 57% of the time because I made so many par-saving putts), so my scores weren't as great as I would have hoped, but they were a good 3-6 shots better each day than they probably would have been with the way that I'd been putting earlier in the year.

Slowing down my stroke has proven to be a real key to improved putting for me.  I'm going to continue practicing a lot at lunch and before work to make this improvement stick and to hopefully get even better.  It's pretty strange to me to be expecting to make putts.  My hope is that having that kind of confidence on the greens will take some pressure off my iron game and short game, and help me to finally push past the scoring plateau I've hit over the last few years.

[BTO]

Good for you man! Keep it up. I too struggled with that same short, quick backstroke but I started using my right foot for a guide line as to taking my putter back. I bring it back to that right foot or farther depending on the length of the putt and make sure to follow thru too the hole and voila good things are happening; the 3 putts have gone wayyyyy down.

3 Jack Par, on 29 May 2012 - 10:09 AM, said:

I think I've made something of a breakthrough.  I posted a few weeks ago about how I had switched to a belly, and was practicing a lot and hitting 3-footers like it was my job.  After playing about a dozen rounds with the belly, my putting stats had actually been getting worse.  I was making fewer putts outside of 5 feet and missing more inside 5 ft.  It so happens that I was playing a qualifier for our state amateur with a buddy of mine, who told me after the round that it looked like I was taking it back quickly and kind of stabbing at the ball.  He mentioned Loren Roberts' method, which involves a long, slow backstroke and a smooth, down the line through stroke.  Since he showed me that, I've really concentrated on slowing down my stroke -- first with the belly for a few rounds, but I wasn't seeing the results that I was hoping for, though it was an improvement over what I had been seeing.  I decided to give my standard-length putter another try using this new approach, and the improvement is amazing.  It's like I became a good putter overnight.  The longer stroke is giving me a much better feel for distance, and it seems like I'm getting the ball started on line most of the time.  I played a 54 hole tournament (27 per day) over the weekend, and my putts per nine holes went like this:  16, 14, 18, 15, 14, 14.  The nine with 18 putts was the third nine of the day, after two rain delays, and I had lost some of my focus, and got a little quick with my routine and with my stroke on a few putts, which resulted in a couple of frustrating misses.  Over the two days, I had two 3 putts, and missed only two putts inside 5 feet.  For me, that's significant progress.
The second day, I really focused on sticking to the smooth stroke and to my routine (mark ball, read putt, replace ball with alignment line pointed where I want to start it, confirm read/alignment,  as many practice strokes as needed to get the feeling of the length of the putt and the smooth stroke I want -- usually 2-4, step up and pull the trigger), and it was probably the best putting round I've ever had -- certainly the best one in competition.  My playing partner even got visibly exasperated with me a couple times after I had dropped several putts in the 7-15 foot range.  Unfortunately my iron game was way off all weekend and my chipping was atrocious (though I still got up & down 57% of the time because I made so many par-saving putts), so my scores weren't as great as I would have hoped, but they were a good 3-6 shots better each day than they probably would have been with the way that I'd been putting earlier in the year.

Slowing down my stroke has proven to be a real key to improved putting for me.  I'm going to continue practicing a lot at lunch and before work to make this improvement stick and to hopefully get even better.  It's pretty strange to me to be expecting to make putts.  My hope is that having that kind of confidence on the greens will take some pressure off my iron game and short game, and help me to finally push past the scoring plateau I've hit over the last few years.

[3 Jack Par]

BTO, on 29 May 2012 - 10:58 AM, said:

Good for you man! Keep it up. I too struggled with that same short, quick backstroke but I started using my right foot for a guide line as to taking my putter back. I bring it back to that right foot or farther depending on the length of the putt and make sure to follow thru too the hole and voila good things are happening; the 3 putts have gone wayyyyy down.

I'm going mostly by feel as far as the length of my stroke.  I'm actually pretty surprised at how quickly I adjusted to how hard to hit the ball using this technique.  On the longer putts, it seems like I get a much better feel for speed if I look at the hole while taking a couple of practice strokes.  In two days, I remember 2 putts from outside of 30 feet that ended up more than a couple feet away.  A lot of my putting problems over the years come from leaving myself 6 footers for my second putt.

[glenbrookchamp10]

Using a friends homemade version of the putting cyclops because I have a SB/ST stroke.

[StevenF]

Danattherock-
Did the SAM putt lab yesterday.  Very informative.  I was very inconsistent with my #9.  Tried both GoLo and GoLo S and was significantly better with both of them.  The fitter couldn't even decide which one I putted better with, but after some comparison on the practice green the heel shafted GoLo without a doubt is my new gamer.

[fogger]

So much good information on this topic...thanks for bringing this up.  I've read Geoff's book, Pelz' book, bought a few of the putting aids and find that the Truth Board from Pelz has worked well for me.  Does it take a 100 putts at a time?  It does for me, helps me stay focused and put enough hit on the ball to ensure it doesn't come up short.
I'm a right handed putter and left eye dominant,have been to putt lab, have been fitted by Edel, and have purchased some pretty nice putters.  Still, I have problems with pulling putts, at least that's my miss.  I have a decent stroke and have had some low rounds putting but average 30-31 putts per round...I'm a weekender for the most part.  I can read greens pretty well but it's always about distance for me.  For years I was a drop it in the whole kind of putter and when I learn the speed of greens, say a home course, I can do that well.  For me, playing on a different course is where that style doesn't work too well.  Hitting it a bit harder has proved the better way to putt, you know, if you miss your by the hole 12" or 15".  The trouble is I don't do it enough and can have a bad putting round which puts me in the 80s instead of the 70s.  As you know, when you're striking the ball well and your short game is in good shape, poor putting can just let the air out of your tires.
Do I practice putting enough to have high expectations, probably not but I always think I should putt better because I play pretty well.  Thanks all for sharing...it's nice to know that we all know where we need to improve to score better!

[aop62]

I changed putting my putting grip to the Claw grip. Seems to be working.

[bullie76]

The pro at my club has a putting arc training aid device I have been borrowing on the practice green. Does seem to help as I had grooved an inside path that was too sever. The device does allow for for some inside motion, just not too much. Also going slightly left hand low using a fat 2 thumbs putting grip to help take a way too much hand action. Also trying to relax my grip pressure.

Been putting horribly for a while now. Going to use the training aid before each round for the next few weeks. Hopefully I can overcome my bad habits. If not, there's always the 19th hole.

Edited by bullie76, 30 May 2012 - 01:18 PM.

[danattherock]

StevenF, on 30 May 2012 - 04:53 AM, said:

Danattherock-
Did the SAM putt lab yesterday.  Very informative.  I was very inconsistent with my #9.  Tried both GoLo and GoLo S and was significantly better with both of them.  The fitter couldn't even decide which one I putted better with, but after some comparison on the practice green the heel shafted GoLo without a doubt is my new gamer.

Good to hear. Now take that information and identify your strengths and weaknesses. Let that influence the areas of your putting (if any) you want to change for the better. Consider taking the SAM putting lab report to a good putting instructor and having him view it. While a useful tool for putter fit, it's true value is to allow you to become a better putter. Can't fix what you don't know is broken. SAM putting eval is top dog when it comes to identifying deficiencies.



-Dan

[Little Lefty]

There is only one book on putting worth reading and that is putting out of your mind by Bob Rotella. Compared to the rest of the game putting is the simplest and least mechanically demanding aspect of golf. In terms of mechanics putting, like the full swing, is most easily practiced without a ball. Thinking about mechanics anywhere besides the practice green or your carpet means death. Putting is all about getting the ball in the hole, so naturally feel and green reading capabilities take precedence over mechanics. Putting is the only part of the game that is 95% mental and 5% physical. A solid, repeatable pre shot routine and mental approach will do so much more for your game than any change in mechanics can. Additionally, putting is all about confidence. Without confidence even the best putting stroke in the world won't make you any putts (for example: Tiger Woods right now). If all of these are true, then it logically follows that the best practice for your putting is mental practice. Putting out of your mind shows you how to mentally practice putting, therefore reading it and applying what you learn is the best way to improve.
Well that was fun. Now I need to go and finish studying for my exams.