254 replies to this topic

[FairwayGolfUSA.com]

Great work Howard! Thank you...

- Wayne

[techjunkee]

Howard Jones is GTG!  

Great addition with the PXi specs.

Thank you!

++++++1

[r510ti]

thanks!

[David81]

Just a post to say thanks for posting this information. I tried PXi 6.0 and they worked well for me which I couldn't understand as I thought I would be a 5.5 or even a 5.0 guy - your measurements helped me make some sense of what I found in practice

[Barto78]

Per the KBS website, the R+ has a 5.8 FCM, not 5.7.  Just thought i'd let you know that in case your chart was based off information other than their official info.

[Howard Jones]

 Barto78, on 30 April 2013 - 10:29 AM, said:

Per the KBS website, the R+ has a 5.8 FCM, not 5.7.  Just thought i'd let you know that in case your chart was based off information other than their official info.

- ALL Numbers from KBS is measured with SW value D2, while the FCM system is based on D3
Thats why all KBS numbers is adjusted by 1 CPM to be directly comparable to the others.

[Kellen Kalso]

I feel like i owe Howard a beer!  Great job and thank you for posting this chart.

[Jack Pearsall]

Would CFS be more like PXi in terms of tip and where the shaft loads (mid)?

[Wardonation]

Howard Jones, on 16 August 2012 - 03:00 AM, said:

@dcforuk

RIFLE or FCM flex has some BASE numbers, but CPM value change when we go longer or shorter
BASE is 43.00" with a Swing weight of D3

FCM 5.0 = 250 CPM
FCM 5.5 = 255 CPM....
FCM 6.0 = 260 CPM

If this club was 40 long, then the CPM value would raise with 4.3 CPM for each 0.5 or 8.6 for each inch
so at 40 : ( 3 x 8.6 = PLUS 25.8 )

FCM 5.0 = 250 + 25.8 = 275.8
FCM 5.5 = 255 + 25.8 = 280.8
FCM 6.0 = 260 + 25.8 = 285.8

IF SW value is other than D3, then CPM follow 1:1
Lower SW gives higher CPM so at D2 - ADD 1 CPM
Higher SW gives lower CPM so at D4 - Substract 1 CPM

Its all math, but this numbers is measured with a 2.5 inch clamp. If a 5.0 inch clamp is used, we can add 17 CPM (average)

EDIT : To early in the morning, gave you the wrong base length :-)

SO I have read through this AWESOME thread two times and have a questions. If I like the weight of the S300 but the dispersion of the PX should I go with 6.0's ss 2x's. I currently went through a swing change and the 6.0 flighted have lost me a club of distance from the PXI 6.0's. I love the weight of the flighted but need a little softer flex especially in shoulder season when it is cold. The PX5.5 are getting pretty light again for me. thanks as always you are great for all your help to everyone... WRX superstar for sure.

[Howard Jones]

I dont understand where you wants to go here, since DG is close to 130 grams and PXi 6.0 is down at 108 grams
The hole PXI series is softer than  regular PX so if you came from 6.0F and wants it both softer and lighter, PXi 6.5 would be closest in the PXi series in both flex and weight, but still lighter and softer than 6.0F

[Wardonation]

MY BAD HOWARD I WAS SPEAKING ABOOUT THE PXF 6.0'S WHICH ARE STILL A TAD HARSH FOR ME? WONDERING ABOUT SSX2 PX6.0 TO GET THE FCM NEAR 5.8 AND NOT LOOSE AS MUCH WEIGHT AS GOING STRAIGHT TO 5.5PX? Sorry for caps.

[Howard Jones]

 Wardonation, on 21 May 2013 - 11:40 AM, said:

MY BAD HOWARD I WAS SPEAKING ABOOUT THE PXF 6.0'S WHICH ARE STILL A TAD HARSH FOR ME? WONDERING ABOUT SSX2 PX6.0 TO GET THE FCM NEAR 5.8 AND NOT LOOSE AS MUCH WEIGHT AS GOING STRAIGHT TO 5.5PX? Sorry for caps.

There is very different opinions if soft stepping PX is a good idea or not, but what ever works.....Get 1 shaft and try it first.
Going Constant weight might be a good thing in the short irons, compared to Flighted.

[Wardonation]

Howard Jones, on 04 September 2012 - 12:23 AM, said:

gambit, on 02 September 2012 - 10:16 PM, said:

Hi Howard, the information you provided has been great. I'm wondering, however, when you were comparing the Px flighted to standard which iron length were you using. I read from the beginning of this thread, and it seems as if your partner who helped make the chart stated that Px flighted 6.0s would be closer 5.5 in the long, 6.0 in the mids, and 6.5 in the short, but you and others are saying that Px 6.0 flighted is = 5.5 standard. Please correct me if I misunderstood. My concern is that I just got some clubs with 5.5 flighted after demoing the 6 iron. I play 5.5 non-flighted previously so I'm worried that they'll either be too soft or a combo of too soft/hard depending if I'm hitting long or short iron. I've also read that standard 5.5s are stiffer than DGS300 shafts, so would the stiffness in flighted 5.5s be comparable to DGS300s and KBS Tour S? Thanks.

First of all, this is ONLY butt Cpm strength and it not useful to compare 2 shafts as a hole. Then we need the hole profile like Tom Wishons shaft profiling software. Im using the #6 iron shaft, since its the #6 iron im using for fitting of irons.
PX Flighted is on average 4 CPM softer than regular, so PX 5.5 Flighted equals to "PX 5.1" as standard.

In FCM numbers the shafts you mention looks like this

KBS Tour R+ = 5.5
PX 5.5 Flighted = 5.6
S300 = 5.8
PX 5.5 = 6.0
KBS Tour S = 6.0

Flighted is a mix of flexes but they dont vary in flex "as a set". They way they are trimmed makes them equal as a set, so the long irons who actually is a stronger shaft, becomes softer the way its trimmed, and the short irons who is actually a softer shaft is made stronger the way its trimmed. Thats why Flighted is descending weight even with taper tip shafts, while butt Cpm strength got normal progression with a average of 4 CPM from iron to iron like ordinary PX or DG.

I have a set of Callaway Prototype 3-PW on my table with PX 6.5 Flighted today, and i can give you all numbers later so you can see what slope they follow

Howard I have one last question for you. I am currently gaming now PXF 6.0's. I am deeply studying all your good info but I have a personal concern. To me the 9 and PW in the flighted set feel stiffer than the rest of the irons? They also end up playing about a .5 club shorter than normal for me? Would it be crazy for me to put the 8 iron shaft in the 9 and PW? Or do you have another idea for me? I love the weight so I am afraid to go to a 5.5 in either Flighted or PX? Thank you for your help you WRXer of the year for sure.

[Howard Jones]

...What ever works, is the best rule of them all, but be aware of a few things here.

Some OEM uses a lower BBGM on their short irons, who makes them to play stronger, and PXF is a hard stepped 1 flex softer, so they are also lighter weight than your mid and long irons.  I have no idea of why they are 0.5 shorter than they should...
8,9,PW is the "Hard stepped" short iron, so if you feel for changing them, go PX 6.0 standard flight 8,9,PW, and you stay in flex  and keep shaft weight and flight pattern equal to your mid irons.
(If hosel specs in the short heads is equal to the others, so measure both BBGM and hosel depth)

Thats my suggestion, Go 6.0 standards strait in. Your Long irons will still be like 6.5 SS1, so they have more weight than the others.

Edited by Howard Jones, 26 May 2013 - 07:57 AM.

[Wardonation]

Awesome will do I am also going to put in my wedges. Thank you howard...