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Inside path pull hooks


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#1 Chappie

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 09:01 PM

I've been battling a pull hook for the last 2 months now, it really only comes up with my woods, and is at it's worst with my driver.  In fact some days, I don't even take it out of the bag because of this.

There are many things I think that could be a problem, and one I assume is that I am turning my right hand over my left at impact, but I have no idea what I can do to fix it.

What monitors all universally tell me, and what I see when filmed:

My face is incredibly closed at the top of my back swing.  I don't know how to stop this, my wrist is basically flat, and I play a slightly strong grip, not too strong though (I don't think). My down swing path is about 1 to 1.8 inside, and I believe myself to be an inside to inside swinger.

I never used to hit pull hooks until I started really striking the ball well and creating lag/leverage.  It started out with just being a draw, now it's become so much worse, and it's killing my ability to score lower.

I realize a video would help, right now though I don't have one that is recent enough.  If I have time, I will try to get one up tomorrow though.


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#2 hoganfan924

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 09:33 PM

Obviously, you're shutting the face down through impact.  That could be a few different things, but if you use a pretty strong grip (sounds like you do), then these are the things to watch for:

1. Not opening the face in the backswing.  I can use a strong grip and still get the face parallel with the left forearm at the top if I open the face by pronating the left forearm in the backswing.  Since you're shut at the top, you're probably not doing this
2. Shoulder turn is too flat.  Right shoulder too out and not down enough in the downswing
3. Pivot stall or a stall with the shoulders in the downswing.  This becomes more prevalent the more tired you get.  To keep the hands from turning over, you really need to keep the shoulders opening very fast.  especially concentrate on the left shoulder opening up on plane (up and back - perpendicular to your spine).

#3 Chappie

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 02:07 AM

Hmmm.  The shoulder stall, combined with not opening my face may be the problem.

I always try to keep my shoulders from opening up, because I've always assumed that will generate more power.  That may be my problem.  As for the shutting face through the backswing, I can't confirm, but as I move back, it feels like I am opening it, but i know from video that at the top, it's dead closed, incredibly so.  

If my shoulder turn is flat, I think it's a result of #3, because in the backswing I definitely have a good angle.

What would you suggest to fix this?

Edited by Chappie, 16 July 2010 - 02:12 AM.


#4 naj959

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 03:34 AM

Clubface is closed to target line and path is too far inside out. I ocasionaly have a hook or even worse pull hook sneak up on me and to fix it I set up with a slightly open clubface and swing less inside out. Straightens the ball flight out everytime. I don't know if you've read about the new ball flight laws but if you haven't I would check them out. I've learned a lot about how to correct my misses and get the desired shot shape I want :D.

#5 Darin322

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 11:34 AM

View PostChappie, on 15 July 2010 - 09:01 PM, said:

I've been battling a pull hook for the last 2 months now, it really only comes up with my woods, and is at it's worst with my driver.  In fact some days, I don't even take it out of the bag because of this.

There are many things I think that could be a problem, and one I assume is that I am turning my right hand over my left at impact, but I have no idea what I can do to fix it.

What monitors all universally tell me, and what I see when filmed:

My face is incredibly closed at the top of my back swing.  I don't know how to stop this, my wrist is basically flat, and I play a slightly strong grip, not too strong though (I don't think). My down swing path is about 1 to 1.8 inside, and I believe myself to be an inside to inside swinger.

I never used to hit pull hooks until I started really striking the ball well and creating lag/leverage.  It started out with just being a draw, now it's become so much worse, and it's killing my ability to score lower.

I realize a video would help, right now though I don't have one that is recent enough.  If I have time, I will try to get one up tomorrow though.

I fought a hook for years.  For me, my weight wasn't transferring to the left side enough so that my center of gravity was back, so to compensate I was flipping the club to get the distance.  This could produce wicked hook spin.


#6 turbo4door

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Posted 17 July 2010 - 08:52 AM

I love this thread. I am having the exact same issue. Seems to be with anything longer (5 iron to driver), and gets progressively worse the longer the club.

#7 SwingBlues

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Posted 18 July 2010 - 01:40 AM

Same here too but it only happens on my driver only, the "animal in me" club. Recently I had to change my grip to an odd one to compensate. Now the balls are more push right with a ton of distance and rock solid contact. Still figuring out a easy way to control the release. The grip change is like holding the grip in the palms and not in the 3 fingers.

#8 coops

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Posted 18 July 2010 - 02:49 AM

The tendency for many/most drivers to have a closed face is extremely harmful to you, also. (The pull is due to face closed relative to target line at impact)

Try an Adams 9015D, or get/borrow a driver with an adjustable face angle and try it out set open a bit.

Coops

#9 Chappie

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Posted 18 July 2010 - 07:59 AM

I have a vr tour that is 2* open right now, and have experimented in the past with an R9 in the past set all the way open. It helps, but it also de-lofts the club way to much.

#10 jones137

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 09:21 AM

How have you progressed?

I've had this problem recently and have discovered my left hand grip was way too strong....was strong at address and as I started my backswing it rotated even stronger. I've rotated my left hand back where my left thumb sits on top and straight down the shaft combined with a slighty strong right hand grip (v pointed toward right shoulder). It feels very uncomfortable at first but I guess that means I've made a change. The ball flight came back up and I initially was hitting high pushes or push fades. I then brought my right shoulder up a little and it got my path more inside-square-inside versus inside-out.

It's amazing how much your grip effects your swing.

It's also amazing how the new ball flight laws help understand this....a pull hook was always thought to be from an outside in swing swing with a shut face but I now realize the it can be caused from an extremely shut face regardless of path.

Edited by jones137, 04 August 2010 - 09:25 AM.

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#11 rodney24

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 10:38 AM

View Postturbo4door, on 17 July 2010 - 08:52 AM, said:

I love this thread. I am having the exact same issue. Seems to be with anything longer (5 iron to driver), and gets progressively worse the longer the club.


You couldn't have saifd that better. I to am fighting this right now, and have fought a over draw for sometime. If I would have seen this thread earlier I wouldn't have posted mine this morning.

I could definitly see my weight transfer to the front being a culprit when I think of it.

#12 tngolf22

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 10:59 AM

View Postrodney24, on 04 August 2010 - 10:38 AM, said:

View Postturbo4door, on 17 July 2010 - 08:52 AM, said:

I love this thread. I am having the exact same issue. Seems to be with anything longer (5 iron to driver), and gets progressively worse the longer the club.


You couldn't have saifd that better. I to am fighting this right now, and have fought a over draw for sometime. If I would have seen this thread earlier I wouldn't have posted mine this morning.

I could definitly see my weight transfer to the front being a culprit when I think of it.

+1 to this.  I fought a pull-draw for years as well.  What helps me is finding a way to consciously or unconsciously start the downswing with the lower body.  Lower body leads the transition of the downswing.  If you can get this right you won't come over the top and you won't pull it IMO.  This is difficult to resolve since it's a very subtle move, hard to feel and hard to see on camera sometimes.  

Several things to try:  Sevam's move, Martinez "Different Concept for a Golf Swing" thread, or Slicefixer's 9-3 drill.  What really helped me was finding a way to get the hip movement more automatic (i.e. subconscious).  If you read the "Hogan's Heroes" threads on this site someone mentioned to turn the hips (it feels like turning even after it stops) against a braced right leg/knee.  What happens is the hips automatically shift and turn back toward the target while the shoulders are still completing the backswing.  This greatly helped my transition and I think it's worth a try.




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