[OK_Golf]

I plan on having two golf days over a 4-day vacation in early August: 18 each day or one day of 36 at a two-course facility and one 18. So here's my dilemma, where to play (I've never played in the Scottsdale area, so it's all new to me)? And secondarily where should we stay (4 or 5 star is what the wife is interested in)?

I'm currently trying to choose between the following (unless your suggestions knock any of these out)

Troon North (good 36-hole candidate? Which one if only 18?)
The Boulders (good 36-hole candidate? Which one if only 18?)
Grayhawk (good 36-hole candidate? Which one if only 18?)

Also, if any locals have knowledge of current course conditions, please advise. Am I right to ignore TPC Scottsdale? Also, I’m ignoring We-ko-pa, because Saguaro will be closed for areafication. Cholla is available, but based on other WRX reviews, I’m not putting that one up with the three above. If I’m wrong on this front, let me know.

Now on accommodations we're looking at The Boulders, The Westin Keirland, The Fairmont Scottsdale and Hyatt Regency Gainey Ranch, any thoughts or reviews? The Fairmont and the Hyatt save me about $150 over 4 days. Any idea why the 4-star Westin is as expensive as the 5-star Boulders? Or why the 5-Star Fairmon is at cheap as the 4-star Hyatt? I like the location of the Fairmont and Westin the best.

Thanks for any and all comments/advice/feedback/rants/raves that are offered.

[nagoh]

We-Ko-Pa. Both courses are outstanding.

[OK_Golf]

Thanks for the info nagoh. The Saguro will be closed, so the Cholla is as good (or better) than the others?

If anyone knows the maintenance schedules of the above courses, that would be great to know as well.

Thanks.

[Babydaddy]

Talking Stick is a FUN, first class course.

[Mikeystef77]

I love the Troon courses, not a big fan of Grayhawk. I was there recently and it was a 100 degrees out, but there was water in the fairways and I got mud on my ball probably 5 or 6 times.

You might want to look into the courses at Wildfire. I played the Palmer and really liked it recently. I have also heard great things about the Faldo course, but it was closed when I was there.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Okgolf, I got your Pm

Right now its really between Wekopa and Troon as the best spot to play 36. Both are in fantastic shape, Troon has already aerated and the greens are rolling good again. Wekopa has started to aerate and should be just fine again if your not coming until Aug. Both Troon and Wekopa have great replay specials and you should be able to play 36 at either for less than 80$.

At Troon I really like the Pinnacle course and at Wekopa I prefer the Saguaro course.
I have pics posted of both Wekopa courses here WeKoPa.
Boulders is very nice too but I think Wekopa and Troon have the advantage.

Grayhawk is good aswell but they have had problems with the bermuda not coming through this summer. they are not the only ones Legend Trail and others have had the same issue and leads to over watering and mud balls etc.

For the hotel thing all are great hotels, but the boulders is pretty far from everything.

[OK_Golf]

Thanks for all the info everyone. Keep it coming, if you have more.

We Ko Pa's website says Saguaro will be closed through Aug 7, I'll keep an eye on it and see if it opens earlier.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

OK_Golf, on Jul 8 2009, 03:12 PM, said:

Thanks for all the info everyone. Keep it coming, if you have more.

We Ko Pa's website says Saguaro will be closed through Aug 7, I'll keep an eye on it and see if it opens earlier.

Man that is right I knew it would be close, but for some reason I thought it was the 2nd. well in that case go play both courses at Troon. Boulders being 2nd

[grasbunkers]

WHISPER ROCK

WE KO PA

[jayhawk92]

I played Troon North - Monument two weeks ago during my stay at the Four Seasons Resort in Scottsdale. Great track, great pace of play, great greens. You won't be disappointed.

Enjoy.

[DavePelz4]

We were there about 3 weeks ago...the Troon courses were in outstanding condition and they had a great package for a day. Think we played both courses for $135 and they threw in an Odyssey putter. You're treated incredibly well and the courses are great tracks.

[joeswilkins]

What about the TPC? You could play the Stadium course and the Champions course. Another option a little farther south would be Southern Dunes followed up with The Duke.

[Rohlio]

Suunds like he is staying in North Scottsdale. If you were anywhere down near Ahwatukee the Drive down to Southern Dunes would be totally worth it. I have played every course that has so far been mentioned in this thread (ASU alumni), and I believe Southern Dunes is a superior layout to all of them. Not to mention significantly less expensive.

That course is on my short list, just magical.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

While i agree that southern dunes is a great course. Prob one of the best designs in the state. I have been really let down by the way they have treated me the last 3 times i played it. Too bad to i really like that course but im not driving an hour out of my way to get treated poorly no matter how good the course is. Not when i can drive 15 min or so and play troon grayhawk etc. Re the TPC the stadium is the most overrated course here. I do like the champions course though

[Rohlio]

One_Putt_Blunder, on Jul 9 2009, 04:07 PM, said:

While i agree that southern dunes is a great course. Prob one of the best designs in the state. I have been really let down by the way they have treated me the last 3 times i played it. Too bad to i really like that course but im not driving an hour out of my way to get treated poorly no matter how good the course is. Not when i can drive 15 min or so and play troon grayhawk etc. Re the TPC the stadium is the most overrated course here. I do like the champions course though

Wow that stinks, I played it three times when I was down there for 4 weeks in January/February. I was treated great each time. I assumed with Troon taking over it's management that it would just get better. I hope it doesn't go down a bad road because it is just 25 mins. to get down there from my vacation home in Ahwatukee and the course is so much fun.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Rohlio, on Jul 9 2009, 01:12 PM, said:

Wow that stinks, I played it three times when I was down there for 4 weeks in January/February. I was treated great each time. I assumed with Troon taking over it's management that it would just get better. I hope it doesn't go down a bad road because it is just 25 mins. to get down there from my vacation home in Ahwatukee and the course is so much fun.

I had played it a bunch up until March with no real issues. Before I state my complaints let me add that I am the kind of guy that doesnt expect much service from anywhere, but I notice when people/places go above and beyond and when their service is poor.

Here are the two from Southern Dunes that really stand out.
#1: I played an am round at the Duke with a couple other wrxers, we got done around 12:00 they graciously invited me to join them at Southern Dunes for a 2pm tee time. I headed straight to S.D. I figured I would work on my putting for a bit and grab a bite to eat before we tee'd off. Well I am on the putting green (the only one on it) and the starter guy gets a call for the pro shop to come see what the hell I was doing(exact words I overheard on the walkie talkie). The starter guys starts grilling me on how I shouldnt be practicing if im not playing and before I can tell him what I had planned he basically said I am not welcome to use their facilities and lectures me on how it is for members and paying guests only. When he was done on his power trip I told him what was going on and that I was planning on playing, but graciously thanked him for making up my mind for me and left.

Normaly that would have been it and I would have not gone back but I had already booked the Arizona golfwrx outing at the course for April and didnt want to change all the plans.

#2: The Golfwrx outing, I spent a decent amount of time getting everything line up and was specific about the holes for the long drive and closest to the pin contests, and gave them the exact spelling of our screen names to use on the carts. Well to start a couple names are spelling wrong (no biggie), then the guy in the shop was pretty inconsiderate to me by ignoring me to speak on the phone for 5+min before helping me. When we get on the course by the 4th or 5th hole we are hounded and I mean hounded by the marshalls because we have a 4:00 pace of play granted we did get a hole back of the 3 some in front of us while we were looking for a couple balls in the junk but we made it back up and were always on the 3 some in front of our 4 some. On the back nine it gets worse he starts hounding us again as we are waiting on the group infont of us who is waiting on the group in front of them, he is telling us we need to keep up and the pace is unaccaptable etc, one of the guys in are group finally says well what are we suppossed to do wouldnt it be better to talk to the guys 2 groups up the marshall gets all pissy with him and drives off. I mean I am all for a fast place but hounding guys that finished in 4:06 is a bit over the top.
This doesnt even count the closest to the pin and long drive markers that they never put out on the course at all, or the fact that their director of sales(the guy who helped my with the booking) didnt even come out to thank us for bringing out 16 guys to a course that has been having financial problems, nor did he bother to send me an email thanking me or ask how it all went, which was prob a good thing for him cause I would have voiced my displeasure.

Anyways thats my last two episodes at the course, again I think its a fantastic course and if I were to go back I am sure I would follow my normal routine and just get my bag from the car, pay for my round, warm up for a while, and hit the first tee and be none the wiser to how the service is which is fine by me. The problem is these two episodes stand out and are plenty enough reason for me not to drive an hour each way to go play there.

[Rohlio]

That stinks. It sounds like they just hired a jerk for a manager. Hopefully he gets fired for power tripping and things go back to the way they ought to be, that is too good of a course to be ruined by a small man.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Rohlio, on Jul 9 2009, 05:52 PM, said:

That stinks. It sounds like they just hired a jerk for a manager. Hopefully he gets fired for power tripping and things go back to the way they ought to be, that is too good of a course to be ruined by a small man.

I agree I am sure mine are isolated since there was some unusual circumstances to them, I would like to get back out there and play again but will prob wait till it gets cooler and there is more value in going down that far. It is really the only times I have every been even slightly dissapointed by a Troon managed course.

[DavePelz4]

Matt:

Here one for you on the pace of play, and with God as my witness, this is EXACTLY how it happened.

We played Whistling Straits on a Friday morning...the second tee time of the day (7:10) with the first tee time being a 2 some. We walked the front nine in 2:10 and honestly, we didn't play well. At the turn, the Pro Shop Manager came up to me and said, "You are 2 holes down to the group in front of you. You either need to pick it up or we'll place you." I told him we were a foursome and he said "I don't care, you either keep up or we'll put you in the appropriate place."

We had not seen the group behind us the entire time and we were not causing any congestion on the course. We talked with our caddies and they told us he was serious. Well, in 4 holes, our foursome, had caught up to, and was now waiting on, a twosome. We played the back nine in 1:30 and the entire 18 in 3:40.

We were staying at the American Club, paying $375 for the Straits Course, before caddie fee; also playing the Irish Course and the two courses at Blackwolf. Between the 4 of us for golf and lodging alone for 2 days, we were dropping $4,000. We won't talk about the bar bill but rest assured it was the GNP of several third world nations.

I don't get mad...but I'm not shy about escalating to decision makers and stating facts. I made the Pro Shop Manager call the GM and bring him down. In front of the PSM I asked him what was the normal 18 hole pace of play and he said, "We look for 4:20 but usually get 4:30 to 4:40." So I asked what would he say to the second foursome of the day who played the front in 2:10 and the 18 in 3:40. His response was "I'd say thank you."

So I asked why the Pro Shop Manager gave us grief at the turn and threaten to "place" us? He literally said, "I'll fix this." Our round at WS was comped, our hotel room for the previous night was covered and he gave us another comp round on BWR on a return visit.

We go back there and support them because of the quality of the service. At the end of the day, it's not what happens when something goes wrong, it's how do they respond and do they TRY to fix it. Herb Kohler runs a great program and a lot of other facilities would benefit with the same approach.

[One_Putt_Blunder]

Wow now that is quality and way above and beyond service I would have been plenty happy with a 375 round comped but the hotel night and one other round that is great!. I bet that PSM got an earfull later.

[rlheiman]

Troon North for 36 holes. With the rerouting of a couple of years ago, they are both very solid.

Another fun place is Keirland. they have 27 holes and Segway gofl carts which are tons of fun. The course is a little less desert and not as difficult as some of the others, but a tip top place for sure.

[fore_life]

FOr what its worth, the TPC stadium course is currently closed

[volrus]

Any idea how long Stadium course will be closed?

[MizzyMan]

Phoenix in August? You might want to go bowling.

[OK_Golf]

Ok, one week countdown, so I thought I'd get some up to the minute feedback.

I plan on playing 36 at Troon North and then just 18 on Boulders South (South is a better than North or are they interchangeable?).

If any locals have course condition feedback on these that would be great.

Also, I'm planning to avoid Saturday morning, as I assume deals are harder to find and the courses will be (more) crowded. Locals, if I'm wrong on this let me know.

Thanks Wrxers for all the info. Can't wait to sample your fair city.

[tjy355]

OK_Golf, on Jul 29 2009, 06:02 AM, said:

Ok, one week countdown, so I thought I'd get some up to the minute feedback.

I plan on playing 36 at Troon North and then just 18 on Boulders South (South is a better than North or are they interchangeable?).

If any locals have course condition feedback on these that would be great.

Also, I'm planning to avoid Saturday morning, as I assume deals are harder to find and the courses will be (more) crowded. Locals, if I'm wrong on this let me know.

Thanks Wrxers for all the info. Can't wait to sample your fair city.

I'm certain you will have an awesome time.

The South gets mentioned about as often as the North in various rankings so I don't think you will go wrong with either. Both Troon and the Boulders offer top-notch service and course conditioning. Both sites feature courses routed through rugged desert terrain and among huge boulders scattered about. BRING YOUR CAMERA.


*edit* Oh yeah, about Saturday AM, weekend rates are usually higher, but in the summer, tee times and good deals are ALWAYS to be had. www.Golfnow.com

[One_Putt_Blunder]

I think your making a great choice. If you want a inexpensive Saturday round check out vista verde its 30 bucks on golfnow great track and we played sunday morning in 3:40. Also bring a camera for sure troon and especially boulders will provide some great pictures. Also dont wander into the desert to look for a ball without a club in hand you never know when a rattlesnake will cross your path

[poppyhillsguy]

OK_Golf, on Jul 29 2009, 06:02 AM, said:

Ok, one week countdown, so I thought I'd get some up to the minute feedback.

I plan on playing 36 at Troon North and then just 18 on Boulders South (South is a better than North or are they interchangeable?).

If any locals have course condition feedback on these that would be great.

Also, I'm planning to avoid Saturday morning, as I assume deals are harder to find and the courses will be (more) crowded. Locals, if I'm wrong on this let me know.

Thanks Wrxers for all the info. Can't wait to sample your fair city.

Excellent decision!

[eaglecabport]

I have been to Phoenix/Scottsdale a lot for conferences and alwasy in summer.....just drink lots and lots of water (like I have to here in Houston as well).

I loved the Troon North courses. I never got the privilege to play Boulders but hear they are fantastic.

I would never recommend Hyatt Gainey Ranch because I got food poisoning there so have a bad memory

Kierland is interesting because if you are in the market fro any club fitting, there is a guy at the back of teh range that does this. I went to get fitted for a Ping driver and walked away with a Nakashima. The guy there is amazing.....I hit tons of different clubs and he recommended a head and shaft for me, did everything for me and even some unique things for the grip based on what he noticed in my swing. Was pretty cool. This guy gets all tehse clubs sent to him, rips the shafts out and sends them for independent testing. That was how he decides what is best for different people based on how the ball reacts to the different faces (he liked the way the Nakashima head reacted best). He does a lot of Pros as well and like I said, was great. Best fitting experience ever!

Have fun!!!!!