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USGTF anyone?


64 replies to this topic

#1 bobbyp

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Posted 19 May 2009 - 12:29 PM

Came across this organization a few years ago.  Haven't gone forward with it yet.   Anyone here a member or anyone know of this group enough to comment?

http://www.usgtf.com/


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#2 tigerphan

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Posted 19 May 2009 - 01:58 PM

my golf instructor is a member, sorry don't know more, would like more info on it

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#3 victor2000

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Posted 19 May 2009 - 09:55 PM

I went through the program many years ago and it felt like one of the biggest rip offs ever.  The staff is nice and friendly but the program is lacked depth and you basically learned how to teach the grip.  There was no classroom activities.......this same group has a golf school and I thought they used part of that program as well in that they were teaching us how to play instead of how to teach.  

This is of course, my two cents worth.  To be honest, I am embarrassed to admit that I paid for the program.  

If you want to be a golf instructor, my advice is to find an instructor you believe in and find some way to go to work for the guy.  Pick the range, wash his car......whatever it takes.  Do it for free if you have to.  In the end, you will get further this way than if you go to the USGTF.

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#4 bobbyp

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Posted 20 May 2009 - 04:27 AM

Thanks, Victor, for the honest feedback.  Funny you mention washing his car as I have a detailing business on the side.  I may just do that.   LOL!

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#5 Hondabuff

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Posted 20 May 2009 - 07:38 AM

 victor2000, on May 19 2009, 10:55 PM, said:

I went through the program many years ago and it felt like one of the biggest rip offs ever.  The staff is nice and friendly but the program is lacked depth and you basically learned how to teach the grip.  There was no classroom activities.......this same group has a golf school and I thought they used part of that program as well in that they were teaching us how to play instead of how to teach.  

This is of course, my two cents worth.  To be honest, I am embarrassed to admit that I paid for the program.  

If you want to be a golf instructor, my advice is to find an instructor you believe in and find some way to go to work for the guy.  Pick the range, wash his car......whatever it takes.  Do it for free if you have to.  In the end, you will get further this way than if you go to the USGTF.

I also went thru the course back in 2000 and dont even mention it to anyone anymore. You tell them your an instructor and ask if you have played on the PGA tour before and then I try to explain what the USGTF is and then they are confused. The dues are way to expensive to maintain your certification. SDGA has a better course.

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#6 rehberg

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Posted 20 May 2009 - 10:00 AM

The USGTF is very good if you a going to teaching locally in a area without a lot of PGA guys. I took the course and the instructor I had was very good. He had played some mini tours, caddie on tour some, etc. I had some other friends who took the same thing from the USGTF and said it was a joke also. I think it depends on who is teaching the course. I know in mine he questioned the students a lot and made a couple of folks redo some of the test.

Once again if your at a course without PGA guys around it is good.

BUT lets put it this way from my point of veiw......I passed my PGA PAT a couple of weeks ago and I am about to join the PGA Apprentice Program. So the USGTF will only get you so far. And to be honost not very far.

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#7 Sigalep18

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Posted 15 July 2009 - 04:26 PM

Hi.  I cannot let this thread go without answering some of the criticism.  As the USGTF instructor in Rehberg's class, I appreciate the kind words he said about me personally.  I take what I do very seriously and always strive to do my best, and I'm glad that came across.

To say that the USGTF will not get you very far in the golf business may be true in individual cases and in some very strong PGA areas of the country, but to make that a blanket statement for everyone is inaccurate.  We have many successful teaching members who only have USGTF credentials, and these people are making very handsome livings.  A number of them come to our annual national championship every year, the United States Golf Teachers Cup.  If Rehberg is still a USGTF member, I invite him to come this year and talk to these members.  He might form a different opinion.  We also feature USGTF members in our tri-yearly publication who specifically say the USGTF opened doors for them.  I'm sure Rehberg has seen these stories.

As to Victor2000's assertion that all you learn is how to teach the grip - this is ridiculously false, at least as I write this in 2009.  Anyone who goes through a class I conduct and only gets out of it how to teach the grip either didn't pay attention or isn't very smart - and this person won't pass the class.  He mentions he went through the course back in 2000.  Well, since then we have had some turnover, so I will concede it's possible he had an instructor who wasn't very good, but that is no longer the case today.  Since then, we have implemented an examiner training program and only put instructors in a class who have demonstrated they are up to the job.

Our mission is simple - those who have earned full certification have our confidence that they can teach a competent lesson to an average-level player.  That's our benchmark for qualification.  And, having taught for 20 years myself, I can say that these concepts can be learned during our week-long class.  Why?  Because there are certain concepts that present themselves over and over in teaching.  If you know them and how to apply them, you can teach golf competently to at least the average player, and probably most players.

In closing, I never discourage anyone from seeking PGA membership - I say the more credentials you have, the better.  But the bottom line of any organization or business is its track record. If we were what Victor or Rehberg said, we wouldn't be here going strong 20 years after our founding.

And the fact is, we are.

Edited by Sigalep18, 15 July 2009 - 04:28 PM.


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#8 iteachgolf

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Posted 15 July 2009 - 04:36 PM

You'd be better off spending your money elsewhere.  I'm not saying there aren't good UGTF instructors or you won't learn anything but there a much better options in regards to both expense and knowledge gained.  I'd agree that the PGA is not the end all be all of golf instruction.  Most UGTF guys I've met frankly are either too lazy to put in the work to get through the PGA or couldn't pass the PAT, but I do know of one who is pretty good and has a very steady business.  Like anything else in life its all about what you make out of it.

Edited by iteachgolf , 15 July 2009 - 04:40 PM.


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#9 mikec222

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Posted 16 July 2009 - 12:17 AM

My old boss was a usgtf instructor and was quite good, I stopped working there and now I don't get free lessons and my game  is falling to pieces.

However, he found it completely pointless to keep paying the 150 or so dollars a year for a bag tag and a couple magazines.


To signal, why are the yearly dues so expensive? continuing to be a member doesn't really accomplish anything.

Seems to just get you a crappy bag tag and a few magazines.

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#10 Sigalep18

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Posted 20 July 2009 - 09:37 AM

To reply to MikeC, the USGTF membership offers more than just a bag tag and magazines.  We have about a dozen golf club companies that give fairly generous discounts, and I can tell you from experience that if you are an unaffiliated instructor that these discounts are few and far between.

We also offer a liability insurance program for $110 per year, and this insurance is required by many facilities.  To purchase this insurance on your own can be well over $500 - much more than the combined cost of our insurance plus our membership.

Also, many of our members' facilities require them to retain professional credentials.

As for the PGA - it's funny, some PGA members have these same complaints, that all they get for their $600 per year dues is a magazine.  However, most people who have gone through our course consider it worthwhile to keep their membership and identify themselves as USGTF professionals.


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#11 iteachgolf

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Posted 20 July 2009 - 01:15 PM

View PostSigalep18, on Jul 20 2009, 10:37 AM, said:

To reply to MikeC, the USGTF membership offers more than just a bag tag and magazines. We have about a dozen golf club companies that give fairly generous discounts, and I can tell you from experience that if you are an unaffiliated instructor that these discounts are few and far between.

We also offer a liability insurance program for $110 per year, and this insurance is required by many facilities.  To purchase this insurance on your own can be well over $500 - much more than the combined cost of our insurance plus our membership.

Also, many of our members' facilities require them to retain professional credentials.

As for the PGA - it's funny, some PGA members have these same complaints, that all they get for their $600 per year dues is a magazine.  However, most people who have gone through our course consider it worthwhile to keep their membership and identify themselves as USGTF professionals.
That part is not entirely accurate.  Even kids in the cart barn can get PUD from most of the larger OEMs.  There are plenty of "unaffiliated" instructors with full staff deals.  I understand your sales pitch and while it is certainly better than nothing pretty much everyone in the business can get PUD if they ask for it.

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#12 Sigalep18

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Posted 21 July 2009 - 04:03 PM

Well, your experience is different than mine, that's all I can say, but maybe we are talking about two different things.  I'm talking about unaffiliated independent contractor teaching pros, which many of our members are.  If you are genuinely employed BY the facility, that can be another story.

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#13 hbgpagolfpro

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 02:05 PM

Thought I would throw in my 2 cents regarding this topic.  

I am 43 and decided to start a new career as a golf instructor last Fall.  I was a pretty good amateur player back in the day, and played on a scholarship at a Division I school in college.  I never made it to the big show, but at 19, made it through to the section qualifier for the U.S. Open.  So, I got some game.

At my age, and with my financial obligations, it is impossible for me to go through the PGA program.  I did some research, and decided to take the home study course through the USGTF.  In my view, it is good reference material for teaching the basics and learning the different ways that different people learn.  

The most important thing I did was attend Hank Haney's annual Teaching the Teacher seminar at his golf ranch near Dallas.  Watching the master teach was quite an experience, and I learned even more.

At the advice of 2008 PGA Teacher of the Year, Martin Hall, who was in attendance at the Haney seminar, I went and spent a couple hours with a top teacher here in PA.  He insisted that to have any credibility, I should go through the PGA program.

Well, I thought this would be impossible, but I considered it.  I had the opportunity to work as an assistant at the club where I grew up, but realized that they would want 40 hours per week.  Add that to the hours I put into my real estate consulting biz, and I would not have time to teach.  Working as an assistant pro teaches you nothing about teaching golf.  You are just a low paid grunt, paying your dues as you come up through the system.

So, I contacted a couple people at Haney headquarters, and fortunately for me, they have started their own instructor program.  Hank Haney himself will tell you that he is not overly impressed with what the teach PGA apprentices at PGA school when it comes to golf instruction.  The PGA also will not offer any type of pure teaching program to people like me....the response I received was "we are only interested in developing the COMPLETE golf professional."  Trouble is, I don't know many "complete golf professionals" that are very good teachers.  They are too busy trying to run a pro shop, kiss the feet of their members or patrons, directing tournaments, etc., to learn how to teach well.

The people at Hank Haney headquarters told me to FORGET about the PGA program and just go through their teaching program.  Now, keep in mind, you have to have some ability to go through this program...no 10 handicappers need apply.  

That is the essential difference between the PGA and the USGTF in my view...the Players Ability Test for the PGA is definitely more difficult.  That is where the USGTF loses a lot of credibility in my view.  Still, I think you will learn just as much at the one week school of the USGTF program as you will attending the few teaching seminars that are part of the PGA curriculum.  There is no doubt in my mind about that.

The bottom line is that to become a good teacher, you need to have some good mentors.  To have credibility, you don't need any initials next to your name.  If you can play well (by this I mean have the ability to shoot even par in competition) and you can communicate your knowledge well, you will have credibility.  Having PGA after your name helps, but not very much for the better players if they recognize that you are no better than a 5 handicap, and that is really all you need to be to pass the PAT.

My advice to anyone considering getting into the business is to certainly at least do the home study course of the USGTF or the PGTAA, and then figure out a way to attend the Haney seminar, or even attend one of the intensive seminars put on by Jim Hardy for his teaching program.  

If you are a good player, and just want to teach, try and work that out with a local pro who has a good teaching reputation.  Or, at least go through the USGTF, PGTAA and then get into the Hankey instructor program.  

When I asked Martin Hall for some advice, and mentioned that I could not go through the PGA program, he pointed to a young guy with him at the seminar and said "I just saved him from that."  Working 7 to 10 years as an assistant is a waste of time if all you want to do is teach.  If you want to work as a head professional somewhere, then that is what you need to do.  But, you will not learn how to teach unless you are lucky enough to work for a good teacher.  Bottom line is, there are few of those out there.
Blogging about all things golf on my blog at Scott Cole Golf.  Will be getting back to teaching part time in 2019!

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#14 EnglishBob

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 02:51 PM

My Instructor is both PGA and USGTF certified, I think he is a great instructor, but then he has also done the seminars with Butch Harmon and others.

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#15 bdcava

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Posted 14 August 2009 - 01:07 PM

I just took a blind lesson and was a little leary when I saw that the instructor was USGTF and not PGA.  Well the guy put me in a great position and I was feeling and hitting the type of shot I wanted to in no time. So for me, it was money well spent.  I've had quite a few lessons over the years and this was one of the most satisfying.  Granted, the adjustments were small but I'm glad I gave  this teacher a chance.


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#16 LBCPete

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Posted 14 August 2009 - 09:53 PM

At my range we have 2 instructors who are class 3 instructors through them. They are good to go, its all about being certified who cares after that really, they charge the same amount as the PGA class A guys.

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#17 BigLeftyinAZ

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Posted 14 August 2009 - 10:17 PM

I've been debating about the USGTF. I don't really care about the PGA school,especially since they don't teach you to teach.Only to run a golf course/club. Don't want to be a general manager,head pro or take care of the beverage cart crap.I just want to teach.

I'd love to learn from Martin Hall.

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#18 SadTrombone

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Posted 15 August 2009 - 01:13 AM

Just out of curiosity, how long does a successfully passed PGA PAT "last"?  How long until you have to take it again?

If you were to become employed by a course with no PGA affiliation and their goal/reason for hiring you was to obtain such credentials, how would one go about doing that?

I know it's sort of OT, but thanks for responding.

-mini

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#19 hbgpagolfpro

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Posted 15 August 2009 - 08:55 AM

View PostBigLeftyinAZ, on Aug 14 2009, 10:17 PM, said:

I've been debating about the USGTF. I don't really care about the PGA school,especially since they don't teach you to teach.Only to run a golf course/club. Don't want to be a general manager,head pro or take care of the beverage cart crap.I just want to teach.

I'd love to learn from Martin Hall.

I met Martin Hall at Hank Haney's teaching seminar in February, shortly after it was revealed that he was voted the 2008 PGA Teacher of the Year.  I asked him what he was doing there and he said "if he's good enough to teach Tiger, I am sure I can learn something from him!"  Martin took more notes than anyone there.

I asked him for advice on getting started in the biz, being that I am 43 and simply could not afford to work for $10/hour in a pro shop...he pointed to a kid next to him and said "I just saved him from that."  He suggested I look up Ted Sheftic, who teaches near me in PA.  Unfortunately, Ted is too busy and really did not offer to mentor me.  

I am sure there are a lot of great teachers in AZ.  Hopefully, you can find one willing to take you on.
Blogging about all things golf on my blog at Scott Cole Golf.  Will be getting back to teaching part time in 2019!

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#20 hbgpagolfpro

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Posted 15 August 2009 - 09:00 AM

View Postminitour, on Aug 15 2009, 01:13 AM, said:

Just out of curiosity, how long does a successfully passed PGA PAT "last"? How long until you have to take it again?

If you were to become employed by a course with no PGA affiliation and their goal/reason for hiring you was to obtain such credentials, how would one go about doing that?

I know it's sort of OT, but thanks for responding.

-mini

Once you've passed the PAT, it never goes away as long as you keep paying your dues!  I know many pros that don't even play anymore, and probably could not break 80, let alone do it under any type of pressure!

You can't go through the PGA program unless you are working for a PGA professional.  So, an unaffiliated facility is only going to get their affiliation by hiring a PGA Class A pro.

Blogging about all things golf on my blog at Scott Cole Golf.  Will be getting back to teaching part time in 2019!

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#21 iteachgolf

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Posted 15 August 2009 - 09:37 AM

 hbgpagolfpro, on Aug 15 2009, 10:00 AM, said:

 minitour, on Aug 15 2009, 01:13 AM, said:

Just out of curiosity, how long does a successfully passed PGA PAT "last"? How long until you have to take it again?

If you were to become employed by a course with no PGA affiliation and their goal/reason for hiring you was to obtain such credentials, how would one go about doing that?

I know it's sort of OT, but thanks for responding.

-mini

Once you've passed the PAT, it never goes away as long as you keep paying your dues!  I know many pros that don't even play anymore, and probably could not break 80, let alone do it under any type of pressure!

You can't go through the PGA program unless you are working for a PGA professional.  So, an unaffiliated facility is only going to get their affiliation by hiring a PGA Class A pro.
not 100% accurate.  The PAT is good for 2 years but once you enter the program and stay in the program it is good.  If you either never start or drop out you will have to retake the PAT.

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#22 Fiend76

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Posted 07 November 2009 - 11:54 PM

I am a member of the CGTF (Canadian Golf Teachers Federation) which is the Canadian brother of the USGTF.  

I found the course was very good and my Teacher was amazing.  We had 3 hours of class time everyday and we were taught more than how to grip a club.  I know we have an uphill battle against the USGA or CPGA and we are not taken seriously and it's hard out there to find work.  It is possible but you have to really work hard at it.  I work full time and do this on the side to make some extra money and I love teaching.  

We do get more than just a bag tag and a magazine and the dues aren't  really that bad.  

There are a lot of us who can actually play and now what we are doing.  I carry a +.8 handicap.  

I Teach in Canada and do know a few guys who own ranges and they hand out my card and recommend me to people who go there and they don't charge me anything at all for this.  They don't want to hire a pro and i am usually there giving lessons so people can see me in action before they sign up for a lesson.  I made over $12,000 this summer doing this part time.  I don't know much about how the USGTF works but the CGTF is amazing.  I have had many people tell me that I gave them the best lesson of their lives and that I fixed what CPGA guys did to them.  I have never had a bad lesson and I have been able to fix everyones game to a degree.  

If you are serious about teaching even if it's at night or on weekends I would seriously recommend this for you. I am at the point where i can't spend years making crap money as an assistant pro so i can get my CPGA Certification.

If you're looking for a lesson give one of us a chance.  

You will not regret it.

Edited by Fiend76, 07 November 2009 - 11:58 PM.


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#23 MWL

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Posted 10 November 2009 - 06:52 AM

why not become an authorised instructor of the golfing machine.   I would rather spend my time and money on this.  Going forward TGM should receive more publicity as it is associated with S&T.  I believe the course material is extremely challenging, and as such I would be happy to pay money to receive instruction from an authorised instructor, PGA or not.

Edited by MWL , 10 November 2009 - 06:54 AM.


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#24 Parker19822

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Posted 13 November 2009 - 02:20 PM

As a recent graduate of the level III USGTF program, I have to say my experience was excellent. I was not very pleased with the course we took our PAT on, but the instruction was fantastic and I learned a lot.

Both of my instructors were PGA Class A and USGTF Level IV certified. They have given tens of thousands of lessons, and one of them even spent a brief time on tour back in the 80's, and was a short game instructor for Cleveland Golf.

The course material covered the fundamentals (grip, stance, posture, ball position, etc.), swing plane, backswing and forward swing, short game, how to use video in lessons, rules, common swing flaws and how to fix them, and how to market yourself as an instructor.

I met a teacher in Palm Springs who was both Class A and USGTF Level IV, and he said he learned more about teaching golf in his one week with USGTF than he did through the entire PGA program.

If I had known I wanted to teach golf at a younger age, I would have definitely gone through the PGA program, but because I'm in my late 20's now, I can't afford to work in a pro shop for minimum wage for 4 years, as much as I'm sure I would enjoy it. I currently work part time giving group lessons to kids after school, and I really have fun with it.

The PGA and USGTF programs give you a base knowledge, but it's up to you to work on your own to build upon that knowledge. The good PGA instructors out there aren't good because the program taught them everything they know, they're good teachers because they found another teacher to learn from, and/or they did their homework and read everything they could about teaching golf.

Overall, the USGTF is a great program for guys who want to teach part time. If you want to be a full time instructor, you have to find work in a part of the USA that isn't a highly competitive PGA market, like California, Florida, Texas, N./S. Carolina, New York, etc.

Edited by Parker19822, 13 November 2009 - 02:49 PM.


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#25 tigergolfer22

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Posted 13 November 2009 - 02:31 PM

Quote

You can't go through the PGA program unless you are working for a PGA professional. So, an unaffiliated facility is only going to get their affiliation by hiring a PGA Class A pro.

this is also incorrect as I am a director of golf and not PGA but working through the program and will be class A without a day working for a PGA member


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#26 Professor D

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Posted 13 November 2009 - 02:56 PM

Right or wrong, USGTF doesn’t carry much weight in the industry. But the truth is that the instruction portion of the PGA’s training program is weak. I’m a PGA Certified Professional, and to me, PGA membership does not mean that you have any clue how to teach. I think the strongest credential that you can have as a teacher is that you have studied under a Top 100 “name” instructor.

My advice to anyone looking to jumpstart a career in teaching is spend $3,000 and 3 weeks at Doral training at the Jim McClean golf school.  “Jim McClean Certified Instructor” sounds pretty good to me. Then again, I think Jim is tops. http://jimmclean.com...32/Default.aspx

Edited by Professor D, 13 November 2009 - 02:58 PM.


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#27 Sigalep18

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Posted 06 January 2010 - 07:53 PM

Again, I am biased, but I disagree the USGTF doesn't carry much weight in the industry.  Yes, I do recognize it may not carry much weight at certain facilities or certain areas, but we have way too many successful and employed members nationwide to say we don't carry much weight.  I, myself, was hired at our golf course by our PGA director of golf, and we have a lot of USGTF guys working with, over, and under PGA members.

I'm also heartened by those with personal experiences who say the USGTF puts out a good program.  I think our 20-year track record speaks for itself; if we weren't any good, we would have gone by the wayside a long time ago.

Having said this, I always encourage USGTF members to obtain PGA membership if they can - the more the better, as I said earlier.  But I also encourage PGA members to obtain USGTF membership, as many Class A's and their assistants have done.

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#28 titleiststafferpga

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Posted 10 January 2010 - 09:31 AM

After reading this entire thread.........I have to respond!

As a PGA Professional, and a Head Professional.......I wear many hats and one of those happens to be teaching.  When I hire new assistants, I only hire PGA Apprentices........USGTF does not cary the weight that the PGA does.  To pass the PAT with the PGA of America you have to be a good player.  One person posted a 5 handicap can do that.......ya right.  You would have to have two career rounds in one day with a handicap like that.  Unless you are a two handicap or better, don't attempt it until you can get your handicap down and most importantly produce those scores in tournaments.  If anyone wants to teach either if its full time at a driving range or being more of a club pro, you have to play the game and also know the golf swing.  Just because you understand the grip, swing plane, and setup does not mean you can disect someones swing and give "professional advice."  You have to know the cause of the problem.  Understand the laws, principals, and preferences that all relate to why the ball is flying the way it is.  So many people out there think they know the swing just cause they can break 80 a few times a month.  

One member posted that working as an Assistant did not pay much and he did not learn how to teach so he basically left......PERFECT!  That is called the weeding out process, means he was not ment to be a PGA Professional.  You have to work your way up from the bottom, put in the hours and the dirt pay, pass your PAT and start your book work.  Then you start to learn once you prove you can make it in the business.  For someone to say the PGA does not teach you how to teach, that is 100% wrong.  

Becoming a PGA Professional means your an expert of the Game of Golf.  That statement sais a lot.  Not only can you play, you also teach, mentor, coach, listen, run a business, tournaments, budgets, etc, etc, etc.  

For anyone that wants to get into the PGA, its not for everyone.........and there is a reason for that!

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#29 mtstartup

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Posted 10 January 2010 - 07:24 PM

 lansdowneHP, on 10 January 2010 - 09:31 AM, said:

After reading this entire thread.........I have to respond!

As a PGA Professional, and a Head Professional.......I wear many hats and one of those happens to be teaching.  When I hire new assistants, I only hire PGA Apprentices........USGTF does not cary the weight that the PGA does.  To pass the PAT with the PGA of America you have to be a good player.  One person posted a 5 handicap can do that.......ya right.  You would have to have two career rounds in one day with a handicap like that.  Unless you are a two handicap or better, don't attempt it until you can get your handicap down and most importantly produce those scores in tournaments.  If anyone wants to teach either if its full time at a driving range or being more of a club pro, you have to play the game and also know the golf swing.  Just because you understand the grip, swing plane, and setup does not mean you can disect someones swing and give "professional advice."  You have to know the cause of the problem.  Understand the laws, principals, and preferences that all relate to why the ball is flying the way it is.  So many people out there think they know the swing just cause they can break 80 a few times a month.  

One member posted that working as an Assistant did not pay much and he did not learn how to teach so he basically left......PERFECT!  That is called the weeding out process, means he was not ment to be a PGA Professional.  You have to work your way up from the bottom, put in the hours and the dirt pay, pass your PAT and start your book work.  Then you start to learn once you prove you can make it in the business.  For someone to say the PGA does not teach you how to teach, that is 100% wrong.  

Becoming a PGA Professional means your an expert of the Game of Golf.  That statement sais a lot.  Not only can you play, you also teach, mentor, coach, listen, run a business, tournaments, budgets, etc, etc, etc.  

For anyone that wants to get into the PGA, its not for everyone.........and there is a reason for that!

After reading all of these threads I had to give my opinion as well.  I have grown up and played golf in southern California my whole life and I can name only one PGA instructor I know that can break 80.  From what I have seen the PAT is a kind of joke, shot 78-79 from the white tees with middle pins on every green.
I became a USGTF instructor because they have their own PAT which is about the same as PGA and then you pass teaching, written and rules tests and then you are certified.  Either you know what you are doing or not, plus a lot of teaching is experience.  If you are no good you will get no repeat business.  The PGA of America Charges way to much for a 3-4 year program which then nets you a job a $12.00 bucks an hour as an assistant.  I do not know why anyone would do it.  Be a business man and open your own range or shop it would cost the same as a PGA certification.

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#30 titleiststafferpga

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Posted 10 January 2010 - 10:56 PM

The PAT is a lot harder than it sounds..........like to see if you could pass it.  Like I stated in me last post you have to be about a 2 handicap to pass the PAT.  Yes the course is setup at about 6,500 and the pins are in the middle of the greens.  The total score that one would have to shoot all depends on the course rating and slope.  The USGTF PAT in not even close to the PGA of Americas.  That is one of many reasons why the USGTF does not cary any weight compared to someone that is a PGA Professional.



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