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I知 calling BS on 10+ yard gains


112 replies to this topic

#1 bogeypro

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won稚 gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I知 wrong...

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#2 cardoustie

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    haha, we don't play for 5's

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:33 PM

I think gains are better fits ... that's it

Shaft or spin or launch or length or swingweight or loft etc
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Ping G400 3w 15.1* Oban Kiyoshi Purple 55.05
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#3 James Cole

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:37 PM

Gains are mostly on mishits, newer drivers tend to be straighter and longer when not centering the face.

That and fitting of course but thats a different enchilada.

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#4 Cwebb

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:43 PM

I'm with you.  This has been a topic since about 2007 or so.

Distance sells, so the companies market it any possible way they can

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#5 RodrigoNicely

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:43 PM

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won’t gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I’m wrong...




What do you care!?! If someone is picking up a gain good for them. It’s not unheard of that a driver fits someone better than another. I couldn’t hit G400 max to save my life consistently. My G400 lst is almost automatic. Same shaft and everything.


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#6 bluedot

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:45 PM

There is no one simple answer to this.

I think the OP's basic premise is correct; gains are small if the previous fit was good, AND relatively recent.

However, I'm in a segment of the golfing population that is at least somewhat different in that I'm just flat out getting old and losing swing speed.  So the fitting that I did in 2014 DID get me 10 yards over the driver that I was fit to in 2010, simply by decreasing the spin rate.  And the driver I was fit to in January of 2018 got me 10 yards back that I had lost by giving me an additional 3 mph of swing speed.

On top of all of that, distance gains are only a third of the equation, with the other parts being dispersion and forgiveness.  Those aren't sexy and so don't get marketed, but they are critical, of course, and the interaction between the three means that it is very possible at any given moment to find a driver that will give you marginally better overall results.

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#7 new2g0lf

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:46 PM

You're not wrong, if you are properly fit for your current driver which is less than 5 years old, you're unlikely going to find 10 more yards using another driver.
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#8 MtlJeff

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 05:49 PM

Disagree....And there's pretty much zero question that i'm right at least in that this will not apply to everyone , or even almost everyone

If you carry the ball 280 for example, 10 yards is 3.5% of your total distance. That is really not that much. A low spin head versus a normal head, even with the same loft and shaft, you could see a 10yd difference for sure.

If you carry 250yds, we're talking 4% of your total

I do not believe that all driver heads are within 4% of each other for every possible swing type and swing speed. I'm very confident that if you gave most golfers the ability to test every driver on the market with the same loft and shaft, there'd be a 10yd variance between the longest and shortest if they can carry the ball anywhere close to 250 or longer

If your current driver is one that you were properly fit for and is <6-7 years old. Than no you probably wouldn't gain 10 however. But i would strongly disagree that all drivers are basically the same

Edited by MtlJeff, 10 February 2019 - 05:51 PM.

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#9 ian-500

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:12 PM

Had a Titleist fitting in December, and the fitter couldn't beat my gamer at the time(jBEAM Glorious/Motore VT) in anyway with a TS3/EvenFlow combo.
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#10 bogeypro

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:30 PM

View PostMtlJeff, on 10 February 2019 - 05:49 PM, said:

Disagree....And there's pretty much zero question that i'm right at least in that this will not apply to everyone , or even almost everyone

If you carry the ball 280 for example, 10 yards is 3.5% of your total distance. That is really not that much. A low spin head versus a normal head, even with the same loft and shaft, you could see a 10yd difference for sure.

If you carry 250yds, we're talking 4% of your total

I do not believe that all driver heads are within 4% of each other for every possible swing type and swing speed. I'm very confident that if you gave most golfers the ability to test every driver on the market with the same loft and shaft, there'd be a 10yd variance between the longest and shortest if they can carry the ball anywhere close to 250 or longer

If your current driver is one that you were properly fit for and is <6-7 years old. Than no you probably wouldn't gain 10 however. But i would strongly disagree that all drivers are basically the same

I知 talking using the same shaft in all drivers.  What works well in one head may not work in another that has different characteristics.  


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#11 ezpz

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:36 PM

You are probably right, however how many guys you come across on a random driving range have been properly fit? Most people I know spend most of their time making excuses for not getting fit, "I'm not consistent enough" "what if I don't swing like my normal game" "I just have to fix swing move ABC and I'll get fit" "I'd rather buy 2nd hand clubs once a year then get fit" etc. etc. Tons of players out there who could make gains. Everyone who is into equipment probably knows switching to the latest shaft when your already pretty optimized won't help (not even when they feel like they are hitting bomb draws with their new XX shaft that plays butter smooth like a S).

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#12 Sparky14

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:47 PM

You are wrong. It's 17 yards improvement, every year. With better feel, better sound, and speedier foam.

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#13 vwgolfer

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:51 PM

Your WRONG!  I went from 50 degrees and windy to 85 and sunny and gained 25 yards.
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#14 cardoustie

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:52 PM

View PostRodrigoNicely, on 10 February 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won’t gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I’m wrong...




What do you care!?! If someone is picking up a gain good for them. It’s not unheard of that a driver fits someone better than another. I couldn’t hit G400 max to save my life consistently. My G400 lst is almost automatic. Same shaft and everything.

Me too, LST amazing ... max was atrocious
Ping G400 LST 11.0* Oban Revenge Green 65.05
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#15 Nixhex524

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 06:55 PM

View Postvwgolfer, on 10 February 2019 - 06:51 PM, said:

Your WRONG!  I went from 50 degrees and windy to 85 and sunny and gained 25 yards.

TRUTH!!!!!  Lol

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#16 nsxguy

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 07:03 PM

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won't gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I'm wrong...

⬇ This is what you meant by this ⬆  ?

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 06:30 PM, said:

I'm talking using the same shaft in all drivers.  What works well in one head may not work in another that has different characteristics.  

In that case I disagree as well. Same shaft doesn't necessarily work as well in a different head.

Edited by nsxguy, 10 February 2019 - 07:04 PM.

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#17 RodrigoNicely

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 07:07 PM

View Postcardoustie, on 10 February 2019 - 06:52 PM, said:

View PostRodrigoNicely, on 10 February 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won’t gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I’m wrong...




What do you care!?! If someone is picking up a gain good for them. It’s not unheard of that a driver fits someone better than another. I couldn’t hit G400 max to save my life consistently. My G400 lst is almost automatic. Same shaft and everything.

Me too, LST amazing ... max was atrocious


Glad Im Not the only one lol!! The way the max is talked about I thought it would be perfect and I couldn’t hit it worth a flip

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#18 Davidv

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 07:11 PM

Right or Wrong it sure is fun chasing those 10 extra yards with the latest and greatest drivers.

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#19 Luke'sdad

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 08:03 PM

I see way to many guys we might call weekend warrior types. Play once a week in a league, maybe a Sat or Sunday round. These guys are mostly out there for laughs and giggles. Drink some beer, smoke a few cigars, hand out w/buddies in the clubhouse afterwards. They honestly don't care about buying the newest and the best, let alone getting properly fit for any club, let alone a driver. I get comments like, "Why would I drop over $500 on a new driver, then have to get fit on top of that after spending that kind of cash?" These are the guys most courses make their money from. It's not the guy who show's up at the course w/a new bag full of the latest 2019 Hot List of clubs. Most likely they didn't buy them at this course anyway. But, most of us here are cut from a different cloth. We are addicts, club junkies, shaft maniacs, and passionate about the game. Sadly, most golfers aren't like us. It's more about the chase, not the end result, because we are always chasing something to make our ego feel better.

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#20 LaymanM

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 08:08 PM

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won稚 gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I知 wrong...

No manufacture has promised 10 more yards since Taylormade a few years ago...do you live in a hole?

PING G400 Max 9*, Adidla Rogue Max 75x
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#21 rt_charger

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 08:38 PM

Well at least I have nothing to worry about when I get my new driver... Currently playing a 10 year old driver that's never been fit and playing @ 45.5-46 inches. I wouldn't surprised to see a 15+ yard increase with a new stick that's actually fit.

Honestly, same for the rest of my bag. If you've ever seen a bad shaft relationship, it's mine with R flex KBS tour 90s when I can hit a 7 iron 160-170 yards.

Edited by rt_charger, 10 February 2019 - 08:42 PM.

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#22 NDGolfer13

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 08:52 PM

View Postrt_charger, on 10 February 2019 - 08:38 PM, said:

Well at least I have nothing to worry about when I get my new driver... Currently playing a 10 year old driver that's never been fit and playing @ 45.5-46 inches. I wouldn't surprised to see a 15+ yard increase with a new stick that's actually fit.

Honestly, same for the rest of my bag. If you've ever seen a bad shaft relationship, it's mine with R flex KBS tour 90s when I can hit a 7 iron 160-170 yards.

Probably accurate. You probably will see a drastic improvement.  We should probably all get fit and play the proper clubs but then I wouldn't have as much fun searching for the holy Grail.  

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#23 Laznasty

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 08:59 PM

Didn't Big D**k Rick get 10+ from a ball? So it's easily achievable from the new technology(marketing as some would call it), but yes, fitting is obviously the most important part of the equation.

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#24 ode1

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 09:20 PM

I'm not calling bs on 10 yards, but 10 yards per year since they've been saying 10 yards....I am calling bs on that!

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#25 Bonesaw

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 09:56 PM

Yes you are right, the current drivers are all similar.  But I do believe there are improvements being made every year.

I think the drivers and the process keep getting better(includes the shafts).  Fitting seems to be improving at all levels, stock shafts are improving(made for shafts went the way of the white head) as well as high end shafts, and I believe speeds across the face are improving (CNC milled faces etc).

For example, I hit the F9 at a golf galaxy yesterday.  Terrible mishits were still flying 250 for me (I am around 160 ballspeed on good hits).  I was able to hit a variety of shafts/loft combos and got to see pretty reliable numbers for free on a gc2.  I walked out of the bay trying to figure out what I could sell to get 450$.  And a smile on my face.  They also had a atmos black 7x in stock.  If it would have been 44.5 I would have bought it.

I remember trying to do the same thing for an R1 a few years ago.  It was not nearly as good in terms of options or performance.

But yes you are right.  Year over year, though, they are better(and more expensive).





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#26 Bush Pilot

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:06 PM

Maybe if someone finally gets fit by a good club fitter, sure. But a guy I know has bought a new driver every year the last 6 years. I don't think he's gained 60 yards.

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#27 artist08

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:24 PM

View PostRodrigoNicely, on 10 February 2019 - 07:07 PM, said:

View Postcardoustie, on 10 February 2019 - 06:52 PM, said:

View PostRodrigoNicely, on 10 February 2019 - 05:43 PM, said:

View Postbogeypro, on 10 February 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

My point is this:  most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance.  If you are properly fit, you won’t gain 10+ yards going from one to another.  

Convince me I’m wrong...

I found the same thing. Max spun more and was wayyyy shorter than LST for me with the same shaft!


What do you care!?! If someone is picking up a gain good for them. It’s not unheard of that a driver fits someone better than another. I couldn’t hit G400 max to save my life consistently. My G400 lst is almost automatic. Same shaft and everything.

Me too, LST amazing ... max was atrocious


Glad Im Not the only one lol!! The way the max is talked about I thought it would be perfect and I couldn’t hit it worth a flip


27

#28 BMC

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:31 PM

Dispersion plays a role.  If you hit it straighter at the same swing speed, it will go farther.

Some drivers/shaft combinations can go straighter.
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#29 Swisstrader98

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:34 PM

No, I didn稚 get an extra 10yards with a new driver...was more like 15-20 yards😂

No BS. A few short years back went from a Slider to an Epic and with a proper fitting was getting an extra 15-20. No BS

29

#30 Krt22

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Posted 10 February 2019 - 10:38 PM

If properly fit (not even same shaft in same head since different heads may not react identical to the shaft characteristics), on perfect strikes, I agree the delta wont be big. But avg distance perhaps, depending on the drivers launch/spin/ characteristics and forgiveness one might avg 10yrs or more than the other.


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