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Putting with flag in (MERGED)


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#1 3chavgolf

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 02:08 PM

https://www.golf.com...pin-2019-rules/

Interesting read. Wonder how this will play out. Thoughts?


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#2 Golfer4Life

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 02:41 PM

Is within the rules, so.....
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#3 Barfolomew

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 02:55 PM

We used to leave pin in all the time when putting just to save time and it never got in the way....
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#4 new2g0lf

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 03:01 PM

There will be a whole new set of stats that centers on putting and flag sticks.  If it's in the rules I don't see why anyone would have a problem.
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#5 3chavgolf

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 04:52 PM

View PostGolfer4Life, on 01 November 2018 - 02:41 PM, said:

Is within the rules, so.....

I was away from the game for a while and didn’t know that this was coming in 2019.

I thought that it was interesting and am a fan of this, especially since I play alone most of the time.

Bryson’s reasoning was interesting and I just wanted to get the opinion of other golfers on this forum as to why he wants to leave the flag in.


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#6 bladehunter

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 04:52 PM

Its going to slow things down.  In , out , in , out.  No way everyone Wants  it one way.
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#7 Vindog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 05:27 PM

I always leave it in.  And mind you under the current rules it is not a penalty to putt with the flag in.  Only if your ball hits it is it a penalty.

The only danger moving forward is if the ball is not completely below the level of the ground.  It is not considered "holed" and if the ball pops out as the flagstick is removed then you must play it as it lies.

Edited by Vindog, 01 November 2018 - 05:37 PM.

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#8 BrandonDunes

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 05:27 PM

I was playing with an older gentleman that was arguing with me that I cannot tend the flag on the green. According to his view, once on the green the flag had to be out, no exceptions. I hope he doesn't watch much golf.
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#9 Shilgy

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 05:45 PM

View PostVindog, on 01 November 2018 - 05:27 PM, said:

I always leave it in.  And mind you under the current rules it is not a penalty to putt with the flag in.  Only if your ball hits it is it a penalty.

The only danger moving forward is if the ball is not completely below the level of the ground.  It is not considered "holed" and if the ball pops out as the flagstick is removed then you must play it as it lies.
Rule 13-2C in 2019 if ball is against flagstick and any portion of the ball is below the level of the green it's considered holed.
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#10 imakaveli

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 05:53 PM

Its going to be a mess, both for pros and amateurs.


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#11 scotee

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 05:56 PM

I remember that Pelz research and was always surprised that nearly all of the pro's take it out to chip. I tend to loose sight of the hole on long putts and look forward to leaving it in. My lag putting is better with the flag in or tended. It seems to give me better depth perception. Also looking forward to the stats for next year. But yeah, they may have opened a can of worms.
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#12 Vindog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 05:59 PM

View PostShilgy, on 01 November 2018 - 05:45 PM, said:

View PostVindog, on 01 November 2018 - 05:27 PM, said:

I always leave it in.  And mind you under the current rules it is not a penalty to putt with the flag in.  Only if your ball hits it is it a penalty.

The only danger moving forward is if the ball is not completely below the level of the ground.  It is not considered "holed" and if the ball pops out as the flagstick is removed then you must play it as it lies.
Rule 13-2C in 2019 if ball is against flagstick and any portion of the ball is below the level of the green it's considered holed.

Crisis averted!


I didn't know that, thanks.
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#13 larciel

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 06:02 PM

What's wrong with it other than it's something new and against what was norm for 50years?

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#14 pinhigh27

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 07:00 PM

View PostBrandonDunes, on 01 November 2018 - 05:27 PM, said:

I was playing with an older gentleman that was arguing with me that I cannot tend the flag on the green. According to his view, once on the green the flag had to be out, no exceptions. I hope he doesn't watch much golf.

It's strange how the people who have the poorest understanding of the rules tend to be the ones most adamant about them. If you go to rules subforum you find a lot of people who are actually wrong.
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#15 rawdog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 08:16 PM

A smart decision backed by Pelz's research.

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#16 Pat du Golf

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 08:42 PM

In This ESPNs article, BD is interested in exploring the new flagstick rule to his full advantage.
Whats your opinion?

http://www.espn.com/...ck-putting-2019


PS: I am not the author of this article.
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#17 rawdog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 08:51 PM

It's definitely the way to go.

My opinion would be to merge this thread with the one literally 5 or less posts below.
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#18 ebrasmus21

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 08:55 PM

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:51 PM, said:

It's definitely the way to go.

My opinion would be to merge this thread with the one literally 5 or less posts below.

How dare you.
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#19 rawdog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 08:59 PM

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:51 PM, said:

It's definitely the way to go.

My opinion would be to merge this thread with the one literally 5 or less posts below.

How dare you.

What, leave the pin in? :D
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#20 ebrasmus21

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:17 PM

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:59 PM, said:

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:51 PM, said:

It's definitely the way to go.

My opinion would be to merge this thread with the one literally 5 or less posts below.

How dare you.

What, leave the pin in? :D

Care to provide any statistical analysis regarding putting flag-in vs flag-out?

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#21 rawdog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:21 PM

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 09:17 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:59 PM, said:

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:51 PM, said:

It's definitely the way to go.

My opinion would be to merge this thread with the one literally 5 or less posts below.

How dare you.

What, leave the pin in? :D

Care to provide any statistical analysis regarding putting flag-in vs flag-out?

I have, and will continue to, fight the good fight!

http://www.golfwrx.c...0#entry15067588

It'll be fun when we have Bryson's (and hopefully others') data.

EDIT: I guess I was prophetic :D

Edited by rawdog, 01 November 2018 - 09:29 PM.

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#22 ebrasmus21

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:28 PM

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 09:21 PM, said:

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 09:17 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:59 PM, said:

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 08:55 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 08:51 PM, said:

It's definitely the way to go.

My opinion would be to merge this thread with the one literally 5 or less posts below.

How dare you.

What, leave the pin in? :D

Care to provide any statistical analysis regarding putting flag-in vs flag-out?

I have, and will continue to, fight the good fight!

http://www.golfwrx.c...0#entry15067588

It'll be fun when we have Bryson's (and hopefully others') data.

Lmao.  Of course you ALREADY made a post about this in 2017.
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#23 rawdog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:34 PM

View Postebrasmus21, on 01 November 2018 - 09:28 PM, said:


Lmao.  Of course you ALREADY made a post about this in 2017.

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#24 Holy Moses

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:42 PM

Only an organization as backwards as the USGA would permit a stupid rule like this new flagstick rule. No reason for it on the PGA Tour.
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#25 rawdog

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:49 PM

View PostHoly Moses, on 01 November 2018 - 09:42 PM, said:

Only an organization as backwards as the USGA would permit a stupid rule like this new flagstick rule. No reason for it on the PGA Tour.

Genuinely curious your reasoning.

Making it too easy? Pace of play? Those seem to be the ones I read the most.

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Aldila Rogue Black, 9.5* @44.5"
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Graffaloy ProLaunch Axis Blue @41.5" 5W = 19*
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Cobra F7 One Length Irons
Nippon Modus 105 Stiff @ 36.5"
6I = 24*   7I = 29*   8I = 34*   9I = 39*   PW = 44*   GW = 49*   SW = 54*   LW = 59*
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Maxfli SoftFli

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#26 Holy Moses

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:55 PM

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 09:49 PM, said:

View PostHoly Moses, on 01 November 2018 - 09:42 PM, said:

Only an organization as backwards as the USGA would permit a stupid rule like this new flagstick rule. No reason for it on the PGA Tour.

Genuinely curious your reasoning.

Making it too easy? Pace of play? Those seem to be the ones I read the most.

Golf historically is about getting the ball into the hole unaided with a flagstick while on the green. A flagstick can keep a ball out of the hole that should be in it and in it when it should be out of it. The PGA Tour and high level championships have no need to improve pace of play like this when they employee caddies. Turns the game into a clownshow. Bryson is already planning on using an unecesary rule to his advantage.
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#27 Golfer4Life

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 09:55 PM

View Post3chavgolf, on 01 November 2018 - 04:52 PM, said:

View PostGolfer4Life, on 01 November 2018 - 02:41 PM, said:

Is within the rules, so.....

I was away from the game for a while and didnt know that this was coming in 2019.

I thought that it was interesting and am a fan of this, especially since I play alone most of the time.

Brysons reasoning was interesting and I just wanted to get the opinion of other golfers on this forum as to why he wants to leave the flag in.

I know :-)
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#28 Bingo1976

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 10:04 PM

View PostHoly Moses, on 01 November 2018 - 09:55 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 09:49 PM, said:

View PostHoly Moses, on 01 November 2018 - 09:42 PM, said:

Only an organization as backwards as the USGA would permit a stupid rule like this new flagstick rule. No reason for it on the PGA Tour.

Genuinely curious your reasoning.

Making it too easy? Pace of play? Those seem to be the ones I read the most.

Golf historically is about getting the ball into the hole unaided with a flagstick while on the green. A flagstick can keep a ball out of the hole that should be in it and in it when it should be out of it. The PGA Tour and high level championships have no need to improve pace of play like this when they employee caddies. Turns the game into a clownshow. Bryson is already planning on using an unecesary rule to his advantage.

I can see it slowing down the pro game as each player will want it in or out.

I don't see flags being in or out being a cause of slow play at the amateur level. It just seems like a dumbing down of the game - the flag is there to show where the hole is, usually when you are off the green (i.e. teeing ground, fairway eyc.) It's not meant to be present when you have a realistic chance of holing your shot (most usually whilst putting).

And as you can't post scores playing alone, it doesn't affect singles anyway.
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#29 Holy Moses

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 10:08 PM

Be it slow play or whatever reason you want there to be, there is no way that in any high level tournament you should be able to hit the ball against the pin with a putter on the green. Putting with the pin out is as basic to the game as getting penalized for dropping out of a water hazard and playing the ball as it lies.

Edited by Holy Moses, 01 November 2018 - 10:15 PM.

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#30 Golfer4Life

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Posted 01 November 2018 - 10:09 PM

View PostBingo1976, on 01 November 2018 - 10:04 PM, said:

View PostHoly Moses, on 01 November 2018 - 09:55 PM, said:

View Postrawdog, on 01 November 2018 - 09:49 PM, said:

View PostHoly Moses, on 01 November 2018 - 09:42 PM, said:

Only an organization as backwards as the USGA would permit a stupid rule like this new flagstick rule. No reason for it on the PGA Tour.

Genuinely curious your reasoning.

Making it too easy? Pace of play? Those seem to be the ones I read the most.

Golf historically is about getting the ball into the hole unaided with a flagstick while on the green. A flagstick can keep a ball out of the hole that should be in it and in it when it should be out of it. The PGA Tour and high level championships have no need to improve pace of play like this when they employee caddies. Turns the game into a clownshow. Bryson is already planning on using an unecesary rule to his advantage.

I can see it slowing down the pro game as each player will want it in or out.

I don't see flags being in or out being a cause of slow play at the amateur level. It just seems like a dumbing down of the game - the flag is there to show where the hole is, usually when you are off the green (i.e. teeing ground, fairway eyc.) It's not meant to be present when you have a realistic chance of holing your shot (most usually whilst putting).

And as you can't post scores playing alone, it doesn't affect singles anyway.

Can it be any slower? Lol...

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Non Titleist Welded Neck 35/330g SC 009

Check your Ego at the Club House and Play the Correct Tees

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