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Guys that shoot under par. What clubs?


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#31 Grip It & Rip It 82

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Posted 28 October 2018 - 03:50 PM

For me to shoot under par the clubs I would need would have to be vodka clubs......only way I think I'd be able to not overthink every shot


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#32 Arpeggi

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Posted 28 October 2018 - 04:05 PM

See signature.
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#33 "THE GREEK"

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 02:39 AM

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

It all comes down to the driver for me. When i'm hitting it well i shoot well. I might also add that my handicap was tested last year. It could be a little better than that.  Is it rare to see a 4 handicap shoot under par in your world? There is a guy at my club that claims to be a 6 and i played 18 with him,  he shot 4 under.

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#34 extrastiff

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 04:02 AM

View Postpinestreetgolf, on 28 October 2018 - 03:48 PM, said:

View PostJagpilotohio, on 28 October 2018 - 12:09 PM, said:

Agree with tgood.  It really doesn’t matter much. You just have to like the clubs and get used to them.

I’ve been as low as +2 and currently 1.2 with extremely poor putting since I started wearing glasses for distance a few years ago. .  I Can’t read anything anymore but I still hit 12+ greens in regulation on average and shoot par or better about 30% of the time.

I played Mizuno MSX Midsize cavity back irons with custom Daiwa graphite shafts from 1993 until 2015. Those XX Daiwa graphites were eventually just too stiff and I looked for a new set.  I found my Hogan’s 3 years ago.  Love at first swing.  Loved the look, the shape, the feel. Since then I’ve been using Hogan PTx with KBS TourV in 120x. Various ping and vokey wedges.  Now using glide 2’s and a vokey 60m lob wedge.

Driver has varied over time.  Big Bertha in the 90’s. 400 and 460 Cleveland titanium launchers in the 2000’s until 3 years ago.  Cobra LTD to 917 d3 and back  to LTD this summer.

I believe the most important thing, besides being fit properly with the correct shafts and lie angles, is to love the look and feel of your clubs and committ 100% to them for a significant  period of time.  It is so important to simply GET USED TO YOUR CLUBS.

Too many people on this site actually seem to think there is a significant difference between different irons of the same category.  There isn’t.  All the top irons perform essentially the same anymore if they are fit to you.  You can’t buy a game. I know that doesn’t fit many people’s mindset on this site, but changing irons constantly is absolutely hurting your scoring.  

If this is true wouldn’t changing a good players clubs hurt their score? Or do only bad players need to be used to their clubs?

I agree with this post btw. I totally disagree with the “a good player is just as good with anything” crowd. Usually the people in that crowd are not good players. It’s just as important, good or bad, especially in wind or soggy conditions.
Changing a good players clubs will have exponentially less of an effect.

Jag said himself using the same irons since 1993 till 15, and is very good. I agree with what he said in beginning, "it doesn't matter," and "you just have to like/get used to them."

I feel like he is saying the exact thing you disagree with, that if they are fit to you, it's all pretty much the same, that you cannot buy game. With the caveat that you should be comfortable with them.





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#35 pinestreetgolf

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:02 AM

View Postextrastiff, on 29 October 2018 - 04:02 AM, said:

View Postpinestreetgolf, on 28 October 2018 - 03:48 PM, said:

View PostJagpilotohio, on 28 October 2018 - 12:09 PM, said:

Agree with tgood.  It really doesn’t matter much. You just have to like the clubs and get used to them.

I’ve been as low as +2 and currently 1.2 with extremely poor putting since I started wearing glasses for distance a few years ago. .  I Can’t read anything anymore but I still hit 12+ greens in regulation on average and shoot par or better about 30% of the time.

I played Mizuno MSX Midsize cavity back irons with custom Daiwa graphite shafts from 1993 until 2015. Those XX Daiwa graphites were eventually just too stiff and I looked for a new set.  I found my Hogan’s 3 years ago.  Love at first swing.  Loved the look, the shape, the feel. Since then I’ve been using Hogan PTx with KBS TourV in 120x. Various ping and vokey wedges.  Now using glide 2’s and a vokey 60m lob wedge.

Driver has varied over time.  Big Bertha in the 90’s. 400 and 460 Cleveland titanium launchers in the 2000’s until 3 years ago.  Cobra LTD to 917 d3 and back  to LTD this summer.

I believe the most important thing, besides being fit properly with the correct shafts and lie angles, is to love the look and feel of your clubs and committ 100% to them for a significant  period of time.  It is so important to simply GET USED TO YOUR CLUBS.

Too many people on this site actually seem to think there is a significant difference between different irons of the same category.  There isn’t.  All the top irons perform essentially the same anymore if they are fit to you.  You can’t buy a game. I know that doesn’t fit many people’s mindset on this site, but changing irons constantly is absolutely hurting your scoring.  

If this is true wouldn’t changing a good players clubs hurt their score? Or do only bad players need to be used to their clubs?

I agree with this post btw. I totally disagree with the “a good player is just as good with anything” crowd. Usually the people in that crowd are not good players. It’s just as important, good or bad, especially in wind or soggy conditions.
Changing a good players clubs will have exponentially less of an effect.

Jag said himself using the same irons since 1993 till 15, and is very good. I agree with what he said in beginning, "it doesn't matter," and "you just have to like/get used to them."

I feel like he is saying the exact thing you disagree with, that if they are fit to you, it's all pretty much the same, that you cannot buy game. With the caveat that you should be comfortable with them.

I know, that's why I said "I agree with you" to him in my post.  We agree.

All golf is proportional.  If you take a good player from 72 to 73 due to taking away his equipment that is a much worse slide than a less skilled player going from 90 to 93.  As you get lower the effect isn't less, its just that the strokes matter so much more the actual number is fewer.

We're competing against a golf course and good or bad unfamiliar or ill-fitting equipment hurts your score.  The "good players can play with anything" is silly.  Now, "good players can still beat bad players in match play with bad equipment" - that I will agree with.  A season where a really good am averages a 71.5 is oceans apart from one in which he averages a 74.  There is also way less margin for error, especially with the driver, given that each player is playing the appropriate tees (and the plus cap is at the tips).

Edited by pinestreetgolf, 29 October 2018 - 08:04 AM.

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#36 bladehunter

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:11 AM

agree^ ...the idea that low caps can "hit anything " is true...  i could get around with a rented ladies set 2 inches too short for me..BUT.... im never going to "score" the same ...difference from 71-74 is same as 80-90 for a 10 cap in my opinion... These days i consider a 74 and lower to be a "good round" depending on course and conditions...  above that is bad no matter the conditions...  yesterday i shot a bad round ....and hit alot of good shots... cant imagine my scoring average would stay the same with the ladies set 2 inches too short...

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#37 MtlJeff

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:22 AM

View PostNRJyzr, on 28 October 2018 - 11:39 AM, said:

I've played with a few guys who were scratch or a bit better, the bags vary quite a bit.  One played R9 TP B, irons and a SLDR, another played old TM Tour Preferred blades from the 80s, with a component driver.  Another had full Titleist bag, complete with 690 blades.  If they're lower trajectory players, might see a hybrid or two.

Kind of all over the place.  :)

I'm scratch and I have 2 under par rounds this year out of 55. I don't even come close to the OP's criteria! ( Granted I play a tough course)

Scratch players wouldn't qualify for this unless they played the easiest muni in town
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#38 ago33

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:33 AM

I shoot under ~20% of the time.

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#39 NRJyzr

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:41 AM

View PostMtlJeff, on 29 October 2018 - 08:22 AM, said:

View PostNRJyzr, on 28 October 2018 - 11:39 AM, said:

I've played with a few guys who were scratch or a bit better, the bags vary quite a bit.  One played R9 TP B, irons and a SLDR, another played old TM Tour Preferred blades from the 80s, with a component driver.  Another had full Titleist bag, complete with 690 blades.  If they're lower trajectory players, might see a hybrid or two.

Kind of all over the place.  :)

I'm scratch and I have 2 under par rounds this year out of 55. I don't even come close to the OP's criteria! ( Granted I play a tough course)

Scratch players wouldn't qualify for this unless they played the easiest muni in town


Don't think you have to go quite that far, but I get what you're saying.

My course isn't long, and isn't tough tee to green, but the greens are the equalizer.  Lot of subtle movement that isn't always evident.  As such, at 6500 yds / par 71, it's rated 71.4 / 127.  In theory, a scratch player would shoot under par 25% of the time.

And there's a much easier course a few miles down the road.  :)

Leave it to me to spoil a rhetorical post.   LOL
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#40 surfnbrett

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 10:08 AM

Currently gaming:
8.5 Tour M4 driver with Tour AD BB 7X
M2 First gentleman 15 degree three wood
Fourteen Prototype 2 iron
Taylormade P730 p-6 P750 5,4 1 degree strong on the 4 and 5
Vokey Wedges 52-56-60
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#41 davep043

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 10:46 AM

View Post"THE GREEK", on 29 October 2018 - 02:39 AM, said:

Is it rare to see a 4 handicap shoot under par in your world? There is a guy at my club that claims to be a 6 and i played 18 with him,  he shot 4 under.
A 4 handicap should shoot +4 (from course rating) about 25% of the time.  USGA Research has estimated that the probability of shooting -4 (relative to CR) is around 1%. (http://oga.org/sites...ility Table.pdf).  So yes, its rare to see a 4 handicap shoot under par, unless the CR is substantially lower than par.

Edited by davep043, 31 October 2018 - 01:56 PM.


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#42 Superbrit

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 11:09 AM

View Post"THE GREEK", on 29 October 2018 - 02:39 AM, said:

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

It all comes down to the driver for me. When i'm hitting it well i shoot well. I might also add that my handicap was tested last year. It could be a little better than that.  Is it rare to see a 4 handicap shoot under par in your world? There is a guy at my club that claims to be a 6 and i played 18 with him,  he shot 4 under.

A 6 shooting 4 under par? either he just had the round of his life and he now wont be a 6, he's a sandbagger, or you play on one of the easiest courses around
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#43 bladehunter

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 11:43 AM

View Postsurfnbrett, on 29 October 2018 - 10:08 AM, said:

Currently gaming:
8.5 Tour M4 driver with Tour AD BB 7X
M2 First gentleman 15 degree three wood
Fourteen Prototype 2 iron
Taylormade P730 p-6 P750 5,4 1 degree strong on the 4 and 5
Vokey Wedges 52-56-60
Scotty Cameron 009

M2 first gentlemen?? Lol.  

I may try that and name my m1 3 wood ď lady grace , queen of the fairway ď.



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#44 MtlJeff

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 12:01 PM

View PostNRJyzr, on 29 October 2018 - 08:41 AM, said:

View PostMtlJeff, on 29 October 2018 - 08:22 AM, said:

View PostNRJyzr, on 28 October 2018 - 11:39 AM, said:

I've played with a few guys who were scratch or a bit better, the bags vary quite a bit.  One played R9 TP B, irons and a SLDR, another played old TM Tour Preferred blades from the 80s, with a component driver.  Another had full Titleist bag, complete with 690 blades.  If they're lower trajectory players, might see a hybrid or two.

Kind of all over the place.  :)

I'm scratch and I have 2 under par rounds this year out of 55. I don't even come close to the OP's criteria! ( Granted I play a tough course)

Scratch players wouldn't qualify for this unless they played the easiest muni in town


Don't think you have to go quite that far, but I get what you're saying.

My course isn't long, and isn't tough tee to green, but the greens are the equalizer.  Lot of subtle movement that isn't always evident.  As such, at 6500 yds / par 71, it's rated 71.4 / 127.  In theory, a scratch player would shoot under par 25% of the time.

And there's a much easier course a few miles down the road.  :)

Leave it to me to spoil a rhetorical post.   LOL

I was just pointing out how specific the OP request was LoL. Guys who break par more than they don't are probably on tour haha
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#45 GSDriver

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 12:11 PM

Arrow or Archer, the debate will never end.

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#46 chisag

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 12:14 PM

... I had to check my index revision, but I was par or under 8 of my last 20. I play a Cobra F8 with an Even Flow Black and P790's with Recoils. I will say I had been hanging around a 1 or 0 for several years and it wasn't until I put P790's in my bag that I finally got to a + index. I would credit the long irons the most as they have certainly improved my confidence with my long iron play. For me at least, the difference between a MP63 4 iron and a P790 4 iron is night and day so the P790's gave me the confidence to know if I missed it a little, I would still get serviceable results whereas hitting the 63 a hair thin and slightly toward the toe was quite penal. So standing in the fairway from 200yds out, I feel 100% confident that I can hit the green with my P790. I may not of course but the confidence is there and that makes all the difference.
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#47 stk123

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 12:19 PM

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

If that is true then that is stupid. Either that or you are playing a 6000y course with 68 par rating.

I finally got to the plus side handicap this year and only broke 70 twice in my life. When I was first starting out, I got to 6handicap while only breaking 80 a few times. No way a 4 handicap breaks par more than once a year at most courses I see, par rating 73ish and 130 slope

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#48 Jagpilotohio

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 12:40 PM

View Postextrastiff, on 29 October 2018 - 04:02 AM, said:

View Postpinestreetgolf, on 28 October 2018 - 03:48 PM, said:

View PostJagpilotohio, on 28 October 2018 - 12:09 PM, said:

Agree with tgood.  It really doesnít matter much. You just have to like the clubs and get used to them.

Iíve been as low as +2 and currently 1.2 with extremely poor putting since I started wearing glasses for distance a few years ago. .  I Canít read anything anymore but I still hit 12+ greens in regulation on average and shoot par or better about 30% of the time.

I played Mizuno MSX Midsize cavity back irons with custom Daiwa graphite shafts from 1993 until 2015. Those XX Daiwa graphites were eventually just too stiff and I looked for a new set.  I found my Hoganís 3 years ago.  Love at first swing.  Loved the look, the shape, the feel. Since then Iíve been using Hogan PTx with KBS TourV in 120x. Various ping and vokey wedges.  Now using glide 2ís and a vokey 60m lob wedge.

Driver has varied over time.  Big Bertha in the 90ís. 400 and 460 Cleveland titanium launchers in the 2000ís until 3 years ago.  Cobra LTD to 917 d3 and back  to LTD this summer.

I believe the most important thing, besides being fit properly with the correct shafts and lie angles, is to love the look and feel of your clubs and committ 100% to them for a significant  period of time.  It is so important to simply GET USED TO YOUR CLUBS.

Too many people on this site actually seem to think there is a significant difference between different irons of the same category.  There isnít.  All the top irons perform essentially the same anymore if they are fit to you.  You canít buy a game. I know that doesnít fit many peopleís mindset on this site, but changing irons constantly is absolutely hurting your scoring.  

If this is true wouldnít changing a good players clubs hurt their score? Or do only bad players need to be used to their clubs?

I agree with this post btw. I totally disagree with the ďa good player is just as good with anythingĒ crowd. Usually the people in that crowd are not good players. Itís just as important, good or bad, especially in wind or soggy conditions.
Changing a good players clubs will have exponentially less of an effect.

Jag said himself using the same irons since 1993 till 15, and is very good. I agree with what he said in beginning, "it doesn't matter," and "you just have to like/get used to them."

I feel like he is saying the exact thing you disagree with, that if they are fit to you, it's all pretty much the same, that you cannot buy game. With the caveat that you should be comfortable with them.

To elaborate a little....

I play Hogan PTx now.....

Fitted with the same shaft and length,lie, grip and swingweight Could I play....

AP2
0311t
Apex pro
X forged
P760
i500
i210
765
Etc, etc, etc..

Yes. Absolutely  I could.  The differences in all the top ďplayers clubsĒ is very subtle.  Most of it is about preference. To flatly say one is ďbetterĒ than another is ignorant.

Some may look better to me,  Some may feel better to me,  Some may have a sole design I prefer, but I promise you I could learn to play any of these clubs proficiently given some time to get used to them.

Itís not that club choice is irrelevant, because certain clubs do suit individuals better than others, but the differences in actual performance between them is almost impossible to quantify. Itís very subtle and it varies with each persons individual swing.

Pick something you like to look at, get fitted properly, and then.... GET USED TO THEM.

Edited by Jagpilotohio, 29 October 2018 - 01:32 PM.

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#49 "THE GREEK"

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 02:38 PM

View Poststk123, on 29 October 2018 - 12:19 PM, said:

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

If that is true then that is stupid. Either that or you are playing a 6000y course with 68 par rating.

I finally got to the plus side handicap this year and only broke 70 twice in my life. When I was first starting out, I got to 6handicap while only breaking 80 a few times. No way a 4 handicap breaks par more than once a year at most courses I see, par rating 73ish and 130 slope

Guess i'm not a 4 handicap anymore then. The course is 6400 and i can overpower it with a driver. The only question is if i'm hitting fairways. I average about 3 over par and definitely get the even par to 1 or 2 under round every 5th round or so. I got my handicap last year at a different track, but was still able to shoot under par around 5 times last year at the tougher course. The course i'm on now is definitely easier, but closer to home. I play around 4 rounds a week. I guess i'll have to test my handicap at the new "easier" course. I just stuck with the handicap from the 7100 course to keep me honest, since most courses aren't as easy as the one i play on regularly now. I would hate to say i'm a 2 handicap and get on a tougher course and shoot 77 or so. All i'm saying is the course i play now is definitely easier and shorter so i can shoot under par every 5th round. Sorry if i have made this confusing to some and got off topic. The op asked for suggestions and i figured i would throw mine out there sorry for the confusion.

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#50 chisag

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 02:39 PM

... One thing that I find frustrating on WRX is those that think because something is applicable to them it is applicable to everyone. One thing I learned from teaching is everyone is different. For every player that can use any iron and not have it make any difference in their score, there is another that can have very different results using different irons. I have rarely found new irons make any difference in my score but it has certainly happened. Going from MB’s to 762b’s was one such change that made a big difference in my scores. And as stated earlier P790s were game changers for me. I taught a 2 index that played MB’s and I put him in some Maxfli VHLs and he dropped to a + index. Not only did he have better misses he had a better ball flight with his mid/long irons. And yet I had a 10 index playing MB’s that desperately needed a more forgiving iron. I tried several and he hit all of them worse than his MB’s. The irony was his misses were better, but he missed almost every shot where he hit some really nice shots with the MB’s, so we stuck with them.

... The moral to the story is it is always informative to read what works for you but that certainly does not mean it will be the same for everyone.

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#51 davep043

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 03:02 PM

View Post"THE GREEK", on 29 October 2018 - 02:38 PM, said:

Guess i'm not a 4 handicap anymore then. The course is 6400 and i can overpower it with a driver. The only question is if i'm hitting fairways. I average about 3 over par and definitely get the even par to 1 or 2 under round every 5th round or so. I got my handicap last year at a different track, but was still able to shoot under par around 5 times last year at the tougher course. The course i'm on now is definitely easier, but closer to home. I play around 4 rounds a week. I guess i'll have to test my handicap at the new "easier" course. I just stuck with the handicap from the 7100 course to keep me honest, since most courses aren't as easy as the one i play on regularly now. I would hate to say i'm a 2 handicap and get on a tougher course and shoot 77 or so. All i'm saying is the course i play now is definitely easier and shorter so i can shoot under par every 5th round. Sorry if i have made this confusing to some and got off topic. The op asked for suggestions and i figured i would throw mine out there sorry for the confusion.
"Shooting under par" can be a misleading phrase, since in the US our handicaps really relate to the course rating.  Its possible the question would have been better worded to ask the question of "scratch golfers" instead.  However, you can't simply "stick with" an old handicap, you have to post your scores, all of them.  And a 2 handicap will average about 77 on a course with a CR = 72.  Anyway, let's go back to the topic of clubs used by dang good players.

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#52 bladehunter

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 04:17 PM

View Poststk123, on 29 October 2018 - 12:19 PM, said:

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

If that is true then that is stupid. Either that or you are playing a 6000y course with 68 par rating.

I finally got to the plus side handicap this year and only broke 70 twice in my life. When I was first starting out, I got to 6handicap while only breaking 80 a few times. No way a 4 handicap breaks par more than once a year at most courses I see, par rating 73ish and 130 slope

You must play a really hard course.    I canít get below 0.0 to save my life and my course is rated as moderate to easy yet even when it hosts a one day mini tour event the winner has only been 1-2  tops 4 under par.   Wish they re-rate it now that the trees are 40 plus years old. I feel like itís still the 1969 rating when half the trees were 6 ft high. (71.2/127)
I play around elsewhere once a month or so and my scores travel to longer courses   Because I can hit more drivers ( hit 4 on my home course ).

Edited by bladehunter, 29 October 2018 - 04:32 PM.


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#53 pinestreetgolf

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 04:34 PM

Type of course is pretty important too, since they don't rate all aspects of the game the same.

A course by my parents place (Donald Ross' Lake Sunapee Country Club) is really short but the greens are ridiculous and you can lose a ball on every hole.

A course here in New Orleans (Lakewood) has literally no out of bounds.  You can hit 200 yard slices and be fine.

Handicaps will always be skewed if they are more than half their rounds on the same course.  Some guys here would look like scratches on the Donald Ross course but couldn't reach most of the Lakewood par 4s in two shots (several 480+).  Some other guys (me, for example) can look like Koepka at Lakewood but can't break 80 on the Ross course that's tight with tough greens.

If your "handicap" is more than half the rounds from one course you don't have a handicap.
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#54 BiggErn

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 04:55 PM

View Postbladehunter, on 29 October 2018 - 04:17 PM, said:

View Poststk123, on 29 October 2018 - 12:19 PM, said:

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

If that is true then that is stupid. Either that or you are playing a 6000y course with 68 par rating.

I finally got to the plus side handicap this year and only broke 70 twice in my life. When I was first starting out, I got to 6handicap while only breaking 80 a few times. No way a 4 handicap breaks par more than once a year at most courses I see, par rating 73ish and 130 slope

You must play a really hard course.    I can’t get below 0.0 to save my life and my course is rated as moderate to easy yet even when it hosts a one day mini tour event the winner has only been 1-2  tops 4 under par.   Wish they re-rate it now that the trees are 40 plus years old. I feel like it’s still the 1969 rating when half the trees were 6 ft high. (71.2/127)
I play around elsewhere once a month or so and my scores travel to longer courses   Because I can hit more drivers ( hit 4 on my home course ).

Only 4 drivers at village? I usually hit about 9/10 or more depending how I’m feeling. Only holes that I never hit driver are 2 & 8.

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#55 Mcgeeno

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 05:01 PM

I got my share under par this year:

Cobra single length shovels 4-LW and a Cleveland niblick chipper to boot!

Play your game and use what works for you.


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#56 cqueen

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 06:21 PM

Itís just all about course management. Doesnít matter what clubs you use if you consistently leave yourself in bad spots. If you really break it down and use the right clubs off the tee to make sure you leave yourself a good number or angle coming into the greens then your scores will drop. Hitting driver off every tee isnít the answer regardless the courses.
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#57 BiggErn

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 06:30 PM

View Postcqueen, on 29 October 2018 - 06:21 PM, said:

It’s just all about course management. Doesn’t matter what clubs you use if you consistently leave yourself in bad spots. If you really break it down and use the right clubs off the tee to make sure you leave yourself a good number or angle coming into the greens then your scores will drop. Hitting driver off every tee isn’t the answer regardless the courses.

Yea but that has nothing to do with the topic. Not trying to prove that really good players use certain clubs. If anything quite the contrary.

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#58 extrastiff

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:02 PM

View Postpinestreetgolf, on 29 October 2018 - 08:02 AM, said:

View Postextrastiff, on 29 October 2018 - 04:02 AM, said:

View Postpinestreetgolf, on 28 October 2018 - 03:48 PM, said:

View PostJagpilotohio, on 28 October 2018 - 12:09 PM, said:

Agree with tgood.  It really doesn’t matter much. You just have to like the clubs and get used to them.

I’ve been as low as +2 and currently 1.2 with extremely poor putting since I started wearing glasses for distance a few years ago. .  I Can’t read anything anymore but I still hit 12+ greens in regulation on average and shoot par or better about 30% of the time.

I played Mizuno MSX Midsize cavity back irons with custom Daiwa graphite shafts from 1993 until 2015. Those XX Daiwa graphites were eventually just too stiff and I looked for a new set.  I found my Hogan’s 3 years ago.  Love at first swing.  Loved the look, the shape, the feel. Since then I’ve been using Hogan PTx with KBS TourV in 120x. Various ping and vokey wedges.  Now using glide 2’s and a vokey 60m lob wedge.

Driver has varied over time.  Big Bertha in the 90’s. 400 and 460 Cleveland titanium launchers in the 2000’s until 3 years ago.  Cobra LTD to 917 d3 and back  to LTD this summer.

I believe the most important thing, besides being fit properly with the correct shafts and lie angles, is to love the look and feel of your clubs and committ 100% to them for a significant  period of time.  It is so important to simply GET USED TO YOUR CLUBS.

Too many people on this site actually seem to think there is a significant difference between different irons of the same category.  There isn’t.  All the top irons perform essentially the same anymore if they are fit to you.  You can’t buy a game. I know that doesn’t fit many people’s mindset on this site, but changing irons constantly is absolutely hurting your scoring.  

If this is true wouldn’t changing a good players clubs hurt their score? Or do only bad players need to be used to their clubs?

I agree with this post btw. I totally disagree with the “a good player is just as good with anything” crowd. Usually the people in that crowd are not good players. It’s just as important, good or bad, especially in wind or soggy conditions.
Changing a good players clubs will have exponentially less of an effect.

Jag said himself using the same irons since 1993 till 15, and is very good. I agree with what he said in beginning, "it doesn't matter," and "you just have to like/get used to them."

I feel like he is saying the exact thing you disagree with, that if they are fit to you, it's all pretty much the same, that you cannot buy game. With the caveat that you should be comfortable with them.

I know, that's why I said "I agree with you" to him in my post.  We agree.

All golf is proportional.  If you take a good player from 72 to 73 due to taking away his equipment that is a much worse slide than a less skilled player going from 90 to 93.  As you get lower the effect isn't less, its just that the strokes matter so much more the actual number is fewer.

We're competing against a golf course and good or bad unfamiliar or ill-fitting equipment hurts your score.  The "good players can play with anything" is silly.  Now, "good players can still beat bad players in match play with bad equipment" - that I will agree with.  A season where a really good am averages a 71.5 is oceans apart from one in which he averages a 74.  There is also way less margin for error, especially with the driver, given that each player is playing the appropriate tees (and the plus cap is at the tips).

Hmmm. . seems I was misunderstanding you.  You said "play with anything" crowd is silly, and i thought you were referring to the point Jags,myself and a couple posts had made; that as long as comfortable, really good players can play it (once used to it, obviously will make a difference).Even if its not new or fancy.  OP pointed out this has nothing to do with his post lol, my bad big ern :)

Pretty sure we agree here, cause i definitely was not making the point that putting a good payer in ill-fitting, unfamiliar equipment would not affect their score.  Just making a point that OP did not ask for, that if it fits and is familiar/liked, a good player can probably get to their pre-switch handicap with that set in my opinion.  I fully agree with you that bad (subjective, but whatever, i think you get me), ill fitting, or unfamiliar equipment will affect any player
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#59 bladehunter

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:21 PM

View PostBiggErn, on 29 October 2018 - 04:55 PM, said:

View Postbladehunter, on 29 October 2018 - 04:17 PM, said:

View Poststk123, on 29 October 2018 - 12:19 PM, said:

View Postcradd10, on 28 October 2018 - 02:09 PM, said:

View Post"THE GREEK", on 28 October 2018 - 01:30 AM, said:

I don't shoot under more often than not, but i shoot under about 20% of the time. I play g400 lst driver with hzrdus black 75 gram in extra stiff. The irons are Bridgestone j15 cb 3-p with x100 shafts.

This is why I hate playing in every Member/guest. Guy shoots under par 20% of time and is a 4 handicap.

If that is true then that is stupid. Either that or you are playing a 6000y course with 68 par rating.

I finally got to the plus side handicap this year and only broke 70 twice in my life. When I was first starting out, I got to 6handicap while only breaking 80 a few times. No way a 4 handicap breaks par more than once a year at most courses I see, par rating 73ish and 130 slope

You must play a really hard course. I can’t get below 0.0 to save my life and my course is rated as moderate to easy yet even when it hosts a one day mini tour event the winner has only been 1-2  tops 4 under par.   Wish they re-rate it now that the trees are 40 plus years old. I feel like it’s still the 1969 rating when half the trees were 6 ft high. (71.2/127)
I play around elsewhere once a month or so and my scores travel to longer courses   Because I can hit more drivers ( hit 4 on my home course ).

Only 4 drivers at village? I usually hit about 9/10 or more depending how I’m feeling. Only holes that I never hit driver are 2 & 8.


yep i hit it on 1, 5, 12, 14,  and sometimes 16 if the wind isnt left to right ...If the wind is down or no wind  i hit 3 wood and draw it away from OB..

on the flip side , played Links O'Tryon sunday and hit it alot ..But its wide open and seems to fit more spaces.

29

#60 BiggErn

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 08:41 PM

I like links but their greens haven’t been that great for awhile. Another diamond zoysia convert. Their par 5s are a bit more of a test than village’s except maybe 18. There’s a few holes there I won’t hit the big stick. 5, 10, 13, 16, and 17.


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