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At what point are lessons a waste of money


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#31 iteachgolf

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 11:30 AM

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 10:17 AM, said:

 heavy_hitter, on 18 October 2018 - 10:13 AM, said:

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 09:59 AM, said:

 leezer99, on 18 October 2018 - 09:30 AM, said:

Y'all railing on iTeach for saying what you don't want to hear but he's developing a great cadre of junior players and at least one PGA tour player that I know of that was top 20 at the PGA championship and top 30 at the Open. He's giving you great feedback. Listen.


This is not about Iteach at all. He is not really giving me advice when he claims he can beat most top kids and college players.  He is including players who probably within a few years will win a major tournament and become Top PGA players. That is a bold statement!!!  It also irrelevant to question, He is also a instructor so I do not see how he would never say you don't need him. I never met an instructor who thinks that either.

With every coach I see there is progress and then it levels off and starts to seem like you paying for practice more then actual learning.At first you seek out better and better instructors. I can see at a certain point where the instructors are not really helping.   The other issue I see is every instructor what to change a swing and has a different opinion on what works and doesn't.  If your paying $200-$300 and hour your need to see results quickly.

I bring up Tiger Woods as an example because he was the greatest player and he talked to the greatest instructors the world ever seen and guess what he got confused and didn't win for years. They tried to change his swing after winning 13 majors?  He even said this himself.  He finally fired all the instructors and basically got success again.

I can see how this happens and at certain point you want to forget about lessons and play golf.

I have never met an instructor that has wanted to change my son's swing.  They want to make a tweak here and there and that is it.  That is because while he has some flaws that need tweaking, he has a really good swing and is a good ball striker.  I paid an instructor, a really good one $150.00 an hour and he didn't want to change his swing, just tweak.

Every instructor wanted to change my daughter's swing because, quite honestly, when she was younger it was absolutely terrible.  She did learn how to score with it though.  I paid the same instructor $150 an hour and he wanted to change her swing.

It is the tweaks here and there that cause issues. Every instructor has different tweaks and at some point they contradict each other and confuse.

The only reason thatís an issue is because youíre going to a bunch of different instructors.  Student should be all in and be on board.  And if they canít find someone they can be with.  If you only have one voice in your head there canít be contradictory thoughts.  

Can you post your daughters swing?  Based on results I canít imagine any instructor saying he canít teach her much.  If your paying $200-300 an hour and the teacher tells you he canít teach much to a girl who frankly isnít shooting very good scores youíre being ripped off


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#32 iteachgolf

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 11:36 AM

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 11:11 AM, said:

 heavy_hitter, on 18 October 2018 - 10:45 AM, said:

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 10:41 AM, said:

 BertGA, on 18 October 2018 - 10:05 AM, said:

 leezer99, on 18 October 2018 - 09:30 AM, said:

Y'all railing on iTeach for saying what you don't want to hear but he's developing a great cadre of junior players and at least one PGA tour player that I know of that was top 20 at the PGA championship and top 30 at the Open. He's giving you great feedback. Listen.

I do find it funny when people post info on a forum looking for guidance or insight, and just categorically refute what is offered.

Tiger, are you seeking help, or do you just want to prove you are correct?

He not offering advice at all.  Everyone has limitations when teaching people and some players.   All instructors have limitations and the best ones will not be afraid to tell you at all.

I am at point with my kids that I can either stick with the coaches or look elsewhere to attempt to learn more. I am afraid that based on the coaches I seen there is not much more to learn out there.We seen a few big name coaches with players who are winning PGA and LPGA tournaments and given good advice. But truthfully sometimes they struggle to find something wrong and will then tweak something one week and then tweak it back the next week. I feel like an idiot for dumping spending money on lessons when that happens.

When you start to see that you start to think instruction has limitations too and cutting down lesson to a few times a year may actually be better then on a regular basis.

What kind of scores is she shooting?  It may not be swing at all.

Shoots in the 80's easily sometimes low 70's if not under much pressure. It's not the swing for sure holding her back. I been told that by a lot people who know a lot more then me that it's a very natural swing and don't change a thing. She easily drives well over 200 yards and is only 11.  She is also reasonably accurate on her irons and very constant. Her issue is mostly short game. She needs to get better on up and down to be honest more importantly nail more 10-15 foot putts for birdies which would solve both problems. She actually  very good putter what is agonizing is most of those 10-15 foot putts are tap ins which can add a lot points to a round. If she figures out her short game she will unstoppable.

Not sure if I need to add a short game specialist or just let her practice more and be patient. This is the area where I see the most intructors struggle with and where technology may help more then technique.

How many 10-15 foot putts do you think should be made?  Nobody makes a ton of those putts.   If she has 10-15í putts for par thatís a huge issue.  

Her tournament scores seem much higher than the scores youíre saying she shoots.  I can assure you there are big issues in her swing she could do better

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#33 kekoa

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 11:36 AM

This is only my opinion so take it with a grain of salt.

At 11, I don't care how good your daughter is or what others say about her swing.  I would start looking for a qualified swing coach that your daughter likes, gets along with, and can take instruction from.  Things may be going well for her now, but it is very common for juniors and pro's alike to literally lose it over night.  I believe with some regular instruction, the odds of this happening are decreased significantly.  And if things do go wrong, it should be a lot easier for the coach to fix since they would know the junior and his/her flaws already.  If you look at all of the top junior in the world, they are all taking lessons regularly.  Sometimes they may be working on a minor tweak and other times they coach may just be watching them hit balls.  Either way, there is value.

My son is only 8 right now and as I have said before, lessons ARE not worth the money right now.  He competes very well against the best 8 Y/O's RIGHT NOW with no lessons.   When he turns 11 or 12, you can bet I will get him the best instructor I can afford, but only if my son shows that he is committed to taking his game to the next level.  A lot of kids around us are taking lessons from very expensive instructors ($200-350/hr) and they say it's all worth it even though it appears as though the child's scores aren't improving at all.

For juniors, I think parents can run into a real road block when they want to see immediate results when starting with an instructor.  If that is the case, you are setting yourself up for huge disappointment.

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#34 golfer929

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 11:43 AM

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 11:11 AM, said:

 heavy_hitter, on 18 October 2018 - 10:45 AM, said:

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 10:41 AM, said:

 BertGA, on 18 October 2018 - 10:05 AM, said:

 leezer99, on 18 October 2018 - 09:30 AM, said:

Y'all railing on iTeach for saying what you don't want to hear but he's developing a great cadre of junior players and at least one PGA tour player that I know of that was top 20 at the PGA championship and top 30 at the Open. He's giving you great feedback. Listen.

I do find it funny when people post info on a forum looking for guidance or insight, and just categorically refute what is offered.

Tiger, are you seeking help, or do you just want to prove you are correct?

He not offering advice at all.  Everyone has limitations when teaching people and some players.   All instructors have limitations and the best ones will not be afraid to tell you at all.

I am at point with my kids that I can either stick with the coaches or look elsewhere to attempt to learn more. I am afraid that based on the coaches I seen there is not much more to learn out there.We seen a few big name coaches with players who are winning PGA and LPGA tournaments and given good advice. But truthfully sometimes they struggle to find something wrong and will then tweak something one week and then tweak it back the next week. I feel like an idiot for dumping spending money on lessons when that happens.

When you start to see that you start to think instruction has limitations too and cutting down lesson to a few times a year may actually be better then on a regular basis.

What kind of scores is she shooting?  It may not be swing at all.

Shoots in the 80's easily sometimes low 70's if not under much pressure. It's not the swing for sure holding her back. I been told that by a lot people who know a lot more then me that it's a very natural swing and don't change a thing. She easily drives well over 200 yards and is only 11.  She is also reasonably accurate on her irons and very constant. Her issue is mostly short game. She needs to get better on up and down to be honest more importantly nail more 10-15 foot putts for birdies which would solve both problems. She actually  very good putter what is agonizing is most of those 10-15 foot putts are tap ins which can add a lot points to a round. If she figures out her short game she will unstoppable.

Not sure if I need to add a short game specialist or just let her practice more and be patient. This is the area where I see the most intructors struggle with and where technology may help more then technique.

So she is a really good driver of the ball, good and concsistent iron player, and a very good putter but struggles breaking 80? Listen to what you are saying Tiger! The best players in the world have teachers, find an instructor who can help her our

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#35 farmer

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 12:42 PM

This is great, amateur parent arguing with an established, well respected coach, even managing to lightly touch on blades-gi.  All about an 11 year old child, who is right on the cusp of major body changes.  I don't know how often iTeach sees his top students, but I doubt he does a major change, more likely the student has started to fall into bad habits that need correcting.  She's 11, Tiger, you need to change your expectations.


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#36 alfriday

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 12:44 PM

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 09:59 AM, said:

With every coach I see there is progress and then it levels off and starts to seem like you paying for practice more then actual learning.

Practice is learning.

Or at least it should be when done right.  That's where a coach comes in--not a swing instructor, a coach.  The coach may need to make swing changes to help a student reach long term goals, but a coach will direct the student's practice to improve skills that transfer directly to improvement on the course.  The practice may take place on the course or the range.  But a good coach will assess the student's strengths and weaknesses and provide a plan to improve, along with drills, games, mental exercises, etc. that aid the improvement.  A coach will gear the practice to the students abilities for maximum learning.  

Here is a link to a PDF of Mark Guadagnoli's book on practice and learning.  He knows a thing or two about the subject.

  https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/view/49986968/practice-to-learn-play-to-win-mark-guadagnoli

Edited by alfriday, 18 October 2018 - 12:45 PM.


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#37 kekoa

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 12:48 PM

 leezer99, on 18 October 2018 - 12:40 PM, said:

 kekoa, on 18 October 2018 - 11:36 AM, said:

This is only my opinion so take it with a grain of salt.

At 11, I don't care how good your daughter is or what others say about her swing.  I would start looking for a qualified swing coach that your daughter likes, gets along with, and can take instruction from.  Things may be going well for her now, but it is very common for juniors and pro's alike to literally lose it over night.  I believe with some regular instruction, the odds of this happening are decreased significantly.  And if things do go wrong, it should be a lot easier for the coach to fix since they would know the junior and his/her flaws already.  If you look at all of the top junior in the world, they are all taking lessons regularly.  Sometimes they may be working on a minor tweak and other times they coach may just be watching them hit balls.  Either way, there is value.

My son is only 8 right now and as I have said before, lessons ARE not worth the money right now.  He competes very well against the best 8 Y/O's RIGHT NOW with no lessons.   When he turns 11 or 12, you can bet I will get him the best instructor I can afford, but only if my son shows that he is committed to taking his game to the next level.  A lot of kids around us are taking lessons from very expensive instructors ($200-350/hr) and they say it's all worth it even though it appears as though the child's scores aren't improving at all.

For juniors, I think parents can run into a real road block when they want to see immediate results when starting with an instructor.  If that is the case, you are setting yourself up for huge disappointment.
Kekoa - just my 2 cents but start the coach search now. Even if you only see them twice a year you are part of their core. That same top instructor may not take on new students in three or four years.

Good point.  I've reached out to Chris Mayson and he basically said that he only sees kids who are at least 14 and shooting in the 60's for competitive rounds.  I know there are tons of good coaches here in Socal, but I've yet to speak to them about my son.  If anyone has recommendations please PM me.

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#38 benlenahan

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 01:28 PM

 heavy_hitter, on 18 October 2018 - 08:36 AM, said:

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 07:16 AM, said:

 iteachgolf, on 18 October 2018 - 06:48 AM, said:

No good teacher is telling a player to avoid the flop shot. They'd teach them not only how but when to use it.  Who cares about the ability of the student, it doesn't mean that they know more about how to get better.  

You're just making a bunch of straw man arguments.  What your saying literally doesn't happen.  If you don't want to get lessons that's fine.  But guidance from a competent coach will absolutely be the fastest and most lasting path to improvement.

Btw I've yet to have a junior or college student I couldn't beat.

I don't believe any instructor can beat anyone other then a few skills game that in the context of things are meaningless. If you were truly that great you go on tour instead of teaching. You may be good but it hard to believe you could beat the top juniors or college players in tournaments.


The flop shot is really just an example and was really the only common one I could think of other then say hitting the driver off the fairway with a major hook like Bubba. I am talking about shots where 99% of the people out there can't do properly and that includes instructors.

A coach doesn't need to need to be good at the game to teach someone how to be play or be good at the game.  Bill Belicheck, Nick Saban, Vince Lombardi, Tommy Lasorda, Red Aurebach, and many other coaches were better teachers than they ever were players.
Thatís a little different. Tommy Lasorda isnít teaching the Dodgers how to hit the ball, he is managing them. He didnít teach Kirk Gibson how to hit a homer, he made the right call to put him in the position to hit a homer. Football coaches are calling plays, not teaching blockers how to block.

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#39 benlenahan

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 01:34 PM

I believe in self teaching, at least through the younger years. I am completely self taught, and I could for sure see how having a coach would help, but the hours of struggling with myself on the course and on the range greatly improved me. I learned to figure out what is wrong and fix it, and when I became able to do it on the fly mid round, that changed the game. I donít know if a swing coach in the range can offer that.

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#40 heavy_hitter

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 01:50 PM

 benlenahan, on 18 October 2018 - 01:28 PM, said:

 heavy_hitter, on 18 October 2018 - 08:36 AM, said:

 tiger1873, on 18 October 2018 - 07:16 AM, said:

 iteachgolf, on 18 October 2018 - 06:48 AM, said:

No good teacher is telling a player to avoid the flop shot. They'd teach them not only how but when to use it.  Who cares about the ability of the student, it doesn't mean that they know more about how to get better.  

You're just making a bunch of straw man arguments.  What your saying literally doesn't happen.  If you don't want to get lessons that's fine.  But guidance from a competent coach will absolutely be the fastest and most lasting path to improvement.

Btw I've yet to have a junior or college student I couldn't beat.

I don't believe any instructor can beat anyone other then a few skills game that in the context of things are meaningless. If you were truly that great you go on tour instead of teaching. You may be good but it hard to believe you could beat the top juniors or college players in tournaments.


The flop shot is really just an example and was really the only common one I could think of other then say hitting the driver off the fairway with a major hook like Bubba. I am talking about shots where 99% of the people out there can't do properly and that includes instructors.

A coach doesn't need to need to be good at the game to teach someone how to be play or be good at the game.  Bill Belicheck, Nick Saban, Vince Lombardi, Tommy Lasorda, Red Aurebach, and many other coaches were better teachers than they ever were players.
That's a little different. Tommy Lasorda isn't teaching the Dodgers how to hit the ball, he is managing them. He didn't teach Kirk Gibson how to hit a homer, he made the right call to put him in the position to hit a homer. Football coaches are calling plays, not teaching blockers how to block.

LOL at this post.


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#41 TigerMom

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 02:33 PM

I donít know when it is a waste

But there should be a financial consideration in the decision

Many parents are spending too much compared to what they make

One family we know spends over 20% of their gross annual income on kidsí sports lessons and fees

Too much



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#42 Cwing

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 03:30 PM

A swing coach/lessons are a waste of time/money when you arenít willing or cannot put in the time and effort to put in the work.

One cannot get a lesson, go to the range, work on a drill for 5-10 swings and then just wale away. You will never improve that way -NEVER!!!
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#43 farmer

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Posted 18 October 2018 - 05:48 PM

To benlahan's post, someone, at some time, taught Kirk Gibson how to swing a bat.  Being a freakish athlete made it easier, but someone taught him.  Every position on every team is taught how to play that position.  Someone taught Usain Bolt how to get into the proper stance and how to efficiently run 100m.

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#44 Forged4ever

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Posted 19 October 2018 - 10:03 AM

Oh Dear God, just when I think that Iíve read it all and it canít get any better???

💥BOOM💥

😂😂😂😂

Seriously, if weíre sittin around the table in the Menís Grille(yea, it Is Men only and the Ladies have their own 19th hole. I may be an arsehole however through Maddie I have morphed into an enlightened arsehole and I voted for the separate grille room. What, ya think that I was gonna vote for a coed grille😂😂), and someone says some of this garbage at a table of Players, theyíre toast, lmao

Seriously, burnt🔥

On a more serious note,  my .03 on when??

When your kid wins 20+ on THE Tour, 2-3 majors and OWNS his/her swing

Till then???

Find em a Teacher who is more than a damn swing coach because as they improve and if your kid EVER gets to a competitive Plus, he/sheís gonna need a mental game that exceeds his/her physical game cuz theyíre gonna have to learn to Play, compete and WIN with less than his/her A game, and thatís got absolutely NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR SWING/STROKE!!!

Jesus Christ, no wonder why there are sooooo many effed up kids out there, lmao😂😂

Madison canít even come into these types of threads anymore😂😂

Thatís ok cuz between parents tryin to play coach and the kid never mastering the mental game, 98%+ of these kids will be playin for shats & giggles or walkin away from the game altogether inside of 6-8 years.

Find the child a quality Teacher, and if youíre lucky, that Pro will become much much much more than just a ďTeacher,Ē they will become a Confidante & Mentor, like I had for 32+ years.

Playing ability as a barometer for TEACHING ability??!!

Oh sweet Jesus😂😂

My Teacher, Pete Snead, couldnít even swing a stick his last 8-9 years and he had Tour Boys, Tour Girls, three Walker Cuppers & Madison, not to mention my knarly arse, come swing in his front yard while he sat in a rocker on his friggin porch.

WTF does Playing ability have to do with Teaching, as long as they did at one time know understand and appreciate what itís like to swing under the immense pressure of Tourney Golff???

With our daughter, we settled on a Teacher(no, itís not Madison), and we stayTF outa the way,  STFU and let him do his job. You donít know myself or Madison, though we both have strong personalities, strong opinions and beliefs, and sheís a Pro and I was a Plus, yet we both know when to find the best available, turn the child over to em, and STFU, unless we truly observe something that bothers us, and the odds are great that it wouldnít be swing related cuz in the grand scheme of becoming a Player, the swing ainít the most important factor, as Heavyís daughter, Aggís son, Matthew and Jim Furyk show. Whatever swing the child has, it has to be consistent reproducible and spot on under pressure.

Go stand on the line at any Junior Tourney, forget Tour line, lol.

Practically every swing/stroke is gorgeous, yet many of those same kids are gonna finish 15-20+ strokes off of the winning score.

Same with the Tour Boys, and Iíll let you pick the Tour line or practice green~

98%+ are a work of art and a thing of beauty, yet HALF will be slammin trunks on Friday evenin, lol

It ainít the swing/stroke😉

Find a Teacher who can Teach the kid how to read a divot and ball flight with his/her eyes and ya got someone who stands half a chance of making mid-round adjustments without having to wait till they get home or get to their club to jump on the LM😂😂

This shat just keeps gettin better and better😂😂

Iím outa dodge cuz these types of threads sicken me when someone whoís tone of certainty soooooo far exceeds their actual knowledge and then to top it off, theyíve got control over someoneís future other than their own, especially a child, who unfortunately, does not know that there is a better way, and even if they do realize this, there is little that they can do to alter the path that their Parent(s) has/have chosen for them?!?!?

What, you wanna be ďTiger Dad????Ē

#1, he was 1 in MILLIONS, and you ainít Tigerís Dad, and #2, your child ainít Tiger😉

That trainís already left the station my man and you two ainít on it~

Oh eff me😂😂

Only on WRX Gents, only on WRX😜

Great comments Dan👌🏼

Have a great weekend Gents🍻
RP

Edited by Forged4ever, 19 October 2018 - 01:45 PM.

GHIN: Beefeater 24

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#45 jslane57

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Posted 19 October 2018 - 10:09 AM

Lessons only become a waste of money when you decide you're no longer going to listen to your instructor. And this has zero to do with talent or age. I've seen 25 hcp golfers throwing their money away with lessons as they simply don't want to learn, and I've seen fabulous golfers getting every penny worth out of a lesson with the seemingly smallest adjustment...


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#46 heavy_hitter

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Posted 19 October 2018 - 10:17 AM

View PostForged4ever, on 19 October 2018 - 10:03 AM, said:

Oh Dear God, just when I think that I've read it all and it can't get any better???

��BOOM��

��������

Seriously, if we're sittin around the table in the Men's Grille(yea, it Men only and the Ladies have their own 19th hole. I may be an arsehole however through Maddie I have morphed into an enlightened arsehole and I voted for the separate grille room. What, ya think that I was gonna vote for a coed grille����), and someone says some of this garbage at a table of Players, they're toast, lmao

Seriously, burnt��

On a more serious note,  my .03 on when??

When your kid wins 20+ on THE Tour, 2-3 majors and OWNS his/her swing

Till then???

Find em a Teacher who is more than a damn swing coach because as they improve and if your kid EVER gets to a competitive Plus, he's gonna need a mental game that exceeds his physical game cuz he's gonna have to learn to Play, compete and WIN with less than his/her A game, and that's got absolutely NOTHING TO DO WITH SWING!!!

Jesus Christ, no wonder why there are sooooo many effed up kids out there, lmao����

Madison can't even come into these types of threads anymore����

That's ok cuz between parents tryin to play coach and the kid never mastering the mental game, 98%+ of these kids will be playin for shats & giggles or walk-in away from the game altogether.

Find the child a quality Teacher, and if you're lucky, that Pro will become much much much more than just a "Teacher," they will become a Comfidante & Mentor, like I had for 32+ years.

Playing ability as a barometer for TEACHING ability??!!

Oh sweet Jesus����

My Teacher, Pete Snead, couldn't even swing a stick his last 8-9 years and he had Tour Boys, Tour Girls, and theee Walker Cuppers & Madison, not to mention my knarly arse, come swing in his front yard while he sat in a rocker on his friggin porch.

WTF does Playing ability have to do with Teaching, as long as they did at one time know understand and appreciate what it's like to swing under the immense pressure of Tourney Golff???

With our daughter, we settled on a Teacher(no, it's not Madison), and we stayTF outa the way,  STFU and let him do his job.

This shat just keeps gettin better and better����

I'm outa dodge cuz these types of threads sicken me when someone who's tone of certainty soooooo far exceeds their actual knowledge and then to top it off, they've got control over someone's future other than their own?!?!?

Oh eff me����

Only on WRX Gents, only on WRX��

Great comments Dan����

Have a great weekend Gents��
RP

Hope you are doing well Rich.

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#47 agatha

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Posted 19 October 2018 - 10:55 AM

I think a good coach is invaluable.  My son has been with his since Freshman year of high school, thru college and now in his 4th year as a professional.  His coach doesn't just work on his "swing".  First of all my son's swing is a bit unconventional but Don did not try to change it because it worked for him and why change what is working.   Rather, he works with him on what he can do to fine tune it.  But more importantly he is dialed into his mental state, his physical state etc.. He knows what he needs whether it be a nutritionist or a fitness trainer or just a good old fashioned chewing out which he sometimes needs.

I can't imagine that anyone at age 11 can go solo with a parent who is over involved without her wanting to quit or get totally burned out down the road.  As a parent its important to know your place,  being the parent, not the coach, not the track man reader, not the psychologist.  Trust me if you don't step back it won't be helping her one bit.  You leave that up to the professionals or it will surely bite you in the butt.

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#48 GolfTurkey

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Posted 19 October 2018 - 10:42 PM

Dunning-Kruger at its finest.

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#49 darter79

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Posted 20 October 2018 - 09:40 AM

so let's all compare Tiger Woods results to that of your daughter. Tiger has always been an old school feel player he was always seeking to be the best which is why he mixed it up over the years. But let's compare HIM to any junior on here yeah that's completely logical.  I've never seen a player let alone a junior that didn't need lessons. But let's compare junior golf to Tiger no matter how 'good' your daughter might be. She needs lessons find the right fit and they will get her on the right path. Unless she breaking 30 per 9 or 60 per 18 then I wouldn't get her lessons but we all know that isn't the case. and I though I've read it all on here...

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#50 tdk8180

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Posted 20 October 2018 - 09:45 AM

When the lessons result in higher scores or an inability to strike a ball in the best way possible.

As an individual, you need to realize what is happening in the lessons as it relates to your success.  

In my opinion, thinking and mental approach to playing is more key than lessons, if you are already capable of making it around a golf course a few over par.


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#51 leezer99

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 05:22 AM

View Postkekoa, on 18 October 2018 - 12:48 PM, said:


Good point.  I've reached out to Chris Mayson and he basically said that he only sees kids who are at least 14 and shooting in the 60's for competitive rounds.  I know there are tons of good coaches here in Socal, but I've yet to speak to them about my son.  If anyone has recommendations please PM me.

I guess he's taking new juniors now based on someone's recent post.

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#52 Atrayn

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 07:42 AM

Oh the pain and agony of re-reading the last page of this thread but.....
Not only junior wanna be's but many many more need to heed this advice by Richard....

"Find a Teacher who can Teach the kid how to read a divot and ball flight with his/her eyes and ya got someone who stands half a chance of making mid-round adjustments without having to wait till they get home or get to their club to jump on the LM����"
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that will swing a golf club as well as it can possibly be done." "That is probably as close to
the perfect swing as it would be possible for human beings to get." Ben Hogan 1965 SI

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#53 MikekiM

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 11:51 AM

View Postleezer99, on 05 February 2019 - 05:22 AM, said:

View Postkekoa, on 18 October 2018 - 12:48 PM, said:

Good point.  I've reached out to Chris Mayson and he basically said that he only sees kids who are at least 14 and shooting in the 60's for competitive rounds.  I know there are tons of good coaches here in Socal, but I've yet to speak to them about my son.  If anyone has recommendations please PM me.

I guess he's taking new juniors now based on someone's recent post.
I've spoken with another junior that worked with Mayson as well and his biggest complaint was that he was never available for him despite agreeing to work with him.  He had a couple lessons with him but then during peak season his was traveling so much he couldn't get in to see him.  6-8 months of trying he gave up and moved on.

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#54 leezer99

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 12:05 PM

View PostMikekiM, on 05 February 2019 - 11:51 AM, said:

View Postleezer99, on 05 February 2019 - 05:22 AM, said:

View Postkekoa, on 18 October 2018 - 12:48 PM, said:

Good point.  I've reached out to Chris Mayson and he basically said that he only sees kids who are at least 14 and shooting in the 60's for competitive rounds.  I know there are tons of good coaches here in Socal, but I've yet to speak to them about my son.  If anyone has recommendations please PM me.

I guess he's taking new juniors now based on someone's recent post.
I've spoken with another junior that worked with Mayson as well and his biggest complaint was that he was never available for him despite agreeing to work with him.  He had a couple lessons with him but then during peak season his was traveling so much he couldn't get in to see him.  6-8 months of trying he gave up and moved on.

This is something you have to understand when trying to land a big fish.  It's going to be difficult to get into the boat but is worth it in the end.  

That being said, if you haven't seen the Mr. Shortgame video with Chris Mayson it's worth the 7 1/2 minutes of your time.



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#55 ebrasmus21

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 12:08 PM

Dan is one of the last remaining knowledgeable instructors that posts on this site -- but yeah lets all s*** on him for not knowing what he's talking about.  That makes total sense.

You guys realize that at one time this site had NUMEROUS highly respected/highly knowledgeable instructors that would post and share free information all the time?  Many of them don't post that often anymore and it's probably because of all the s*** posting from the peanut gallery.  Guys that actually have something to say eventually get tired of banging their heads against a wall arguing with a 16 handicap internet expert.

I followed Joseph Mayo on IG because his videos were interesting and instructive - free information from someone that I actually wanted to listen to.  He deleted his IG account because he was sick of dealing with all the bull s***.

How about we ask questions on this site and then when someone comes along that actually knows what they are talking about and is nice enough to chime in, lets, oh I don't know, listen to them.

Edited by ebrasmus21, 05 February 2019 - 12:09 PM.

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#56 kekoa

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 01:03 PM

View PostMikekiM, on 05 February 2019 - 11:51 AM, said:

View Postleezer99, on 05 February 2019 - 05:22 AM, said:

View Postkekoa, on 18 October 2018 - 12:48 PM, said:

Good point.  I've reached out to Chris Mayson and he basically said that he only sees kids who are at least 14 and shooting in the 60's for competitive rounds.  I know there are tons of good coaches here in Socal, but I've yet to speak to them about my son.  If anyone has recommendations please PM me.

I guess he's taking new juniors now based on someone's recent post.
I've spoken with another junior that worked with Mayson as well and his biggest complaint was that he was never available for him despite agreeing to work with him.  He had a couple lessons with him but then during peak season his was traveling so much he couldn't get in to see him.  6-8 months of trying he gave up and moved on.

I could totally see that happening especially if the player is young.  With Mayson's stable of players I think you need to be really...really...really good to get his time on a consistent basis.  I'm talking high level D1 players and LPGA/PGA pros.  I heard this from the asst. coach at UCLA-  If you can't get a response from your coach within 24 hours then move on.  

RB (who is 10 yrs old) just saw Mayson on Sunday and that was after several months of coaxing and pulling some strings with friends of friends who know Mayson personally.  I understand the lesson was very good and hopefully they will be able to work together on somewhat of a consistent basis for years to come.

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#57 leezer99

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 01:54 PM

View Postkekoa, on 05 February 2019 - 01:03 PM, said:


I could totally see that happening especially if the player is young.  With Mayson's stable of players I think you need to be really...really...really good to get his time on a consistent basis.  I'm talking high level D1 players and LPGA/PGA pros.  I heard this from the asst. coach at UCLA-  If you can't get a response from your coach within 24 hours then move on.  

RB (who is 10 yrs old) just saw Mayson on Sunday and that was after several months of coaxing and pulling some strings with friends of friends who know Mayson personally.  I understand the lesson was very good and hopefully they will be able to work together on somewhat of a consistent basis for years to come.

Lets just be clear, a $500 / hr coach isn't going to teach a 10 year old anything different than a $60 / hr coach.  The benefit comes down the line when they are older.

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#58 darter79

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 02:35 PM

View Postleezer99, on 05 February 2019 - 01:54 PM, said:

View Postkekoa, on 05 February 2019 - 01:03 PM, said:

I could totally see that happening especially if the player is young.  With Mayson's stable of players I think you need to be really...really...really good to get his time on a consistent basis.  I'm talking high level D1 players and LPGA/PGA pros.  I heard this from the asst. coach at UCLA-  If you can't get a response from your coach within 24 hours then move on.  

RB (who is 10 yrs old) just saw Mayson on Sunday and that was after several months of coaxing and pulling some strings with friends of friends who know Mayson personally.  I understand the lesson was very good and hopefully they will be able to work together on somewhat of a consistent basis for years to come.

Lets just be clear, a $500 / hr coach isn't going to teach a 10 year old anything different than a $60 / hr coach.  The benefit comes down the line when they are older.

And thats how you grow your wallet not the game. Junior lessons are wayyy overpriced. Absurd how expensive some of these coaches will charge kids. $500 an hour.  I bet he learn more 10 or 5 lessons with a reasonable priced coach.

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#59 kekoa

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 02:52 PM

View Postleezer99, on 05 February 2019 - 01:54 PM, said:

View Postkekoa, on 05 February 2019 - 01:03 PM, said:

I could totally see that happening especially if the player is young.  With Mayson's stable of players I think you need to be really...really...really good to get his time on a consistent basis.  I'm talking high level D1 players and LPGA/PGA pros.  I heard this from the asst. coach at UCLA-  If you can't get a response from your coach within 24 hours then move on.  

RB (who is 10 yrs old) just saw Mayson on Sunday and that was after several months of coaxing and pulling some strings with friends of friends who know Mayson personally.  I understand the lesson was very good and hopefully they will be able to work together on somewhat of a consistent basis for years to come.

Lets just be clear, a $500 / hr coach isn't going to teach a 10 year old anything different than a $60 / hr coach.  The benefit comes down the line when they are older.

I'd agree.   I will say that is seems like Mayson went straight to the issue and gave RB some drills to work on.  Nothing major or ground breaking, but I saw the before and after vids and there was some real progress.

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#60 tiger1873

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Posted 05 February 2019 - 03:34 PM

View Postleezer99, on 05 February 2019 - 01:54 PM, said:

View Postkekoa, on 05 February 2019 - 01:03 PM, said:

I could totally see that happening especially if the player is young.  With Mayson's stable of players I think you need to be really...really...really good to get his time on a consistent basis.  I'm talking high level D1 players and LPGA/PGA pros.  I heard this from the asst. coach at UCLA-  If you can't get a response from your coach within 24 hours then move on.  

RB (who is 10 yrs old) just saw Mayson on Sunday and that was after several months of coaxing and pulling some strings with friends of friends who know Mayson personally.  I understand the lesson was very good and hopefully they will be able to work together on somewhat of a consistent basis for years to come.

Lets just be clear, a $500 / hr coach isn't going to teach a 10 year old anything different than a $60 / hr coach.  The benefit comes down the line when they are older.

Hate to say it but no one out there is probably worth $500 even for an PGA pro. The reason a famous PGA pro would pay as much as they do is for privacy and rental of the facility and team that goes along with the steep rate.

I been a few of these facilities and there a way to practice with no distractions.


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