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MD/DC/VA Golfers - Twelve Monkeys Mental Divergence


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#8161 Obee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 04:23 PM

 No Laying Up, on 10 January 2019 - 12:14 PM, said:

 2moreTerps, on 10 January 2019 - 11:34 AM, said:

 No Laying Up, on 10 January 2019 - 10:43 AM, said:

 2moreTerps, on 07 January 2019 - 09:55 AM, said:

 dcmidnight, on 07 January 2019 - 08:17 AM, said:

Q. for the guys who are reading a lot of golf architecture stuff or listening to podcasts. Lets say you read a *really* long, opinion based article with tons of uberwoke opinions about how a particular course is being "ruined" by technology. And that most players that play it seem to still love the course even though they probably arent smart enough to appreciate the course's architectural features < authors opinion tinged with my sarcasm.

Does your opinion of the article change if 3/4 of the way through it the author reveals that not only has he never played there but he's never even been there? Its essentially an "on paper" exercise - although he is perfectly happy running down people who dont agree with his very long winded opinions?

I've been slowly chopping all the golf architecture stuff off my podcast list for various reasons. i think mostly bc I can just enjoy playing certain courses without having to get into the weeds about crap like this. But this article really sort of brought home to me why I am perfectly happy tapping out on this sort of thing altogether.

well i'm not the post's target audience but i tapped out of this stuff about 4 minutes into a NLU podcast when Tron and Soly agreed that good golf courses could only be built on sandy soil. Soly said that again on the pod with Brandel and Brandel was like "that's absurd. most golf courses in the US aren't built on sandy soil and you can still enjoy the game playing those courses".

so can you post the article or just allow me to guess the course? augusta?

I'm fine with people disagreeing with things that are said on the podcast. That's what it's there for. But this representation of what was actually said on the podcast borders on parody. Never in my life have I ever said that good golf courses can only be built on sandy soil. I honestly have no clue what Tron conversation you're referring to, but that's also not at all what the conversation was like with Brandel. If you're going to disagree with something, the minimum hurdle you need to clear is to at least accurately represent what the other person is saying.

Even if you got the actual quotes right, the next step would be to consider the context of the conversation.

Episode 255 Scotland recap:
Soly "I want to hear your overarching takeaway from spending a week playing golf in scotland"
Tron "it ruined golf for me"
Soly "how so"
Tron "ahhhh. i do not want to play golf in the united states anymore"
Soly "what made it so great"
Tron "ahh. maybe more this year than others years the turf conditions were insanely good and exceptional firm and burned out"

these guys were expressing course architecture discussion/breakdown/snobbery fatigue and NLU wades into those waters. You've expressed that playing shots on the ground is more fun and that playing shots in the air is boring. You discussed the superiority of sandy soil for courses in the podcast with the austrailan course designer. i forget his name. It came up in the Brandel pod. His response to you is exactly what i'm thinking when i'm listening. My context is that i'm a guy in maryland playing two courses where we broke records for rainfall in a year. they were at best chronically soaked and at worst under water. Even if you reasonably do prefer courses where you can play on the ground and courses built on sandy soil it has felt like you guys were missing the fact that a massive % of your US audience does not, and will not, play those type of courses. I played last saturday and every ball in the fairway backed up and everything is a mud ball. it's still fun.

i'm not NLU hater either. just the opposite. I listen to most of the podcasts. I'm excited to see your upcoming version of wide world of golf thing. I watched and enjoyed strapped, etc.

This is at least closer, but again, context is key. We're prone to hyperbole, and of course Tron doesn't mean that he doesn't want to play golf in the US. We play the same soggy courses down in Florida as you guys do in Maryland (different grass types, but not anywhere close to firm and fast at some of the best places I've played). And no one said that good golf courses can only be built on sandy soil.

But it is eye opening how much more fun golf is on these types of soils. Tron had played golf his whole life, loved it, and had never played the type of golf that were lucky enough to play this summer. And it was eye opening to him how enjoyable that was. I've shared my thoughts on Scotland golf on the podcast many times before, and wanted to open it up to the rest of the group to describe their experience.

It's simply a fact that sandy soil provides the best opportunity for firm and fast conditions, and the courses that are designed around these types of conditions are the most enjoyable courses I've ever encountered. Which is a far cry from "good golf courses can only be built on sandy soil." If that was the case, there would only be golf courses on the coasts.

But playing those types of courses really does make it hard to come back home and play the aerial game all over again, (which is where we play about 98% of our annual rounds).

I played 10 rounds of golf in 12 days in Scotland and Ireland three summers ago. I, too, will never define a great golf course the same as I used to before going there....

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#8162 TheCityGame

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:13 PM

 FAbb, on 11 January 2019 - 02:35 PM, said:

Didn't he make changes after 2015 to try and get some more yardage?  And he ended up worse off in SG OTT.  Ouch.


I do believe he'll win again, including a major, or majors.  I think he's more likely to complete the career slam than Rory at this point.
what makes you think he'll win again?

Not arguing. Just wondering, because I'm totally on the fence. Maybe he snaps back into winning form. Maybe THAT was the anomoly and he fades away, or wins at the rate of, say, rickie fowler, which I would consider a disappointment.
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#8163 TheButteryCut

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:35 PM

 Obee, on 11 January 2019 - 04:09 PM, said:

 TheButteryCut, on 11 January 2019 - 03:12 PM, said:

Putting is unique in that it has the ability to bring your whole game down, both physically and mentally. If you don't think you can get the ball in the whole, no matter how well you strike it with the rest of your game, it can really wear you down and make you question everything. Knowing, or at least believing, that you have an excellent chance of making everything you look really frees up the rest of your game. Vice versa, knowing that you need to be within 3 feet to have a solid chance can really grind you down. You start to think that no matter how well I hit it, I still can't get it down.

I guess what I am trying to say is that you can have a bad driving day or ballstriking, but if you are a great putter than you will always have that chance and belief that you can salvage something. But take away one's strength and confidence, and you start to wonder what you have left to rely on when the game goes south.

Amen. I have written words like yours many times in the past to people who do not understand and/or who have never experienced the yips.

I didn't want to say it was personal experience, but I was speaking from the heart. I've never putted like Speith when he was on, but I was pretty good at one point. The last few years, especially in tournament play, I have had the tips. I'd rather have a 25 footer than a 3 footer just because I could tell myself I was supposed to make the 25 footer. You feel like the rest of your game is worthless befuddled you could hit 18 greens within 10 feet Everytime and still shoot over par. Great ballstriking becones irrelevant

Happy to say I think I've fought through it and finding some confidence. But it was mentally the weakest and most frustrated I've ever been. I can relate to him being on the edge of breaking down. You either grind through them or just accept them
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#8164 davechen

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:39 PM

 bandondunes54, on 11 January 2019 - 03:51 PM, said:

 davechen, on 11 January 2019 - 02:30 PM, said:

 bayrat88, on 11 January 2019 - 12:03 PM, said:

non-GTF: What is THDC's next job and where?

Job?  What job?  My plan is to walk the earth.

Like Caine in Kung Fu?

Exactly!

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#8165 eagle1997

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:48 PM

Polishing off this dumb bottle of Evan Williams Single Barrell tonight.  Gonna give my guy at the packy some serious side-eye next time he makes a recommendation.

Happy DTF my Bros.

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#8166 FAbb

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 07:52 PM

 TheCityGame, on 11 January 2019 - 07:13 PM, said:

 FAbb, on 11 January 2019 - 02:35 PM, said:

Didn't he make changes after 2015 to try and get some more yardage?  And he ended up worse off in SG OTT.  Ouch.


I do believe he'll win again, including a major, or majors.  I think he's more likely to complete the career slam than Rory at this point.
what makes you think he'll win again?

Not arguing. Just wondering, because I'm totally on the fence. Maybe he snaps back into winning form. Maybe THAT was the anomoly and he fades away, or wins at the rate of, say, rickie fowler, which I would consider a disappointment.

I feel it in my loins.

He's a gamer. He's won on the biggest stages. He has been a pretty elite ball striker. I think he really, really wants to get back to the top of the game.

It just feels like there's no way he's done.

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#8167 GooseHook

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 08:09 PM

 eagle1997, on 11 January 2019 - 07:48 PM, said:

Polishing off this dumb bottle of Evan Williams Single Barrell tonight.  Gonna give my guy at the packy some serious side-eye next time he makes a recommendation.

Happy DTF my Bros.

You don't like it??

I think EWSB is one of the best Bourbons for the money.
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#8168 Go_Time

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 08:13 PM

 eagle1997, on 11 January 2019 - 07:48 PM, said:

Polishing off this dumb bottle of Evan Williams Single Barrell tonight.  Gonna give my guy at the packy some serious side-eye next time he makes a recommendation.

Happy DTF my Bros.

Posted Image

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#8169 eagle1997

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 08:43 PM

He said it's just like the Four Roses Single Barrel.

In my opinion, it pales in comparison.  

Price difference is $10.  I'd happily pay that.  I think there's a reason why the FRSB was sold out and the EWSB was on sale for $22.99 (with a ton on the shelf).
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#8170 GooseHook

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 08:51 PM

For the podcasters, I have a rec if you like ultra long episodes. Dan Carlin's Hardcore History.

I'm on the second one of his five part WW1 series.

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#8171 Johnny T

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 09:17 PM

I haven't had the EWSB but it gets good reviews.  I'm sure I'll try it at some point as it's right in my wheelhouse for price.  

Old Grand Dad 114 for me tonight.  Makes a great old fashioned.
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#8172 GooseHook

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 09:22 PM

For 23 bucks I'd find it hard to rag on. That's almost down to microbrew territory.

But I'm drinking box wine tonight, so I'm not exactly living the high Life.
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#8173 eagle1997

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 09:39 PM

That probably true.  If I hadn't gotten the "it's just as good" spiel, I'd be less lathered up about it.

Anyway, it's all gone now, how bad could it be?
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#8174 Obee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 09:49 PM

Eagle Rare tonight.
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#8175 SullGolf

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 10:03 PM

Eagle Rare also describes how unique his rage is about Evan Williams.


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#8176 Johnny T

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 10:08 PM

$23 for EWSB?  I need to make a trip to MD for some booze...stuff is $33 here.


Love Eagle Rare but it's so hard to find now.
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#8177 eagle1997

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 10:14 PM

That price is only good in Montgomery County.  I'll pick you up a bottle if you like.  Liquor store is 2 mins. away and I need to go back tomorrow anyway.
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#8178 eagle1997

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 10:19 PM

 SullGolf, on 11 January 2019 - 10:03 PM, said:

Eagle Rare also describes how unique his rage is about Evan Williams.

Posted Image

Edited by eagle1997, 11 January 2019 - 10:20 PM.

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#8179 Johnny T

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 10:32 PM

 eagle1997, on 11 January 2019 - 10:14 PM, said:

That price is only good in Montgomery County.  I'll pick you up a bottle if you like.  Liquor store is 2 mins. away and I need to go back tomorrow anyway.



Can you bring it to Pinehurst?  I know you can!


(Yes, get me a bottle if it's $23)
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#8180 eagle1997

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 11:02 PM

Of course!  NP at all.  Hopefully my guy is there.  Dude is gonna be VERY confused when I rail on EWSB as I am putting another bottle on the counter for him to ring up.

I invite the awkwardness, and am in fact looking forward to it.

Any other liquor requests for PH?  

Domes, what do you want me to bring for you?

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#8181 Obee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 11:03 PM

If you love ANY 70's cheesy soft rock, please watch this and read the scrolls....

And even if you don't...

https://www.kickstar...lton?ref=drqvfr

Edited by Obee, 11 January 2019 - 11:04 PM.

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#8182 davechen

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 11:34 PM

 Obee, on 11 January 2019 - 11:03 PM, said:

If you love ANY 70's cheesy soft rock, please watch this and read the scrolls....

And even if you don't...

https://www.kickstar...lton?ref=drqvfr

Oh man!  Cheesy sounds of the 70s.  Flash back to my youth.  I ordered a CD.

Along those lines, one of my favorite albums last year was Juliana Hatfield's album of all Olivia Newton John covers.



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#8183 Obee

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Posted 11 January 2019 - 11:50 PM

"Loud rock music scared me..."
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#8184 bubbagump

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 09:27 AM

 eagle1997, on 11 January 2019 - 11:02 PM, said:

Of course!  NP at all.  Hopefully my guy is there.  Dude is gonna be VERY confused when I rail on EWSB as I am putting another bottle on the counter for him to ring up.

I invite the awkwardness, and am in fact looking forward to it.

Any other liquor requests for PH?  

Domes, what do you want me to bring for you?

Anybody try Belle Isle?
Posted Image

This one and some sparkling ginger lime ICE from harris teeter, or diet ginger ale is my jam....likely forever.  
Other flavors: Cold brew coffee, blood orange, ruby red grapefruit.

Edited by bubbagump, 12 January 2019 - 09:30 AM.

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#8185 HighBoomingDraws

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 09:37 AM

 bubbagump, on 12 January 2019 - 09:27 AM, said:

 eagle1997, on 11 January 2019 - 11:02 PM, said:

Of course!  NP at all.  Hopefully my guy is there.  Dude is gonna be VERY confused when I rail on EWSB as I am putting another bottle on the counter for him to ring up.

I invite the awkwardness, and am in fact looking forward to it.

Any other liquor requests for PH?  

Domes, what do you want me to bring for you?

Anybody try Belle Isle?
Posted Image

This one and some sparkling ginger lime ICE from harris teeter, or diet ginger ale is my jam....likely forever.  
Other flavors: Cold brew coffee, blood orange, ruby red grapefruit.

Genuinely intrigued. However, how is moonshine weaker ABV wise than bourbon or vodka?

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#8186 bubbagump

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 10:52 AM

That Iím not sure, they call it a hybrid moonshine so maybe itís different in how they make it.  However, I highly recommend it, as itís very good and been my favorite liquor for the past year.  The honey habenero hits sweet up front but finishes with spicy but not overwhelming.  The ginger mixer really works well with it too.  Plus itís 19-23 bucks depending on your abc.  Really good stuff.

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#8187 2moreTerps

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 01:27 PM

Speaking of Bourbon. Really good friend of mine opened a barbershop in Old a Ellicott City. With your haircut you get a bourbon. Haircut, shampoo, hot towel and a bourbon is pretty great on a Saturday afternoon.

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#8188 dcmidnight

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 01:53 PM

Started snowing about three hours earlier than they initially thought. Not sure what the Balto area guys are getting but I think they finally admitted it might get to a foot around here.

Posted Image

Good news is I might finally get to use the snowblower I bought two years ago.

So I'm starting to run into an issue on the liquor shelf where I have just an ounce or two left in particular bottles. Havent been sure what to do but I've just started randomly mixing them. Last weekend I had the last of a Blood Oath bourbon with the final bit of WhistlePig 10 yr rye. Actually was pretty tasty, WP gives it a little spice.
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#8189 2moreTerps

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 03:12 PM

Snow is awesome and itís January 12th so Iím not complaining. If it was March 12th? Sure. Thatíd be different. But with two days of NFL and college hoops? Seems mostly amazing to me. Iíll have some beers and enjoy it

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#8190 TheCityGame

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Posted 12 January 2019 - 03:12 PM

Nothing yet. Just finished playing timbers with domes. Fun day. We played 1 do-over per hole but you had to use it.

I was a couple under par doing that. Greens were frozen but ran well. We made a ton of feet of putts.

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