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Whats after the 140 yard PW?

Short game

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#1 Chowdah86

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:20 PM

Great news, I worked really hard on my swing this past winter and I went from being a really short hitter with an over the top swing, fighting a slice to now being realitively long, fighting a hook.  It was almost overnight.  My 9 iron used to go 120 yards (like 300 yards high), now its 150 with less effort and a more normal flight.  It seems like there is more in there too if I really let her go.  Im swinging from inside now.  This makes the game way more fun.

The problem is that my short iron game plan is all messed up now.  Clubs were spaced 10 yards apart,  120yd 9iron, 110 PW then Shots from 100 yards in were pretty simple.  I would use a Steve stricker type meathod, no wrist c0ck pitch, controlling distance by swinging chest to chest, hip to hip, shoulder to shoulder.  I had (have) those pretty well dialed in with my 50 and 56.  But there is a huge gap between those and my full swings with 9i and PW.


I should note that I have the srixon 545 irons.  These things have the jacked up lofts.  PW is really a 9 iron.  

Below are my new distances:  30 yards more than last year

??? - Driver,  still figuring this out.  The range stops at 230ish.  I carry it a bit further now and the course distances are tough to trust becuase I play a hilly course.  The driver also hooks like a bastxxx sometimes now (which is a whole different issue)

220? 3W   still sorting this out too.  Messing with three different FW woods.
200  22* hybrid
190  24* 5i
180  27* 6i
170  7i
160  8i
150  9i
140  44* PW
130   ??   What do you do here?
120   ??   What do you do here?
110   ??   What do you do here?
100  ??    What do you do here?
90   I can pick up with the no wrist c0ck wedges from here on in.  Or completely swich it all up.



So for you short game guru's with 140 yard Pitching wedges.  What do you do for 130 yards in?  Full swing your little cleveland/vokey's?  Seems like a bad idea....  just awkward.  Start cutting down your PW swing?  Grip down?  I dont like relying on touch too much do control wedge distance.  I feel like having the pre determined swing hight allows me to really commit to my wedge shots and avoid slowing and duffing/thinning it.

Edited by Chowdah86, 27 April 2018 - 01:27 PM.


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#2 SNIPERBBB

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:28 PM

48* gap wedge should be mid-hi 120 yardage for your full swing.  From there down 3/4 swings with your wedges will cover your yardages down to 70-80 yards depending on how strong your lob wedge is, if you carry one.

Edited by SNIPERBBB, 27 April 2018 - 01:50 PM.

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#3 DavePelz4

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:31 PM

We're pretty close on distance so here's the Phil n the Blanks...

130   52 degree gap wedge
120   Choked down 52 degree gap wedge
110   56 degree wedge
100  Choked down 56 degree wedge

Edited by DavePelz4, 27 April 2018 - 01:49 PM.


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#4 nochct1

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:37 PM

I would weaken the loft to 45 for the PW. Then I would have a 50, 55, 60 setup.

I would  make sure 140 is my real yardage and not my perfectly struck 140 club. I can hit it 140 w a PW, but I hardly ever do. And I would work in 3/4 shots. You should be comfortable hitting the PW from 130-140. Maybe even from 125. Then the GW gets you from 110-125 and go down from there.

You fixed your swing which is important. Now learn how to hit some shots.

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#5 tatertot

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:49 PM

 SNIPERBBB, on 27 April 2018 - 01:28 PM, said:

48* gap wedge should be mid-hi 120 yardage for your full swing.  From there down 3/4 swings with your wedges will cover your yardages down to 70-80 yards depending on how strong your love wedge is, if you carry one.

You said "love wedge" :cheesy:


And yes, I'm 12.

Driver: Adams Speedline Fast 11, 9°
Fairway: Adams Fast 10, 15*
Irons: Ping i200 3 iron, Ping iE1 4-PW
Wedges: Titleist SM7, 48º; Titleist SM5, 54º & 58º
Putter: Cleveland Classics Huntington Beach #1, 35"

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#6 golfnmudd

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:57 PM

 DavePelz4, on 27 April 2018 - 01:31 PM, said:

We're pretty close on distance so here's the Phil n the Blanks...

130   52 degree gap wedge
120   Choked down 52 degree gap wedge
110   56 degree wedge
100  Choked down 56 degree wedge


Iím definitely no guru, but this is me as well.

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#7 spiffdogxl

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 01:59 PM

I think if you are trying to take touch out of the equation, you're going to struggle immensely at anything less than full shots. All the good players I know have touch. And you get it from trying things out. I can hit a lot of clubs 120 yards -- on purpose or otherwise.

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#8 Krt22

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:04 PM

After nuking my scoring clubs for so long, I am now flighting wedges down and learning to control distance with less than full swings. You should watch how smoothly DJ hits his wedges now

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#9 tatertot

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:11 PM

I CAN hit my 8 iron 180 ... but my 180 club is my 5 iron. Big difference. Spend some time on the range figure out your 75% comfort zone.

Edited by tatertot, 27 April 2018 - 02:47 PM.

Driver: Adams Speedline Fast 11, 9°
Fairway: Adams Fast 10, 15*
Irons: Ping i200 3 iron, Ping iE1 4-PW
Wedges: Titleist SM7, 48º; Titleist SM5, 54º & 58º
Putter: Cleveland Classics Huntington Beach #1, 35"

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#10 Chowdah86

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:17 PM

 Krt22, on 27 April 2018 - 02:04 PM, said:

After nuking my scoring clubs for so long, I am now flighting wedges down and learning to control distance with less than full swings. You should watch how smoothly DJ hits his wedges now

I mean, I could go back to hitting them short in a minute.  I was just presenting a lot of loft through the ball and swinging down and across it with all my clubs.  Now, its like I compress the ball.  Trap it.  To swing from inside with a closed delofted face gives the ball no where to go and it allows it to swing easier.   Also having the club move through closer to my body makes the speed more effortless.  A real eurieka moment.  

I feel like the wedges may benefit from that old out to in path though.  Thats why were told to set up with an open stance, open face with weight preloaded on the front leg.  So we can 'slice' across it.  Make it go high, weak and floatey (like my 220 yard driver did).


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#11 RichieHunt

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:22 PM

Depends on your skill.  Personally, I got myself a Gap Wedge that had more SW properties to it.  So, I just carry a 52* and a 60* wedge.  I use the 52* a lot for full swings so it is gapped properly from my PW.  

I found that when it comes to wedges...even if I had a 56* wedge....most of my shots around the green would be with a 60* wedge.  The difficulty in this is finding a 52* that performs well out of the bunker.  I finally found one in the Miura K-Grind.

I only hit my LW about 80 yards, max.  And I don't really like taking full swings with it.  So anything from 65-120 yards I try to use my 52* wedge.  I'm pretty good with it and I've been deadly with it from 65-80 yards as I have that swing for that distance dialed in extremely well.  

You may want to try something like a 52* and a 58* instead.






RH

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#12 Chowdah86

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:26 PM

 tatertot, on 27 April 2018 - 02:11 PM, said:

I CAN hit my 8 iron 180 ... but my 180 club is my 6 iron. Big difference. Spend some time on the range figure out your 75% comfort zone.


Im telling you man.  Its like night and day.  No effort, 160 8i.  160 was my 5 iron last year.  I wasnt swinging, i was jerking and chopping. Part of what is helping it go further for me is not trying so hard.  Getting the tension out. Just swinging from inside with what feels like a 'pre closed' face.  No one ever really told me to do that, which is annoying. That and a couple other things like weight shift and keeping it outside the hands, which I was working on before.

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#13 Chowdah86

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:31 PM

 RichieHunt, on 27 April 2018 - 02:22 PM, said:

Depends on your skill.  Personally, I got myself a Gap Wedge that had more SW properties to it.  So, I just carry a 52* and a 60* wedge.  I use the 52* a lot for full swings so it is gapped properly from my PW.  

I found that when it comes to wedges...even if I had a 56* wedge....most of my shots around the green would be with a 60* wedge.  The difficulty in this is finding a 52* that performs well out of the bunker.  I finally found one in the Miura K-Grind.

I only hit my LW about 80 yards, max.  And I don't really like taking full swings with it.  So anything from 65-120 yards I try to use my 52* wedge.  I'm pretty good with it and I've been deadly with it from 65-80 yards as I have that swing for that distance dialed in extremely well.  

You may want to try something like a 52* and a 58* instead.






RH



I like this.   I really dont want a 4th wedge.   Im not joining the tour, and its nice to have fewer tools to grab.  Plus, you've got guys out there who are on tour winning with 3 wedges all the time.  And they hit their Pitching wedges (with real pitching wedge loft) 20 yards further.

Edited by Chowdah86, 27 April 2018 - 02:31 PM.


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#14 Swisstrader98

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:49 PM

Good on you for improving distance but not sure I get why youíre assuming thereís some sort of witchcraft required to figure this out.

OEMs make every possible loft so simply go to a range, take a laser gun w you and see how far each of your wedges go and where the gaps are. Done!



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#15 MPStrat

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 02:49 PM

 nochct1, on 27 April 2018 - 01:37 PM, said:

I would weaken the loft to 45 for the PW. Then I would have a 50, 55, 60 setup.
This is kind of what I do. My pitching wedge is stock 45* -- which is essentially a 9 iron. I don't think of it as a wedge at all, because it's really not. My 50 is my "pitching wedge" 54 "gap/sand wedge" 58 "shots around the green"


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#16 Chowdah86

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 03:09 PM

 Swisstrader98, on 27 April 2018 - 02:49 PM, said:

Good on you for improving distance but not sure I get why you're assuming there's some sort of witchcraft required to figure this out.

OEMs make every possible loft so simply go to a range, take a laser gun w you and see how far each of your wedges go and where the gaps are. Done!


Just curious to see what other peolpe do.  You know, like to talk about it.  Like on a forum.  Like a golf fourm.

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#17 fillwelix

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 03:24 PM

My distances sound similar to you, what I did was spend a lot of time on the range, my PW is 46*, then I go 50*, 54*, and 58*. Work on hitting different shots with the wedges, you won't have a single 80 yard club, you'll have four.
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#18 Shades234

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 05:00 PM

What kind of courses do you play most often? I found myself having a lot of shots between my PW and 56*, so I bought a gap wedge (52) and took out my 3 iron. Now I carry 48 (pw), 52, 56, 60.

If you don't want to change up the configuration of your bag, then you have to learn some different wedge shots. Think of this as a good thing. You get to learn something new because you worked hard over the off season and found a great swing that works throughout your bag.
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#19 CaddiesFault

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 05:54 PM

Hey Chowdah,

Gap control is so important in golf. It is most important with the shorter clubs, as those are your "scoring clubs". Its nice to hear someone consider this instead of trying to hit everything as far as they can. That being said, I have a 2 part answer for you:

1. im interested in the distance gap between a 45* club and a 50*. Theres no reason for those 2 clubs to have a 50 yard gap. You should be able to hit the 50* at least 110 if your pw goes 140. Either:
         a. you can hit it 110+ but are using the no wrist swing exclusively. You should then develop a 2nd swing with the 50* along with the current no wrist. One similar to the rest of your clubs.
         b. if thats not true, the you are probably playing the ball to far forward in your stance and its adding loft at impact, thus not going far enough forward.

2. Remove one of your longer clubs for another wedge. Theres no need for a 180, 190, and 200 club. Its much harder to control distance with longer clubs anyways, so ditch the 5i. On second look, it doesnt look like you have 14 clubs, so maybe just add a club that goes around 125. It doesnt matter what loft it is, it matters how far it goes.

I can bring you 2 clubs with 48* loft and you will hit them 10+ yards different due to the other characteristics of the club(shaft, swingweight, COG, length, etc). Its all about the distance it travels for you. Bring your PW and 50* to a golf store with a sim and find a club that goes a distance in between them.
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#20 oikos1

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 08:39 PM

 Chowdah86, on 27 April 2018 - 02:26 PM, said:

 tatertot, on 27 April 2018 - 02:11 PM, said:

I CAN hit my 8 iron 180 ... but my 180 club is my 6 iron. Big difference. Spend some time on the range figure out your 75% comfort zone.


Im telling you man.  Its like night and day.  No effort, 160 8i.  160 was my 5 iron last year.  I wasnt swinging, i was jerking and chopping. Part of what is helping it go further for me is not trying so hard.  Getting the tension out. Just swinging from inside with what feels like a 'pre closed' face. No one ever really told me to do that, which is annoying. That and a couple other things like weight shift and keeping it outside the hands, which I was working on before.
So you need people to tell you what to do?  And you get upset if you think they didn't?  Golf is probably not for you.


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#21 b.helts

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Posted 27 April 2018 - 08:47 PM

Nothing wrong with working in the shoulder to shoulder move with the PW and the 9 iron. Should be able to dial that in pretty quick. And fill gaps pretty tight.

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#22 dg_1983

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Posted 28 April 2018 - 01:11 AM

I'd have expected your gapping to have remained constant with any swing changes no?

For what it is worth I'd take your gapping to the next level and see where you find yourself.

3 yardage for each club. I describe these as feelings rather than trying to tell you how far to swing

flat out, everything you've got,only flushed gets you there
Stock swing, comfortable, controlled gives you a high% chance of making good contact and consistent yardage
Knock down, little educated swing

This is what my bag looks like in the shorter end

PW 135
PW 125
PW 115
AW 120
AW 110
AW 100
SW - 100
SW - 90
SW - 80
LW - 80
LW - 70
LW - 60

You can see here that I'm well covered. You can use what ever adjustment or style you want to get there like peltz or what ever but having 3 swings that just have slightly different intentions should give you all the yardage so you need

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2015 Low 2.6
2016 Low 2.1
2017 Target 1.4
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Current 0.2

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#23 sketchmcdrawski

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Posted 28 April 2018 - 09:45 AM

Club A - Club M

285 - Club A
270 - Club A or B
250 - Club A, B, or C
...
100 - Club A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, or M

you get the idea.  or maybe, you don't?

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#24 bmyles

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Posted 29 April 2018 - 07:24 PM

I would start with the 565 AW, maybe bent 1-2 degrees strong.  Would not recommend dropping all the way to 52 as your next club, 8 degrees is too much.  You could go 49, 54, and then 58-60 or something similar.  If you need to lose a club take either the 5 or 6 iron out and maybe bend the other a little.  You don't need 3 clubs to cover from 180 to 200, 2 is plenty

Edited by bmyles, 29 April 2018 - 07:24 PM.


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#25 ShortGameJunkie

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Posted 29 April 2018 - 11:42 PM

 Chowdah86, on 27 April 2018 - 01:20 PM, said:

Great news, I worked really hard on my swing this past winter and I went from being a really short hitter with an over the top swing, fighting a slice to now being realitively long, fighting a hook.  It was almost overnight.  My 9 iron used to go 120 yards (like 300 yards high), now its 150 with less effort and a more normal flight.  It seems like there is more in there too if I really let her go.  Im swinging from inside now.  This makes the game way more fun.

The problem is that my short iron game plan is all messed up now.  Clubs were spaced 10 yards apart,  120yd 9iron, 110 PW then Shots from 100 yards in were pretty simple.  I would use a Steve stricker type meathod, no wrist c0ck pitch, controlling distance by swinging chest to chest, hip to hip, shoulder to shoulder.  I had (have) those pretty well dialed in with my 50 and 56.  But there is a huge gap between those and my full swings with 9i and PW.


I should note that I have the srixon 545 irons.  These things have the jacked up lofts.  PW is really a 9 iron.  

Below are my new distances:  30 yards more than last year

??? - Driver,  still figuring this out.  The range stops at 230ish.  I carry it a bit further now and the course distances are tough to trust becuase I play a hilly course.  The driver also hooks like a bastxxx sometimes now (which is a whole different issue)

220? 3W   still sorting this out too.  Messing with three different FW woods.
200  22* hybrid
190  24* 5i
180  27* 6i
170  7i
160  8i
150  9i
140  44* PW
130   ??   What do you do here?
120   ??   What do you do here?
110   ??   What do you do here?
100  ??    What do you do here?
90   I can pick up with the no wrist c0ck wedges from here on in.  Or completely swich it all up.



So for you short game guru's with 140 yard Pitching wedges.  What do you do for 130 yards in?  Full swing your little cleveland/vokey's?  Seems like a bad idea....  just awkward.  Start cutting down your PW swing?  Grip down?  I dont like relying on touch too much do control wedge distance.  I feel like having the pre determined swing hight allows me to really commit to my wedge shots and avoid slowing and duffing/thinning it.

Couple things I would consider doing, all without knowing too much about you game. In no order

1. Go 49* GW, 54* SW and 58 or 60* wedge(whichever you prefer)

2. Weaken PW(or whole set) 1 degree weak and add 50, 54/55, 58/60.

3. Drop 5i and bend 6i 1-2* sting then add 48* GW, 52*, 56*, and 60*

Edited by ShortGameJunkie, 29 April 2018 - 11:46 PM.

Driver: 2016 M2 10.5* Fukijura pro 60 S

3wood: Tour Edge Exotics EX9 15* Matrix Ozik Red Tie S

3 hybrid: Ping G 19* Alta 70 S

4i: Mizuno JPX 900 Hot Metal C-Taper Lite S

5-GW: Mizuno JPX 900 Forged C-Taper Lite S

Wedges: Cleveland RTX-3 V-MG 54* & 60*

Putter: 2018 Newport 34Ē

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#26 ChrisNH

ChrisNH

    3 putts strictly prohibited...

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Posted 30 April 2018 - 05:30 PM

 Chowdah86, on 27 April 2018 - 01:20 PM, said:

Great news, I worked really hard on my swing this past winter and I went from being a really short hitter with an over the top swing, fighting a slice to now being realitively long, fighting a hook.  It was almost overnight.  My 9 iron used to go 120 yards (like 300 yards high), now its 150 with less effort and a more normal flight.  It seems like there is more in there too if I really let her go.  Im swinging from inside now.  This makes the game way more fun.

The problem is that my short iron game plan is all messed up now.  Clubs were spaced 10 yards apart,  120yd 9iron, 110 PW then Shots from 100 yards in were pretty simple.  I would use a Steve stricker type meathod, no wrist c0ck pitch, controlling distance by swinging chest to chest, hip to hip, shoulder to shoulder.  I had (have) those pretty well dialed in with my 50 and 56.  But there is a huge gap between those and my full swings with 9i and PW.


I should note that I have the srixon 545 irons.  These things have the jacked up lofts.  PW is really a 9 iron.  

Below are my new distances:  30 yards more than last year

??? - Driver,  still figuring this out.  The range stops at 230ish.  I carry it a bit further now and the course distances are tough to trust becuase I play a hilly course.  The driver also hooks like a bastxxx sometimes now (which is a whole different issue)

220? 3W   still sorting this out too.  Messing with three different FW woods.
200  22* hybrid
190  24* 5i
180  27* 6i
170  7i
160  8i
150  9i
140  44* PW
130   ??   What do you do here?
120   ??   What do you do here?
110   ??   What do you do here?
100  ?? What do you do here?
90   I can pick up with the no wrist c0ck wedges from here on in.  Or completely swich it all up.



So for you short game guru's with 140 yard Pitching wedges.  What do you do for 130 yards in?  Full swing your little cleveland/vokey's?  Seems like a bad idea....  just awkward.  Start cutting down your PW swing?  Grip down?  I dont like relying on touch too much do control wedge distance.  I feel like having the pre determined swing hight allows me to really commit to my wedge shots and avoid slowing and duffing/thinning it.
You get 4 wedges.  50* that carries 120ish, 54* that carries 105ish, 58* that carries 88ish and 62* that carries 75ish.  At least that's how I deal with it.  To accommodate the 4 wedges you go driver, 3w, 19* hybrid, 5iron on the top end.

Edited by ChrisNH, 30 April 2018 - 05:31 PM.

  • TaylorMade M2 9.5* Driver
  • TalorMade M2 15* 3 wood
  • Cobra F6 19* 3/4 Hybrid
  • Cobra King F6 5-PW
  • Cleveland RTX CB 2.0 50*, 54*, 58*, 62*
  • Odyssey o-works #2 putter
  • Callaway Chrome Soft Truvis (or) Vice Pro Soft

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#27 Dave D

Dave D

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Posted 01 May 2018 - 10:42 AM

 dg_1983, on 28 April 2018 - 01:11 AM, said:

I'd have expected your gapping to have remained constant with any swing changes no?

For what it is worth I'd take your gapping to the next level and see where you find yourself.

3 yardage for each club. I describe these as feelings rather than trying to tell you how far to swing

flat out, everything you've got,only flushed gets you there
Stock swing, comfortable, controlled gives you a high% chance of making good contact and consistent yardage
Knock down, little educated swing

This is what my bag looks like in the shorter end

PW 135
PW 125
PW 115
AW 120
AW 110
AW 100
SW - 100
SW - 90
SW - 80
LW - 80
LW - 70
LW - 60

You can see here that I'm well covered. You can use what ever adjustment or style you want to get there like peltz or what ever but having 3 swings that just have slightly different intentions should give you all the yardage so you need

pretty much identical for me

Edited by Dave D, 01 May 2018 - 10:42 AM.

Driver: Taylormade M2 10.5* w/ Hzrdus Black 6.0 62g
3 Wood: Taylormade M1 3HL 17* w/ Hzrdus Black 6.0 75g
2 iron: Taylormade P790 UDI w/ Hzrdus Black 6.0 85g
4 iron: Taylormade P790 w/ Project X 6.0
5 - PW: Taylormade P770 w/ Project X 6.0
Wedges: Taylormade Milled Grind 50* & 54*, Hi-Toe 58* w/ Project X 6.0
Putter: Custom Raybon Squareback 34" w/ Superstroke Mid Slim 2.0
Ball: Callaway Chrome Soft


Posted Image
Posted Image

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#28 deepred

deepred

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Posted 10 October 2018 - 11:22 AM

Interesting discussion, sad I came to it late. I decided to junk the totally matched set of clubs in favor of clubs that do specific things and to simplify what I’m doing.
I carry a low bounce 55* degree SW unless I know I’m playing a course with soft sand.
I will carry a low bounce 58* on courses with elevated or multiple tiered greens
Everything short of my PW, 130 or so, I hit the 50* or the 8i depending on the situation.
In short I have moved away from the perfect club for each shot to one or two clubs I can hit multiple shots with.
I also carry a zero offset hybrid 24* that I can hit from almost any lie and get a positive result.
Wilson Staff M3 4-GW
Cleveland Classic XL Driver
Wilson Fybrid 15*
KE4 5 wood
Maltby SW54, black
Snake Eyes SW
Ram Watson Troon Grind 58
Ram Zebra deep face, black

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#29 JonnyKrasnodar

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Posted 11 October 2018 - 08:53 PM

For the yardages 130 and down use one club (GW) and mark out initially 20-100 yards using sticks or plastic cones or something. Then it's a case of hitting shots until you are inside 10-15 foot radius of each target yardage. This will let you see what grip and length of swing and speed you need for each one.

Doing that once or twice a week will have you knowing what to do very quickly.

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#30 Golfjack

Golfjack

    Where's the distance gone?

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Posted 11 October 2018 - 10:21 PM

More wedges!  I don't mind swinging full swing wedge shots.  Also practice the 3/4, half swings a lot too for distance variations.  You'll love it when on the course you can say, yeah I know exactly how I am going to hit this distance.  Also, you can also get a set where the PW isn't so strong.  That way the wedge distances aren't so far apart.  Now that you are hitting the ball further, you have that luxury now.

TM M4 Driver 10.5
TM M4 3 wood 16
4H (22) Aeroburner TP
Mizuno MP-15 4, 5 iron, Project X LZ 6.5
Mizuno MP-5 6-PW, Project X LZ 6.5
Wedges Mizuno T7 50, 56, 60
Honma HP 1002

Alternate set:
Callaway Epic Sub Zero 9.5, Nike VR Pro 4-PW DG x100, Titleist AP2 712 DG x100 4-P, Callaway Jaws X Series CC Wedges 52 56 60, , Odyssey Arm Lock Putter, Gauge Design Eldik Putter with Superstroke Fatso 5

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