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Forget Yardage books! Allow laser rangefinders...


125 replies to this topic

#61 BNGL

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 03:33 PM

View PostAaronwilson_95, on 24 April 2018 - 08:16 AM, said:

View PostBNGL, on 23 April 2018 - 08:56 PM, said:

View PostBiggErn, on 23 April 2018 - 07:47 PM, said:

View PostBNGL, on 23 April 2018 - 07:41 PM, said:

Attachment IMG_1524530438.174369.jpg

This is from of the better college coaches in the country.

So play with a range finder is over 4.5 hours? If someone hits in another fairway I wouldn’t call use of a rangefinders reward for the golfer but for everyone playing. I can only imagine the amount of time it would take for that player to get a yardage and take their shot without a rangefinder.

I never timed it, but some days it was glacial. BUT it's the pace of play, I can't change it, i just had to do the best I could. I had (along with other top players) developed a solid mental game plan with a sports psychologist, to stay fresh and focused only when it was my turn to play.
That’s actually one of our conference events I was speaking about ^

PBA is sunshine state conference now?


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#62 SwooshLT

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 03:59 PM

View Posthighergr0und, on 24 April 2018 - 02:34 PM, said:

How would this speed up play?  With a laser, they would have to wait until the group in front exits the green then shoot the flag.  With a yardage book, the caddy will have the distance ready while the players are putting out.


Well if THIS was true, why aren't players EVER ready to hit? For guys who hit it as great as they do, 4hrs+ for a 2-some is ridiculous.......

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#63 lowndes

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 04:05 PM

I donít think the pace of play is an issue as a viewer at all.  Really doesnít affect me at all.  Also, if I was playing golf to provide for my family Iíd probably play slower than if I was just out playing with friends too.

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#64 highergr0und

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 04:47 PM

View PostSwooshLT, on 24 April 2018 - 03:59 PM, said:

View Posthighergr0und, on 24 April 2018 - 02:34 PM, said:

How would this speed up play?  With a laser, they would have to wait until the group in front exits the green then shoot the flag.  With a yardage book, the caddy will have the distance ready while the players are putting out.


Well if THIS was true, why aren't players EVER ready to hit? For guys who hit it as great as they do, 4hrs+ for a 2-some is ridiculous.......

Imagine if they didn't start the process until the green cleared?  

How come nobody mentions carts when coming up with ways to save time?

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#65 lowndes

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 06:06 PM

View Posthighergr0und, on 24 April 2018 - 04:47 PM, said:

View PostSwooshLT, on 24 April 2018 - 03:59 PM, said:

View Posthighergr0und, on 24 April 2018 - 02:34 PM, said:

How would this speed up play?  With a laser, they would have to wait until the group in front exits the green then shoot the flag.  With a yardage book, the caddy will have the distance ready while the players are putting out.


Well if THIS was true, why aren't players EVER ready to hit? For guys who hit it as great as they do, 4hrs+ for a 2-some is ridiculous.......

Imagine if they didn't start the process until the green cleared?  

How come nobody mentions carts when coming up with ways to save time?

Because carts are not really quicker - I routinely walk and play in under 3 hours.


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#66 SwooshLT

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 06:19 PM

View Postlowndes, on 24 April 2018 - 04:05 PM, said:

I donít think the pace of play is an issue as a viewer at all.  Really doesnít affect me at all.  Also, if I was playing golf to provide for my family Iíd probably play slower than if I was just out playing with friends too.

Why? To over think, over analyze,  create paralysis?  Golf is hard but simple and we'll never ready each and every time ....the Langer,  Day , Crane,  Harrington,  Holmes of the golfing set such horrible examples of pace that's it not even funny....

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#67 2putttom

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 09:02 PM

there's only two things people should do slow...ly .










.








.







.








.






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:~)







.



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#68 Aaronwilson_95

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Posted 24 April 2018 - 09:49 PM

View PostBNGL, on 24 April 2018 - 03:33 PM, said:

View PostAaronwilson_95, on 24 April 2018 - 08:16 AM, said:

View PostBNGL, on 23 April 2018 - 08:56 PM, said:

View PostBiggErn, on 23 April 2018 - 07:47 PM, said:

View PostBNGL, on 23 April 2018 - 07:41 PM, said:

Attachment IMG_1524530438.174369.jpg

This is from of the better college coaches in the country.

So play with a range finder is over 4.5 hours? If someone hits in another fairway I wouldnít call use of a rangefinders reward for the golfer but for everyone playing. I can only imagine the amount of time it would take for that player to get a yardage and take their shot without a rangefinder.

I never timed it, but some days it was glacial. BUT it's the pace of play, I can't change it, i just had to do the best I could. I had (along with other top players) developed a solid mental game plan with a sports psychologist, to stay fresh and focused only when it was my turn to play.
Thatís actually one of our conference events I was speaking about ^

PBA is sunshine state conference now?
Yes this was our second year as a full fledged member .

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#69 Sneakbox

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Posted 06 May 2018 - 10:13 AM

I'll echo the others sentiments about a laser rangefinder is great for flat holes where you can shoot the lip of a bunker...It doesn't give you the following information quickly though, which is why I make my own. www.flaghunting.com

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

I like to prepare before I play a round, especially at a tournament, so I already know (wind, etc... can influence this) before I step up to the tee box what club I'm hitting. I know its not for everyone, but yardage books are very useful and I fully believe speeding up play is more on the individual player and less on getting yardages.

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#70 MountainGoat

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Posted 06 May 2018 - 10:45 AM

My head hurts.


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#71 SwooshLT

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Posted 06 May 2018 - 10:52 AM

I can shoot trees in landing zones faster....all the adding , subtracting and double checking adds up quickly ......then to compound this are players who WAIT until it's their shot to do all of it! You literally should be completely ready if you're not 1st to hit....instead most players begin their routines adding 2-3 mins

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#72 ray9898

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Posted 06 May 2018 - 01:26 PM

Lasers won't speed up play and the PGA Tour doesn't have a problem as long as their slotted entertainment ends at Sunday 6pm EST.

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#73 SwooshLT

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Posted 06 May 2018 - 07:48 PM

View Postray9898, on 06 May 2018 - 01:26 PM, said:

Lasers won't speed up play and the PGA Tour doesn't have a problem as long as their slotted entertainment ends at Sunday 6pm EST.

Lasers certainly COULD speed up play as I've offered tons of logical information pertaining to the subject. If you've chosen not to read it, then your lost.

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#74 smeech8000

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 08:12 AM

I'll echo the sentiment that allowing rangefinders would not materially affect pace of play.  Yardage books currently offer much more information than a DMD could yield, and they are more accurate (if you've ever tried to shoot a bunker lip or spot in the fairway you know what I mean... a 3-4 yard variation is common).  Most shots into the green are targeting a particular area of the green and raw distance to the pin is not going to add much value to that calculation.

The #1 time-killer on Tour is the compulsive obsession with remarking and realigning every putt within 5' of the hole.  I understand these guys are playing for their livelihood, but there needs to be some kind of disclaimer at the outset of every broadcast because THAT phenomenon has certainly carried over to the weekend player's routine and it completely kills POP.  If I ever own a golf course I'm going to make continuous putting mandatory!  :D

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#75 dlygrisse

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 08:26 AM

View Postimakaveli, on 24 April 2018 - 07:19 AM, said:

View Postdlygrisse, on 24 April 2018 - 07:10 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Out of control?  Exaggerate much?i think what you are seeing is the TV networks showing more player/caddie conversation. They think it makes it more interesting and entertaining. Technology has helped make it possible. Also in Tigers day they couldn’t do it because he was 50 % of the coverage and 50% of what he said wasn’t family friendly.

Why exaggerating? It is indeed out of control since they indeed have no control (or they don't want to have it).

You are missing my point.  Players have been talking to caddies for a while, it's just that there wasn't a directional mic on them in the past.  Since the advent of the modern tour caddie it has been going on, in the "old days" Ben Hogan or whomever, just picked up a local caddie to "show up, keep up, and shut up" and there wasn't much talking...but that ship sailed several decades ago.

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#76 dlygrisse

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 08:31 AM

View Postlowndes, on 24 April 2018 - 04:05 PM, said:

I don't think the pace of play is an issue as a viewer at all.  Really doesn't affect me at all.  Also, if I was playing golf to provide for my family I'd probably play slower than if I was just out playing with friends too.

I agree with this as long as the TV network switches to more "action" while the player and the caddie are getting it figured out.  The entire issue is not a player/caddie issue...it's a TV network issue.  The TV networks decided it would be better TV to shoot a directional mic in the direction of JS and Greller to listen in on what is going on, now they try to eves drop on everyone.  Some people, like the OP apparently, prefer to watch golf shots being hit....which is the guys in the TV truck deciding what to show the viewers.  

I don't give a rats patootie if they allow lasers or GPS on tour or not, but lasers/not lasers, are not the issue.
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#77 imakaveli

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 08:33 AM

View Postdlygrisse, on 07 May 2018 - 08:26 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 24 April 2018 - 07:19 AM, said:

View Postdlygrisse, on 24 April 2018 - 07:10 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Out of control?  Exaggerate much?i think what you are seeing is the TV networks showing more player/caddie conversation. They think it makes it more interesting and entertaining. Technology has helped make it possible. Also in Tigers day they couldn’t do it because he was 50 % of the coverage and 50% of what he said wasn’t family friendly.

Why exaggerating? It is indeed out of control since they indeed have no control (or they don't want to have it).

You are missing my point.  Players have been talking to caddies for a while, it's just that there wasn't a directional mic on them in the past.  Since the advent of the modern tour caddie it has been going on, in the "old days" Ben Hogan or whomever, just picked up a local caddie to "show up, keep up, and shut up" and there wasn't much talking...but that ship sailed several decades ago.

So what? My answer is still the same. This is out of control.

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#78 Roadking2003

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?

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#79 hehateme2285

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 09:27 AM

They did an experiment on the web.com for a few events last year allowing range finders. It made zero difference in pace of play.
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#80 illum1na71

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 10:06 AM

Yardage books isn't the pain point.  These guys have all the data nailed down pat in their yardage books.  So, going laser won't make them any quicker.  They just need a shot clock.


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#81 imakaveli

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:03 PM

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?

As I said before, it's out of control because they have no control over time spent for a shot. You think POP is not a problem?

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#82 golfer07840

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:28 PM

View Post2putttom, on 23 April 2018 - 10:07 AM, said:

View PostFerguson, on 23 April 2018 - 08:35 AM, said:

Why would a slower round by a tour player bother someone who is not a tour player?
Is it a vicarious thing?
for some every thing has gotta be faster. 8 G phones.. 100 Mbps internet ... golf has gotta get with the times with  10 G Player speed.

Many on here feel as though you must be able to walk 18 holes in under 2.5 hours, or you're considered "slow".

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#83 knock it close

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:39 PM

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?
Because they have rules pertaining to pace of play but they choose not to enforce them, therefore it is out of control, if you aren't going to penalize guys just take it out, idgaf but if you have the rule enforce it
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#84 Roadking2003

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:40 PM

View Postimakaveli, on 07 May 2018 - 12:03 PM, said:

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?

As I said before, it's out of control because they have no control over time spent for a shot. You think POP is not a problem?

Correct.  I think POP on the tour is not a problem.  I lose no sleep over their POP.

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#85 Roadking2003

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:41 PM

View Postknock it close, on 07 May 2018 - 12:39 PM, said:

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?
Because they have rules pertaining to pace of play but they choose not to enforce them, therefore it is out of control, if you aren't going to penalize guys just take it out, idgaf but if you have the rule enforce it

I'm not sure where you get the info that supports your statement that they don't enforce the rules.


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#86 knock it close

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:46 PM

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 12:41 PM, said:

View Postknock it close, on 07 May 2018 - 12:39 PM, said:

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?
Because they have rules pertaining to pace of play but they choose not to enforce them, therefore it is out of control, if you aren't going to penalize guys just take it out, idgaf but if you have the rule enforce it

I'm not sure where you get the info that supports your statement that they don't enforce the rules.
So you're going to sit here and tell me that a 14 year old asian kid is the only person on the PGA Tour in the last 20 years to get two bad times in one round? We had Kevin Na taking 3 minutes to pull the trigger for a month on tour and not one penalty.
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#87 Roadking2003

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 12:56 PM

View Postknock it close, on 07 May 2018 - 12:46 PM, said:

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 12:41 PM, said:

View Postknock it close, on 07 May 2018 - 12:39 PM, said:

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 08:58 AM, said:

View Postimakaveli, on 23 April 2018 - 08:25 AM, said:

I would give more penalty shots, even to top/popular players. This is becoming out of control. PGA Tour needs to step up...

Why do you think it's out of control?  Why do you think POP is a problem on tour at all?
Because they have rules pertaining to pace of play but they choose not to enforce them, therefore it is out of control, if you aren't going to penalize guys just take it out, idgaf but if you have the rule enforce it

I'm not sure where you get the info that supports your statement that they don't enforce the rules.
So you're going to sit here and tell me that a 14 year old asian kid is the only person on the PGA Tour in the last 20 years to get two bad times in one round? We had Kevin Na taking 3 minutes to pull the trigger for a month on tour and not one penalty.

I'm going to sit here and tell you that you need facts supporting your statement that they don't enforce POP rules.

Do you even know the rules?  Kevin Na taking 3 minutes is not a violation of the rules unless he is already on the clock.

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#88 knock it close

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 01:09 PM

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 12:56 PM, said:



I'm going to sit here and tell you that you need facts supporting your statement that they don't enforce POP rules.

Do you even know the rules?  Kevin Na taking 3 minutes is not a violation of the rules unless he is already on the clock.
Yes I know the rules and I'm saying there is no way he should not of been on the clock and been penalized for the subsequent times. And yes I don't unfortunately have shot times becuase the PGA Tour does not publish anything all I'm saying is there is zero chance that only one person has broken the parameters in the last 23 years. Again if you don't want to enforce it just get rid of the rule I don't care
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#89 AceCatKY

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 01:49 PM

View Postknock it close, on 07 May 2018 - 01:09 PM, said:

View PostRoadking2003, on 07 May 2018 - 12:56 PM, said:

I'm going to sit here and tell you that you need facts supporting your statement that they don't enforce POP rules.

Do you even know the rules?  Kevin Na taking 3 minutes is not a violation of the rules unless he is already on the clock.
Yes I know the rules and I'm saying there is no way he should not of been on the clock and been penalized for the subsequent times. And yes I don't unfortunately have shot times becuase the PGA Tour does not publish anything all I'm saying is there is zero chance that only one person has broken the parameters in the last 23 years. Again if you don't want to enforce it just get rid of the rule I don't care

It pains me to say this as a UK guy but JB Holmes display at Torrey this year was the most egregious I've seen in a while. He took 4 minutes and 10 seconds to play his approach on the 72nd hole, ultimately laying up when he needed an eagle to tie, while his playing partners who I believe just needed a birdie were forced to wait. I understand it was the last hole of a tourney but stuff like this is happening way too much. You can turn on any telecast and see it week in and week out, usually the same suspects. PGA  Tour is not serious about enforcement of this issue; doesn't matter to me bc I am not playing but I understand PGA guys expressing frustration about it.
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#90 Roadking2003

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Posted 07 May 2018 - 02:48 PM

View Postknock it close, on 07 May 2018 - 01:09 PM, said:

Yes I know the rules and I'm saying there is no way he should not of been on the clock and been penalized for the subsequent times.

OK, let's just look at Kevin Na.  He took 3 minutes to make a shot (I assume you got this fact from a reliable source.)   But if he was not on the clock, there is no time limit.  A group only gets put on the clock when the group is out of position, usually a full hole open in front of the group.

Once a group is "on the clock", every shot of every player is timed.  If a player gets a bad time, he is warned.  If he gets a second bad time, he is penalized.

Do you know if Na's group was "on the clock"?  And if so, was this Na's first "bad time" or second "bad time"?


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