Shilgy, on 10 April 2018 - 10:09 PM, said:
mark m, on 10 April 2018 - 07:15 PM, said:
Obviously the courses are way longer. Greens seem to be getting firmer each year as well. There is a point where green speeds and firmness make for a bad golf course and a test which is not interesting to play or to watch. We are close to the max now.
Wait for Shinnecock.
From what I've read, they have really lengthened the golf course. Tips used to be 6996 and rated 74.7 - which is no longer a high rating. That would put it about 3.3 behind Bethpage, Hazeltine, Torrey, Erin Hills, etc. (which equals about 13 strokes over 4 rounds.) It sounds like it will be 7400+ par 70 - which should give it a rating around 78 before they start in on the US Open stuff they do. Hopefully this will enable them to have a fair set up. Here is a reminder of what happened last time:
A few paragraphs from that article
BETHESDA, Md. (AP) — The U.S. Open will return to Shinnecock Hills in 2018, heading back to a course that produced one of the most embarrassing final rounds in the tournament's history.
Retief Goosen won by two shots over Phil Mickelson in 2004 after a final round marred by greens that were almost too fast to play. At one point, officials had to sprinkle the seventh green simply to keep balls on the putting surface.
Ernie Els played in the final group that day and shot 80. No one broke par in the final round and the average score was 78.7.
It was widely viewed as one of the worst days for the USGA, which prides itself on setting up the toughest courses in tournament golf. Even the USGA officials conceded they lost control of the course.
"Shinnecock is a challenging course to set up, and we certainly experienced that in 2004 when we let the course get away from us the last round," USGA president Jim Hyler said Wednesday. "This has been well chronicled and discussed over the years. I will tell you that we have used this as a wholesome learning experience, and this experience led us to the development of our current setup philosophy that we use today."
So we'll see what happens this time.
Here is an article on the changes made to Shinnecock:
My original point was regarding what the PGA Tour has been doing with regard to their venues over the last 20 years.
(Not the USGA.) The scores would be much lower if they were playing the same courses from 20 years ago (under the same conditions and distances).
Edited by mark m, 11 April 2018 - 07:20 AM.