1893 replies to this topic

[The Gachet]

[okesa]

Fantastico!Big drive from Faldo on 9th,using a metal against Woosie's percy?

Great footage,thanks Gachet.

[The Gachet]

[The Gachet]

[lead]

Wonderful stuff Gachet.

This is the tournament that made me take up golf! That last iron shot is epic.
You don't have the morning play by any chance?

Also, I've read somewhere that Ian Woosnam had to qualify 5-7 times before making it on to the EuropeanTour? It's very hard to believe
considering the play he performs on the videos above:)

[The Gachet]

My 'Private Messaging System' is now working, yippee !!!

lead, yes mate I have got the morning session and will stick it up at some point later today !

[The Gachet]

lead, on 19 February 2012 - 04:43 AM, said:

You don't have the morning play by any chance?

[lead]

Thanks Gachet!

[okesa]

Thanks Gachet,what a pleasure to see this match again,fantastic play and especially memorable are the long irons that both players hit,simply awesome ball striking.

[The Gachet]

[chip75]

lead, on 19 February 2012 - 04:43 AM, said:

Also, I've read somewhere that Ian Woosnam had to qualify 5-7 times before making it on to the EuropeanTour? It's very hard to believe considering the play he performs on the videos above:)

I have memories of him mentioning a beat-up panel van, tins of beans et cetera. Not sure if I'm mixing him up with Nicky Price but didn't his career take off after he won £25, 000 of jeans? £25, 000 of jeans, that's like 8 decent pairs these days....

Looking back at the Wentworth footage I wonder if Bruce Critchley watched the video sometimes, if you look at 17 he says Faldo aims down the left and Woosie aims down the right but they're aiming in opposite sides of the fairway. Earlier he says Faldo flattens his plane on the way down causing poor shots but Sir Nick more or less always did that!

Edited by chip75, 20 February 2012 - 05:05 PM.

[The Gachet]

chip75, on 20 February 2012 - 05:01 PM, said:

Looking back at the Wentworth footage I wonder if Bruce Critchley watched the video sometimes, if you look at 17 he says Faldo aims down the left and Woosie aims down the right but they're aiming in opposite sides of the fairway. Earlier he says Faldo flattens his plane on the way down causing poor shots but Sir Nick more or less always did that!

LOL, I also wandered that too as it seems that every time Faldo has a long iron in his hands it's a one iron yet on the 36th hole it has been confirmed that it was actually in fact a two iron !?

Also his commentary is usually quite fluid and accurate but on this it was all over the place, almost like he was reading the script from somebody who doesn't know what they are talking about !?!

[okesa]

Commentators' disease....they talk for the sake of talking and never know when to shut up.The great Henry Longhurst never said anything unless it had to be said and set a benchmark that has not been equalled on the BBC...cue Hazel Irvine the walking Wikipedia of sport,possibly the greatest one book expert ever paid a ridiculous salary for always stating the bleeding obvious!Favourite is;"Just assess for the viewers what position Rory/Tiger/Roger/Ronnie ( depending on sport watched) is in and what he needs to do".
Well you don't have to be a pundit being paid £kkk's to answer a+b) Shoot a lower score than the others,c) win the next 4 sets d) win the remaining frames.Or am I an expert and didn't realise it?
Have climbed off the soapbox and returned to the sofa,rant over!

[mat562]

Yes, that one-iron confusion is the one very slightly galling thing about that footage - which is fantastic, by the way.

First there's Faldo supposedly hitting one-irons from everywhere - without one in the bag - and then Woosie's supposedly whacking away with a one-iron off the 16th, when the shiny head and ferrule show quite clearly that it isn't the faithful old Ping Eye in his mitts, but a 2 or 3-iron.

Blimey, they were happy days, they were; down at the old old Suntory. Five straight years of thrilling stuff for a youngster. Greg Norman beating Lyle in '86, and then Woosie capping his breakthrough year in '87 with a win over a very fed-up looking Lyle. And then a mesmerising Lyle/Faldo final in '88 (an extra day down there to see the final and lots of wet clothes notwithstanding) and that '89 final. Both days threw up some of the best golf I've ever seen. Woosie's form against Mark McNulty the following year, too, was sublime. He was probably striking it about as well as I ever saw him that autumn (I think it was only a couple or three months later that he waltzed around his home track in a cheeky 57 that could have been a couple or three shots better) and making it all look ridiculously easy. A swish, and away it went - with the ball seemingly on a string. He was looking confident and holing a few on the greens, too, with that little ladies' Ram Zebra with the original, very thin, blue grip on it. In between the guest house roof nearly coming off the eaves during Michael Fish's hurricane-that-wasn't (remember that oft-repeated line: "Earlier on today, someone rang the BBC and said there was a hurricane on the way. Well, if you're watching, don't worry. There isn't!") and Sandy Lyle beating David Ishii to the sound of chainsaws chopping up all the fallen trees, there was some fantastic golf during that golden stretch of October spectating with my old man.

I miss that event. It's not the same now without a big matchplay event around a classic track to cap the season. It's all 72 hole strokeplay now, some of which is not a lot more interesting than watching paint dry. Those finals made for fantastic viewing. They had everything over the years. The 1988 final was an absolute corker. You had Faldo hitting laserlike shot after laserlike shot in the final (I reckon he only missed about three shots in 35 holes) and Sandy Lyle doing his usual trick of alternately whacking balls all over the place like a 10 handicapper and then having a sniff, adjusting his cap and shooting five under for the last five holes. And the day before that final (or two days, actually, now I think about it) he put up a glorious performance against Seve in the semi-final where he gave the Maestro a dog licence on the back of a couple of approximate 64s. The following year was a corker, too, as we've been able to see from that cracking footage above. God knows what score Faldo and Woosnam shot, better ball, over the afternoon 18. With four eagles in 20 holes from Big Nick and Woosie birdieing away besides, they probably shot close to a 60 in the afternoon. On a big course like Wentworth, with proper bats and balls, it was some golf.

Ahhh. Halcyon days. How I miss that championship and the old West Course. The new one in Spain really isn't the in the same class.

Edited by mat562, 21 February 2012 - 08:14 PM.

[Staffer]

mat562, on 21 February 2012 - 07:20 AM, said:

He was looking confident and holing a few on the greens, too, with that little ladies' Ram Zebra with the blue grip on it.

I still take my zebra for a spin sometimes. Works pretty well on real slow greens, with all 4 shims in.

Didnt Faldo play Zebra for a short period? Price played it for quite some time at least.

[NHBubba5]

seems like alot of these older blade playing guys stick with blades.  Once you find a nice set of blades you never steer very far away from them i suppose..

[chip75]

Staffer, on 21 February 2012 - 01:09 PM, said:

Didn't Faldo play Zebra for a short period? Price played it for quite some time at least.

I can't remember Nick ever using a Zebra, although almost every professional back in the day has putted with one, one time or another. Price, Watson, Ray Floyd and Woosie are/were probably the biggest names to use them.

It's a shame the old Zebra still isn't around.

[mat562]

Price swapped around a bit when it came to putters, but during his purple patch c. '92-94 he was certainly bagging a Zebra for a chunk of the time. If I remember rightly, he won at Turnberry with one in the bag and, I think, again at the PGA Championship a few weeks later. A Ray Cook mallet and a Bobby Grace Fat Lady Swings were the other flatsticks in the rotation during that period, I think; post-Bullseye.

Tom Watson certainly bagged one for a time in the early '90s, Floyd had one in play for years (wasn't there a retail model patterned after Floyd's wand that was christened the '.38 Special' as a nod to the overlength - presumably 38" or so - shaft he played?) and I remember Curtis Strange bagging a black-finished Deep Face one, too, for a time in the early '90s as he was going for the U.S. Open 'three-peat' at Medinah. Greg Norman was another big name I recall having a waft with one back in the mid '80s and again in the mid '90s. As you say, Chip, it's a shame they've gone for a Burton; along, let's be honest, with Ram clubs in general. The Curse of Nick Price strikes again...

As far as Faldo's usage goes, I can't remember him using one in anger at any point, but it wouldn't surprise me if Paul fishes out a photo from somewhere. A bit like the old Taylor Made metal woods and Ping Ansers and 1 and 2-irons, every man and his dog has had one in the bag at one time or another.

Edited by mat562, 21 February 2012 - 07:57 PM.

[mat562]

NHBubba5, on 21 February 2012 - 02:00 PM, said:

Seems like a lot of these older blade-playing guys stick with blades.  Once you find a nice set of blades you never steer very far away from them i suppose..

This line set me thinking about something that someone mentioned last week. He - and, as it turned out, I too - can't recall Jose Maria Olazabal ever playing with a cavity-backed iron of any description whatsoever. There are plenty of blokes who like a nice blade and tend to stick with pretty much the same thing year after year (dare I say it, like me for example), but a set-up made up over the years exclusively of blades or musclebacks is surely pretty unusual in the modern era. I'm sure Olazabal's tinkered with all sorts of irons in his time, but I don't remember ever seeing him using a cavity-backed iron in anger at any point in the last twenty-five years. I like my blades, but fall short thanks to a season or so's play with copper Eye 2s as well as a few Ping wedges, a couple of Ping 1-irons and a few other bits and bobs at various times thrown in for good measure, but among the proper players I can't think of another top name of the last twenty or thirty years who hasn't at any point stepped out with any cavity-backed irons in the bag in tournament play. Norman played a few sets of Cobra CBs, Seve did too, and Faldo and Woosie have both bagged a set or two of cavity backs during their respective primes. Lyle always had a Ping 1-iron in the bag and also put some beryllium Eye 2s in during the mid '90s. Duval had his 962Bs. A young Tiger Woods used an Eye 2+ set and a couple of Cobra and Mizuno 1-irons. The list goes on. Not Ollie, though. Not even in the 1-iron slot. I may be wrong, but it was a throwaway remark that's had me thinking away during a quiet spell or two and which has come to mind again, now, in the absence of anything productive to do.

While I'm on the subject of 1-irons, Paul: as an off-topic aside, and as an encore to your finding of a picture of the old Maruman 600 Series metal spoon which I must admit I thought was off to a non-starter, I challenge you to find a picture of Woosie's short-lived Maruman 1-iron that he bagged for a while during the 1990 season. He ditched the old faithful Ping Eye for a Maruman one for a while; a cavity-backed job with a chrome finish and a ferrule, but with quite a chunky sole and a bit of offset to it. I saw it up-close at St Andrews and at Wentworth, but I've never ascertained what model it was, nor indeed have I ever seen a photograph of the thing. Away you go, son. Challenge Anneka...

Edited by mat562, 21 February 2012 - 08:03 PM.

[Trap Junior]

Faldo claims in his book that the adams tight lies was a brilliant invention. Yet he never played one once he stopped sponsoring them or vice versa. In 2001-2004 he had a mizuno t zoid fairway wood in the bag.  Also found it strange that he actually used a mizuno driver from 96-98. They never really made decent wooda. The streelhead T zoid was one of their best .

[rich13]

Mat.......would this be the 1-iron in question?

[The Gachet]

mat562, on 21 February 2012 - 07:55 PM, said:

While I'm on the subject of 1-irons, Paul: as an off-topic aside, and as an encore to your finding of a picture of the old Maruman 600 Series metal spoon which I must admit I thought was off to a non-starter, I challenge you to find a picture of Woosie's short-lived Maruman 1-iron that he bagged for a while during the 1990 season. He ditched the old faithful Ping Eye for a Maruman one for a while; a cavity-backed job with a chrome finish and a ferrule, but with quite a chunky sole and a bit of offset to it. I saw it up-close at St Andrews and at Wentworth, but I've never ascertained what model it was, nor indeed have I ever seen a photograph of the thing. Away you go, son. Challenge Anneka...

It has to be the one Rich posted above as that photo was taken from the 1990 Suntory World Match Play at Wentworth where you actually saw it although these are a couple of others that he used at some point too.

[The Gachet]

mat562, on 21 February 2012 - 07:55 PM, said:

Paul: as an off-topic aside, and as an encore to your finding of a picture of the old Maruman 600 Series metal spoon which I must admit I thought was off to a non-starter.

Not sure I will ever find a photo of Faldo wielding a Ram Zebra putter but in addition to that photo I posted of a Maruman 600 Series metal spoon, here is albeit rather small a shot of Woosie's actual one.

It has 13 degrees of loft, DG X100 shaft and a Golf Pride Victory grip complete with a nice bit of heavy ball striking too !  

[Staffer]

The Gachet, on 22 February 2012 - 08:00 AM, said:

Not sure I will ever find a photo of Faldo wielding a Ram Zebra putter

I suspect my memory is mixing zebra with the odyssey mallet he used in -96.

[chip75]

Maruman the Ultimate Driving Machine? Not quite but their blades looked superb. I remember the 1-iron from the only Maruman brochure I got my hands on! Good old Maruman they used to make beautiful looking clubs and with Mizuno you could probably have your pick of a handful of different blades. Was never a huge fan of their Jean Claude Van Damme steel shafts though and I'm sure a good few fishing rods were harmed making their graphite/boron shafts....

Woosie's odds and sods had pride of place in Celtic Machine hallway for a good few years.

[freddiec]

Not sure if anybody else caught the Match play tournament today on the golf channel. Faldo was talking about the old Matchplay event at Wentworth , they had to go 36 holes each match. He said there was always a period of time usually late in the 2nd round where a players mind (Including his) would go to mental mush. (M. M weren't his exact words), but said something to that effect. You could be 3 up at the turn and late in the back nine of round 2 a player could just completely loose it for a few holes because of the mental strain of playing 36. Thought that was interesting for him to say that. I always enjoy listening to Nick talk about the ol' days.

Edited by freddiec, 22 February 2012 - 10:38 PM.

[The Gachet]

[denishurley]

Only just registered tonight, but been a long-time lurker in this thread, massive Faldo fan (same birthday, only in 1984!). Sorry if I'm taking it off-topic, but does anybody else feel that the 1993 Open Championship is overlooked in terms of how it may or may not have affected Faldo's career?

He was at or near the top of his game, if he had won it would have been a third Open in four years and a fourth in seven, but instead it proved to be the only time (as far as I know) that he led a major after 54 holes and didn't win. Despite this, Dale Concannon's book gives the tournament less than a page, while Life Swings has about a page and a half but is of the 'Greg played great and what could I do?' view (and there's no doubt that Norman's final round was one of the best ever, even if he's regarded as a choker by all and sundry).

Just wondering what anybody else thinks?

[faldofan1980]

I think in his '94 book 'in search of perfection' faldo says he lost the tournament with his 3rd round of 70 (level par).  He explained the pins were in tough positions and he just didn't hole anything unlike in '92 when he broke 30 putts for the first 3 rounds.  

denishurley, on 24 February 2012 - 09:14 PM, said:

Only just registered tonight, but been a long-time lurker in this thread, massive Faldo fan (same birthday, only in 1984!). Sorry if I'm taking it off-topic, but does anybody else feel that the 1993 Open Championship is overlooked in terms of how it may or may not have affected Faldo's career?

He was at or near the top of his game, if he had won it would have been a third Open in four years and a fourth in seven, but instead it proved to be the only time (as far as I know) that he led a major after 54 holes and didn't win. Despite this, Dale Concannon's book gives the tournament less than a page, while Life Swings has about a page and a half but is of the 'Greg played great and what could I do?' view (and there's no doubt that Norman's final round was one of the best ever, even if he's regarded as a choker by all and sundry).

Just wondering what anybody else thinks?

[The Gachet]