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MEMBERS' CHOICE: What's the best driver of 2018?


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Poll: Member's Choice 2018 Drivers (1247 member(s) have cast votes)

Member's Choice 2018 Drivers

  1. Bridgestone TourB XD-3 (2 votes [0.13%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.13%

  2. Bridgestone TourB XD-5 (3 votes [0.20%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.20%

  3. Bridgestone TourB XD-7 (4 votes [0.26%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.26%

  4. Callaway Rogue (131 votes [8.56%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 8.56%

  5. Callaway Rogue Draw (13 votes [0.85%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.85%

  6. Callaway Rogue Subzero (197 votes [12.87%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 12.87%

  7. Callaway Epic Star (6 votes [0.39%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.39%

  8. Cleveland Launcher HB (6 votes [0.39%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.39%

  9. Cobra F8 (54 votes [3.53%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 3.53%

  10. Cobra F8+ (106 votes [6.92%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.92%

  11. Mizuno GT180 (7 votes [0.46%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.46%

  12. Mizuno ST180 (37 votes [2.42%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 2.42%

  13. Ping G400 (111 votes [7.25%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 7.25%

  14. Ping G400 Max (198 votes [12.93%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 12.93%

  15. Ping G400 LST (181 votes [11.82%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.82%

  16. Ping G400 SFT (16 votes [1.05%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 1.05%

  17. PXG 0811X (3 votes [0.20%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.20%

  18. PXG 0811XF (1 votes [0.07%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.07%

  19. Srixon Z565 (7 votes [0.46%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.46%

  20. Srixon Z765 (11 votes [0.72%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.72%

  21. TaylorMade M3 (129 votes [8.43%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 8.43%

  22. TaylorMade M3 440 (48 votes [3.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 3.14%

  23. TaylorMade M4 (104 votes [6.79%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 6.79%

  24. TaylorMade M4 D-Type (9 votes [0.59%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.59%

  25. Titleist 917 D2 (75 votes [4.90%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.90%

  26. Titleist 917 D3 (48 votes [3.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 3.14%

  27. Tour Edge XJ1 (1 votes [0.07%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.07%

  28. Tour Edge HL3 (1 votes [0.07%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.07%

  29. Vertical Groove Golf (6 votes [0.39%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.39%

  30. Wilson C300 (7 votes [0.46%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.46%

  31. Wilson D300 (3 votes [0.20%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.20%

  32. XXIO X (3 votes [0.20%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.20%

  33. XXIO Prime (3 votes [0.20%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 0.20%

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#91 FilOfFuture

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Posted 08 March 2018 - 12:02 AM

Spent some time getting fit the other day - looking to upgrade from my Titleist 905-S 8.5* with Graffoly BLUE stiff shaft - a club that I still pure after 12 years?

Went through all of the drivers, Epic SZ, F8+, TMs and then the G400 LST.

I was hitting my club 905-S about 285 on the monitor with a pretty high spin number (I think in the 5000s, but maybe 4000s) which the fitter was impressed with.

Epic SZ took me to about 295-305 but I didnít quite have the control with it... some big draw shots and a few blocked out right (which is normal for me hitting a natural draw)

Ping G400 LST gave me about the same distance as the SZ, but I almost could not hit it far from center... I was amazed to get about 15-20 yards more distance and cut the side spin/ distance Left/right almost out of the equation.

***From what I remember - Back spin was down to about 2200 with LST with healthy launch of ~13*

I ordered the club the same day - should have it in hand with HZRDUS 75 Yellow 6.5 (xStiff) in the next week or so


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#92 matchavez

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Posted 08 March 2018 - 02:02 AM

If you liked the G30 LST with the Tour shaft, you owe it to yourself to try the G400 LST with the KK TiNi.

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#93 AmpliFIRE

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 10:55 PM

Iíve tried them all, but nothing compares to the Rogue SZ. Long, low spin and surprisingly forgiving. Itís firmly in my bag and puts the Epic to shame IMO.
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#94 dmac4g

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Posted 10 March 2018 - 08:49 AM

Ping G400 Max has been a huge surprise to me.  I had a G400 LST and the G400 Max has matched it for launch and spin but is offering even more forgiveness.  If I miss a fairway, it sure isn't the clubs fault!

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#95 Kaexo

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Posted 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

Attached Thumbnails

  • Screenshot_20180310-212108.jpg

Edited by Kaexo, 10 March 2018 - 10:24 PM.


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#96 bladehunter

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 09:09 AM

Looks like itís the rogue subzero by a mile aye?  Not a huge surprise.
17 M1 8.7  Tour Issue Aldila Synergy Blue 70TX
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#97 Shinny2017

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 06:51 PM

 Rapatt95, on 07 February 2018 - 01:31 AM, said:

So after getting to get my hands on the demos for the new sticks, I have 3 extremely clear winners. These drivers truly separated themselves from the pack:

G400 LST Ping Tour 75s
Callaway Rogue Synergy S
Cobra F8+ Aldila NV S

The flights I had from these three were very different, but all in good ways. The G400 LST is easily the best driver I've ever hit. The thing just wanted to go straight and long. It's also the only driver I've ever hit that didn't start to slice when I started to go after it. It launched higher than any driver I've hit, but with good low spin numbers so it didn't balloon to get that high.
G400 LST Summary: high, straight, long, da best

The Callaway Rogue surprised me, honestly. I wasn't a huge fan of the epic and didn't expect much out of the Rogue. However, what I found was a driver that definitely felt better, looked better, and performed better than the epic. This driver launched much lower and spun low (1900-2200), but for some reason just stays in the air. It's just dead straight low-medium launch missiles. I've hit balls miles off the toe with this that launch around 9* with 1600rpm and the ball speed does not drop off at all despite the toe strike. With the maintaining of ball speed across the face, that terrible toe strike just ends up being another low but long bullet down the middle.
Rogue Summary: ultra forgiving missile launcher

Lastly, in third place, but by no fault of its own, the F8+. This was actually the first of these three I hit, and immediately fell in love with it. It feels amazing. Simply a wonderful driver to hit. Like the Rogue, this thing just hit absolute bullets for me. Slightly higher than the Rogue, but still much lower than the G400. Even on low hits on the face, it still felt good and spin didn't jump dramatically. Very well-balanced club that I enjoyed hitting.
F8+ Summary: Low spin bullet monster with great feel. Definitely the surprise driver along with the Rogue.

The disappointment(s): M3 & M4

Poor distance and dispersion from the M4 and a pure inability to find a weight and loft setting in the M3 that could match anything close to those top 3. I will admit, though, on heel strikes, they started more left than usual and worked back to almost dead center (twistface?). But, toe strikes were a disaster. There was no telling where they were going. Also, a good thing about the M3 & M4, I think the look and feel were greatly improved at address and impact respectively. The M3 looks amazing all around. The M4 looks ugly as sin on the bottom but address is good.

Overall:
G400 LST
Looks: 5/5
Feel: 4.5/5
Distance: 4.5/5
Forgiveness: 5/5
Total: 19/20

Rogue:
Looks: 4/5
Feel: 4/5
Distance: 5/5
Forgiveness: 5/5
Total: 18/20

F8+
Looks: 4/5
Feel: 5/5
Distance: 4.5/5
Forgiveness: 4/5
Total: 17.5/20

M3
Looks: 5/5
Feel: 4.5/5
Distance: 4/5
Forgiveness: 3/5
Total: 16.5/20

M4
Looks: 2/5
Feel: 4.5/5
Distance: 3.5/5
Forgiveness: 4/5
Total: 14/20

Overall, there are some great drivers out there right now. More than a few for the first time that I can really get on with too. Really, though, the only way to get a good point of reference on what's best is to go out and try them. What's best for me may not be best for everyone else, so definitely try everything, and don't rule anything out like I did initially.

Anyway, excited to see what drivers everyone else has been enjoying!

great write up, thx.
what was your swing speed, ball speed, carry, total distance, and distance from center?
TM R9 Tri Driver TP stiff
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#98 Shinny2017

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 07:23 PM

guys, would be great if you all posted your handicap, swing speed, ball speed, carry distance, total distance, distance off line

its great to hear you hit a club a certain way, but i would pay much more attention if your numbers are near mine.

i'm a 12 handi, 102-104 club head speed...........

thx.
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#99 Cwing

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 07:48 PM

Demo days aren’t for another 6 weeks or so. All I know is this, thus far, M4 is strighter than my Callaway Fusion.
TaylorMade Kingdom M4 9.5* Red 5S stiff Atmos
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PING G25 5-U
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#100 FlyOver

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 10:00 PM

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

Great post on the video.  I had a Callaway Rogue SZ with Hzrdus Yellow and was bombing it 300 yards (with rollout) and hitting fairways when swinging well.  After 4 rounds of play, I noticed I was missing fairways....I decided to go with the G400 Max with their stock low launch low spin shaft 60 grams shaft. I hit it 270-280 now, but more fairways.

Iím a 6-7 hdcp and SS 106-108.

Edited by FlyOver, 11 March 2018 - 10:02 PM.

Ping G400 Max 9 degrees-Ping Tour 65 stiff flex
Callaway Epic Sub Sero 15 degrees-Aldila Rogue Max stiff flex
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 19*
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 23*
Mizuno FliHi 5-6 irons-Nippon Modus 105
Mizuno  MMC 7-PW-Nippon Morus 105
Titliest Vokey SM6 Gap and Sand Wedges
Callaway PM Lob Wedge
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#101 1Mordrid1

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 10:59 PM

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I felt the Ping G400 max was a great driver, just not for me. I hit over 50 balls with different set ups and shafts with the G400 Max and my numbers were fairly consistent but just not a good match for my game. But that does not mean it is not the right driver for someone else.

But I guess what I devise from this video is completely different. I look at the inconsistencies of the data from all of his set ups.  Peak height, side spin and yds offline are all over the place. Which means that the strikes were all over the face of the club. Plus his EUREKA moment was based on one of 2 strikes with that set-up. It seems like he felt once the ball was crushed, and he got the result he wanted, that this is all the data he needs? EUREKA he found it! But from the data we saw with his other set ups, there was a very high probability that he would not replicate that EUREKA result over the next several strikes.

Then is his testing or data complete? For one look at the launch angle on the Rogue SZ compared to the G400 Max. The video shows that there was an effort to improve launch conditions with the Ping. What would the Rogue numbers look like with optimal launch conditions with that extra ball speed?

I am as guilty as the next guy of reading reviews and watching them on Youtube to try to get an initial basis of information. But I try to consider the source. And it's just my opinion but I think a single digit handicapper can definitely fit into a driver more easily and with less strikes than someone like me. Mainly because after a few strikes they can at the very least rule something out. With my inconsistencies I need a lot of strikes to really have enough comparable data. And while the guy in this video hits it well past where I do, it looks like he has a similar level of inconsistency as I do. 2 Strikes and a EUREKA moment does not seem like enough data for his level of play. I have been guilty of buying a driver because of a EUREKA moment before, and it was a hard lesson learned.
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#102 FlyOver

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Posted 11 March 2018 - 11:27 PM

 1Mordrid1, on 11 March 2018 - 10:59 PM, said:

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I felt the Ping G400 max was a great driver, just not for me. I hit over 50 balls with different set ups and shafts with the G400 Max and my numbers were fairly consistent but just not a good match for my game. But that does not mean it is not the right driver for someone else.

But I guess what I devise from this video is completely different. I look at the inconsistencies of the data from all of his set ups.  Peak height, side spin and yds offline are all over the place. Which means that the strikes were all over the face of the club. Plus his EUREKA moment was based on one of 2 strikes with that set-up. It seems like he felt once the ball was crushed, and he got the result he wanted, that this is all the data he needs? EUREKA he found it! But from the data we saw with his other set ups, there was a very high probability that he would not replicate that EUREKA result over the next several strikes.

Then is his testing or data complete? For one look at the launch angle on the Rogue SZ compared to the G400 Max. The video shows that there was an effort to improve launch conditions with the Ping. What would the Rogue numbers look like with optimal launch conditions with that extra ball speed?

I am as guilty as the next guy of reading reviews and watching them on Youtube to try to get an initial basis of information. But I try to consider the source. And it's just my opinion but I think a single digit handicapper can definitely fit into a driver more easily and with less strikes than someone like me. Mainly because after a few strikes they can at the very least rule something out. With my inconsistencies I need a lot of strikes to really have enough comparable data. And while the guy in this video hits it well past where I do, it looks like he has a similar level of inconsistency as I do. 2 Strikes and a EUREKA moment does not seem like enough data for his level of play. I have been guilty of buying a driver because of a EUREKA moment before, and it was a hard lesson learned.

Actually he hit several shots with the G400 Max at 10 degrees and already like that his dispersion was better than the Rogue SZ.  Once the fitter changed to a lower launch/spin shaft at 9 degrees.  It checked all the boxes he wanted.  

Remember they also discussd if a player always hits fairways and wants more distance...the Rogue would have been a better fit.  It all depends what a player is trying to acheive.

Edited by FlyOver, 11 March 2018 - 11:32 PM.

Ping G400 Max 9 degrees-Ping Tour 65 stiff flex
Callaway Epic Sub Sero 15 degrees-Aldila Rogue Max stiff flex
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 19*
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 23*
Mizuno FliHi 5-6 irons-Nippon Modus 105
Mizuno  MMC 7-PW-Nippon Morus 105
Titliest Vokey SM6 Gap and Sand Wedges
Callaway PM Lob Wedge
Titliest Scotty Cameron Newport 2.7 putter 34 inch or Classic Catalina putter 34 inch

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#103 Bubbtubbs

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Posted 12 March 2018 - 10:07 PM

Seems silly to make a thread like this when the season hadn't even begun yet for a lot of us.

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#104 matchavez

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 05:03 AM

 bladehunter, on 11 March 2018 - 09:09 AM, said:

Looks like itís the rogue subzero by a mile aye?  Not a huge surprise.

By a mile? Rogue combine for 22%, G400 33%. So I guess itís not so clear cut.

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#105 osubuckeyes691

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:06 AM

For those who have played both...

Is the spin of the G400 Max really that similar to the G400 LST???

May need to make the switch if so...

Callaway Rogue SubZero - HZRDUS T1100 6.5
Taylormade 2016 M2 Deep Face 14* - Tensei Blue 90TX
Titleist 818H2 - Tensei Pro White 90x
Srixon 745 4-PW - KBS C Taper 130x softstepped 1x
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#106 osubuckeyes691

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 08:03 AM

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I've never watched any youtube videos from those guys and now I'm absolutely hooked. He seems incredibly knowledgeable
Callaway Rogue SubZero - HZRDUS T1100 6.5
Taylormade 2016 M2 Deep Face 14* - Tensei Blue 90TX
Titleist 818H2 - Tensei Pro White 90x
Srixon 745 4-PW - KBS C Taper 130x softstepped 1x
Vokey 50* F Grind - KBS C Taper 130
Vokey Wedgeworks 54V grind - KBS C Taper 130
Vokey Wedgeworks 60K, low bounce - KBS C Taper 130
Evnroll 1.1 (yup...square bumpers!)

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#107 1Mordrid1

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 10:41 AM

 FlyOver, on 11 March 2018 - 11:27 PM, said:

 1Mordrid1, on 11 March 2018 - 10:59 PM, said:

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I felt the Ping G400 max was a great driver, just not for me. I hit over 50 balls with different set ups and shafts with the G400 Max and my numbers were fairly consistent but just not a good match for my game. But that does not mean it is not the right driver for someone else.

But I guess what I devise from this video is completely different. I look at the inconsistencies of the data from all of his set ups.  Peak height, side spin and yds offline are all over the place. Which means that the strikes were all over the face of the club. Plus his EUREKA moment was based on one of 2 strikes with that set-up. It seems like he felt once the ball was crushed, and he got the result he wanted, that this is all the data he needs? EUREKA he found it! But from the data we saw with his other set ups, there was a very high probability that he would not replicate that EUREKA result over the next several strikes.

Then is his testing or data complete? For one look at the launch angle on the Rogue SZ compared to the G400 Max. The video shows that there was an effort to improve launch conditions with the Ping. What would the Rogue numbers look like with optimal launch conditions with that extra ball speed?

I am as guilty as the next guy of reading reviews and watching them on Youtube to try to get an initial basis of information. But I try to consider the source. And it's just my opinion but I think a single digit handicapper can definitely fit into a driver more easily and with less strikes than someone like me. Mainly because after a few strikes they can at the very least rule something out. With my inconsistencies I need a lot of strikes to really have enough comparable data. And while the guy in this video hits it well past where I do, it looks like he has a similar level of inconsistency as I do. 2 Strikes and a EUREKA moment does not seem like enough data for his level of play. I have been guilty of buying a driver because of a EUREKA moment before, and it was a hard lesson learned.

Actually he hit several shots with the G400 Max at 10 degrees and already like that his dispersion was better than the Rogue SZ.  Once the fitter changed to a lower launch/spin shaft at 9 degrees.  It checked all the boxes he wanted.  

Remember they also discussd if a player always hits fairways and wants more distance...the Rogue would have been a better fit.  It all depends what a player is trying to acheive.

And what was the Rogue set at? 8 degrees? and lower loft generally means a wider dispersion area especially when it comes to side spin. And 2 degrees of loft is a pretty huge change. If tighter dispersion was the main concern then why have him hit a Rogue not set up with that in mind. It does not matter if the driver was a TM, Wilson, Cobra or PXG. If your main goal is to find fairways it is going to be very hard for an amateur to do so with an 8 degree loft

Edited by 1Mordrid1, 13 March 2018 - 10:43 AM.

WITB

Callaway Rogue driver w/ Oban Tour Limited 4 60
Taylormade R15 3 wood w/ Kurocage 60 tini s
Nike Sasquatch Sumo #2 & #4 hybrids w/ H Diamana s
Ping G700 5-UW AWT 2.0(1°flat, 2° weak)
Callaway Mack Daddy PM grind 56 /KBS Tour V
Callaway Mack Daddy PM grind 60/KBS Tour V
Scotty Cameron Select Fastback
Team Effort Collegiate TCU bag
Q Star Tour

17

#108 FlyOver

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 11:30 AM

 1Mordrid1, on 13 March 2018 - 10:41 AM, said:

 FlyOver, on 11 March 2018 - 11:27 PM, said:

 1Mordrid1, on 11 March 2018 - 10:59 PM, said:

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I felt the Ping G400 max was a great driver, just not for me. I hit over 50 balls with different set ups and shafts with the G400 Max and my numbers were fairly consistent but just not a good match for my game. But that does not mean it is not the right driver for someone else.

But I guess what I devise from this video is completely different. I look at the inconsistencies of the data from all of his set ups.  Peak height, side spin and yds offline are all over the place. Which means that the strikes were all over the face of the club. Plus his EUREKA moment was based on one of 2 strikes with that set-up. It seems like he felt once the ball was crushed, and he got the result he wanted, that this is all the data he needs? EUREKA he found it! But from the data we saw with his other set ups, there was a very high probability that he would not replicate that EUREKA result over the next several strikes.

Then is his testing or data complete? For one look at the launch angle on the Rogue SZ compared to the G400 Max. The video shows that there was an effort to improve launch conditions with the Ping. What would the Rogue numbers look like with optimal launch conditions with that extra ball speed?

I am as guilty as the next guy of reading reviews and watching them on Youtube to try to get an initial basis of information. But I try to consider the source. And it's just my opinion but I think a single digit handicapper can definitely fit into a driver more easily and with less strikes than someone like me. Mainly because after a few strikes they can at the very least rule something out. With my inconsistencies I need a lot of strikes to really have enough comparable data. And while the guy in this video hits it well past where I do, it looks like he has a similar level of inconsistency as I do. 2 Strikes and a EUREKA moment does not seem like enough data for his level of play. I have been guilty of buying a driver because of a EUREKA moment before, and it was a hard lesson learned.

Actually he hit several shots with the G400 Max at 10 degrees and already like that his dispersion was better than the Rogue SZ.  Once the fitter changed to a lower launch/spin shaft at 9 degrees.  It checked all the boxes he wanted.  

Remember they also discussd if a player always hits fairways and wants more distance...the Rogue would have been a better fit.  It all depends what a player is trying to acheive.

And what was the Rogue set at? 8 degrees? and lower loft generally means a wider dispersion area especially when it comes to side spin. And 2 degrees of loft is a pretty huge change. If tighter dispersion was the main concern then why have him hit a Rogue not set up with that in mind. It does not matter if the driver was a TM, Wilson, Cobra or PXG. If your main goal is to find fairways it is going to be very hard for an amateur to do so with an 8 degree loft

I think everyone here knows that lowering the loft has a higher dispersion rate.  Especially since lofting down opens the club face 2 degrees. I have played both the Rogue SZ (4 rounds and hit it many times at the range), but exchanged it for the Ping G400 Max.  I also have the TM M3.  The Rogue is NOT as forgiving as the Ping G400 Max, but the Max is also not as long.  The MOI numbers proves that...Rogue is 8700 and Max is 9900.

I know you game the Rogue SZ, but not all drivers fits a certain swing and what the player values more.  eg distance over accuaracy or vice versa and most of all confidence with the equipment they are using to play well.

Edited by FlyOver, 13 March 2018 - 11:42 AM.

Ping G400 Max 9 degrees-Ping Tour 65 stiff flex
Callaway Epic Sub Sero 15 degrees-Aldila Rogue Max stiff flex
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 19*
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 23*
Mizuno FliHi 5-6 irons-Nippon Modus 105
Mizuno  MMC 7-PW-Nippon Morus 105
Titliest Vokey SM6 Gap and Sand Wedges
Callaway PM Lob Wedge
Titliest Scotty Cameron Newport 2.7 putter 34 inch or Classic Catalina putter 34 inch

18

#109 Kaexo

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 04:07 PM

 FlyOver, on 13 March 2018 - 11:30 AM, said:

 1Mordrid1, on 13 March 2018 - 10:41 AM, said:

 FlyOver, on 11 March 2018 - 11:27 PM, said:

 1Mordrid1, on 11 March 2018 - 10:59 PM, said:

 Kaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I felt the Ping G400 max was a great driver, just not for me. I hit over 50 balls with different set ups and shafts with the G400 Max and my numbers were fairly consistent but just not a good match for my game. But that does not mean it is not the right driver for someone else.

But I guess what I devise from this video is completely different. I look at the inconsistencies of the data from all of his set ups.  Peak height, side spin and yds offline are all over the place. Which means that the strikes were all over the face of the club. Plus his EUREKA moment was based on one of 2 strikes with that set-up. It seems like he felt once the ball was crushed, and he got the result he wanted, that this is all the data he needs? EUREKA he found it! But from the data we saw with his other set ups, there was a very high probability that he would not replicate that EUREKA result over the next several strikes.

Then is his testing or data complete? For one look at the launch angle on the Rogue SZ compared to the G400 Max. The video shows that there was an effort to improve launch conditions with the Ping. What would the Rogue numbers look like with optimal launch conditions with that extra ball speed?

I am as guilty as the next guy of reading reviews and watching them on Youtube to try to get an initial basis of information. But I try to consider the source. And it's just my opinion but I think a single digit handicapper can definitely fit into a driver more easily and with less strikes than someone like me. Mainly because after a few strikes they can at the very least rule something out. With my inconsistencies I need a lot of strikes to really have enough comparable data. And while the guy in this video hits it well past where I do, it looks like he has a similar level of inconsistency as I do. 2 Strikes and a EUREKA moment does not seem like enough data for his level of play. I have been guilty of buying a driver because of a EUREKA moment before, and it was a hard lesson learned.

Actually he hit several shots with the G400 Max at 10 degrees and already like that his dispersion was better than the Rogue SZ.  Once the fitter changed to a lower launch/spin shaft at 9 degrees.  It checked all the boxes he wanted.  

Remember they also discussd if a player always hits fairways and wants more distance...the Rogue would have been a better fit.  It all depends what a player is trying to acheive.

And what was the Rogue set at? 8 degrees? and lower loft generally means a wider dispersion area especially when it comes to side spin. And 2 degrees of loft is a pretty huge change. If tighter dispersion was the main concern then why have him hit a Rogue not set up with that in mind. It does not matter if the driver was a TM, Wilson, Cobra or PXG. If your main goal is to find fairways it is going to be very hard for an amateur to do so with an 8 degree loft

I think everyone here knows that lowering the loft has a higher dispersion rate.  Especially since lofting down opens the club face 2 degrees. I have played both the Rogue SZ (4 rounds and hit it many times at the range), but exchanged it for the Ping G400 Max.  I also have the TM M3.  The Rogue is NOT as forgiving as the Ping G400 Max, but the Max is also not as long.  The MOI numbers proves that...Rogue is 8700 and Max is 9900.

I know you game the Rogue SZ, but not all drivers fits a certain swing and what the player values more.  eg distance over accuaracy or vice versa and most of all confidence with the equipment they are using to play well.

To say the G400 Max lofted down to 9/9.5 With a low spin shaft isn't as long is completely false. It's actually slightly longer due to the higher/better launch conditions for most players.

19

#110 Kaexo

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 04:09 PM

 osubuckeyes691, on 13 March 2018 - 07:06 AM, said:

For those who have played both...

Is the spin of the G400 Max really that similar to the G400 LST???

May need to make the switch if so...

I own both and game the max. I regularly see 2k-2300 spin with max with better much easier to obtain launch conditions.

I use the 70 Kuro Kage DCXT-TX tour model shaft. Great pair; Swing speed 115ish.

Edited by Kaexo, 13 March 2018 - 05:34 PM.


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#111 FlyOver

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 06:59 PM

View PostKaexo, on 13 March 2018 - 04:09 PM, said:

View Postosubuckeyes691, on 13 March 2018 - 07:06 AM, said:

For those who have played both...

Is the spin of the G400 Max really that similar to the G400 LST???

May need to make the switch if so...

I own both and game the max. I regularly see 2k-2300 spin with max with better much easier to obtain launch conditions.

I use the 70 Kuro Kage DCXT-TX tour model shaft. Great pair; Swing speed 115ish.

It all depends on the player swinging the club doesnít it?  Lots of variables to take into consideration.  

I was paired with a player yesterday and he out drove me on a few holes by 10-15 yards using a TM M3 with a Tensei Blue shaft (mid launch mid spin shaft) vs my Max w/pro tour 65.  I average 270-280 with roll out with the Max.   He probably had a 112-115 SS vs my 108 SS.  Yet, posters are saying the 2018 M lines arenít as good as the 2016/2017 lines.  All depends on the player.

I have the TM M3 with Hzrdus Black 6.0 62 gram shaft and it is longer than the Max with the stock Tour 65 shaft.  The Max is more forgiving, so I ordered a Hzrdus Black 6.0 62 gram shaft (arrives Thursday) and will compare the 2 drivers on distance using the same shafts.
Ping G400 Max 9 degrees-Ping Tour 65 stiff flex
Callaway Epic Sub Sero 15 degrees-Aldila Rogue Max stiff flex
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 19*
Titliest 818 H2 Hybrid-Tensei Blue stiff 23*
Mizuno FliHi 5-6 irons-Nippon Modus 105
Mizuno  MMC 7-PW-Nippon Morus 105
Titliest Vokey SM6 Gap and Sand Wedges
Callaway PM Lob Wedge
Titliest Scotty Cameron Newport 2.7 putter 34 inch or Classic Catalina putter 34 inch

21

#112 osubuckeyes691

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:00 PM

View PostKaexo, on 13 March 2018 - 04:09 PM, said:

View Postosubuckeyes691, on 13 March 2018 - 07:06 AM, said:

For those who have played both...

Is the spin of the G400 Max really that similar to the G400 LST???

May need to make the switch if so...

I own both and game the max. I regularly see 2k-2300 spin with max with better much easier to obtain launch conditions.

I use the 70 Kuro Kage DCXT-TX tour model shaft. Great pair; Swing speed 115ish.

That's the exact shaft I have...hmmm
Callaway Rogue SubZero - HZRDUS T1100 6.5
Taylormade 2016 M2 Deep Face 14* - Tensei Blue 90TX
Titleist 818H2 - Tensei Pro White 90x
Srixon 745 4-PW - KBS C Taper 130x softstepped 1x
Vokey 50* F Grind - KBS C Taper 130
Vokey Wedgeworks 54V grind - KBS C Taper 130
Vokey Wedgeworks 60K, low bounce - KBS C Taper 130
Evnroll 1.1 (yup...square bumpers!)

22

#113 1Mordrid1

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:02 PM

View PostFlyOver, on 13 March 2018 - 11:30 AM, said:

View Post1Mordrid1, on 13 March 2018 - 10:41 AM, said:

View PostFlyOver, on 11 March 2018 - 11:27 PM, said:

View Post1Mordrid1, on 11 March 2018 - 10:59 PM, said:

View PostKaexo, on 10 March 2018 - 10:17 PM, said:

https://youtu.be/U5st6_4CtBY

If you really want to see how good the G400 Max is. Watch till the end of the video when they crank the loft down with a low spin/low launch shaft. 340 bomb 14.2 launch 2100 spin fairway finder.

G400 Max is the top dog matched with a good shaft/loft combo. It's also likely going to win the MGS most wanted driver. You heard it here first.

The bottom two shots are the G400 Max with TPT 15 shaft set at 9 degrees.

Rogue SZ was at 8 degrees with T1100 shaft.

I felt the Ping G400 max was a great driver, just not for me. I hit over 50 balls with different set ups and shafts with the G400 Max and my numbers were fairly consistent but just not a good match for my game. But that does not mean it is not the right driver for someone else.

But I guess what I devise from this video is completely different. I look at the inconsistencies of the data from all of his set ups.  Peak height, side spin and yds offline are all over the place. Which means that the strikes were all over the face of the club. Plus his EUREKA moment was based on one of 2 strikes with that set-up. It seems like he felt once the ball was crushed, and he got the result he wanted, that this is all the data he needs? EUREKA he found it! But from the data we saw with his other set ups, there was a very high probability that he would not replicate that EUREKA result over the next several strikes.

Then is his testing or data complete? For one look at the launch angle on the Rogue SZ compared to the G400 Max. The video shows that there was an effort to improve launch conditions with the Ping. What would the Rogue numbers look like with optimal launch conditions with that extra ball speed?

I am as guilty as the next guy of reading reviews and watching them on Youtube to try to get an initial basis of information. But I try to consider the source. And it's just my opinion but I think a single digit handicapper can definitely fit into a driver more easily and with less strikes than someone like me. Mainly because after a few strikes they can at the very least rule something out. With my inconsistencies I need a lot of strikes to really have enough comparable data. And while the guy in this video hits it well past where I do, it looks like he has a similar level of inconsistency as I do. 2 Strikes and a EUREKA moment does not seem like enough data for his level of play. I have been guilty of buying a driver because of a EUREKA moment before, and it was a hard lesson learned.

Actually he hit several shots with the G400 Max at 10 degrees and already like that his dispersion was better than the Rogue SZ.  Once the fitter changed to a lower launch/spin shaft at 9 degrees.  It checked all the boxes he wanted.  

Remember they also discussd if a player always hits fairways and wants more distance...the Rogue would have been a better fit.  It all depends what a player is trying to acheive.

And what was the Rogue set at? 8 degrees? and lower loft generally means a wider dispersion area especially when it comes to side spin. And 2 degrees of loft is a pretty huge change. If tighter dispersion was the main concern then why have him hit a Rogue not set up with that in mind. It does not matter if the driver was a TM, Wilson, Cobra or PXG. If your main goal is to find fairways it is going to be very hard for an amateur to do so with an 8 degree loft

I think everyone here knows that lowering the loft has a higher dispersion rate.  Especially since lofting down opens the club face 2 degrees. I have played both the Rogue SZ (4 rounds and hit it many times at the range), but exchanged it for the Ping G400 Max.  I also have the TM M3.  The Rogue is NOT as forgiving as the Ping G400 Max, but the Max is also not as long.  The MOI numbers proves that...Rogue is 8700 and Max is 9900.

I know you game the Rogue SZ, but not all drivers fits a certain swing and what the player values more.  eg distance over accuaracy or vice versa and most of all confidence with the equipment they are using to play well.

This is why "forgiveness" is subjective. MOI is the ability to resist the face twisting at impact.......this is not an issue for me. The forgiveness that I want is more consistent ball speeds across the face, which is where the "Jailbreak" technology has excelled. My R15 430 and M1 440 killed me distance wise on off center hits, especially near the heel.

I actually don't game the Rogue SZ because the spin was too low for me, and the Ping G400 Max had the same issue for me. For me the Rogue and Epic were the best at retaining ball speed on off center strikes. On the center of the face most drivers will behave similarly for me with minor differences in ball speed.

But back to my original post, all I was trying to state is that the data was no surprise given that one driver was "open" at 8 degrees and the other started at 10 degrees. I guess to make my point more clear, I was wondering if doing a proper fitting, why would you not start both drivers off at 10 degrees, then go from there.

Edited by 1Mordrid1, 13 March 2018 - 07:08 PM.

WITB

Callaway Rogue driver w/ Oban Tour Limited 4 60
Taylormade R15 3 wood w/ Kurocage 60 tini s
Nike Sasquatch Sumo #2 & #4 hybrids w/ H Diamana s
Ping G700 5-UW AWT 2.0(1°flat, 2° weak)
Callaway Mack Daddy PM grind 56 /KBS Tour V
Callaway Mack Daddy PM grind 60/KBS Tour V
Scotty Cameron Select Fastback
Team Effort Collegiate TCU bag
Q Star Tour

23

#114 1Mordrid1

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:08 PM

View Postosubuckeyes691, on 13 March 2018 - 07:06 AM, said:

For those who have played both...

Is the spin of the G400 Max really that similar to the G400 LST???

May need to make the switch if so...

I have not hit the LST, but the G400 Max for me was spinning around 1400-1600 consistently, and was similar to my numbers with the Rogue SZ. I would have had to go to a higher launch higher spin shaft to make either of those work for me. But the G400 Max felt amazing and I found it really easy to hit a controlled right to left shape.
WITB

Callaway Rogue driver w/ Oban Tour Limited 4 60
Taylormade R15 3 wood w/ Kurocage 60 tini s
Nike Sasquatch Sumo #2 & #4 hybrids w/ H Diamana s
Ping G700 5-UW AWT 2.0(1°flat, 2° weak)
Callaway Mack Daddy PM grind 56 /KBS Tour V
Callaway Mack Daddy PM grind 60/KBS Tour V
Scotty Cameron Select Fastback
Team Effort Collegiate TCU bag
Q Star Tour

24

#115 osubuckeyes691

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:14 PM

View Post1Mordrid1, on 13 March 2018 - 07:08 PM, said:

View Postosubuckeyes691, on 13 March 2018 - 07:06 AM, said:

For those who have played both...

Is the spin of the G400 Max really that similar to the G400 LST???

May need to make the switch if so...

I have not hit the LST, but the G400 Max for me was spinning around 1400-1600 consistently, and was similar to my numbers with the Rogue SZ. I would have had to go to a higher launch higher spin shaft to make either of those work for me. But the G400 Max felt amazing and I found it really easy to hit a controlled right to left shape.

Holy smokes that's low spin!

I'm debating between a 400max head to get with my KKDC XT or trying an epic SZ with black mamba.

Anyone have any thoughts on the Callaway combo?

Callaway Rogue SubZero - HZRDUS T1100 6.5
Taylormade 2016 M2 Deep Face 14* - Tensei Blue 90TX
Titleist 818H2 - Tensei Pro White 90x
Srixon 745 4-PW - KBS C Taper 130x softstepped 1x
Vokey 50* F Grind - KBS C Taper 130
Vokey Wedgeworks 54V grind - KBS C Taper 130
Vokey Wedgeworks 60K, low bounce - KBS C Taper 130
Evnroll 1.1 (yup...square bumpers!)

25

#116 hurricanes7

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Posted 13 March 2018 - 07:35 PM

are you guys writing in this thread to be mean? im in new york and got 14 inches of snow today
DRIVER-  Callaway Rogue Oban Tour Limited 60s
3 WOOD- GBB Epic  Oban Kiyoshi Gold 75s
HYBRID-  Titleist 818 H1 19/23 Hybrid Atmos HB Tour Spec 85s
IRONS- Srixon 765/565 Nippon Modus 105s
GAP- Callaway MD4 Chrome 52 Modus 105
SAND- Callaway MD4 Chrome 54 Modus 105
LOB- Callaway MD3 Chrome 58 Modus 105
PUTTER-  Bettinardi Queen Bee #6
BALL-   Callaway Chrome Soft X

26

#117 rxk9fan

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 02:59 PM

I hit around 120 drives yesterday inside on a monitor.  I currently play a Titleist D3 with Fujikura 74 tour spec stiff and love it.  But the more I read this thread the more I convinced myself that I needed to clean out some older gear and trade for a new driver.  I just did not know if I wanted the Ping or Callaway
Tested most extensively:
Ping G400 LST with 65 tour Stiff
Callaway Rogue SZ with Evenflow blue Stiff
Cobra F8 + with Hzrd Yellow Stiff
Ping G400 with Alta CB Stiff
Taylormade M3 with Tensei stiff and 70gm X
Taylormade M4 with the Tensei stiff and 70gm X

I will keep this to basics and generalities:
Swing speed was highest with Callaway SZ at 104
Swing speed was lowest with Cobra at 95
All loft were less than 10.

Almost every shot with every shaft was a little right to left except for the Ping LST and TM3 with the X shaft.
I have a little buyers remorse this morning because I came home with something that I was not looking for, did not give me the highest swing speeds, and honestly makes little sense to my tiny brain!
The longest club for me time after time was the TM3 with Tensei white X Stiff shaft and 9.5 loft.  The best dispersion with very little draw was the same club.  The best spin numbers were produced by the same club.  I know my swing speed would not indicate to me I would want the X stiff shaft (averaged 98mph) but it averaged about 273 which was a good 6 yards past the next best average.  For some reason this combo allowed me to consistently hit the club face.

I might very well be in the market for a stiff shaft soon :-). But, I felt like after what the monitor told me I needed to give the best performer a shot.  I still have my Titleist for back up if needed.

Handicap - 7.1
SS - upper 90ís to 104

Worth noting: We were having monitor problems with 2 or 3 restarts needed.  So, who knows if the numbers are even correct.  I only hope if things were off they were off consistently with all the clubs?

Edited by rxk9fan, 14 March 2018 - 03:23 PM.

TM M3 with Motore Speeder VC 6.3 Tour Spec Stiff played at 44.5
Callaway 15 degree SZ with Yellow Hzd. stiff playing 1/2 inch short
Titleist 816 19 degree with Speeder Tour Spec Stiff
Titleist 816 23 degree with Speeder Tour Spec Stiff
TM P770's with Steelfiber shafts PW-6i
TM P790 5i
TM Milled Grind 50SB and 54LB
TM Hi Toe 60
Scotty futura 5w

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#118 bosevelt

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Posted 14 March 2018 - 03:06 PM

I gamed the Epic SZ since it came out (Rogue 65, 9.0).  Great club for me. I tend to launch it high with medium to high spin and consider driver my most confident club.  HC = 7, SS = 99.  I went into this year mostly happy with my Epic SZ but curious if anything could top it.  I was looking for at least the same distance and help with an occasional toe blast.  I thought the Rogue would be the ticket.  But I just couldn't feel comfortable with it, feeling a lot of heel strikes.  I tried it like 4 times, regular and SZ.  I tried the F8+ (great and straight but spin wasn't ideal and distance suffered).   The best fit for me, after two fitting sessions, was the Ping G400 Max.  Same launch angle, slightly less spin than the Epic SZ (crazy, right?), slightly more carry distance and very good dispersion.  If I can go from one of the least forgiving to one of the most forgiving and not lose any distance, it's a no brainer...(G400 Max, Tour 65, 8.4 degrees)
Boom! Roasted.

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#119 zbeard23

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 04:05 PM

Callaway rogue just felt so light and smooth while testing. Like hitting the sweet spot of a baseball bat, ball just pops off without any harsh feeling.

29

#120 Booker

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Posted 17 March 2018 - 05:58 PM

Cobra f8+ , great looking head, feels good, good ballspeed and spin numbers. Not quite as long as epic, rogue and m3 but does everything well. None of them could kick out my 282 Superquad. Still can't beat the ballspeed this head creates.


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