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G400 vs G400 Max driver confusion??


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#61 North Butte

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:20 AM

Welcome to the 21st century. Ping and Titleist are no longer sticking to their long time strategy of spreading out release cycles. The whole industry runs on a max-churn model now.

Everything has its drawbacks, as the man said when his mother-in-law died, and they came down upon him for the funeral expenses.

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#62 Sh00terMcgavin

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:25 AM

This thread is full of interesting comments. I bought the G400 because I like a smaller footprint and the G400 is more forgiving then any 460cc head I have ever tested. Just because tour pros game a certain club, doesn't mean you should. Your crazy to think Tony Finau is gaming an off the rack G400MAX. Maybe a 460cc profile head fits his eye better? You know it has been hotmelted to the specs he needs as you can hear it when he tees off. To all the people bashing PING, was someone holding a gun to your head when you ordered the g400? Not sure why some people feel so much entitlement like PING was suppossed to tell you of their upcoming release or something.

If you don't want to feel bashed by companies putting out new products, don't buy them.

If I bought a 2018 car, and they came out with a better one in the same model in 2018.5 with some updates, why would you be mad? Your going to say the same damn thing when the 2019's come out. Yeesh

This is one of the softest threads I have read on here and it's only 2 pages long.
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#63 moonshine

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:31 AM

@sh00ter he actually says in video...the max fit his eye like previous g series. He did not like regular club and said hits max higher.
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#64 North Butte

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:32 AM

View PostSh00terMcgavin, on 31 January 2018 - 10:25 AM, said:

This thread is full of interesting comments. I bought the G400 because I like a smaller footprint and the G400 is more forgiving then any 460cc head I have ever tested. Just because tour pros game a certain club, doesn't mean you should. Your crazy to think Tony Finau is gaming an off the rack G400MAX. Maybe a 460cc profile head fits his eye better? You know it has been hotmelted to the specs he needs as you can hear it when he tees off. To all the people bashing PING, was someone holding a gun to your head when you ordered the g400? Not sure why some people feel so much entitlement like PING was suppossed to tell you of their upcoming release or something.

If you don't want to feel bashed by companies putting out new products, don't buy them.

If I bought a 2018 car, and they came out with a better one in the same model in 2018.5 with some updates, why would you be mad? Your going to say the same damn thing when the 2019's come out. Yeesh

This is one of the softest threads I have read on here and it's only 2 pages long.

They are mad because Ping was one of the last holdout companies to stick to a 1990's style release schedule. For guys who absolutely will not play anything other than the hottest, newest, most recent model of any club Ping and Titleist were a safe haven. They could indulge their "first kid on the block" needs without buying new clubs every few months like Taylormade and Callaway fanboys do.

Now they don't have that safe haven so they'll either have to start buying drivers twice as often or else live with a year-old one that they feel is out of date. Nobody likes having something they're long accustomed to taken away from them.
Everything has its drawbacks, as the man said when his mother-in-law died, and they came down upon him for the funeral expenses.

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#65 hunter42

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:32 AM

Ping has been on an 18 month cycle for many years.  With the G30-G they released the regular version and several months later the LST was released.  Really not much different than this situation.

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#66 hunter42

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:34 AM

And they still are on an 18 month cycle...G400/G400Max  (same family)
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#67 peepee

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 10:49 AM

Anyone know the MOI figure for the g25 driver

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#68 tbowles411

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 11:38 AM

View PostNorth Butte, on 31 January 2018 - 10:20 AM, said:

Welcome to the 21st century. Ping and Titleist are no longer sticking to their long time strategy of spreading out release cycles. The whole industry runs on a max-churn model now.
Not necessarily true.  The exception of the 400 Max was the fact that they were asked by pros and the like to make a bigger head.  I'm sure marketing has a bit to do with it.  But the fact people are flipping out over a product release is funny to me.
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#69 e-man

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 11:43 AM

Honest question, do you think Ping knew about the g400 max in July 2017 when they launched the g400?  Assuming they knew about it, did they also know that it would be released within 6 months?  Last question.  Assuming the answers to both of these questions is yes, is it safe to say that they didn't make any announcements because they knew that prospective buyers would hold off on purchasing the g400 and wait until the max came out so they could compare the two and decide which worked better for them?

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#70 J13

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 11:49 AM

View Poste-man, on 31 January 2018 - 11:43 AM, said:

Honest question, do you think Ping knew about the g400 max in July 2017 when they launched the g400?  Assuming they knew about it, did they also know that it would be released within 6 months?  Last question.  Assuming the answers to both of these questions is yes, is it safe to say that they didn't make any announcements because they knew that prospective buyers would hold off on purchasing the g400 and wait until the max came out so they could compare the two and decide which worked better for them?

Teach them a lesson by not buying the Max.

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#71 Mr. Wolfe

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 11:58 AM

View Poste-man, on 31 January 2018 - 11:43 AM, said:

Honest question, do you think Ping knew about the g400 max in July 2017 when they launched the g400?  Assuming they knew about it, did they also know that it would be released within 6 months?  Last question.  Assuming the answers to both of these questions is yes, is it safe to say that they didn't make any announcements because they knew that prospective buyers would hold off on purchasing the g400 and wait until the max came out so they could compare the two and decide which worked better for them?

I am not upset with Ping, but that is exactly what they did.

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#72 Marco Colo

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 12:27 PM

View Poste-man, on 31 January 2018 - 11:43 AM, said:

Honest question, do you think Ping knew about the g400 max in July 2017 when they launched the g400?  Assuming they knew about it, did they also know that it would be released within 6 months?  Last question.  Assuming the answers to both of these questions is yes, is it safe to say that they didn't make any announcements because they knew that prospective buyers would hold off on purchasing the g400 and wait until the max came out so they could compare the two and decide which worked better for them?

I consider your points very valid and a real argument to be discussed.

Frankly I believe they knew it, maybe not January 18, but for sure before the beginning of the season. I mean, guys we are talking about engineering, designing, testing and put in mass production a product. It takes long and everything is properly planned.

The thing is that they would have killed a new product if they would have said a word.

Potentially it is true that it was going to be part of the original lineup and they had a last minute problem that delayed the G400 MAX. What to do at that point?
You cannot delay all the lineup and they delayed the launch of the MAX only, to be presented together with the G700, trying to play the max forgiveness card.

Anyhow I wouldn’t change my jewel (G400 STF 12*) with that bulky thing. But this is very personal.

Edited by Marco Colo, 31 January 2018 - 12:28 PM.


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#73 Ryan5508

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 01:22 PM

I think this is all just a great example on why you should wait to buy a new driver until its been out a few months in the spring/summer.

people get over their hommymoon phase and give real reviews and ping doesnt sneak a newer/faster/longer/more forgiving driver in.
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#74 SubaruWRX

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 01:36 PM

F this!

I bought a G2 driver brand new a while back. I was NEVER told a G400 Max would be released!!! I fully expect Ping to give me 100% trade in value based on my initial purchase price. Why wasn’t I told before I committed to the G2? This is preposterous.

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#75 th6252

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Posted 31 January 2018 - 03:26 PM

View PostSh00terMcgavin, on 31 January 2018 - 10:25 AM, said:

This thread is full of interesting comments. I bought the G400 because I like a smaller footprint and the G400 is more forgiving then any 460cc head I have ever tested. Just because tour pros game a certain club, doesn't mean you should. Your crazy to think Tony Finau is gaming an off the rack G400MAX. Maybe a 460cc profile head fits his eye better? You know it has been hotmelted to the specs he needs as you can hear it when he tees off. To all the people bashing PING, was someone holding a gun to your head when you ordered the g400? Not sure why some people feel so much entitlement like PING was suppossed to tell you of their upcoming release or something.

If you don't want to feel bashed by companies putting out new products, don't buy them.

If I bought a 2018 car, and they came out with a better one in the same model in 2018.5 with some updates, why would you be mad? Your going to say the same damn thing when the 2019's come out. Yeesh

This is one of the softest threads I have read on here and it's only 2 pages long.

Another thing to possibly consider is the marketing angle as to why Finau may be in the max.  New driver release and he's their newly signed young gun staffer...???


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#76 myspinonit

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 08:40 AM

View Postth6252, on 31 January 2018 - 03:26 PM, said:

View PostSh00terMcgavin, on 31 January 2018 - 10:25 AM, said:

This thread is full of interesting comments. I bought the G400 because I like a smaller footprint and the G400 is more forgiving then any 460cc head I have ever tested. Just because tour pros game a certain club, doesn't mean you should. Your crazy to think Tony Finau is gaming an off the rack G400MAX. Maybe a 460cc profile head fits his eye better? You know it has been hotmelted to the specs he needs as you can hear it when he tees off. To all the people bashing PING, was someone holding a gun to your head when you ordered the g400? Not sure why some people feel so much entitlement like PING was suppossed to tell you of their upcoming release or something.

If you don't want to feel bashed by companies putting out new products, don't buy them.

If I bought a 2018 car, and they came out with a better one in the same model in 2018.5 with some updates, why would you be mad? Your going to say the same damn thing when the 2019's come out. Yeesh

This is one of the softest threads I have read on here and it's only 2 pages long.

Another thing to possibly consider is the marketing angle as to why Finau may be in the max.  New driver release and he's their newly signed young gun staffer...???
Light bulb moment....it was timed for Tiger's latest comeback. Wait for the news of the switch :taunt: ...he could use the forgiveness it seems. Man, if he could just keep it in the short stuff ....
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#77 mikec3672

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 01:03 PM

View PostHedgehog, on 30 January 2018 - 03:51 AM, said:

Do you guys think Ping could do a trade in program for the G400 heads if you are better fit for the G400max? I think a lot of amateurs will be a better fit for a more forgiving driver then a less forgiving driver.


I feel a bit let down by Ping, got my 445cc G400 head late last fall when it arrived to retail stores at my location, got a 2 rounds in with it and then came winter and closed all the courses. Now I have a  2 round old driver in my bag that has already been replaced by a better product. Lets face it, 460CC option should have been offered from the get go for G400 lineup, IMO this late release was only a marketing move to counter Taylormade / Callaway at the time of their 2018 launch.

Really disappointing that Ping had to choose this route, and letting the early adopters down that tend to be the most loyal. Will look into Rogue if Ping is doing nothing to fix this situation.
It's not a BETTER product, it's a DIFFERENT product. The MAX is higher MOI (but as noted, even at 445cc, the G400 was the most forgiving MOI amongst OEM's), but with that comes higher spin. For some that will be a GOOD fit, for some NOT. And yes, even some pros are playing the MAX. For me though, I did not think that PING could top the G30, and they did, and I absolutely am over the moon on the more compact shape. So sure, go test the Max vs your 400, but it does not automatically mean it's better or will fit you.

View PostSubaruWRX, on 31 January 2018 - 01:36 PM, said:

F this!

I bought a G2 driver brand new a while back. I was NEVER told a G400 Max would be released!!! I fully expect Ping to give me 100% trade in value based on my initial purchase price. Why wasn't I told before I committed to the G2? This is preposterous.
too funny!

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#78 mikec3672

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 01:06 PM

View Poste-man, on 30 January 2018 - 11:29 PM, said:

View PostVNutz, on 30 January 2018 - 07:31 PM, said:

View PostDouble Gee, on 30 January 2018 - 02:29 PM, said:

So, let's go over again how Ping have acted so innocently.

Can we go over again how people were forced into buying something they weren't satisfied with?

They should have introduced both the standard and the max version at or about the same time so that people could get fit and have the option of choosing the best design for their game.
So now we are going to blame PING to try and keep up with Callaway and TM, the EPIC is barely a year old and here comes Rouge.....give me a break

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#79 e-man

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 01:17 PM

Why can't people just take a step back and look at this objectively.  If Ping had released the max as part of the next product cycle (e.g., the Epic and then the Rogue), we wouldn't be having this conversation.  The max is part of the g400 family and should have been released around the same time as the standard version so people could try both and pick the one that suits their game best.  And maybe the max is completely "different," but shouldn't that be up to the player to decide for him or herself?  

As for the poster who sarcastically claimed that he is mad because he had a g2 and now this came out, thanks for that, because it supports the other side's point perfectly.   Again, we're talking about product cycles here.

Now, maybe that's all changed.  Maybe product cycles are out the window.  Maybe gone are the days when you can trust that a manufacturer will stick to a product release cycle, whether it be 12, 18, 24 months, whatever.  That may be, and if so, well, lesson learned.  Move on.  But I don't think Ping's new product cycle is now going to be every 6 months.  For whatever reason, the max wasn't ready to be released at the time the standard model was released and now early adopters are being penalized to the extent that the max would have been a better fit for them.

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#80 North Butte

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 01:23 PM

Early adopters are "penalized" by initial exorbitant prices of golf equipment, no matter which brand they choose. In fact it isn't actually a "penalty" but simply the (high) price you pay for being the first on your block with the new stuff.

All you've got to do is keep your wallet in your pants for a year or so before buying and you won't be "penalized" ever again!

Everything has its drawbacks, as the man said when his mother-in-law died, and they came down upon him for the funeral expenses.

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#81 e-man

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 01:45 PM

 North Butte, on 01 February 2018 - 01:23 PM, said:

Early adopters are "penalized" by initial exorbitant prices of golf equipment, no matter which brand they choose. In fact it isn't actually a "penalty" but simply the (high) price you pay for being the first on your block with the new stuff.

All you've got to do is keep your wallet in your pants for a year or so before buying and you won't be "penalized" ever again!

True, but that penalty (the exorbitant price) is a penalty that people were willing to pay, not the penalty of the max being launched on the heels of the standard model and not being able to choose between the two.

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#82 North Butte

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 01:54 PM

Do you know the parable about the philosopher and the beautiful girl at the party?

The one that ends, "We've established exactly what you are, now we're just haggling over price"...
Everything has its drawbacks, as the man said when his mother-in-law died, and they came down upon him for the funeral expenses.

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#83 Lemonde

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 08:27 PM

This is a fascinating thread.  Here we are with the G400, released with the most forgiving MOI headcount of all time, in a sleaker and potentially faster package.  The Max comes out with only a slightly more MOI headcount that might not mean a hill of beans in the end. Yeah yeah, I get the whole "late release" thing, but that's water under the bridge now, and psychological deflation has set in.  My recommendation to the OP is find a way to test the MAX and see if there is ANY appreciable difference at all.   I won't play Ping because I hate how they look.  I should play Ping because I hit 1.5 fairways a round.  Most of my drivers I have purchased are typical 440ish player type heads because I hate most 460 cc drivers because they look too big and I feel I can't swing them faster, and I'll bet the MOI is not better than 6000 on anything I have ever played.  We are talking about a mere 500 MOI points difference perhaps between something that is 9000+ to start with!  I don't think that is much in the way of being "better".  But if psychological deflation has set in maybe there is no chance of giving the test comparison a fair shot.
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#84 SwingMan

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 08:39 PM

 North Butte, on 01 February 2018 - 01:23 PM, said:

Early adopters are "penalized" by initial exorbitant prices of golf equipment, no matter which brand they choose. In fact it isn't actually a "penalty" but simply the (high) price you pay for being the first on your block with the new stuff.

All you've got to do is keep your wallet in your pants for a year or so before buying and you won't be "penalized" ever again!

Hmmm, I can also see early adopters taking advantage of the opportunity to be the first to try the newest tech on the market. Most know the cost.
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#85 SwingMan

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Posted 01 February 2018 - 09:09 PM

 Mr. Wolfe, on 29 January 2018 - 02:29 PM, said:

Good review of the Max. I ordered one yesterday. Currently gaming a G30.

https://www.youtube....h?v=tcQXHDNztqM

Mr. Wolfe

All I heard was a bunch of drama in that review. If you think 3% more cc (460 v. 445 cc) makes that much difference, I don't know what to say. Some people just want to see 460cc. And you cannot evaluate feel/sound indoors. You must go outside where you play the game. Over the top dramatic Crossfield comments; and both men show ignorance. If you need 3% more cc with worse feel/sound, go for it. But relying on these guys? No. That was a clownish review.

See the pic in the attachment per Ping of a comparion of the outline of the G400 versus the Max.

Attached Thumbnails

  • Screen Shot 2018-02-02 at 12.43.58 AM.png

Edited by SwingMan, 02 February 2018 - 01:52 AM.

"My swing is so bad, I look like a caveman killing his lunch" - Lee Trevino

In the Bag: Ping G400/TPT Golf Series 17 LKP  ● Callaway Rogue 4, 7 wd/GD YS-6 Reloaded ● Exotics EX10 22 GD ADHY 75 ● PXG 0311 XF 5-7i, PXG 0311/Mitsubishi OT 75 8-PW,  Miura Y Grind 50, K Grind 55, 59 Nippon Pro Modus 3 105 ● Directed Force Reno ● Callaway CS, Snell MTB; Cart: Stewart Golf RS-1; Irons/Wedges built by Frank VIola @ www.aceofclubstp.com

25

#86 J13

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 09:10 AM

I don't really watch the Crossfield reviews anymore.  He just mocks everything which is bizarre to me.

Edited by J13, 02 February 2018 - 09:10 AM.

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#87 North Butte

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 09:20 AM

 J13, on 02 February 2018 - 09:10 AM, said:

I don't really watch the Crossfield reviews anymore.  He just mocks everything which is bizarre to me.

He's a clown using golf equipment as props.

Remember the old TV sketch comedy show In Living Color? They had a frequent segment featuring two of "movie reviewers" called Men On Film. Crossfield is a "reviewer" in the same sense as Damon Wayans and David Alan Grier's "Blaine and Antoine".
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#88 Hedgehog

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 10:35 AM

https://youtu.be/HaVczyaCQYo

Looks to me like the performance is pretty identical, the other one is just more forgiving. If you want to go with less forgiving, now you have the option :dntknw:

Mark is not that bad, hes just making fun of the nonsense marketing that these companies use.

Can't wait for Ricks take on the Max, he has been testing the Max for a while now. Hes new review format is great.
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#89 SwingMan

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 10:58 AM

 Hedgehog, on 02 February 2018 - 10:35 AM, said:

https://youtu.be/HaVczyaCQYo

Looks to me like the performance is pretty identical, the other one is just more forgiving. If you want to go with less forgiving, now you have the option :dntknw:

Mark is not that bad, hes just making fun of the nonsense marketing that these companies use.

Can't wait for Ricks take on the Max, he has been testing the Max for a while now. Hes new review format is great.

Yes, I know, 3% more volume makes a world of difference. :crazy2:  Look at Ping's own pic above. If you have played the G400, do you really feel any twisting or instability? Doubt it. Like we've said, if you feel like you need it, at the sacrifice of some feel/sound, go for it. But let's not kid ourselves about Crossfield and Friends.

It was an amateurish "review", not even a review. Just two guys acting like they've had one too many Guiness.

Edited by SwingMan, 02 February 2018 - 10:58 AM.

"My swing is so bad, I look like a caveman killing his lunch" - Lee Trevino

In the Bag: Ping G400/TPT Golf Series 17 LKP  ● Callaway Rogue 4, 7 wd/GD YS-6 Reloaded ● Exotics EX10 22 GD ADHY 75 ● PXG 0311 XF 5-7i, PXG 0311/Mitsubishi OT 75 8-PW,  Miura Y Grind 50, K Grind 55, 59 Nippon Pro Modus 3 105 ● Directed Force Reno ● Callaway CS, Snell MTB; Cart: Stewart Golf RS-1; Irons/Wedges built by Frank VIola @ www.aceofclubstp.com

29

#90 Mr. Wolfe

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Posted 02 February 2018 - 11:15 AM

 SwingMan, on 01 February 2018 - 09:09 PM, said:

 Mr. Wolfe, on 29 January 2018 - 02:29 PM, said:

Good review of the Max. I ordered one yesterday. Currently gaming a G30.

https://www.youtube....h?v=tcQXHDNztqM

Mr. Wolfe

All I heard was a bunch of drama in that review. If you think 3% more cc (460 v. 445 cc) makes that much difference, I don't know what to say. Some people just want to see 460cc. And you cannot evaluate feel/sound indoors. You must go outside where you play the game. Over the top dramatic Crossfield comments; and both men show ignorance. If you need 3% more cc with worse feel/sound, go for it. But relying on these guys? No. That was a clownish review.

See the pic in the attachment per Ping of a comparion of the outline of the G400 versus the Max.

Who the hell said I was "relying on those guys"? If there is one thing I learned about golf, it is the little things that make the club right for someone. I am a big fan of Ping drivers - love my G30. I just wish it was bigger. Most certainly prefer a 460 over a 445 head. It slows my swing speed down, is more forgiving, and I prefer the way it looks at address.

If you don't like Crossfield, watch any other review of the G400 vs. Max. Let me guess, you have a G400 driver.

Mr. Wolfe

Edited by Mr. Wolfe, 02 February 2018 - 11:16 AM.


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