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Wedges...best mid bounce grind with heel relief?


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#1 RainShadow

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 09:46 AM

I seem to have a problem especially with my 58* RTX 3 (2dot) catching the heel when using it for finesse shots.
If I swing it full (65-70yrds) itís better, but by looking at the grass/dirt stains on the sole, Iím still catching heel.
Is this a lie problem or grind issue?
Doesnít happen with my 54* RTX 3 ( standard lie ), nor with the rest of my clubs, which are 1* upright, including the 50*GW.
Should I bend the 58 upright a little or should I be looking for a different sole grind?

Mods feel free to move this to the club builders forum if need be....

Edited by RainShadow, 12 January 2018 - 09:51 AM.

GBB Epic 10.5 (11.5) Fuji Pro 62   Back to the speeder 661
XHot 15* and 19*
Apex Hybrid  23 & 26 Kuro Kage stiff
Srixon Z765 6-GW Modus 105 stiff
RTX 3 54 and 58
Bettinardi BB1/ 2016 Bettinardi Tiki / MXM Versa #1
Chrome Soft/ KSig/ FG Tour

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#2 Bye

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 09:52 AM

View PostRainShadow, on 12 January 2018 - 09:46 AM, said:

I seem to have a problem especially with my 58* RTX 3 (2dot) catching the heel when using it for finesse shots.
If I swing it full (65-70yrds) it’s better, but by looking at the grass/dirt stains on the sole, I’m still catching heel.
Is this a lie problem or grind issue?
Doesn’t happen with my 54* RTX 3 ( standard lie ), nor with the rest of my clubs, which are 1* upright, including the 50*GW.
Should I bend the 58 upright a little or should I be looking for a different sole grind?

The heel of the club digging in is a too upright lie problem. Maybe have it bent 1 degree flat and see how you go. I had my 56 and 60 bent 1 degree up because I use softer shafts and I had the toe digging in.
Taylormade 2017 M1 8.5 - Aldila Rogue Silver 70g X
Titleist 915F 17.25 - Diamana Whiteboard D+ 80g X
Titleist 716CB 3-9 - X100
Vokey 46.08, 50.08 - X100
Vokey 56S, 60M - S300
Scotty Cameron Newport 2.5 Studio Stainless
Titleist Pro V1

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#3 Z1ggy16

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 09:57 AM

Depeds on your technique when you flop or open the face. If you lower your hands... you effectively change the lie angle of the club.

Mid bounce with heel relief, only thing coming to mind off the top of my head would be either a Taylormade MG wedge in std bounce, or perhaps a vokey M that you bend weak.

Also, I hear the new X grind on the MD4 is going to have heel and toe relief, but come with a wide sole which is effectively add bounce.
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DR - '16 M2 Speeder Evo II 661
3W - F8 2KXV Blue 70
3i - JPX 850 Tensei Blue 80 (U65 on rotation)
Irons - P790 4i Modus 105, 5-PW Modus 120
Wedges - Trusty Tour 50/8 54/10 60/6 Modus Wedge 115
P - Odyssey WHP #7
Ball - ProV1 or Project (a)
Cobra Ultralight Bag

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#4 North Butte

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 10:00 AM

The heel is relieved nicely on the MD Forged wedges but it's not quite what I'd consider "mid" in terms of effective bounce. There's plenty of bounce angle but the overall sole plays a bit narrow because of the grind.

I do agree that flattening your wedges a couple degrees can be a miracle worker on heel-digging issues. My irons are pretty darned upright (Ping yellow dot) but i do with a 63-degree lie on my wedges and can't remember the last time I caught the heel.

There is a certain amount of heel relief on the Mizuno T7's which play with more effective bounce IMHO than the MD Forged. But not a lot of heel relief and it probably does require a fairly flat lie to be safe.
Everything has its drawbacks, as the man said when his mother-in-law died, and they came down upon him for the funeral expenses.

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#5 RainShadow

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 10:25 AM

View PostZ1ggy16, on 12 January 2018 - 09:57 AM, said:

Depeds on your technique when you flop or open the face. If you lower your hands... you effectively change the lie angle of the club.

Mid bounce with heel relief, only thing coming to mind off the top of my head would be either a Taylormade MG wedge in std bounce, or perhaps a vokey M that you bend weak.

Also, I hear the new X grind on the MD4 is going to have heel and toe relief, but come with a wide sole which is effectively add bounce.
More bounce probably wouldnít hurt me, I could adjust.
I definitely drop my hands a bit,( miss is toward the toe) but when I lift them a bit, I hit Center face, I donít have the ability to play the same shots, it seems.

Maybe my technique needs work, but my old MD2 TG didnít catch heel like this.....

Edited by RainShadow, 12 January 2018 - 10:35 AM.

GBB Epic 10.5 (11.5) Fuji Pro 62   Back to the speeder 661
XHot 15* and 19*
Apex Hybrid  23 & 26 Kuro Kage stiff
Srixon Z765 6-GW Modus 105 stiff
RTX 3 54 and 58
Bettinardi BB1/ 2016 Bettinardi Tiki / MXM Versa #1
Chrome Soft/ KSig/ FG Tour

5

#6 trackcoach13

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 10:42 AM

I use the Wilson FG Tour PMP 56-11 Tour Grind for this reason and love it.

Attached Thumbnails

  • s-l225.jpg

Edited by trackcoach13, 12 January 2018 - 10:43 AM.

Driver: Cobra F8 w/ Aldila NV 2KXV Green 65 Stiff
3W: Titleist 917F2 w/Fujikura Speeder Pro Tour Spec 84 Stiff
2/3H: Cobra Amp Cell set to 3+ or 2I: Srixon Z U65 18 Degree w/Miyazaki Kaula 7s
Irons: Wilson FG Tour v6 4-GW   DG S300 AMT
Wedges: 56/11 and 60/09 Wilson FG Tour PMP Raw Tour Grind w/KBS Tour Hi Rev
Putter: Scotty Cameron Select Newport 2

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#7 Z1ggy16

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 11:21 AM

View PostRainShadow, on 12 January 2018 - 10:25 AM, said:

View PostZ1ggy16, on 12 January 2018 - 09:57 AM, said:

Depeds on your technique when you flop or open the face. If you lower your hands... you effectively change the lie angle of the club.

Mid bounce with heel relief, only thing coming to mind off the top of my head would be either a Taylormade MG wedge in std bounce, or perhaps a vokey M that you bend weak.

Also, I hear the new X grind on the MD4 is going to have heel and toe relief, but come with a wide sole which is effectively add bounce.
More bounce probably wouldn't hurt me, I could adjust.
I definitely drop my hands a bit,( miss is toward the toe) but when I lift them a bit, I hit Center face, I don't have the ability to play the same shots, it seems.

Maybe my technique needs work, but my old MD2 TG didn't catch heel like this.....
Well the TG has a fairly thin sole and plenty of heel and toe relief. Only thing similar is M grind, but it comes in only bounce of 8*. When you lower the hands you shallow the swing out anyway, so on these shots you may be fine with just a regular M grind or similar.
WITB
DR - '16 M2 Speeder Evo II 661
3W - F8 2KXV Blue 70
3i - JPX 850 Tensei Blue 80 (U65 on rotation)
Irons - P790 4i Modus 105, 5-PW Modus 120
Wedges - Trusty Tour 50/8 54/10 60/6 Modus Wedge 115
P - Odyssey WHP #7
Ball - ProV1 or Project (a)
Cobra Ultralight Bag

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#8 Quadra

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 11:36 AM

Have tried a Nike Engage Toe Sweep?

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#9 AmAgain

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Posted 12 January 2018 - 09:00 PM

Have you had the lie angles checked?  When my RTX came in the lie angle was close to 66, it was ordered 1 flat.  Check that first, if it checks out, try a little flatter.  I have always played my 60 a bit flat.  Last thing I want is the heel digging around the green.

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#10 RainShadow

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 10:53 PM

View PostAmAgain, on 12 January 2018 - 09:00 PM, said:

Have you had the lie angles checked?  When my RTX came in the lie angle was close to 66, it was ordered 1 flat.  Check that first, if it checks out, try a little flatter.  I have always played my 60 a bit flat.  Last thing I want is the heel digging around the green.
Had it bent 1* flatter.....now hitting center face very consistently, distance control is back to normal.
It's a miracle! Lol
May have to re assess my other clubs as well....

Edited by RainShadow, 14 January 2018 - 12:04 PM.

GBB Epic 10.5 (11.5) Fuji Pro 62   Back to the speeder 661
XHot 15* and 19*
Apex Hybrid  23 & 26 Kuro Kage stiff
Srixon Z765 6-GW Modus 105 stiff
RTX 3 54 and 58
Bettinardi BB1/ 2016 Bettinardi Tiki / MXM Versa #1
Chrome Soft/ KSig/ FG Tour

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#11 ChipNRun

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 11:57 PM

The Callaway XForged wedges from circa 2008 offered a C-grind, with metal sole relief for both toe and heel.
XForgedCgrind.jpg
C-grind has become almost a generic term, and several wedge makers now offer this sole type (although sometimes under different names).

Edited by ChipNRun, 14 January 2018 - 01:03 PM.

What's In The Bag *...

Driver:  Calla XR16 Pro 10.5° (set open) / Fuji Evolution II TS Speeder 665 R-flex 63 gr.
FWs: Tour Edge XRail 4W + 7W / GraphiteDesign G60 R-flex 60 gr.
  or Calla Alpha 815, set 16° + 20° / Fuji Motore Speeder 665 R-flex 62 gr.
Hybrid:  Cobra FlyZ 3H 19° + 4H 22° / Matrix VLCT Altus Lite flex 73 gr.
Irons: Calla X20 Tour 4i-9i / NS Pro 8950GH R-flex 97 gr.
Wedge:  Calla MD3 48°/8.SS + 54°/12.WS - KBS Tour R-flex 110 gr. |

   MD.PM 60°/10 - KBS TourV-W 125 gr.

Putter:   Ping B60 / 34" w. Winn ProX 1.8 grip
Bag:      Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag
Ball:    Calla SuperSoft
   * Either 7W or 3H left out, depending on course.

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#12 RainShadow

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Posted 24 January 2018 - 09:53 AM

View PostChipNRun, on 13 January 2018 - 11:57 PM, said:

The Callaway XForged wedges from circa 2008 offered a C-grind, with metal sole relief for both toe and heel.
Attachment XForgedCgrind.jpg
C-grind has become almost a generic term, and several wedge makers now offer this sole type (although sometimes under different names).
Played them for a couple of years. Great wedges, probably best grind for my game at the time. Played them with PX flighted 5.5 shafts.
Played softer conditions in the PNW and never had a diging issue. They did chew up balls, though.
GBB Epic 10.5 (11.5) Fuji Pro 62   Back to the speeder 661
XHot 15* and 19*
Apex Hybrid  23 & 26 Kuro Kage stiff
Srixon Z765 6-GW Modus 105 stiff
RTX 3 54 and 58
Bettinardi BB1/ 2016 Bettinardi Tiki / MXM Versa #1
Chrome Soft/ KSig/ FG Tour

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