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Played w. an 11-yr Old Ringer


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#61 QEight

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 01:50 AM

View PostBeerPerHole, on 06 December 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 05 December 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 04 December 2017 - 08:32 PM, said:

I don't understand the angst here on this. Perhaps my use of the word "ringer" triggers some.

So why did you use that word?
...Probably the strangest comment I've ever seen in a thread I've started. It's possible people have a different definition of that word(?)

But if you are the only one using your definition in this thread, you should not be that surprised of the responses.

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#62 Noles

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 08:35 AM

View PostQEight, on 08 December 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 06 December 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 05 December 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 04 December 2017 - 08:32 PM, said:

I don't understand the angst here on this. Perhaps my use of the word "ringer" triggers some.

So why did you use that word?
...Probably the strangest comment I've ever seen in a thread I've started. It's possible people have a different definition of that word(?)

But if you are the only one using your definition in this thread, you should not be that surprised of the responses.
He's not though.  And the people giving him a hard time about it need to get the rod out of their a**.  It was obvious what the OP meant, unless you are just looking to argue or nitpick.

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#63 CTgolf

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 09:00 AM

it's all subjective I guess

when the initial response to someone who "has a national rank that's low, in the teens" (presumably referring to finish in world championships?) is that he is "above average" it should immediately give a sense as to paradigm of thought, and at that point probably best just to end the discussion

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#64 heavy_hitter

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 10:15 AM

View PostCTgolf, on 08 December 2017 - 09:00 AM, said:

it's all subjective I guess

when the initial response to someone who "has a national rank that's low, in the teens" (presumably referring to finish in world championships?) is that he is "above average" it should immediately give a sense as to paradigm of thought, and at that point probably best just to end the discussion

Every time you post it becomes more obvious that you don't understand junior golf.

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#65 CTgolf

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 10:17 AM

View Postheavy_hitter, on 08 December 2017 - 10:15 AM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 08 December 2017 - 09:00 AM, said:

it's all subjective I guess

when the initial response to someone who "has a national rank that's low, in the teens" (presumably referring to finish in world championships?) is that he is "above average" it should immediately give a sense as to paradigm of thought, and at that point probably best just to end the discussion

Every time you post it becomes more obvious that you don't understand junior golf.

we can't all be experts - many are just 'above average'


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#66 Nevergolfpar

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 10:29 AM

View Postheavy_hitter, on 05 December 2017 - 04:41 PM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 05 December 2017 - 04:17 PM, said:

View Postheavy_hitter, on 05 December 2017 - 02:09 PM, said:

As a general thumb
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It isn’t a long drive competition.  You have to put the ball in the hole.  

One of the problems with youth sports in this country is parents trying to put kids into college on athletic prowess at an early age.  I don’t understand people trying to equate the success of 11 year olds with moving them on to college.  Just let them have fun and play.  If it happens it happens.

Driving the ball 280 at 14 or shooting -4 at 11 doesn’t hive anyone the chance of playing college golf.  You don’t know their swing, you don’t know their disposition on the course, you don’t know their grades.  

Why can’t kids play youth sports without labeling them as college prospects?

Thanks HH

I would argue simple economics (scarce resources - be it time, money or both - so need to allocate them as best possible) could be one reason people are trying to project forward

If your son had two passions that he enjoyed equally, yet one had the potential to help him in the future (by helping in college admissions, getting a scholarship, or even professional aspirations) and the other was merely a “nice hobby” he enjoyed, perhaps you would be more willing to invest *your* time and money in helping him to pursue the former?

At 7-12 years old?  That is nuts.  13-14 then maybe.  15 -18 for sure.  You do realize that the money it takes to play junior golf would pay for college on its own?  Especially on the male side of golf where there is very little money.  4.5 scholarships per 10+ man teams for D1.  DII gets 3.6 and can only offer at most to each kid 50%.  High school male golfers have a 1.8% chance of playing D1 golf.  

Athletics are not a good investment for college. Youth athletics are NOT about going to college.  Those that think it is are living vicariously through their kids.

There may not be a truer statement I have ever read on these boards than what heavy_hitter stated above.  Although still a Junior, my son will end his college career receiving 76% of his college paid for in 'scholarship' at a D1 university.  This will translate to approximately $76,000 in real tuition and expenses covered by the university.  I also estimate that on average (less when he was younger, more as he got older) I spent about $6,200 per year on his golf and golf related expenses since he was 3 years old.    This translate to an estimated $93,000 (even writing this, I would take the over).  

This would result in a net loss of $17,000 on paper, if I viewed my 'investment' in him as a college savings plan (I did not).  A negative return on ROI by any measure.

To be fair, I would estimate that my son has received many benefits playing for his university as well--tournaments I could never have afforded had I had to pay for them.  Benefits which are saving me thousands of dollars.  Clothes, golf balls, travel expenses, golf course access, range balls, etc..., which I estimate to be about $1,000 per tournament he has played in.  He will have played in about 64 tournaments (he has played them all) by the time he graduates.  So on top of the scholarship it is fair to say, he will receive an additional $64,000 of value from the university.  A valid argument would be, that my investment of $93,000 has actually netted him $140,000 ($76K in tuition + $64K perks) in rewards.  

The final determinant on whether college golf could be considered a smart investment would be to factor in how much my investment of $93,000 would be worth his freshman year of college, had I invested it instead the day he started playing golf (3 years old).  I will use the S&P 500 as a barometer.  Quick math would suggest that I would have accumulated about $223,200 over that time period.  ARGH!!!!!  

The evidence is clear and Heavy is right.  Playing golf is not an investment opportunity for you to invest in your child.  If you do, you will lose 100% of the time.  By my calculation, even with my son's college is 76% paid for (top 10% of all D1 college golfers in terms of percentage), I am out an estimated $130,000 net.  He will have to play on the PGA tour for me to make it into the black!  For me the PGA tour has never been the goal, though maybe it should be. LOL

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#67 Noles

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 10:50 AM

the average golfer does not break 100.  So what does the average junior shoot?

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#68 CTgolf

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 10:51 AM

View PostNoles, on 08 December 2017 - 10:50 AM, said:

the average golfer does not break 100.  So what does the average junior shoot?

to be precise, #1 in the world is also "above average", by definition

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#69 Noles

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 11:39 AM

View PostCTgolf, on 08 December 2017 - 10:51 AM, said:

View PostNoles, on 08 December 2017 - 10:50 AM, said:

the average golfer does not break 100.  So what does the average junior shoot?

to be precise, #1 in the world is also "above average", by definition
Then he and I have something in common.

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#70 8thehardway

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 12:36 PM

View Postjoey2aces, on 07 December 2017 - 09:39 AM, said:

what makes him a ringer? I guess I don't get that part. I was waiting for a betting story.... :dntknw:

ETA: and no... there are no other definitions or meanings to the word except for horseshoes, a crowbar, marbles and a dude with a bell.

In the context of the post, and used by an admiring adult I took it to mean that based his age/appearance the kid would be able to hustle a lot of money from the grown-up golfers the OP has played with if he turned to the dark side.  Secondarily, it reflected the OP's own surprise encountering someone so young with such skill.

I've seen babies hit tee shots of 5 to 10 yards with inferior, plastic equipment and told their parents 'your kid's a ringer' and they just smiled.

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#71 TheFatTick

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 02:06 PM

This thread is hilarious.



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#72 XYB34A

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 02:24 PM

i hate to say it, but this is soundling like a Lavar Ball conversation.

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#73 CTgolf

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 02:33 PM

View Postjustaman5, on 08 December 2017 - 02:24 PM, said:

i hate to say it, but this is soundling like a Lavar Ball conversation.

WHO?

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#74 BeerPerHole

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 03:13 PM

View PostQEight, on 08 December 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 06 December 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 05 December 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 04 December 2017 - 08:32 PM, said:

I don't understand the angst here on this. Perhaps my use of the word "ringer" triggers some.

So why did you use that word?
...Probably the strangest comment I've ever seen in a thread I've started. It's possible people have a different definition of that word(?)

But if you are the only one using your definition in this thread, you should not be that surprised of the responses.
OK

Honestly, guys...I'm surprised at the drama in this thread. Are we all getting a little sensitive with the holiday season or something? It's not big deal, really. If I play a round with a kid who's 11 years old 4'9" and played the best golf I've ever had in my foursome I thought it'd be worth mentioning. But, this is getting weird.
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#75 wildcatden

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 03:21 PM

View PostBeerPerHole, on 08 December 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 08 December 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 06 December 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 05 December 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 04 December 2017 - 08:32 PM, said:

I don't understand the angst here on this. Perhaps my use of the word "ringer" triggers some.

So why did you use that word?
...Probably the strangest comment I've ever seen in a thread I've started. It's possible people have a different definition of that word(?)

But if you are the only one using your definition in this thread, you should not be that surprised of the responses.
OK

Honestly, guys...I'm surprised at the drama in this thread. Are we all getting a little sensitive with the holiday season or something? It's not big deal, really. If I play a round with a kid who's 11 years old 4'9" and played the best golf I've ever had in my foursome I thought it'd be worth mentioning. But, this is getting weird.

So you are saying things are getting supernatural (adjective: weird; comparative adjective: weirder; superlative adjective: weirdest 1. suggesting something supernatural;)?

Surely you meant strange?  (adjective: strange; comparative adjective: stranger; superlative adjective: strangest 1.unusual or surprising in a way that is unsettling or hard to understand.)

Please GolfWRX'ers, let us all be careful with our adjectives!!!!!!!!!!  ;)


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#76 leezer99

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 03:59 PM

View Postwildcatden, on 08 December 2017 - 03:21 PM, said:


So you are saying things are getting supernatural (adjective: weird; comparative adjective: weirder; superlative adjective: weirdest 1. suggesting something supernatural;)?

Surely you meant strange?  (adjective: strange; comparative adjective: stranger; superlative adjective: strangest 1.unusual or surprising in a way that is unsettling or hard to understand.)

Please GolfWRX'ers, let us all be careful with our adjectives!!!!!!!!!!  ;)

Can I interest you in a story about this MONSTER drive my son hit the other day.  I mean, it was truly a BEAST!  He absolutely HAMMERED it.

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#77 CTgolf

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 04:05 PM

View Postjustaman5, on 08 December 2017 - 02:24 PM, said:

i hate to say it, but this is soundling like a Lavar Ball conversation.

Don’t tell me nothin’

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#78 Noles

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 06:46 PM

View PostBeerPerHole, on 08 December 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 08 December 2017 - 01:50 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 06 December 2017 - 03:56 PM, said:

View PostQEight, on 05 December 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

View PostBeerPerHole, on 04 December 2017 - 08:32 PM, said:

I don't understand the angst here on this. Perhaps my use of the word "ringer" triggers some.

So why did you use that word?
...Probably the strangest comment I've ever seen in a thread I've started. It's possible people have a different definition of that word(?)

But if you are the only one using your definition in this thread, you should not be that surprised of the responses.
OK

Honestly, guys...I'm surprised at the drama in this thread. Are we all getting a little sensitive with the holiday season or something? It's not big deal, really. If I play a round with a kid who's 11 years old 4'9" and played the best golf I've ever had in my foursome I thought it'd be worth mentioning. But, this is getting weird.
It's not uncommon in the Junior Golf forum

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#79 ANG

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 02:08 PM

LOL...I can remember when the Junior Forum actually had juniors on it, not a bunch of trolls looking to flame people and or show off their vast "knowledge" of Junior golf.

Be careful what word you use to describe someone or the Jr. golf forum police will have to put you in your place.

Edited by ANG, 11 December 2017 - 02:16 PM.


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#80 marcwhu

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 12:35 AM

Back on topic, some kids just are that good. Played a tourney early 2016 on a brutally tough track, in super windy conditions, paired with a local 13 year old. First hole, 360 yarder straight into the teeth of it (i hit 3wood-5 iron, whelp), he tees up and toe skies his hybrid waaay left in the gorse, the proceeds to knock his provisional into the bush on the other side of the fairway. As we walk down the fairway, i sorta go up to him, just telling him to relax and just enjoy the experience. The look he gave me shoulda given me some clue of what was to come, lol. Of course he finds the first, hack out, wedges to a foot, makes par and goes on to shoot 70, leading by one. Sure made my 77 look average😂.

Fast forward a year, and he's teeing it up at the Junior Presidents Cup and taking selfies with Tiger and Jordan, go figure.


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#81 wrxman

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 03:17 AM

View Postmarcwhu, on 31 December 2017 - 12:35 AM, said:

Back on topic, some kids just are that good. Played a tourney early 2016 on a brutally tough track, in super windy conditions, paired with a local 13 year old. First hole, 360 yarder straight into the teeth of it (i hit 3wood-5 iron, whelp), he tees up and toe skies his hybrid waaay left in the gorse, the proceeds to knock his provisional into the bush on the other side of the fairway. As we walk down the fairway, i sorta go up to him, just telling him to relax and just enjoy the experience. The look he gave me shoulda given me some clue of what was to come, lol. Of course he finds the first, hack out, wedges to a foot, makes par and goes on to shoot 70, leading by one. Sure made my 77 look average😂.

Fast forward a year, and he's teeing it up at the Junior Presidents Cup and taking selfies with Tiger and Jordan, go figure.

Pretty sure not a single 14 year old played on the Junior President's Cup Team. Could be wrong though, what's his name?
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#82 marcwhu

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 01:23 PM

wrxman, his name is Jayden Schaper, a South African playing on the International side. Might be 15? Not too sure, but was definitely either 13 or 14 when we played together.

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#83 propredicr

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 03:41 PM

Truth!  Ranked 157 on AJGA.  Boy is scholarship material LOL.

View Postmarcwhu, on 31 December 2017 - 01:23 PM, said:

wrxman, his name is Jayden Schaper, a South African playing on the International side. Might be 15? Not too sure, but was definitely either 13 or 14 when we played together.


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#84 marcwhu

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 04:20 PM

Got that right. Only player to ever win the South African Boys Championship at all 4 different age groups (12-13,14-15,16-17 and open division this year, in SA you are allowed to enter above your actual age). Pretty impressive stuff.

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#85 llewol007

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 11:24 PM

If he is a champ already he is not a ringer but a very good junior golfer. I have seen some talent around my neck of the neighborhood and to me a ringer is a kid who doesnt play any tournament golf and ends up being a natural and can shoot just as good as a kid who who has the top coaches at his finger tips. Thank God the father is not to overly hovering when it comes to the budding golf game. The kid has to be self driven. That is whats gonna take them to the next level.

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#86 CTgolf

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Posted 02 January 2018 - 07:00 PM

View Postmarcwhu, on 31 December 2017 - 04:20 PM, said:

Got that right. Only player to ever win the South African Boys Championship at all 4 different age groups (12-13,14-15,16-17 and open division this year, in SA you are allowed to enter above your actual age). Pretty impressive stuff.

Definitely above avg

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#87 nuthin but a hacker

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Posted 11 February 2018 - 01:52 PM

View PostANG, on 11 December 2017 - 02:08 PM, said:

LOL...I can remember when the Junior Forum actually had juniors on it, not a bunch of trolls looking to flame people and or show off their vast "knowledge" of Junior golf.

Be careful what word you use to describe someone or the Jr. golf forum police will have to put you in your place.

Boy did I pick the wrong thread to check out what’s going on in this section! I guess every section has its know it alls but they are quick to put you in your place and keep you there in here I guess. I’m out.
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