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Consistency and what we are doing at 5 years old- suggestions


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#1 HWGOLF

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 01:06 AM

My 5 year old daughter soon to be 6 year old and I have been working at the range, putting and chipping for a while now. She takes some group lessons to socialize with other kids and just have fun. We just started playing par3 courses (3 rounds now) and we usually do a scramble.   It’s typically my daughter and grandpa vs me. My dad is older and they actually play a lot of my daughters shots. I thought this would be an easy way to introduce her to the game and not get too frustrated having to play every shot.

Aside from doing kid things on the course (running up small hills on the course,  having to wash her ball multiple times on each hole and just acting silly I feel she is doing well and having a blast.

She hits a series of tremendous shots that get us hooting and hollering but then followed by some of the worst shots you will ever see. Just wondering how we work on consistency. Is it just more practice or what?  I video her swing and remind her of certain things but wondering how to help progress her.

Any thoughts would be appreciated


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#2 hangontight

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 06:22 AM

My Son just turned 7.  When we were at your stage, it was 95% of time "playing " around practice area- any game you can think of- chipping closest to hole, up and down, etc.  play to 5,10, whatever to keep her engaged.  The short game practice (chips, then working up to 1/2 & 3/4 pitches) really helped grove consistancy because he wasn't trying to nail a driver as far and hard as he could.  Instead it was more about placement and control.    A key for us was encorporating "drills" into the games without him knowing it- e.g. We worked hard on hitting down on ball so for an up and down game I would make him (us both so it seems part of the game) hit all of his shots with another ball , towel, or whatever behind his ball.  It became part of the game , so didn't seem like a drill.  Using props like that helped.  It's hard for a 5 year old to take instruction and know what you are talking about (inside out swing????huh?)..instead just place a basket or headcover in front/inside of balll to force correct action. Another big key to get consistancy was to work on holding a balanced finish - ideally without ball so they can focus on getting to finish position and "tapping the rear toe".  He would do 5 or so dry swings holding finish for a few seconds, then put it to work hitting balls.  Woukd try to avoid just beating balls with no purpose, just try to be creative in ways to engrain the fundamentals.  Keep in mind, motor skills and hand eye coordination are still a little goofy at that age.  We had same issues, then at about 5-1/2 it all seemed to come together and click.

Edited by hangontight, 01 December 2017 - 06:23 AM.


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#3 heavy_hitter

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it.  Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.

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#4 heavy_hitter

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 09:30 AM

Just to add on.

Parents push kids too young too soon in all sports and for what?  It is for the hope that they will be the next Derek Jeter, Tiger Woods, Labron James, Aaron Rogers.  Kids need unorganized play.  When we were kids we played all day Saturday and Sunday without a parent in sight.  Baseball, Football, BB Gun wars in the woods, kickball, skateboard, ride bikes, etc.  After school during the week we hang out in the neighborhood and ride bikes.  The only time we had organized anything is when we played Little League baseball, YMCA Football, and Recreation dept. Basketball.  Parents didn't push and we kept a genuine love for the game.  Let the kids be the next them, not who you hope they can become.

You see kids burn out now because everything kids do is organized.  Oh, they love baseball so let's play travel tee ball (yes there is such a thing.)  Kids just want to play and don't always want their parents around to organize it.  Heck, parents arrange play dates.  First time I ever heard this I was SMH.  What happened to kids in the neighborhood just playing without it being organized?  Even on the golf course, leave them alone.  I am as guilty as anyone of this and recently have taken a big step back.  As I have taken a step back I have seen the genuine love and interest peak again.

Edited by heavy_hitter, 01 December 2017 - 11:03 AM.


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#5 DavePelz4

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 09:36 AM

View Postheavy_hitter, on 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM, said:

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it.  Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.

View Postheavy_hitter, on 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM, said:

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it.  Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.

I'd keep the video camera on but for the purpose of recording the memory of her and her grandfather.  As time passes that will become way more beneficial than any swing analysis for everyone.


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#6 HWGOLF

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 11:10 AM

All great points. The video is for memories, but I do take a peek to see what’s going on but of course never do an analysis review with her. I would say after reading a lot of this blog and what people are talking about we are much more on the recreational side of things. Thanks for the tips athangontight. Any other tips keep them coming

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#7 heavy_hitter

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 12:03 PM

View PostHWGOLF, on 01 December 2017 - 11:10 AM, said:

All great points. The video is for memories, but I do take a peek to see what's going on but of course never do an analysis review with her. I would say after reading a lot of this blog and what people are talking about we are much more on the recreational side of things. Thanks for the tips athangontight. Any other tips keep them coming

If she loves it.....  Play tons of putting games with her.  That is the best tool she can learn at her age.  Doesn't matter right now if she can swing the club or chip.  Find different games to play on the putting greens and play them.  After a few months introduce chipping/pitching games.  If she ends up pursuing this as her sport, the short game is the best thing you can do for her and it is by playing games and learning touch.

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#8 hangontight

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Posted 01 December 2017 - 01:08 PM

View Postheavy_hitter, on 01 December 2017 - 12:03 PM, said:

View PostHWGOLF, on 01 December 2017 - 11:10 AM, said:

All great points. The video is for memories, but I do take a peek to see what's going on but of course never do an analysis review with her. I would say after reading a lot of this blog and what people are talking about we are much more on the recreational side of things. Thanks for the tips athangontight. Any other tips keep them coming

If she loves it.....  Play tons of putting games with her.  That is the best tool she can learn at her age.  Doesn't matter right now if she can swing the club or chip.  Find different games to play on the putting greens and play them.  After a few months introduce chipping/pitching games.  If she ends up pursuing this as her sport, the short game is the best thing you can do for her and it is by playing games and learning touch.

Agree With HH.  My 4 YO daughter has started asking to go to golf course(I'me thrilled), but she knows that she gets M&M's during and afte, haha.  Anyway, as I did with my son we do ONLY putting - always fun and games.  Step 1 a associate the golf course with fun time with dad and brother.  Go from there.  Also, I always take them if they ask or want to go, but never force them to go if they don't.   My son is only 7, so I don't have the years of experience like some other posters , but just recent thoughts to share what has worked so far.

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#9 Forged4ever

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Posted 02 December 2017 - 07:21 PM

View Postheavy_hitter, on 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM, said:

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it. Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.
THIS should be pinned!!

Very Nicely Played👊

Cheers🍻
RP

Edited by Forged4ever, 03 December 2017 - 10:27 AM.

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#10 Dan Drake

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Posted 03 December 2017 - 11:26 AM

At 4 years old, my son's attention span lasted two golf balls
At 5, it was less than 5 minutes
At 6, we got to around 15 minutes before boredom set in
At 7, he could play 3 holes in a row or a putting game against dad for 20-30 minutes

He's 8 now and I'm hoping we will get to 4 or 5 holes in a row.  

If you have a child, like Rory or Tiger, who just shows an otherworldly attention span and interest in the game at a very early age, go for it.  Take them to the course, give them very limited and very basic instruction, and get out of the way.  
But, if you have a "normal" child with a "normal" attention span, introduce them to the game and let them decide what is fun ("driving" the golf car will always be near the top of the list!).  One trip to the course, my son decided that using the pvc golf ball scooper-thingy on the short game practice green was the most fun thing to do, so I hit chip shots while he went around scooping them like PacMan.  

I believe that from an early age, it is more important that children associate the golf course with fun than associating it with golf!

Edited by Dan Drake, 04 December 2017 - 09:41 AM.

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#11 Dan Drake

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Posted 03 December 2017 - 03:14 PM

Posted Image

One of my absolute favorite golf pictures, because he was having a blast!

Edited by Dan Drake, 03 December 2017 - 03:35 PM.

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#12 kekoa

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Posted 04 December 2017 - 02:45 PM

Real consistency at that age is really tough to achieve unless the kid is truly gifted and out on the course every single day.

My son literally wakes up with a change to his swing/set-up literally overnight and its happened several times already and he's only 7.
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#13 Paul Verizer

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 12:59 PM

Do not coach her up if she's not asking for it. And I'm guessing she's not. Just have a laugh, keep doing what you're doing and if you keep it fun, then it'll develop on her terms. That being said, at 7 my son started attending the summer camps in our area and asked for a lesson so as not to be embarrassed if the other kids were lots better. After discussing with my wife, we decided it was a good idea and now at the age of 9, that's the only instruction he's received outside of Grandpa. He loves to play and walks nine with me every other week, hitting from 200 yds out for par 5s, 160 out from 4s, and about 60 out from 3s.

Keep having fun, but resist the urge to mold her too quickly.

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#14 Kenny Lee Puckett

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 01:56 PM

View PostFrom 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM:

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it.  Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.
pushing it at 10 would be a mistake.

edit: 13 or 14 is maybe, maybe , when you start gearing things up a little getting ready for high school.

Edited by Kenny Lee Puckett, 06 December 2017 - 02:03 PM.

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#15 Forged4ever

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 10:37 PM

View PostKenny Lee Puckett, on 06 December 2017 - 01:56 PM, said:

View PostFrom 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM:

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it.  Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.
pushing it at 10 would be a mistake.

edit: 13 or 14 is maybe, maybe , when you start gearing things up a little getting ready for high school.
THIS!!

Hahaha, Thank God Maddie’s not allowed to post, lmao.

I hope that you’re well KP👊

My Best🍻
RP

Edited by Forged4ever, 11 December 2017 - 10:37 PM.

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But For The Way That The Sound Of Her Voice Can Silence My Demons....


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#16 Kenny Lee Puckett

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 11:31 PM

View PostForged4ever, on 11 December 2017 - 10:37 PM, said:

View PostKenny Lee Puckett, on 06 December 2017 - 01:56 PM, said:

View PostFrom 01 December 2017 - 06:53 AM:

At 5.....  just keep it fun.  Put away the video camera and just let her enjoy playing.  She will progress at her own pace without you pushing it.  Pushing it at 5 is a mistake.
pushing it at 10 would be a mistake.

edit: 13 or 14 is maybe, maybe , when you start gearing things up a little getting ready for high school.
THIS!!

Hahaha, Thank God Maddie's not allowed to post, lmao.

I hope that you're well KP��

My Best��
RP
Richard, I hope physically you are going strong for the holidays. And to you and yours, have a very Merry Christmas!   RYAN
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#17 nikegal

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 08:20 AM

Good morning guys :) while I am not supposed to be posting(my club said so), I will be leaving for a new position in the next few weeks and I feel so strongly about this that I will only say that I was actually taken aback by the this OP and post. Having been working with and teaching children for almost 25 years and I would not even consider working with a 5 year old child on their swing, much less taking one on as a student. This is what’s wrong with the game, children playing the game and parents’ involvement with them playing it. Richard posted his thoughts last night as he had not read the OP’s post prior to his responding to HH’s post. I told him that while I agreed with everything that he posted, I though it a bit harsh so he did what he has never done prior in his time on the board and he deleted it.

It is just my opinion as a parent and golf professional that this is a misguided short sighted and potentially damaging endeavor. When I read the OP speak of “consistency” and a five year old in the same sentence, I was stunned. I will not rehash Richard s post however I asked the same questions that he did for those who read it. There are no satisfactory answers. What almost 25 years of working with parents and teaching  children has shown me is that this is nothing more than a parent trying to live their desires and  dreams through their child, no matter what his response. Reread that OP!! That says it all and speaks louder than any future responses could. Thank you all for reading and I wish you a happy and joyous holiday season :) Madison

Edited by nikegal, 12 December 2017 - 08:26 AM.


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#18 Forged4ever

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 11:22 AM

Oh yea, since I’m always chirpin about fake avatars, fictitious user names and guys(this is a “guy” thing😝) drooping anonymous “one-stars,” the one-star ratings above were from myself and Madison. The ironic thing is that neither of us have ever given a “one-star” before, lolol.

I didn’t believe in em...

Until this ;)

To the OP, please do not take this as a personal attack as it is not. I and Madison just disagree strongly with what you have posted. This is why I deleted my post last night. Having Played college ball, coached it from college on down to pee-wee, my most fun was with the lil guys, and really those who in all probability will never play a down beyond pee-wee ball. I didn’t care about their intensity, consistency or focus, or whether they could step into the gap and shut it down, I just wanted to help them attain some confidence and shield them from fathers who most had never played a down of ball in their day, yet they were intent on trying to live through their sons. I almost ended up in jail and only because of friends in the right places did I not.

I had to walk away.

So i guess that I’m a tad bitter because I feel that I have a lot to offer young players and most of the pee-wee coaches aren’t much better than the dads, most trying to be the Nick Sabans of their leagues. Madison, and I to a lesser degree, see the same thing happening Children’s golf. I realize that ultimately it’s on me to control my emotions though the world has changed and I’m a dinosaur, lol.

I saw these men in your post and responded as I would if you were in front of me. Unlike most in the virtual world, I am much much more restrained than I am if angered in the “real” world, lol. That’s still a work in progress, haha. Last night I walked to a line that I’ve sworn never to cross on this or any board. Some may think that I crossed it, though I made the decision to delete the post.

Anyhoo, take care-

Fairways & Greens 4ever My Friends⛳️
RP

Edited by Forged4ever, 12 December 2017 - 12:07 PM.

I Love Her Not For The Way That She Dances With My Angels~
But For The Way That The Sound Of Her Voice Can Silence My Demons....


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#19 wildcatden

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 12:33 PM

If you are worried about consistency of your young 5 year old golfer, you are going to be sorely disappointed when they are 7 and have the same consistency. ;)

In all seriousness, keep it fun for your junior. Bring your putter and play putting games with them (sure, let them win most of the time). Bring your P-Wedge and play chipping games with them.  Whatever you do, make it about games.

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#20 CTgolf

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Posted 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares


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#21 Forged4ever

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 09:45 AM

View PostCTgolf, on 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares
Good morning🌞

I believe that every single parent in this thread cares very very very deeply for their child/children however I also believe that to use the word “caring” or more precisely, its definition as the bar for how we treat, raise and influence our children is just a self-indulgent and self serving way for one to justify and rationalize their words and actions.

I don’t believe that a single person in this thread accused you of not “caring.”

It’s just my opinion that if you asked most of the parents of child prodigies gone bad or they flamed out or didn’t “pan” out, they all “cared” deeply.

I mean seriously, what percentage of parents would say that they don’t “care???”

It’s my view that to use the word “care” or any derivative of it is just a self-centered masking of doing for the child what is best for the parent versus the child.

I love when I hear a parent speak of a child who didn’t live up to their supposed potential, whatever the arena or field and the parent says “I simply cared too much.”

That is the ultimate in narcissistic rationalization

I am in no way putting you in this boat though I just believe that “caring” is not an appropriate emotion to base a child’s path on

Trust me here, it can be a very damaging and dangerous emotion because all that “caring” is ALL about the parent and their self interest masked as “caring” and doing what’s in the “best interest” of the child and nothing about the child or THEIR best interest and well being

As always, just my .03 worth

Stay well👊

My Best,
RP

Edited by Forged4ever, 13 December 2017 - 02:58 PM.

I Love Her Not For The Way That She Dances With My Angels~
But For The Way That The Sound Of Her Voice Can Silence My Demons....


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#22 jmiller2

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 11:17 AM

I'm not a parent, I'm not going to speak about how to raise a child. I want to share a story from my own youth relating to golf.

I have glimpses of memories from this time and stories from my parents that back up the few memories I do have. When I was around 5 years old my grandfather provided me a cut down club, he would hit wedges in my parents back yard as i hit an iron of some kind. My parents lived on a couple acres in a royal area. All that he did was show me how to hold the club and where to stand then cut me lose, I don't remember anything about scoring or hitting shots consistently. It was just a time for me to spend time with my grandfather playing a game outside. When I was around 6 years old I went to a summer youth golf clinic, again the pro running the clinic never gave me any mechanical advise, just tweaked my grip and stance.

I eventually stopped going to the course and stopped practicing golf. At the time I didn't know why that happened but I know i played a lot of team sports, from 8-18 I played ice hockey. I hung up my skates my senior year of high school. I was burnt out it got too serious to improve and play at the next level and ice hockey stopped being fun for me to play.

In college I took up golf again, I was 22 at the time and when I took it up again I just had ways to have fun with the game and spend time outdoors. After I picked up the game in college I found out from my parents why I stopped playing golf. My parents wanted me in team sports to socialize so the golf thing was discouraged. I can imagine that my parents decision were based on that they "cared" about my future. However, looking at it now I wish I had been given the choice to pick team sports or golf.

My suggestion is to allow the child to have fun and play a lot of different sports and try to figure out which one they have the most interest in and try to continue to find ways to make whatever sport fun for the child. You will risk burn out if you push to improve early and by the time they are a teen, then they will give up the game.

Edited by jmiller2, 13 December 2017 - 11:18 AM.

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#23 heavy_hitter

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 11:33 AM

View PostForged4ever, on 13 December 2017 - 09:45 AM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares
Good morning��

I believe that every single parent in this thread cares very very very deeply for their child/children however I also believe that to use the word "caring" or more precisely, its definition as the bar for how we treat, raise and influence our children is just a self-indulgent way for one to justify their words and actions.

I don't believe that a single person in this thread accused you of not "caring."

It's just my opinion that if you asked most of the top arenas of child prodigies gone bad or they flames out or didn't "pan" out, they all "cared" deeply.

I mean seriously, what percentage of parents would say that they don't "care."

It's my view that to use the word "care" or any derivative of it is just a self-indulging masking of doing for the child what is best for the parent versus the child.

I love when I hear a parent speak of a child who didn't live up to their supposed potential, whatever the arena or field and the parent says "I simply cared too much."

That is the ultimate in narcissistic rationalization

I am in no way putting you in this boat though I just believe that "caring" is not an appropriate emotion to base a child's path on

Trust me here, it can be a very damaging and dangerous emotion because all that "caring" is ALL about the parent and their self interest masked as "caring" and doing what's in the "best interest" of the child and nothing about the child or THEIR interest and well being

As always, just my .03 worth

Stay well��

My Best,
RP

Trust me..... he is in that boat.  Have been waiting patiently for you and or Madison to respond to several of this persons posts.  They are honestly, disturbing.

Edited by heavy_hitter, 13 December 2017 - 02:24 PM.


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#24 heavy_hitter

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 12:08 PM

View PostForged4ever, on 13 December 2017 - 09:45 AM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares
Good morning��

I believe that every single parent in this thread cares very very very deeply for their child/children however I also believe that to use the word "caring" or more precisely, its definition as the bar for how we treat, raise and influence our children is just a self-indulgent way for one to justify their words and actions.

I don't believe that a single person in this thread accused you of not "caring."

It's just my opinion that if you asked most of the parents of child prodigies gone bad or they flamed out or didn't "pan" out, they all "cared" deeply.

I mean seriously, what percentage of parents would say that they don't "care???"

It's my view that to use the word "care" or any derivative of it is just a self-indulging masking of doing for the child what is best for the parent versus the child.

I love when I hear a parent speak of a child who didn't live up to their supposed potential, whatever the arena or field and the parent says "I simply cared too much."

That is the ultimate in narcissistic rationalization

I am in no way putting you in this boat though I just believe that "caring" is not an appropriate emotion to base a child's path on

Trust me here, it can be a very damaging and dangerous emotion because all that "caring" is ALL about the parent and their self interest masked as "caring" and doing what's in the "best interest" of the child and nothing about the child or THEIR best interest and well being

As always, just my .03 worth

Stay well��

My Best,
RP

This post is spot on.

I have recently taken two steps back and have reevaluated what my purpose/roll is as a parent of a middle aged kid that can golf.  I have seen in my kid stressing, worrying, frustration, not enjoying it because I cared and wanted to help him.  The common denominator with his frustrations and not playing well was me, and that is hard to say as a parent.  As I have removed myself from golf he has started to enjoy going to the course and playing again.  He goes to a lesson and I drop him off and leave.  He goes to play or practice and I stay at home.  The only time I go anymore is when he asks.  The only thing I do now is drive, help with speed workouts at home, provide the financials for him to do it, and help plan the tournaments.  He is surviving without me.  If he turnouts to great then great, if he turns out to be average then great, I still have my son.

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#25 CTgolf

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 01:16 PM

View Postheavy_hitter, on 13 December 2017 - 11:33 AM, said:

View PostForged4ever, on 13 December 2017 - 09:45 AM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares
Good morning��

I believe that every single parent in this thread cares very very very deeply for their child/children however I also believe that to use the word "caring" or more precisely, its definition as the bar for how we treat, raise and influence our children is just a self-indulgent way for one to justify their words and actions.

I don't believe that a single person in this thread accused you of not "caring."

It's just my opinion that if you asked most of the top arenas of child prodigies gone bad or they flames out or didn't "pan" out, they all "cared" deeply.

I mean seriously, what percentage of parents would say that they don't "care."

It's my view that to use the word "care" or any derivative of it is just a self-indulging masking of doing for the child what is best for the parent versus the child.

I love when I hear a parent speak of a child who didn't live up to their supposed potential, whatever the arena or field and the parent says "I simply cared too much."

That is the ultimate in narcissistic rationalization

I am in no way putting you in this boat though I just believe that "caring" is not an appropriate emotion to base a child's path on

Trust me here, it can be a very damaging and dangerous emotion because all that "caring" is ALL about the parent and their self interest masked as "caring" and doing what's in the "best interest" of the child and nothing about the child or THEIR interest and well being

As always, just my .03 worth

Stay well��

My Best,
RP

Trust me..... he is in that boat.  Have been waiting patiently for you and or Madison to respond to several of this persons post.  They are honestly, disturbing.

What do you even think I was referring to with my comment that he responded to?

Thank you for your patient waiting btw...we all know it must be very hard for you.


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#26 Noles

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 01:37 PM

View PostForged4ever, on 13 December 2017 - 09:45 AM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares
Good morning��

I believe that every single parent in this thread cares very very very deeply for their child/children however I also believe that to use the word "caring" or more precisely, its definition as the bar for how we treat, raise and influence our children is just a self-indulgent way for one to justify and rationalize their words and actions.

I don't believe that a single person in this thread accused you of not "caring."

It's just my opinion that if you asked most of the parents of child prodigies gone bad or they flamed out or didn't "pan" out, they all "cared" deeply.

I mean seriously, what percentage of parents would say that they don't "care???"

It's my view that to use the word "care" or any derivative of it is just a self-indulgant masking of doing for the child what is best for the parent versus the child.

I love when I hear a parent speak of a child who didn't live up to their supposed potential, whatever the arena or field and the parent says "I simply cared too much."

That is the ultimate in narcissistic rationalization

I am in no way putting you in this boat though I just believe that "caring" is not an appropriate emotion to base a child's path on

Trust me here, it can be a very damaging and dangerous emotion because all that "caring" is ALL about the parent and their self interest masked as "caring" and doing what's in the "best interest" of the child and nothing about the child or THEIR best interest and well being

As always, just my .03 worth

Stay well��

My Best,
RP
This reply is confusing.  You do realize that the person that you quoted is not the OP, right?  It was actually his first post in this thread.  So why would he think that anything was directed at him if he had not previously posted in the thread?

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#27 CTgolf

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 02:07 PM

The OP asked a question about how he could help his daughter; how do we know the daughter didn't ask/want the help or would benefit from it (even if, in some people's eyes, it might seem "less fun")?  

There are many different types of children (personality, temperament, maturity, skill, etc), and they respond differently to authority and instruction

I think the people who believe there is a one-size-fits-all approach to raising a child or developing an athlete are misguided, and others perhaps a bit too judgmental

I also think that as much as kids need to eventually 'figure it out on their own', the journey of being a parent and becoming a better one is also one that often requires learning from mistakes: improvement is a by-product of wanting what is best for the child and acting out of love

Some on this thread have mentioned they have changed their approach to helping their children; I'm guessing it wasn't because they were chastised by anonymous people on the internet or read a book on the "new" science of how to raise children

I dismiss the view that ALL (or even most) hands-on parents are living vicariously through their children or doing what is in their own interest (and not that of the child)

Edited by CTgolf, 13 December 2017 - 02:08 PM.


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#28 Forged4ever

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 04:02 PM

View PostNoles, on 13 December 2017 - 01:37 PM, said:

View PostForged4ever, on 13 December 2017 - 09:45 AM, said:

View PostCTgolf, on 12 December 2017 - 01:39 PM, said:

never has it been so hard to be a parent who cares
Good morning🌞

I believe that every single parent in this thread cares very very very deeply for their child/children however I also believe that to use the word "caring" or more precisely, its definition as the bar for how we treat, raise and influence our children is just a self-indulgent way for one to justify and rationalize their words and actions.

I don't believe that a single person in this thread accused you of not "caring."

It's just my opinion that if you asked most of the parents of child prodigies gone bad or they flamed out or didn't "pan" out, they all "cared" deeply.

I mean seriously, what percentage of parents would say that they don't "care???"

It's my view that to use the word "care" or any derivative of it is just a self-indulgant masking of doing for the child what is best for the parent versus the child.

I love when I hear a parent speak of a child who didn't live up to their supposed potential, whatever the arena or field and the parent says "I simply cared too much."

That is the ultimate in narcissistic rationalization

I am in no way putting you in this boat though I just believe that "caring" is not an appropriate emotion to base a child's path on

Trust me here, it can be a very damaging and dangerous emotion because all that "caring" is ALL about the parent and their self interest masked as "caring" and doing what's in the "best interest" of the child and nothing about the child or THEIR best interest and well being

As always, just my .03 worth

Stay well👊

My Best,
RP
This reply is confusing.  You do realize that the person that you quoted is not the OP, right?  It was actually his first post in this thread.  So why would he think that anything was directed at him if he had not previously posted in the thread?
Thanks Noles for pointing that out as I did not, as I responded as I believed that it was the OP.

Be that as it may, my views on “caring” or using it justify ones actions or directions with a child are not changed as Madison can attest to the number of parents, specifically fathers, who have said they they pushed because they “cared so much.”

Reading CT’s other posts specifically the one above me, I’m guessing that he’s in the game and has dealt with parents and that’s an excellent post above me and I would wholeheartedly agree that being chastised by strangers is crazy and not well received, lol

Almost as crazy as asking strangers for advice on parenting😉

I also don’t think anyone suggests “one size fits all” is a good parenting template however anyone that tries to work with a five year old to be more “consistent” is a flaming.........

This is of course just my .03 worth😎

Thanks for pullin me outa the rough Noles and nice post CT👍

Have a nice afternoon,
RP

Edited by Forged4ever, 13 December 2017 - 06:25 PM.

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#29 wildcatden

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Posted 13 December 2017 - 04:34 PM

Getting ready to take my kid out for some practice. Wish me luck!!

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#30 jmiller2

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 08:19 AM

I don't really know you, you are an anonymous person to me. I can't really hear the tone you are intended to speak this words in and sometimes it can be hard to interpret written words appropriately. If I miss interpreted your intentions in any of my responses I do apologize.

View PostCTgolf, on 13 December 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

The OP asked a question about how he could help his daughter; how do we know the daughter didn't ask/want the help or would benefit from it (even if, in some people's eyes, it might seem "less fun")?
There wasn't any information about how the child came to the parent for help to initiate this conversation. People can only provide responses based on what is actually written. Had the original post actually mentioned that the child had asked for help become more consistent the responses probably would have been different.


View PostCTgolf, on 13 December 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

There are many different types of children (personality, temperament, maturity, skill, etc), and they respond differently to authority and instruction
This statement holds true for adults as well, everyone is an individual.


View PostCTgolf, on 13 December 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

I think the people who believe there is a one-size-fits-all approach to raising a child or developing an athlete are misguided, and others perhaps a bit too judgmental

I also think that as much as kids need to eventually 'figure it out on their own', the journey of being a parent and becoming a better one is also one that often requires learning from mistakes: improvement is a by-product of wanting what is best for the child and acting out of love
I'm not sure whom here said there was a one-size-fits all approach to raising a child. I didn't get that impression at all from my interpretation of the posts prior to my 1st post. I did read some posts that people felt strongly it was a mistake to push a young child too hard to improve and score early. That is just someone's opinion and the original poster and take it or leave it.

As for the second sentence, I think everyone can agree with that. I'm not a parent and I realize that parents grow and become better parents from learning through their mistakes.

View PostCTgolf, on 13 December 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

Some on this thread have mentioned they have changed their approach to helping their children; I'm guessing it wasn't because they were chastised by anonymous people on the internet or read a book on the "new" science of how to raise children
The topic of "athletic burnout" is a real thing. The research on "athletic burnout" dates back to the mid 1980s as far as I know so it isn't something "new". My firs post was just a story about my own experience and I had "athletic burnout" with ice hockey around age 17 at age 18 I was done because i lost interest because playing felt more like "work" then a "game". If I hadn't specialized in ice hockey and had done another sport over the summer in the years around 8-12 then I probably wouldn't have burned out of ice hockey by the time I was 18. After my first post I did do some research into "athletic burnout" just to see when the research was first published and found an interesting article: http://educatedsport...athlete-burnout


View PostCTgolf, on 13 December 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

I dismiss the view that ALL (or even most) hands-on parents are living vicariously through their children or doing what is in their own interest (and not that of the child)
There is a big difference between being "hands-on" / "caring" and being over "controlling". I would hope that all parents would take an interest in their child's academic performance, their child's friends, where the child is going on weekends as a teen, what kind of music that the child likes, etc. In my mind being in the loop and aware of the child's interest is a healthy approach to parenting.

It becomes unhealthy when you are forcing a child to do something that is in your best interest and not theirs. For example pushing them to improve their "consistency" at a young age in a sport without them expressing interest in getting better or more consistent, comes with extremely high risk that the child will experience "athletic burnout" and lose interest in playing the game.

Golf is a game that takes a lot of time and it isn't cheap entertainment. There are several alternatives that are cheaper and if a child is interested in the game on their own then I think there is an obligation to protect that interest in the game so that you do avoid "athletic burnout".



That is just my 2 cents worth as always with an anonymous message board the readers can take it or leave it.

Edited by jmiller2, 01 January 2018 - 04:14 PM.

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