Jump to content

Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at GolfWRX such as viewing all the images, interacting with members, access to all forums and eligiblility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE GolfWRX account here.

- - - - -

Dialing Back the Ball


123 replies to this topic

#121 new2g0lf

new2g0lf

    Major Winner

  • ClubWRX Charter Members
  • 1,838 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 114437
  • Joined: 09/06/2010
GolfWRX Likes : 1108

Posted 12 November 2017 - 03:13 PM

View PostShilgy, on 10 November 2017 - 11:19 PM, said:

View Postnew2g0lf, on 10 November 2017 - 09:49 AM, said:

View Postsoregongolfer, on 10 November 2017 - 01:58 AM, said:

View Postcoachemup, on 09 November 2017 - 02:15 PM, said:

Chippa13

I said I was done with this thread, but you have made me enter it since you mentioned baseball and that is what I did for a career.  Players must use wooden bats in professional baseball.  They don't have any other choice.  And pitchers must throw the same ball (Rawlings and you will not see any other league anywhere use a Rawlings baseball). They can't throw out the official MLB supplied ball and bring out a Diamond D1 Pro (as an example).  

And as far as paying more for the quality of course, that is wrong as well.  I have played courses in pristine shap that cost $30 a round and then played courses that cost $250 a round that I wouldn't even practice my own game on.

Ok, that is all :)

Baseball is all about tradition and their statistics.  That's why they still have wood bats.  A big allure to baseball is comparing today's players to the past.  That would be hard to do if they switched to aluminum bats even though aluminum bats can be tuned to have the same exit speeds of wood bats.

Of course, today's wood bats are not the same as they were 50 years ago.  Today, they have more options with regards to weight distribution and even the type of wood used.  Many players use maple.  In the past only ash was used.
The reason MLB has not gone to aluminum bats is safety.  If they cared about records, they wouldn't allow stadiums to bring in their walls, wouldn't have allowed steroid abuse for 5+ years and wouldn't have lowered the pitching mounds.  

Quote

The barrels are bigger, and because they are lighter, they can be swung faster than a wooden bat." In addition, the hardness and resilience of aluminum can result in much greater speeds when the ball comes off the bat. ... The primary reason that wooden bats are required in the pros is due to this performance difference.
The ped era lasted a lot longer than 5 years.
Yes, I was being kind given there was a 5 year period where MLB was like a home run derby.


Remove This Advertisement Viewing As Guest

    GolfWRX Forums

    Advertisement


1

#122 Hubijerk

Hubijerk

    Advanced

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 393 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 305901
  • Joined: 04/05/2014
  • Location:Las Vegas
  • Handicap:0
  • Ebay ID:hubijerk2p7b
GolfWRX Likes : 163

Posted 12 November 2017 - 06:02 PM

View Postnew2g0lf, on 12 November 2017 - 03:12 PM, said:

View PostHubijerk, on 11 November 2017 - 07:07 PM, said:

View Postcoachemup, on 10 November 2017 - 03:40 PM, said:

Soregongolfer,

Can you please provide us with the study that shows aluminum bats can be tuned so exit speeds are equal to or slower than wood bats?

Even the new BBCOR bats still show roughly a +4-6 mph increase in exit velocity and those are sweetspot contacts.  I can only imagine handle or cap shots are probably +8-10 compared to wood.

If your post is indeed correct (and I am not doubting you, just wanting to see the study) I need to contact my people and find out other rationals for why wooden bats are still being used.

I know, I know this is topic.  My apologies!  I just like to learn new things

So back on topic, Let's not roll the ball back but instead make a tournament ball.  I can live with that :)

I don't know about stats and science, but I do know I have played a lot of baseball, finished at 3rd base in college and played off season wooden bat leagues and honestly I'm surprised more kids haven't been hurt... pitchers, and 3rd basemen playing up.. Maybe on paper the speeds are 5-8 mph faster but it sure feels a lot faster than that when a line drive is coming at you're head off a pressurized aluminum 2piece bat...

A side note I used to practice with an old rawlings metal bat.. I'm sure it was aluminum but it looked and felt like steel... I think it must have been the 1st metal bat ever.  The handle was almost as thick as the barrel and it was so heavy.  It was a workout just taking BP with that thing.

It depends on when you played, BBCOR is relatively new (last five years) and the old aluminum bats were much faster than wood.

Oh yeah, way more than 5 years, 99-2002 were my college years
You can't sneak the cheese by a rat

2

#123 new2g0lf

new2g0lf

    Major Winner

  • ClubWRX Charter Members
  • 1,838 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 114437
  • Joined: 09/06/2010
GolfWRX Likes : 1108

Posted 12 November 2017 - 10:58 PM

View PostHubijerk, on 12 November 2017 - 06:02 PM, said:

View Postnew2g0lf, on 12 November 2017 - 03:12 PM, said:

View PostHubijerk, on 11 November 2017 - 07:07 PM, said:

View Postcoachemup, on 10 November 2017 - 03:40 PM, said:

Soregongolfer,

Can you please provide us with the study that shows aluminum bats can be tuned so exit speeds are equal to or slower than wood bats?

Even the new BBCOR bats still show roughly a +4-6 mph increase in exit velocity and those are sweetspot contacts.  I can only imagine handle or cap shots are probably +8-10 compared to wood.

If your post is indeed correct (and I am not doubting you, just wanting to see the study) I need to contact my people and find out other rationals for why wooden bats are still being used.

I know, I know this is topic.  My apologies!  I just like to learn new things

So back on topic, Let's not roll the ball back but instead make a tournament ball.  I can live with that :)

I don't know about stats and science, but I do know I have played a lot of baseball, finished at 3rd base in college and played off season wooden bat leagues and honestly I'm surprised more kids haven't been hurt... pitchers, and 3rd basemen playing up.. Maybe on paper the speeds are 5-8 mph faster but it sure feels a lot faster than that when a line drive is coming at you're head off a pressurized aluminum 2piece bat...

A side note I used to practice with an old rawlings metal bat.. I'm sure it was aluminum but it looked and felt like steel... I think it must have been the 1st metal bat ever.  The handle was almost as thick as the barrel and it was so heavy.  It was a workout just taking BP with that thing.

It depends on when you played, BBCOR is relatively new (last five years) and the old aluminum bats were much faster than wood.

Oh yeah, way more than 5 years, 99-2002 were my college years
Yeah, you were putting your life at risk playing 3rd base.  I used to play 3rd base in modified pitch softball and those 3 wall bats were like rocket launchers with a softball can't imagine what it was like with a hardball.

3

#124 playa

playa

    Hall of Fame

  • Advanced Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,173 posts
  •  
  • Member #: 280775
  • Joined: 10/18/2013
GolfWRX Likes : 3811

Posted 13 November 2017 - 04:03 PM

 North Butte, on 09 November 2017 - 02:59 PM, said:

You gotta feel for Tiger. He grew up idolizing Jack Nicklaus and basically dreaming of doing everything that Jack did except doing it better.

Think about it. By the time Jack had left the major-championship scene the top players were guys like Davis Love III and Freddie Couples. Those guys played a game very hard to distinguish from the game Jack played.

Jack couldn't say of that generation as Bobby Jones said of Jack that they played "a game with which he was not familiar".  But when Tiger came along, that's exactly what Jack said. Tiger had an ability to overpower a golf course (not to mention an other-worldly short game that Jack never had need to develop) beyond anything Jack could have done in his prime and Jack admired him for it.

But now Tiger's career has wound down and the PGA Tour landscape isn't filled by guys doing basically what Tiger did. The entire game has transformed over the course of Tiger's 20's and 30's to the point where a 40-year-old Tiger sees NOBODY out there being DL III or Freddie to his Jack. The very next generation after Tiger has transformed the entire way the game is played.

So Tiger is frustrated. He wanted to slide gracefully into middle age seeing a couple generations of players try and match what he did IN THE SAME WAY HE DID IT. But they skipped right over that interim. Now it's not a single once-in-a-lifetime Tiger emerging but entire generations of golfers already playing the next evolution of the game.

He got ripped off.

P.S. There is one compensation. I don't think Tiger will live long enough to see his 14 major championships equaled, much less anyone pass him and overtake Jack. It's the same factor, the sheer number of prodigiously talented, fearless "Tigers" out there stealing majors from each other. It was remarkable the way Tiger dominated the golf landscape for 15 years or so. Now that the game is so much deeper (and thoroughly world-wide) Tiger's remarkable dominance is probably just not possible.

P.P.S. Not to mention that the modern game wears out bodies and putting stroke nerves at a meat-grinder pace. As Tiger himself has found out, the power required in today's game chews up bodies and spits them out on an accelerated time scale.
I agree with most of this but respectfully disagree that the game is that much deeper now or that Tiger wouldn't dominate if he came along now. When Tiger arrived hof certainties Els and Phil were in the start of their peak years, but Tiger destroyed them (especially Els). Fred and DL3 were still at their peak, and Sergio bad Scott had hit the scene by the time Tiger really got going. I honestly think the top bracket of golfers Tiger dominated were every bit as talented as Day, DJ, Rory, Spieth etc. Maybe the second tier players now are better, but that's not relevant to Tiger as he was so far ahead of those guys in his days. If Tiger hit the scene right now he would dominate just like he did in his day. Look at his scoring and his records. You can't just ignore them based on a "fields now are stronger" argument that isn't really backed up by measureable statistics.

Edited by playa, 14 November 2017 - 02:59 PM.


4



0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

GolfWRX Sponsors