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Callaway Epic Star In-Hand Photos: Driver, Fairways, and Irons


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#61 xjohnx

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 07:17 AM

View PostRustynuts, on 13 September 2017 - 03:18 AM, said:

It may be saying the shaft is worth $400 but I can't believe anybody would actually pay that for it, unlike a tour as where people are actually paying market prices for it

People have been paying $300-$350 for shafts for 10 years now. Not that much of a stretch.

Put yourself in the shoes of the person that this driver/shaft are actually made for. Of all the claims and small gains over the last several years, what if overnight someone came out with a club that could potentially increase your clubhead speed 5-7mph. A lot of golfers would pay for that.

Edited by xjohnx, 13 September 2017 - 07:17 AM.


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#62 sandy

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 07:41 AM

Heck people (not Pros) were buying Rouge 125 MSI shafts from Aldila tour department for $800 before any of the retailers could get any of them.  They were aghast that Titleist was offering a 110 MSI version (one of those horrid made for shafts) as a stock shaft in the 915D4.  In reality it is amazing anyone pays over $150 for any shaft that isn't custom hand rolled in Japan..

Edited by sandy, 13 September 2017 - 07:42 AM.


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#63 south_side_lefty

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:15 AM

Looks like they called the 3 iron a 4 iron add slipped in an extra wedge.

Hmmm...

#4    18°    39.50"
#5     20.5°     38.875"
#6     23°     38.25"
#7     26°     37.625"
#8     30°     37.00"
#9     34.5°     36.50"
PW     39°     36.00"
AW     44°     35.75"
GW     49°     35.50"
SW     54°    35.25"

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#64 duffer987

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:26 AM

View Postsouth_side_lefty, on 13 September 2017 - 09:15 AM, said:

Looks like they called the 3 iron a 4 iron add slipped in an extra wedge.

Hmmm...

#4 18° 39.50"
#5 20.5° 38.875"
#6 23° 38.25"
#7 26° 37.625"
#8 30° 37.00"
#9 34.5° 36.50"
PW 39° 36.00"
AW 44° 35.75"
GW 49° 35.50"
SW 54° 35.25"

Exactly. That's because the Epic Star 4I is the Epic 3I. They are the same head, with some gold dusting and a jacked price tag.
Another source provided a review that was more than a copy/paste of Callaway's own spiel and does a better job of highlighting what the Stars are, than the WRX article.

Edited by duffer987, 13 September 2017 - 09:26 AM.


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#65 Raidersgolf99

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:02 PM

I'm a Callaway guy ...

THAT Driver head really is pretty, but the ultralight weight head and gold paint suck.

The EXACT same can be said for the 7 Wood.

The Irons, $2400? Wow! How many clubs are included 8? 7? 6? And my Lord, a 39 PW? That's stronger than my 8 Iron!!

WOW!

Kinda speechless from here.










... Well, I guess I can't keep quiet that long ... I sure hope that Epic Forged is the ticket!

W. I. T. B.


A-Grind Classic 350 10.5° Diamana Kai'li 80x5ct X
Callaway X-Hot Pro 3-Deep TC 14.5
° Diamana Thump F85 X

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Callaway Apex Hybrid 3H TC 20.0° TourSpec Speeder 904HB X
Callaway Apex Hybrid 4H TC 23.0° TourSpec Speeder 904HB X
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Miura 1957 CB-57 6 Steel Fiber i110 S
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#66 xjohnx

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:09 PM

View PostRaidersgolf99, on 13 September 2017 - 09:02 PM, said:

I'm a Callaway guy ...

THAT Driver head really is pretty, but the ultralight weight head and gold paint suck.

The EXACT same can be said for the 7 Wood.

The Irons, $2400? Wow! How many clubs are included 8? 7? 6? And my Lord, a 39 PW? That's stronger than my 8 Iron!!

WOW!

Kinda speechless from here.










... Well, I guess I can't keep quiet that long ... I sure hope that Epic Forged is the ticket!

Everything you said you don't like about it = just buy an Epic?

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#67 Raidersgolf99

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:12 PM

View Postsouth_side_lefty, on 13 September 2017 - 09:15 AM, said:

Looks like they called the 3 iron a 4 iron add slipped in an extra wedge.

Hmmm...

#4    18    39.50"
#5     20.5     38.875"
#6     23     38.25"
#7     26     37.625"
#8     30     37.00"
#9     34.5     36.50"
PW     39     36.00"
AW     44     35.75"
GW     49     35.50"
SW     54    35.25"

WOW.... Just WOW!

MY 7 Iron is 36 3/4" and 36 .... You are telling me it's basically a WEAK 9 Iron in the Epic Star? WOW!

Hmmmm .... Wonder what it's like to hit a 9 Iron 170-175 all the time?

Taking it a step further .... MY 9 Iron is spec for spec matching of the AW. So from 150, I'm gonna hit an AW? What does a LW fly 130? 135?

C'mon now Callaway .... Get back on track to domination!

View Postxjohnx, on 13 September 2017 - 09:09 PM, said:

View PostRaidersgolf99, on 13 September 2017 - 09:02 PM, said:

I'm a Callaway guy ...

THAT Driver head really is pretty, but the ultralight weight head and gold paint suck.

The EXACT same can be said for the 7 Wood.

The Irons, $2400? Wow! How many clubs are included 8? 7? 6? And my Lord, a 39 PW? That's stronger than my 8 Iron!!

WOW!

Kinda speechless from here.










... Well, I guess I can't keep quiet that long ... I sure hope that Epic Forged is the ticket!

Everything you said you don't like about it = just buy an Epic?

Is the Epic bonded? No.

W. I. T. B.


A-Grind Classic 350 10.5° Diamana Kai'li 80x5ct X
Callaway X-Hot Pro 3-Deep TC 14.5
° Diamana Thump F85 X

Callaway Apex Hybrid 1H TC 16.0° TourSpec Speeder 904HB X

Callaway Apex Hybrid 3H TC 20.0° TourSpec Speeder 904HB X
Callaway Apex Hybrid 4H TC 23.0° TourSpec Speeder 904HB X
Callaway Apex Hybrid 5H TC 26.0° TourSpec Speeder 904HB X
Miura 1957 CB-57 6 Steel Fiber i110 S
Miura 1957 Baby Blade 7-P Steel Fiber i110 S
Miura Raw Hand Grind 52° / 10° Steel Fiber i110 S
Miura Raw Hand Grind 58° / 10° Steel Fiber i110 S
Miura 1957 KM-350 Soft Black DGTI Black Onyx S400


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#68 chet schwalm

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:24 PM

Some high end juniors will play these. Get them hooked early re: brand loyalty. Worked with me. Been a TaylorMade driver guy since the launch of the Burner Plus

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#69 lawsonman

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 06:06 AM

I'm not sure why people here think the price point is ridiculous. Hell, there are guys around here that will lay down $300-$500 for a shaft! These are just another choice in the golf equipment world.
I have a excellent short game. It's unfortunate that it starts on the Tee.

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#70 theshadow1971

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 06:39 AM

What is annoying about this club  for me is not the price so much but the manner in which is marketed.  I can go on onto Rakuten now, select the Epic Star Driver select the same lite weight Mitsubishi Shaft it cost me around US$750 in total  (granted a little more in cost).  But if if I buy the one promoted in the US i'm getting  different coloured driver, that's super light and the marketing spiel goes on and on. You are essential buying the basic stock driver option available elsewhere in the world.  To make it out or purport it is a special driver from Japan, is kind of deceptive, especially when the 12* isn't even offered in Japan/Asia or the so called lite grip is not an option in Japan/Asia.  What is also interesting here in Japan/Asia is that there are other shaft choices for this driver, that are the same or even lighter than the Mitsubishi shaft, giving you a driver with a total weight the same or less than the so-called "special USA version" costing less than US$500.

I feel that customers in USA and other parts of the world are getting played by Callaway.

To use a different analogy its like buying a mustang from a dealer, that has different sets of wheels, interior finish etc and the dealer saying it is a special model, when in fact its a mustang made up from a different selection of the available options and calling it a super duper mustang, which you could make by selecting the same options yourself!

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#71 xjohnx

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 08:00 AM

View Posttheshadow1971, on 14 September 2017 - 06:39 AM, said:

What is annoying about this club  for me is not the price so much but the manner in which is marketed.  I can go on onto Rakuten now, select the Epic Star Driver select the same lite weight Mitsubishi Shaft it cost me around US$750 in total  (granted a little more in cost).  But if if I buy the one promoted in the US i'm getting  different coloured driver, that's super light and the marketing spiel goes on and on. You are essential buying the basic stock driver option available elsewhere in the world.  To make it out or purport it is a special driver from Japan, is kind of deceptive, especially when the 12* isn't even offered in Japan/Asia or the so called lite grip is not an option in Japan/Asia.  What is also interesting here in Japan/Asia is that there are other shaft choices for this driver, that are the same or even lighter than the Mitsubishi shaft, giving you a driver with a total weight the same or less than the so-called "special USA version" costing less than US$500.

I feel that customers in USA and other parts of the world are getting played by Callaway.

To use a different analogy its like buying a mustang from a dealer, that has different sets of wheels, interior finish etc and the dealer saying it is a special model, when in fact its a mustang made up from a different selection of the available options and calling it a super duper mustang, which you could make by selecting the same options yourself!

You need to think outside the WRX box. Most golfers don't even know that company's like Callaway etc. offer anything different in other countries. Even if they did, most also wouldn't drop that kind of money without hitting them first. Also, remember that here in US we live in the instant gratification world where if you're waiting longer than 2 days to get something in the mail, it's not worth it. I think Callaway had great success with the models over there and realized that company's like XXIO have proven that there is a sustainable market for the same type of products over here as well. Pair that with the fact that they've already got the top driver of the year and it's hard to improve on that. Might as well capitalize on a different segment of the market now that other company's have taken a lot of the risk testing the market.

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#72 Dscvrr St Louis

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 08:24 AM

This is a push from Callaway to get the same market audience that is currently buying up XXIO in droves.  Srixon made the massive push with XXIO last year to get them Green Grass and in the demo bags of the Srixon Reps at demo days to appeal to the older men and women at Country Clubs looking for whatever distance they can get...these XXIO are also going into the weaker women players in College golf also.  This was a very untapped market other than various OEMs offering simply lighter shafts in the same heads, but not product designed with the SHAFT and HEAD in conjunction...I wouldn't be surprised to see another OEM or two go this way.  
Also, The GB shaft from Mits is around $450+ from most all sources...hence the $699 price tag.
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#73 theshadow1971

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 08:28 AM

View Postxjohnx, on 14 September 2017 - 08:00 AM, said:

View Posttheshadow1971, on 14 September 2017 - 06:39 AM, said:

What is annoying about this club  for me is not the price so much but the manner in which is marketed.  I can go on onto Rakuten now, select the Epic Star Driver select the same lite weight Mitsubishi Shaft it cost me around US$750 in total  (granted a little more in cost).  But if if I buy the one promoted in the US i'm getting  different coloured driver, that's super light and the marketing spiel goes on and on. You are essential buying the basic stock driver option available elsewhere in the world.  To make it out or purport it is a special driver from Japan, is kind of deceptive, especially when the 12* isn't even offered in Japan/Asia or the so called lite grip is not an option in Japan/Asia.  What is also interesting here in Japan/Asia is that there are other shaft choices for this driver, that are the same or even lighter than the Mitsubishi shaft, giving you a driver with a total weight the same or less than the so-called "special USA version" costing less than US$500.

I feel that customers in USA and other parts of the world are getting played by Callaway.

To use a different analogy its like buying a mustang from a dealer, that has different sets of wheels, interior finish etc and the dealer saying it is a special model, when in fact its a mustang made up from a different selection of the available options and calling it a super duper mustang, which you could make by selecting the same options yourself!

You need to think outside the WRX box. Most golfers don't even know that company's like Callaway etc. offer anything different in other countries. Even if they did, most also wouldn't drop that kind of money without hitting them first. Also, remember that here in US we live in the instant gratification world where if you're waiting longer than 2 days to get something in the mail, it's not worth it. I think Callaway had great success with the models over there and realized that company's like XXIO have proven that there is a sustainable market for the same type of products over here as well. Pair that with the fact that they've already got the top driver of the year and it's hard to improve on that. Might as well capitalize on a different segment of the market now that other company's have taken a lot of the risk testing the market.

I not sure what you mean by think outside the WRX box, I thought I am more out of the WRX box looking in. I live in Asia, so everything I get to look at in terms of golfing is more Asian and European centric and I  have a rather more global perspective and exposure to golf equipment and golf, rather than a Nth America perspective (that's not to say I haven't tried learn from the views and perspective of golf &n golfers and member of WRX  from Nth America)

I think what you might have misunderstood the point I was making about the US specs of the Epic Star is essential a stock Epic Star driver with a shaft suited for the slower Swinger, hyped up so much that it gives off the impression you are getting a super fantastic lite weight driver which could be a game changer, to me that is a bit deceitful.

With XXIO - Callaway needs to understand, that XXIO essentially makes and designs every aspect of their driver & clubs for a particular golfer.  They don't pull components from various to manufactures to make a club to jump on a band wagon.  Even if they do go outside for components, it will be a certain specification just for XXIOs exclusive use.
Srixon (asian specs)

Z545 10.5* Driver
Z F45 15* 3W
Z H45 19* 3 Hybrid
Z745 3-PW

Z745 AW@51* & SW@57*

Cleveland Classic HB 2 Black Pearl Putter
Bridgestone B330RXS

13

#74 theshadow1971

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 08:32 AM

View PostDscvrr St Louis, on 14 September 2017 - 08:24 AM, said:

This is a push from Callaway to get the same market audience that is currently buying up XXIO in droves.  Srixon made the massive push with XXIO last year to get them Green Grass and in the demo bags of the Srixon Reps at demo days to appeal to the older men and women at Country Clubs looking for whatever distance they can get...these XXIO are also going into the weaker women players in College golf also.  This was a very untapped market other than various OEMs offering simply lighter shafts in the same heads, but not product designed with the SHAFT and HEAD in conjunction...I wouldn't be surprised to see another OEM or two go this way.  
Also, The GB shaft from Mits is around $450+ from most all sources...hence the $699 price tag.

That's right XXIO design shafts, heads in conjunction with each other.
XXIO already caters for the weaker male and female players, it just that it a new phenonemon for the US.
Srixon (asian specs)

Z545 10.5* Driver
Z F45 15* 3W
Z H45 19* 3 Hybrid
Z745 3-PW

Z745 AW@51* & SW@57*

Cleveland Classic HB 2 Black Pearl Putter
Bridgestone B330RXS

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#75 getair23

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 10:27 AM

Callaway marketing was on Hank Haney's show this morning. They are very aware of who their target audience is on this release.


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#76 gripandrip

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 10:55 AM

View PostLazyLightning22, on 12 September 2017 - 06:52 AM, said:

$800 for a driver is just outrageous.

Is the weight solid gold and all the coloring gold leaf?

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#77 xjohnx

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 11:34 AM

View Posttheshadow1971, on 14 September 2017 - 08:28 AM, said:

View Postxjohnx, on 14 September 2017 - 08:00 AM, said:

View Posttheshadow1971, on 14 September 2017 - 06:39 AM, said:

What is annoying about this club  for me is not the price so much but the manner in which is marketed.  I can go on onto Rakuten now, select the Epic Star Driver select the same lite weight Mitsubishi Shaft it cost me around US$750 in total  (granted a little more in cost).  But if if I buy the one promoted in the US i'm getting  different coloured driver, that's super light and the marketing spiel goes on and on. You are essential buying the basic stock driver option available elsewhere in the world.  To make it out or purport it is a special driver from Japan, is kind of deceptive, especially when the 12* isn't even offered in Japan/Asia or the so called lite grip is not an option in Japan/Asia.  What is also interesting here in Japan/Asia is that there are other shaft choices for this driver, that are the same or even lighter than the Mitsubishi shaft, giving you a driver with a total weight the same or less than the so-called "special USA version" costing less than US$500.

I feel that customers in USA and other parts of the world are getting played by Callaway.

To use a different analogy its like buying a mustang from a dealer, that has different sets of wheels, interior finish etc and the dealer saying it is a special model, when in fact its a mustang made up from a different selection of the available options and calling it a super duper mustang, which you could make by selecting the same options yourself!

You need to think outside the WRX box. Most golfers don't even know that company's like Callaway etc. offer anything different in other countries. Even if they did, most also wouldn't drop that kind of money without hitting them first. Also, remember that here in US we live in the instant gratification world where if you're waiting longer than 2 days to get something in the mail, it's not worth it. I think Callaway had great success with the models over there and realized that company's like XXIO have proven that there is a sustainable market for the same type of products over here as well. Pair that with the fact that they've already got the top driver of the year and it's hard to improve on that. Might as well capitalize on a different segment of the market now that other company's have taken a lot of the risk testing the market.

I not sure what you mean by think outside the WRX box, I thought I am more out of the WRX box looking in. I live in Asia, so everything I get to look at in terms of golfing is more Asian and European centric and I  have a rather more global perspective and exposure to golf equipment and golf, rather than a Nth America perspective (that's not to say I haven't tried learn from the views and perspective of golf &n golfers and member of WRX  from Nth America)

I think what you might have misunderstood the point I was making about the US specs of the Epic Star is essential a stock Epic Star driver with a shaft suited for the slower Swinger, hyped up so much that it gives off the impression you are getting a super fantastic lite weight driver which could be a game changer, to me that is a bit deceitful.

With XXIO - Callaway needs to understand, that XXIO essentially makes and designs every aspect of their driver & clubs for a particular golfer.  They don't pull components from various to manufactures to make a club to jump on a band wagon.  Even if they do go outside for components, it will be a certain specification just for XXIOs exclusive use.

By WRX box I meant that we, about 1% of the golfing community, are passionate about golf equipment and keeping up to date. Your personal global perspective is unique and respectable but, very few golfers have that. I only meant what I said relative to the other 99% not knowing the other driver exists. Some know what they see in golf shops and magazines and others barely know anything at all. My comment wasn't meant to be disrespectful in any way. This ties in to your second point as well. And even if this is the exact same head as the GBB Epic with a bonded hosel, gold paint and a bonded hosel, it might just be a smart new way of teaching this demographic that they shouldn't just be playing clubs similar to what the pros play. Golfers here in NA still think they should be playing an 8* driver and hit line drives that roll 40 yards. Traditionally, some may learn this through fitting and education but, this product and price point will spark a new conversation and the message will reach a lot more people than before.

To the XXIO point, I don't think Callaway has any misunderstandings about who they are, what they make, and who they make it for. I think that's exactly the point. They saw a brand come in here and create a sustainable and growing market that others may have ignored for too long. The point I think you're missing is that XXIO has little to no recognition here and VERY limited distribution. If a guy here even has the choice between the two, he's going to choose the Callaway driver over the brand that he can't even pronounce, let alone ever heard of before. Callaway just swooped in with a product to compete after the other guy took all the risk up front.

Edited by xjohnx, 14 September 2017 - 11:35 AM.


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#78 caloge

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 01:15 PM

Ultimately, I do not believe Callaway understands what makes xxio or pxg a success. My experience is anecdotal based upon knowing people who bag these clubs, but maybe i am wrong. Time will tell i suppose.

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#79 theshadow1971

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 01:25 PM

All good points xJohnx!

I do understand (as I live in Asia) that XXIO has very little recognition in NA as do many other brands from Japan have very to little to none for NA.  As well as other offerings here in Asia from Titliest, TM, Cleveland, Bridgestone, Srixon  have very limited exposure to NA as well.  Or Endo Forged can mean "Made in Thailand".

Part of XXIOs success in making their clubs (as Dscvrr St Louis noted) they make clubs where they design the shaft, head, grips in conjunction with each other from a holistic point of view, there is a whole design thought process at heart here (very Japanese).  The same goes for OnOff, Katana, all making drivers & irons with specially made shafts, grips etc from a wholistic view.

And yes whilst Callaway will tap into that market that XXIO is making a success of, by adding in lighter shafts to their driver heads.  A lot of XXIO success as well as other brands in Asia has been what I described above.

At the end of the day, whether a driver cost $500 to $2000 (as some do here in Asia cost) if more people in the golfing world can get to know that they are brands, options, products out there from other parts of the world that would suit their game more and make it that much more enjoyable.
It is forums like WRX that can help!

Edited by theshadow1971, 14 September 2017 - 01:34 PM.

Srixon (asian specs)

Z545 10.5* Driver
Z F45 15* 3W
Z H45 19* 3 Hybrid
Z745 3-PW

Z745 AW@51* & SW@57*

Cleveland Classic HB 2 Black Pearl Putter
Bridgestone B330RXS

19

#80 xjohnx

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 03:57 PM

View Posttheshadow1971, on 14 September 2017 - 01:25 PM, said:

All good points xJohnx!

I do understand (as I live in Asia) that XXIO has very little recognition in NA as do many other brands from Japan have very to little to none for NA.  As well as other offerings here in Asia from Titliest, TM, Cleveland, Bridgestone, Srixon  have very limited exposure to NA as well.  Or Endo Forged can mean "Made in Thailand".

Part of XXIOs success in making their clubs (as Dscvrr St Louis noted) they make clubs where they design the shaft, head, grips in conjunction with each other from a holistic point of view, there is a whole design thought process at heart here (very Japanese).  The same goes for OnOff, Katana, all making drivers & irons with specially made shafts, grips etc from a wholistic view.

And yes whilst Callaway will tap into that market that XXIO is making a success of, by adding in lighter shafts to their driver heads.  A lot of XXIO success as well as other brands in Asia has been what I described above.

At the end of the day, whether a driver cost $500 to $2000 (as some do here in Asia cost) if more people in the golfing world can get to know that they are brands, options, products out there from other parts of the world that would suit their game more and make it that much more enjoyable.
It is forums like WRX that can help!

You're absolutely right. The only thing holding 99% back from achieving the best performance for their game through equipment is education. Unfortunately this doesn't align with sales strategies and the bottom line for the major club companies.


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#81 sandy

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 06:03 PM

Beres is Honmas XXIO (Srixon). They do the same thing designing their clubs and shafts and grips (although many of the grips have golf pride on them they are unlike anything golf pride offers).  They have models for every classification pros, amateurs, seniors, females, people looking for conspicuous spending conversation pieces. What they have that the U. S. OEMs don't is their own shafts (many of which have equal or superior technology to today's $$$$ aftermarket proto shafts of the moment), no adjustability (watch the Wishon video on adjustable woods and see why the majority of PGA pros use the standard setting). You get 2 lofts 2 shafts for their woods, no choice on grips. They are willing to vary length + - 1/2 inch but you are stuck with the swing weight that generates. No interchangeable weights.  The U.S. markets seem to be pointed at selling equipment with millions of adjustable settings to golfers who are legends in their own minds, who try too hard to acquire "Tour" equipment. Yes U.S. OEMs offer senior, female, and equipment for the high handicapper but having that stuff in your bag is almost like a "golf walk of shame" Many of the posts in this thread are horrified at the prices, but would have no problem getting tour driver for $1,500 that they can't use..

Oh by the way for the posters that continue to insist the driver is $800 might want to check the website that says $699. Maybe they are discounting them already due to the outrage in this thread. Many of those South Korean ladies that regularly beat the U.S. pros like a drum play Honma/Beres.

Edited by sandy, 14 September 2017 - 06:12 PM.


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#82 golf1010

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 06:04 AM

Target group : rich guys with slow swing speed hmmm seems nonsensical

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#83 xjohnx

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 07:59 AM

 golf1010, on 15 September 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

Target group : rich guys with slow swing speed hmmm seems nonsensical

I'm assuming that was sarcastic? lol

If so, I'm agreeing with you 100% I think it's funny how people are so incapable of embracing ideas like this. The most significant change in the golf game in recent past was the introduction of an idea/club that was originally introduced as a replacement for hard to hit long irons. This was originally perceived as something for the "old guys" or hackers. Fast forward about 20 years and now we all have at least one in the bag. Why? Because for most of us, it just makes too much sense not to have one. I know that's kind of an extreme example but, you guys know what I'm saying.

I'm not a crazy high swing speed guy, but I am a high spin guy usually. After an eye-opening fitting this year I am a huge supporter of lighter shafts. I'm playing <60g in the driver and I never would have thought that I could increase my swing speed and still drop spin and improve my flight. The technology is making the shift and soon we'll all be playing lighter shafts than we think. If you can maintain stability and increase your clubhead speed>ball speed, of course you're going to now that driver heads are pretty much maxed out. We're all stubborn so this might take a while but, we'll see this trend continue, just watch. In a few years, very few people will be playing 75g shafts in drivers. Ball speed is king. If you can create consistent and desired launch conditions while increasing speed instantly, how much better can it get?

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#84 FairwayFred

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 10:47 AM

 xjohnx, on 15 September 2017 - 07:59 AM, said:

 golf1010, on 15 September 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

Target group : rich guys with slow swing speed hmmm seems nonsensical

I'm assuming that was sarcastic? lol

If so, I'm agreeing with you 100% I think it's funny how people are so incapable of embracing ideas like this. The most significant change in the golf game in recent past was the introduction of an idea/club that was originally introduced as a replacement for hard to hit long irons. This was originally perceived as something for the "old guys" or hackers. Fast forward about 20 years and now we all have at least one in the bag. Why? Because for most of us, it just makes too much sense not to have one. I know that's kind of an extreme example but, you guys know what I'm saying.

I'm not a crazy high swing speed guy, but I am a high spin guy usually. After an eye-opening fitting this year I am a huge supporter of lighter shafts. I'm playing <60g in the driver and I never would have thought that I could increase my swing speed and still drop spin and improve my flight. The technology is making the shift and soon we'll all be playing lighter shafts than we think. If you can maintain stability and increase your clubhead speed>ball speed, of course you're going to now that driver heads are pretty much maxed out. We're all stubborn so this might take a while but, we'll see this trend continue, just watch. In a few years, very few people will be playing 75g shafts in drivers. Ball speed is king. If you can create consistent and desired launch conditions while increasing speed instantly, how much better can it get?

Not everyone swings lighter shafts faster.  I've done tons of testing and somehow I swing a 75g shaft in my driver just as fast or faster than anything lighter.  I've seen others experience the same phenomenon.  I'm actually playing with a JDM Epic Star driver because I like the look of the slimmer hosel and found one that sets up perfect but I reshafted it with a Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo 2.
9* Callaway GBB Epic w Fujikura Speeder Platinum 6
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10.5* Callaway GBB Epic Sub Zero w Aldila Rogue MAX 75
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#85 xjohnx

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 11:21 AM

 FairwayFred, on 15 September 2017 - 10:47 AM, said:

 xjohnx, on 15 September 2017 - 07:59 AM, said:

 golf1010, on 15 September 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

Target group : rich guys with slow swing speed hmmm seems nonsensical

I'm assuming that was sarcastic? lol

If so, I'm agreeing with you 100% I think it's funny how people are so incapable of embracing ideas like this. The most significant change in the golf game in recent past was the introduction of an idea/club that was originally introduced as a replacement for hard to hit long irons. This was originally perceived as something for the "old guys" or hackers. Fast forward about 20 years and now we all have at least one in the bag. Why? Because for most of us, it just makes too much sense not to have one. I know that's kind of an extreme example but, you guys know what I'm saying.

I'm not a crazy high swing speed guy, but I am a high spin guy usually. After an eye-opening fitting this year I am a huge supporter of lighter shafts. I'm playing <60g in the driver and I never would have thought that I could increase my swing speed and still drop spin and improve my flight. The technology is making the shift and soon we'll all be playing lighter shafts than we think. If you can maintain stability and increase your clubhead speed>ball speed, of course you're going to now that driver heads are pretty much maxed out. We're all stubborn so this might take a while but, we'll see this trend continue, just watch. In a few years, very few people will be playing 75g shafts in drivers. Ball speed is king. If you can create consistent and desired launch conditions while increasing speed instantly, how much better can it get?

Not everyone swings lighter shafts faster.  I've done tons of testing and somehow I swing a 75g shaft in my driver just as fast or faster than anything lighter.  I've seen others experience the same phenomenon.  I'm actually playing with a JDM Epic Star driver because I like the look of the slimmer hosel and found one that sets up perfect but I reshafted it with a Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo 2.

Interesting. Couldn't that have more to do with the models/profiles of the shafts? I'm no expert so I really don't know. I would think if all things were equal, physics would allow the lighter shaft to be faster every time? I understand that it's not that simple, though. I appreciate you sharing your experience!


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#86 FairwayFred

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Posted 15 September 2017 - 05:41 PM

 xjohnx, on 15 September 2017 - 11:21 AM, said:

 FairwayFred, on 15 September 2017 - 10:47 AM, said:

 xjohnx, on 15 September 2017 - 07:59 AM, said:

 golf1010, on 15 September 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

Target group : rich guys with slow swing speed hmmm seems nonsensical

I'm assuming that was sarcastic? lol

If so, I'm agreeing with you 100% I think it's funny how people are so incapable of embracing ideas like this. The most significant change in the golf game in recent past was the introduction of an idea/club that was originally introduced as a replacement for hard to hit long irons. This was originally perceived as something for the "old guys" or hackers. Fast forward about 20 years and now we all have at least one in the bag. Why? Because for most of us, it just makes too much sense not to have one. I know that's kind of an extreme example but, you guys know what I'm saying.

I'm not a crazy high swing speed guy, but I am a high spin guy usually. After an eye-opening fitting this year I am a huge supporter of lighter shafts. I'm playing <60g in the driver and I never would have thought that I could increase my swing speed and still drop spin and improve my flight. The technology is making the shift and soon we'll all be playing lighter shafts than we think. If you can maintain stability and increase your clubhead speed>ball speed, of course you're going to now that driver heads are pretty much maxed out. We're all stubborn so this might take a while but, we'll see this trend continue, just watch. In a few years, very few people will be playing 75g shafts in drivers. Ball speed is king. If you can create consistent and desired launch conditions while increasing speed instantly, how much better can it get?

Not everyone swings lighter shafts faster.  I've done tons of testing and somehow I swing a 75g shaft in my driver just as fast or faster than anything lighter.  I've seen others experience the same phenomenon.  I'm actually playing with a JDM Epic Star driver because I like the look of the slimmer hosel and found one that sets up perfect but I reshafted it with a Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo 2.

Interesting. Couldn't that have more to do with the models/profiles of the shafts? I'm no expert so I really don't know. I would think if all things were equal, physics would allow the lighter shaft to be faster every time? I understand that it's not that simple, though. I appreciate you sharing your experience!

I think just like length there is a point of diminishing returns.  For me that appears to be around 75g.  I also swing 45" faster than 46" generally.  I have a friend who swings his 42.5" 3 wood w 95g shaft just as fast as his 45" driver w 60g shaft.  Id bet most people do swing lighter faster to a point but it's not something that works for everyone.
9* Callaway GBB Epic w Fujikura Speeder Platinum 6
9° Cobra LTD w/ Kuro Kage XT 70
10.5* Taylor Made Mini Driver Tour w Fujikura Motore Speeder 7.2
10.75* Nike Vapor TW w Aldila Rogue 125 MSI Tour
9.5* Taylor Made M1 440 w Kuro Kage TiNi 60
9* Callaway 816 DBD w Aldila Rogue i/o 60
9* Ping G LS Tech w Project X Handmade
10.5* A Grind Classic 350 w Oban Izawa 60
10.5* Callaway GBB Epic Sub Zero w Aldila Rogue MAX 75
9* Bridgestone Tour B XD7 w Fujikura Speeder Platinum 6
9.5* Mizuno JPX 900 w Ozik TP6HD
9.5* Nike Flex 440 w Kuro Kage XT 60
9.5* Taylor Made Tour Issue M2 w Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo 3
9.5* Taylor Made 2017 M2 w Fujikura Speeder 757 Evo 2

FREE AGENT CLUB HO

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