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Unable to get hips open at impact


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#1 Kball10

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 04:48 PM

My index is 3.4 - the lowest it has ever been - but I am unable to get my hips open at impact and have an early extension problem. These are not new issues, but I sure would like to correct them. I am only hitting a 3 wood off the tee 90% of the time as my misses with a driver are often unplayable.  Any good drills that I might help?


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#2 Cwebb

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 05:01 PM

Have you looked into your flexibility?  Sometimes it's a matter of simply not physically being able to dynamically put ourselves into a position

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#3 Kball10

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 05:05 PM

I have looked into my flexibility and it is likely part of the problem. I do stretch and do quite a bit of core work, but I am not very flexible. I have a history of low back issues.

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#4 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 05:06 PM

View PostKball10, on 02 September 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

My index is 3.4 - the lowest it has ever been - but I am unable to get my hips open at impact and have an early extension problem. These are not new issues, but I sure would like to correct them. I am only hitting a 3 wood off the tee 90% of the time as my misses with a driver are often unplayable.  Any good drills that I might help?

You have to correct why they are happening.  Your hips aren't opening and you EE for a reason.
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#5 Kball10

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 05:23 PM

View PostMonteScheinblum, on 02 September 2017 - 05:06 PM, said:

View PostKball10, on 02 September 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

My index is 3.4 - the lowest it has ever been - but I am unable to get my hips open at impact and have an early extension problem. These are not new issues, but I sure would like to correct them. I am only hitting a 3 wood off the tee 90% of the time as my misses with a driver are often unplayable.  Any good drills that I might help?

You have to correct why they are happening.  Your hips aren't opening and you EE for a reason.

Agreed - I am just not sure why it is happening. It seems like I can make the correct move in slow motion.


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#6 ryan983

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 05:36 PM

Going to be pretty tough to diagnose without a video of your swing.

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#7 Jasonic

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 06:06 PM

View PostKball10, on 02 September 2017 - 05:23 PM, said:

View PostMonteScheinblum, on 02 September 2017 - 05:06 PM, said:

View PostKball10, on 02 September 2017 - 04:48 PM, said:

My index is 3.4 - the lowest it has ever been - but I am unable to get my hips open at impact and have an early extension problem. These are not new issues, but I sure would like to correct them. I am only hitting a 3 wood off the tee 90% of the time as my misses with a driver are often unplayable.  Any good drills that I might help?

You have to correct why they are happening.  Your hips aren't opening and you EE for a reason.

Agreed - I am just not sure why it is happening. It seems like I can make the correct move in slow motion.

This drives me nuts. I do so much slow mo mirror work and it doesn't carry over. Slowly it is but frustrating nevertheless
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#8 moehogan

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 06:15 PM

Tough to comment without seeing your swing, but below is a drill to get the right hip moving in the DS.  The right hip won't quite get there, but the "feel" is to have the outside of the right hip and the right hand get to the ball at the same time.  First try to ingrain the feel without a ball, then try to add it, making sure to keep your right wrist extended (bent back) through impact.  



Still another feel to get the right hip moving in the DS is " right quad or right groin to target".  The initial leverage to start the right hip comes from your right foot push point ... the inside of the base knuckle of your right big toe, exactly where Hogan's extra spike was located.


Edited by moehogan, 02 September 2017 - 06:26 PM.


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#9 596

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 06:41 PM

Since my lead leg (left) is 1" longer then my right and a fake hip to boot, these tips should help me too.  I have a tough time getting "up onto" a leg that is 1" longer and fake.  The body some times does not feel that new hip.

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#10 Ghost of Snead

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 07:04 PM

IMO, flexibility has a lot to do with getting them open at impact but so does downswing sequencing and proper hip turn.

Some pros get them far more open than others ...



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#11 11bravoveteran

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 08:40 PM

I'm wondering if you tossed a club down range one handed with your right arm if your hips would be more open than when you swing?

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#12 Grayback1973

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 08:49 PM

View Postmoehogan, on 02 September 2017 - 06:15 PM, said:

Tough to comment without seeing your swing, but below is a drill to get the right hip moving in the DS.  The right hip won't quite get there, but the "feel" is to have the outside of the right hip and the right hand get to the ball at the same time.  First try to ingrain the feel without a ball, then try to add it, making sure to keep your right wrist extended (bent back) through impact.  



Still another feel to get the right hip moving in the DS is " right quad or right groin to target".  The initial leverage to start the right hip comes from your right foot push point ... the inside of the base knuckle of your right big toe, exactly where Hogan's extra spike was located.

Nice drill Moe.I always wonder why swinging right arm only makes the body work rotationally and yet when you add the left hand to the club it changes everything and that feel you have with right only goes away.Its like that left arm is this big limb getting in the way!
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#13 moehogan

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 09:56 PM

View PostGrayback1973, on 02 September 2017 - 08:49 PM, said:

View Postmoehogan, on 02 September 2017 - 06:15 PM, said:

Tough to comment without seeing your swing, but below is a drill to get the right hip moving in the DS.  The right hip won't quite get there, but the "feel" is to have the outside of the right hip and the right hand get to the ball at the same time.  First try to ingrain the feel without a ball, then try to add it, making sure to keep your right wrist extended (bent back) through impact.  



Still another feel to get the right hip moving in the DS is " right quad or right groin to target".  The initial leverage to start the right hip comes from your right foot push point ... the inside of the base knuckle of your right big toe, exactly where Hogan's extra spike was located.

Nice drill Moe.I always wonder why swinging right arm only makes the body work rotationally and yet when you add the left hand to the club it changes everything and that feel you have with right only goes away.Its like that left arm is this big limb getting in the way!

Excellent point, GB!  I think often it has to do with the upper left arm NOT disconnecting from the torso in transition.  Monte has brought this up on occasion.  In transition, the arms triangle (shoulder girdle and arms), needs to rotate CW, sending it to the right and creating right side bend, while the pivot takes the torso and hips CCW and left.  If the upper left arm doesn't separate from the chest, the arms triangle gets dragged OTT by the torso and hips.  Left arm eventually reattaches nearing delivery, catching the pivot, and everything goes around together!

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#14 Clambake

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Posted 02 September 2017 - 10:34 PM

View PostKball10, on 02 September 2017 - 05:23 PM, said:

Agreed - I am just not sure why it is happening. It seems like I can make the correct move in slow motion.

A golf club weighs under a pound, but during a swing can exert 70-80+ pounds of force. Big difference in the physical ability to move 1 pound around in slow-mo and swinging at speed. Perhaps a TPI analysis would help identify if there are physical issues driving your problem.

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#15 Grayback1973

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 12:11 AM

View Postmoehogan, on 02 September 2017 - 09:56 PM, said:

View PostGrayback1973, on 02 September 2017 - 08:49 PM, said:

View Postmoehogan, on 02 September 2017 - 06:15 PM, said:

Tough to comment without seeing your swing, but below is a drill to get the right hip moving in the DS.  The right hip won't quite get there, but the "feel" is to have the outside of the right hip and the right hand get to the ball at the same time.  First try to ingrain the feel without a ball, then try to add it, making sure to keep your right wrist extended (bent back) through impact.  



Still another feel to get the right hip moving in the DS is " right quad or right groin to target".  The initial leverage to start the right hip comes from your right foot push point ... the inside of the base knuckle of your right big toe, exactly where Hogan's extra spike was located.

Nice drill Moe.I always wonder why swinging right arm only makes the body work rotationally and yet when you add the left hand to the club it changes everything and that feel you have with right only goes away.Its like that left arm is this big limb getting in the way!

Excellent point, GB!  I think often it has to do with the upper left arm NOT disconnecting from the torso in transition.  Monte has brought this up on occasion.  In transition, the arms triangle (shoulder girdle and arms), needs to rotate CW, sending it to the right and creating right side bend, while the pivot takes the torso and hips CCW and left.  If the upper left arm doesn't separate from the chest, the arms triangle gets dragged OTT by the torso and hips.  Left arm eventually reattaches nearing delivery, catching the pivot, and everything goes around together!
Thanks for that response.It's a bizarre thing that the arms rotate open going back and don't(at least not until the unconscious hitting area if even that)rotate closed coming down.I am in the camp that believes the arms get the clubhead up and back down to the ball while it's the pivots job to get it around to the ball.But it can only happen that way if the arms perform correctly and nobody does it perfectly.Hope what I'm saying makes sense?I don't believe in a "pivot driven" swing the way most people think of what "pivot driven" means.That results in your point about the triangle getting dragged over.There has to be separation of arms and body but they must work together.The swing is very strange.

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#16 Cwebb

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 01:50 AM

View PostKball10, on 02 September 2017 - 05:05 PM, said:

I have looked into my flexibility and it is likely part of the problem. I do stretch and do quite a bit of core work, but I am not very flexible. I have a history of low back issues.

I think it stops right here.  The odds of anyone pulling off the move you're looking for to that extent, is pretty slim, if not flexible and with lower back issues.  Unless you're Fred Couples.....although he's pretty flexible, despite the chronic back issues he's had over his career

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#17 Golfbeat

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 02:16 AM

Monte told me that mostly this is not about flexibility but it is because of a wrong transition move. He said that often if you stay closed longer in transition you will open better in the follow thru. I have personally experienced that this is very true.
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#18 Lefthook

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 05:56 AM

Almost certainly not a flexibility issue.

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#19 Kball10

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 07:37 AM

Attached is a video - it is old, but very representative.

Tried to upload - getting message not permitted to upload this kind of file

What is the trick to uploading a video

Edited by Kball10, 03 September 2017 - 07:43 AM.


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#20 Ghost of Snead

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 07:51 AM

View PostKball10, on 03 September 2017 - 07:37 AM, said:

Attached is a video - it is old, but very representative.

Tried to upload - getting message not permitted to upload this kind of file

What is the trick to uploading a video

Post it to Youtube and then insert as a link with just the http.


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#21 Kball10

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:16 AM



Video link attached

Edited by Kball10, 03 September 2017 - 08:24 AM.


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#22 Ghost of Snead

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:19 AM

View PostKball10, on 03 September 2017 - 08:16 AM, said:

https://youtu.be/hhsh1HB5O4M

Video link attached

If you post it without the 's' in https, it should embed.

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#23 Kball10

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:25 AM

View PostGhost of Snead, on 03 September 2017 - 08:19 AM, said:

View PostKball10, on 03 September 2017 - 08:16 AM, said:

https://youtu.be/hhsh1HB5O4M

Video link attached

If you post it without the 's' in https, it should embed.

Thanks - first time posting a video to this site

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#24 Ghost of Snead

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:35 AM

In addition to Moe's drill, have a look at this hip direction drill from Monte.


Edited by Ghost of Snead, 03 September 2017 - 08:36 AM.


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#25 Silky

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:42 AM

The mantra is swinging from the ground up. Just as the pelvis torques against the ground through the legs to rotate, the torso torques against the pelvis to rotate.  If the torso is fired prematurely, the firing torque is against the opening rotation of the pelvis.


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#26 MonteScheinblum

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:54 AM

View PostKball10, on 03 September 2017 - 08:16 AM, said:



Video link attached

There are a few reasons you aren't getting Your hips more open.

Turn is too flat as a result of flat shoulder turn, right knee maintaining too much flex and wrist rolling instead of hanging.  In transition your arms trail your rotation and you have to stop rotating to let arms catch up.  

If your hips got More open, you wouldn't be a very good golfer.  As it's stands, you are probably a decent golfer.

This still pretty much tells the tale.

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#27 Hilts1969

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Posted 03 September 2017 - 08:59 AM

View PostKball10, on 03 September 2017 - 08:16 AM, said:



Video link attached

It's the swing not flexibility, look how much your arms are jammed into your body. Left arm stuck to pec, right arm jammed into you side. I would imagine if you kept turning you would miss the ball on the inside by quite a margin.

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#28 Golfjack

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Posted 04 September 2017 - 03:52 AM

Yeah that's the swing.  BTW getting the hips open is a whole can of worms I'm not sure you want opened.  I went from playing decent (for me) to totally up and down unpredictably as I've been trying to figure it out.  You lost distance, your accuracy comes and goes (though I like the ball flight much better).  And sometimes you just revert back to old habits.  I'm starting to get it more, but it sure has taken some work to get more used to it.  You've gotten to be a pretty good golfer using your old swing.  You sure you want to destroy that?  lol.
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#29 Kball10

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Posted 07 September 2017 - 03:51 PM

View PostGolfjack, on 04 September 2017 - 03:52 AM, said:

Yeah that's the swing.  BTW getting the hips open is a whole can of worms I'm not sure you want opened.  I went from playing decent (for me) to totally up and down unpredictably as I've been trying to figure it out.  You lost distance, your accuracy comes and goes (though I like the ball flight much better).  And sometimes you just revert back to old habits.  I'm starting to get it more, but it sure has taken some work to get more used to it.  You've gotten to be a pretty good golfer using your old swing.  You sure you want to destroy that?  lol.

Yes I am concerned it could really mess up my game. I am going to experiment a little bit and see what happens. Shot 74 on Monday trying to get my backswing on a steeper plane and get my hips turning properly. Hit the ball fairly well, but had a few misses that were very unusual.  Having said that, as well as I have been playing with my current swing every once and awhile off the tee I can hit it masssively fat - likely a result of early extending and dumping the club into the ground by releasing my right hand too soon.

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#30 moonshine

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Posted 07 September 2017 - 04:10 PM

Skip rocks at your favorite pond as much as you can and mimic that move on the range.  Also, hitting into that net would run me nuts.  I would rather hit 50 balls and see it than wonder about it all night hitting into a net.

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