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JDM Wedges - Miura, Epon, Fourteen


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#1 benzenbe

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Posted 11 August 2017 - 04:31 PM

Looking to get fitted next week, wanted to know if any has any insight on JDM Wedges, specifically:
  • Miura, in particular the Y, K, C Grinds
  • Epon Tour
  • Fourteen, either the RM-22 or RM Tour

Also, please feel free to compare them against the mainstream offerings (e.g., Cleveland, Titleist Vokeys, Callaway Mack Daddys)

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Titleist Vokey SM6 (56* and 60*) with KBS 610

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#2 MysteryV

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Posted 11 August 2017 - 10:31 PM

I just bought my third Fourteen wedge from Will at People's Clubs (forum sponsor I believe).  All are Tour Raw with KBS Black shafts and in all honesty, I've never hit a wedge that felt better.  The only clubs that feel even close to as good are my Epon 302s.  I'm also a huge fan of the shape as they just look right to me, unlike Clevelands which just never seemed to set up right.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I believe I read Endo actually does some of the forging for Fourteen.  Regardless, I'm sure Miura and Epon make great wedges, but it's tough to compete with the tour raw Fourteens.
Driver: GBB Epic 9.5 w/ GD AD-TP
3 Wood: Epic 3+ w/ GD AD-DI
Hybrid: Epic 4H w/ GD AD-DI
Irons: Epon 302 w/ Modus 120
Wedges: Miura K Grind 56,60 w/ Modus Wedge
Putter: Byron Morgan DH89 GSS

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#3 LionGolfer

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Posted 12 August 2017 - 02:06 AM

 MysteryV, on 11 August 2017 - 10:31 PM, said:

I just bought my third Fourteen wedge from Will at People's Clubs (forum sponsor I believe).  All are Tour Raw with KBS Black shafts and in all honesty, I've never hit a wedge that felt better.  The only clubs that feel even close to as good are my Epon 302s.  I'm also a huge fan of the shape as they just look right to me, unlike Clevelands which just never seemed to set up right.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I believe I read Endo actually does some of the forging for Fourteen.  Regardless, I'm sure Miura and Epon make great wedges, but it's tough to compete with the tour raw Fourteens.

I'm not sure but I think Fourteen has never been Endo but in the past Himeji....Now it could be outsourced to China.
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Irons : BuchiVS200-ModartCBC-Mystery913-PXG311T
Wedges : GrindStudio-Modart-OrionTypeS
Putters : Benock-BPutters-DesignTuning-Machine-Masda-Nead-Slighter-Xenon


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#4 flopshot99

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Posted 12 August 2017 - 09:10 AM

Fourteen has a couple of irons that are endo..i agree wedges are not.

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#5 Fourteen14

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:20 PM

We do have some of our Irons forged by Endo, the FH-900 and TC-606. As far as the wedges go, they are forged in various forging houses across Asia depending on the model. All final grinding, finishing, and all quality control is done in Japan.


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#6 95124hacker

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Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:57 PM

 Fourteen14, on 15 August 2017 - 06:20 PM, said:

We do have some of our Irons forged by Endo, the FH-900 and TC-606. As far as the wedges go, they are forged in various forging houses across Asia depending on the model. All final grinding, finishing, and all quality control is done in Japan.

I have a set of 2009 Japan released TC-770's.  Are those Endo?

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#7 Fourteen14

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Posted 16 August 2017 - 10:50 AM

 95124hacker, on 15 August 2017 - 06:57 PM, said:

 Fourteen14, on 15 August 2017 - 06:20 PM, said:

We do have some of our Irons forged by Endo, the FH-900 and TC-606. As far as the wedges go, they are forged in various forging houses across Asia depending on the model. All final grinding, finishing, and all quality control is done in Japan.

I have a set of 2009 Japan released TC-770's.  Are those Endo?
The TC-770 was not forged by Endo.

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#8 FairwayGolfUSA.com

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Posted 30 September 2017 - 02:07 PM

We really recommend Fourteen RM-22 wedge to our customer that are willing to spend the extra buck.

Check out our Fourteen collection ------------> http://www.fairwaygo...main_page=index
Fairway Golf Online Store :golfer:
Website: http://www.fairwaygolfusa.com
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#9 Norboo

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Posted 30 September 2017 - 02:22 PM

 MysteryV, on 11 August 2017 - 10:31 PM, said:

I just bought my third Fourteen wedge from Will at People's Clubs (forum sponsor I believe).  All are Tour Raw with KBS Black shafts and in all honesty, I've never hit a wedge that felt better.  The only clubs that feel even close to as good are my Epon 302s.  I'm also a huge fan of the shape as they just look right to me, unlike Clevelands which just never seemed to set up right.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I believe I read Endo actually does some of the forging for Fourteen.  Regardless, I'm sure Miura and Epon make great wedges, but it's tough to compete with the tour raw Fourteens.

Raw feel softer than regular?  Does it wear faster?  Does it rust?
Driver: G20 (hard to replace, not from lack of trying)
Mini Driver: Taylormade SLDR 14*
Fairway: Ping G400 5 wood 17.5*
Hybrid: Ping G400 19* and 22* stock shaft
Irons: OnOff 2015 Model with Recoil 680 F4
Wedges: Scor 50* and Callaway MD PM 58* with TT Black Gold
Holy Grail: Honma CB8055 (since 1989)
Ball: TaylorMade TP (2014)
Grip: MCC with 1.5 wraps

Backup:  
Ping Rapture V2 4 wood
Callaway Fusion 5 wood.
TEE EX9 Tour 17* with Rough Silver 70

Club builder/fitter hobbyists since 1997
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#10 Fourteen14

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Posted 02 October 2017 - 11:22 AM

 Norboo, on 30 September 2017 - 02:22 PM, said:

 MysteryV, on 11 August 2017 - 10:31 PM, said:

I just bought my third Fourteen wedge from Will at People's Clubs (forum sponsor I believe).  All are Tour Raw with KBS Black shafts and in all honesty, I've never hit a wedge that felt better.  The only clubs that feel even close to as good are my Epon 302s.  I'm also a huge fan of the shape as they just look right to me, unlike Clevelands which just never seemed to set up right.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong - but I believe I read Endo actually does some of the forging for Fourteen.  Regardless, I'm sure Miura and Epon make great wedges, but it's tough to compete with the tour raw Fourteens.

Raw feel softer than regular?  Does it wear faster?  Does it rust?

All of the above.

Because there is no plating on the wedge the feel is much softer. The only down side to this is that because there is no plating, the wedge can wear a little faster than one of our chrome plated wedges. We do utilize a specialized steel for our wedges that increases the durability while still providing ultimate feel.

Because of the raw nature of the wedges they will rust. This is the preferred finish for our tour staff, once the wedges start to rust it provides a fantastic low glare patina.


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#11 Norboo

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Posted 03 October 2017 - 11:18 AM

How are the Fourteen RM-22 58* out of the bunkers and around the green?  I wish they had 58* with 10* bounce.
Driver: G20 (hard to replace, not from lack of trying)
Mini Driver: Taylormade SLDR 14*
Fairway: Ping G400 5 wood 17.5*
Hybrid: Ping G400 19* and 22* stock shaft
Irons: OnOff 2015 Model with Recoil 680 F4
Wedges: Scor 50* and Callaway MD PM 58* with TT Black Gold
Holy Grail: Honma CB8055 (since 1989)
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#12 Fourteen14

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Posted 03 October 2017 - 12:59 PM

 Norboo, on 03 October 2017 - 11:18 AM, said:

How are the Fourteen RM-22 58* out of the bunkers and around the green?  I wish they had 58* with 10* bounce.

We do offer the RM-22 58 degree in stock 2 bounce options, 58/08 and 58/12. The 58/12 is going to be the more versatile option because of the delta sole and cutting edge muscle design.

We also offer some hand ground custom options for the RM-22 Tour Raw wedges on our website. This could be a way to get the sole option that you like.
http://www.fourteeng...uct=RM22TOURRAW

Here is an example of our hand ground C-grind sole,
IMG_0472.jpg IMG_0463.jpg

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#13 Norboo

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Posted 03 October 2017 - 03:05 PM

 Fourteen14, on 03 October 2017 - 12:59 PM, said:

 Norboo, on 03 October 2017 - 11:18 AM, said:

How are the Fourteen RM-22 58* out of the bunkers and around the green?  I wish they had 58* with 10* bounce.

We do offer the RM-22 58 degree in stock 2 bounce options, 58/08 and 58/12. The 58/12 is going to be the more versatile option because of the delta sole and cutting edge muscle design.

We also offer some hand ground custom options for the RM-22 Tour Raw wedges on our website. This could be a way to get the sole option that you like.
http://www.fourteeng...uct=RM22TOURRAW

Here is an example of our hand ground C-grind sole,
IMG_0472.jpg IMG_0463.jpg

Only concern with 12* bounce, it's harder to flop and 8* wil be harder to hit out of fluffy sand.  I can't justify getting a custom wedge when they last about two seasons max.
Driver: G20 (hard to replace, not from lack of trying)
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Fairway: Ping G400 5 wood 17.5*
Hybrid: Ping G400 19* and 22* stock shaft
Irons: OnOff 2015 Model with Recoil 680 F4
Wedges: Scor 50* and Callaway MD PM 58* with TT Black Gold
Holy Grail: Honma CB8055 (since 1989)
Ball: TaylorMade TP (2014)
Grip: MCC with 1.5 wraps

Backup:  
Ping Rapture V2 4 wood
Callaway Fusion 5 wood.
TEE EX9 Tour 17* with Rough Silver 70

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#14 dmeeksDC

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Posted 03 October 2017 - 10:14 PM

Not a big deal to flop a wedge with 12 degrees of bounce. Check out Phil Mickelson's short game vids: He hits famous flops and is a major believer that bounce is your friend. Says it all the time. He plays a 56.13 and even his lob is a 60.10. Some pros play lobs with 4 or 6 degrees bounce, but Phil is always at 10 or more.

How often do you hit flops? Not a shot I go to frequently because I don't practice it ever. I'd go for versatility -- get the 58.12 and not worry about it. Not likely to hinder you. I have a 58.12 degree RM12 and can hit any shot with it. Excellent out of the bunker. The RM12 has quite a cult following, one of the all-time great wedges.

Edited by dmeeksDC, 03 October 2017 - 10:20 PM.

Current lineup:

TM M1 440 Tour Issue, 10-degree, Diamana B Series X,
67g.
Nike Flex 3 wood, Diamana S-70 stiff
Callaway Epic 5W, Hzrdus T800 S, 65g.
Callaway Apex hybrid, 20 degree, Kuro Kage 80HY stiff shaft
Mizuno MP-59, 4-P, PX 5.5
(Coming: Srixon z565 4 iron, z965 5-P, C Taper Lite X.)
Ping Glide 50, 54, CFS wedge shafts
Fourteen RM12 58/12 sand wedge
Edel Rogue putter (thick blade), 34 inch.

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#15 boycer11

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Posted 04 October 2017 - 10:08 AM

I had the miura, now have the 2017 vokey forged and they feel great. But I'm still debating epon tour, fourteen and mizuno s18.

Ping g400 10.5
Callaway gbb epic sz 3 wood
Ping g400 5 wd rogue black 7s
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Mizuno jpx 900 hotmetal nippon 105
Miura 54/58 nippon modus custom
TM jdm spider

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#16 Jarlaxle

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Posted 04 October 2017 - 03:03 PM

I am very happy with my Miura wedges.

51* Y grind - Primary scoring club from 115 to 100 yards, occasionally play chip and run shots with it but not very often. Probably my single favorite club to hit in the hole bag.
55* C grind - Full swing is a perfect 100 yard club, use it for almost all shots between 25 and 100 yards.
60* K grind - Use for all short game shots including bunker shots but only rarely play it further than 25 yards.  A full swing would go about 70 yards but am more comfortable using the 55* for that kind of yardage.

Not sure if this helps you at all but my wedge game has improved significantly using the Miuras.  Always feel like I have the right club for every shot.

Edited by Jarlaxle, 04 October 2017 - 08:39 PM.

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Miura Y Grind 51 w/ Project X 5.5
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#17 dmeeksDC

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Posted 06 October 2017 - 09:17 PM

 Jarlaxle, on 04 October 2017 - 03:03 PM, said:

I am very happy with my Miura wedges.

51* Y grind - Primary scoring club from 115 to 100 yards, occasionally play chip and run shots with it but not very often. Probably my single favorite club to hit in the whole bag.

It is amazing how many references I see to the Miura Y grind being a favorite of whoever plays it. Seems like it must be a standout wedge grind. Going to have to try one someday.
Current lineup:

TM M1 440 Tour Issue, 10-degree, Diamana B Series X,
67g.
Nike Flex 3 wood, Diamana S-70 stiff
Callaway Epic 5W, Hzrdus T800 S, 65g.
Callaway Apex hybrid, 20 degree, Kuro Kage 80HY stiff shaft
Mizuno MP-59, 4-P, PX 5.5
(Coming: Srixon z565 4 iron, z965 5-P, C Taper Lite X.)
Ping Glide 50, 54, CFS wedge shafts
Fourteen RM12 58/12 sand wedge
Edel Rogue putter (thick blade), 34 inch.

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#18 kyle75

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Posted 07 October 2017 - 06:27 PM

I recently bought a Fourteen Tour Raw 58 wedge from Will Peoples and it is phenomenal.  I love the feel of this wedge and the sole is so versatile.  I can't recommend this club enough.

Edited by kyle75, 07 October 2017 - 06:27 PM.


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#19 boycer11

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Posted 20 October 2017 - 08:12 AM

What about Vega?
Ping g400 10.5
Callaway gbb epic sz 3 wood
Ping g400 5 wd rogue black 7s
Ping g400 4 hybrid
Mizuno jpx 900 hotmetal nippon 105
Miura 54/58 nippon modus custom
TM jdm spider

19

#20 Jmx

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Posted Today, 12:16 AM

 FairwayGolfUSA.com, on 30 September 2017 - 02:07 PM, said:

We really recommend Fourteen RM-22 wedge to our customer that are willing to spend the extra buck.

Check out our Fourteen collection ------------> http://www.fairwaygo...main_page=index

My friend games these, look/feel like nothing else.


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#21 theshadow1971

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Posted Today, 04:08 AM

What  about Miura's MG-M01 one of their latest wedges, or MG-S01 or their MB-5000, WA, WB or WC series!
Or Miura Hagane Series.

The are available in several grinds, finishes available and a whole other assortment of customisation.

See this shop below In Japan  the link is for MG-S01 Miura wedges, it will show you the customisation you can order, which is done by Miura.

http://www.one2one.j....cgi?code=mgs01

Also you can see brands on this site for Orion, ZiZi, Zodia and whole host of Japanese niche brands for irons, woods etc etc.

One interesting thing to see for Miura fans on the above site the CB1007 irons have 3 different models, "stock", "Y-Grind", and "MG" (Muscle Grind).
Srixon (asian specs)

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Z F45 15* 3W
Z H45 19* 3 Hybrid
Z745 3-PW

Z745 AW@51* & SW@57*

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Bridgestone B330RXS

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#22 theshadow1971

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Posted Today, 04:13 AM

 Fourteen14, on 15 August 2017 - 06:20 PM, said:

We do have some of our Irons forged by Endo, the FH-900 and TC-606. As far as the wedges go, they are forged in various forging houses across Asia depending on the model. All final grinding, finishing, and all quality control is done in Japan.

Care to share exactly where your irons are forged, which countries for which models.
So us consumers of golfing products can make informed decisions whether it is ENDO forged in Japan or Thailand, or forged in Taiwan or Mainland China!
Srixon (asian specs)

Z545 10.5* Driver
Z F45 15* 3W
Z H45 19* 3 Hybrid
Z745 3-PW

Z745 AW@51* & SW@57*

Cleveland Classic HB 2 Black Pearl Putter
Bridgestone B330RXS

22



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