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Ping G400 LS Tec Review


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#31 MtlJeff

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Posted 25 July 2017 - 07:10 PM

View PostsTmGolfer, on 25 July 2017 - 07:06 PM, said:

View PostMtlJeff, on 25 July 2017 - 06:06 PM, said:

G LS Tec is a monster driver.....looking forward to hitting the G400 version

I found the G400 LST to not be as fade bias (good for me, not for some). I played the G SF Tec previously and went with the G400 LST. Could never turn over the G LST but much easier time hitting the G400 straight.

A 2yd draw is the closest i can hit to a fade. LOL

So i have no idea what a fade biased driver is because i haven't hit a fade since like 2012

But i love the G LS ....with the tour shaft it's the highest launching truly low spin setup i've hit.

Ping G LS Tec 9 w/Tour 65
Callaway XR Pro 14 w/Diamana D+ 80
Ping G20 Hybrid 17 w/S300
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#32 rainkingjr

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 01:24 AM

View PostMBBG, on 22 July 2017 - 08:07 PM, said:

View Postrainkingjr, on 22 July 2017 - 06:21 PM, said:

View PostLobber, on 22 July 2017 - 12:02 PM, said:

View Postrainkingjr, on 22 July 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

I have two opportunities to hit the G400LST now. 10 degree set at standard with the Tour 65 shaft.  I absolutely love my G30LST with the Tour 65. In fact, I tried the G LST with the same same (which I liked well enough) but went back to the 30. The G400 is definitely threatening the G30LST. I'm not sure I'll pick up any significant distance. Drivers are maxed out so it's really a matter of finding the right head/shaft combo. The appeal for me is the smaller size, improved sound and I find the G400 easier to draw when needed.

Drivers Maxed Out?  What about me?  I am 60 and I don't hit it as far as I used too(:!

Driver technology has been maxed out. All marketing now.


Yet here we have a driver that reduces drag for increased club head speed and lots of reports of higher ball speeds with said driver.

Gee, make it smaller and you can swing it a little faster. Not quite a novel idea. I'm one of biggest Ping fanboys around. I'm not bashing them at all. The G400 line is awesome and I'm pretty confident that I'll end up with a LS in the bag in the very near future. With that being said, I won't be surprised one bit if when I take my G30LS in to hit it head to head with the G400LS, an I end up hitting them the same distance. Feel and dispersion can be a different story so we'll see.
Ping G30 LS tec 9 degree Tour 65 stiff
Ping G20 3 wood TFC159F Tour stiff
Ping G20 3 hybrid TFC169H Tour stiff
Ping S55 Black dot 4-PW CFS stiff
Ping Tour Gorge 50SS, 54SS and 58SS
Ping Anser Milled 2
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#33 rainkingjr

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 01:37 AM

View Postpinestreetgolf, on 24 July 2017 - 09:24 AM, said:

View Postrainkingjr, on 22 July 2017 - 06:21 PM, said:

View PostLobber, on 22 July 2017 - 12:02 PM, said:

View Postrainkingjr, on 22 July 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

I have two opportunities to hit the G400LST now. 10 degree set at standard with the Tour 65 shaft.  I absolutely love my G30LST with the Tour 65. In fact, I tried the G LST with the same same (which I liked well enough) but went back to the 30. The G400 is definitely threatening the G30LST. I'm not sure I'll pick up any significant distance. Drivers are maxed out so it's really a matter of finding the right head/shaft combo. The appeal for me is the smaller size, improved sound and I find the G400 easier to draw when needed.

Drivers Maxed Out?  What about me?  I am 60 and I don't hit it as far as I used too(:!

Driver technology has been maxed out. All marketing now.

Nonsense.  Its just been a bit since someone has come up with something amazing.  A decade isn't that long in golf terms for a huge leap in performance.  Everyone thought wedges were wedges until the 588.  Everyone thought woods were woods until Taylormade gave them a metal face.

There will be another massive breakthrough in either the shaft or the head, and none of us know what it is yet.  The R7 (first driver with perimeter weights and last one i would call a game changer) was only 13 years ago.  Most golf innovations are way more spread out than 13 years (for example, the hybrid is only 16 years old).

But COR's been maxed out!  Don't care.  They are super smart guys.  They will think of something.  We just don't know when.

Whatever.
Ping G30 LS tec 9 degree Tour 65 stiff
Ping G20 3 wood TFC159F Tour stiff
Ping G20 3 hybrid TFC169H Tour stiff
Ping S55 Black dot 4-PW CFS stiff
Ping Tour Gorge 50SS, 54SS and 58SS
Ping Anser Milled 2
Snell MTB

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#34 Z1ggy16

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 05:46 AM

I can't tell from the specs, but is this fade biased due to the standard lie angle, or is there literally more weighting on the toe side? I ask because I heard Ping (and also Cobra) have pretty much neutral face angles on the standard loft setting, but that lie angle is lower to help the better players avoid the over draw. The head between LS and regular G400 seems exactly the same except the weight in the LS is moved up a bit?
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#35 MBBG

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 05:57 AM

Weighting a club to the extreme rear or rear and heel side typically increases a club's dynamic loft at impact as well as its gravity angle, which increases draw bias. Moving weight forward has the opposite effect.

Ping G400 LS Tec 8.5 Alta CB
M2 T3 DF Speeder Evo II 661X
RomaRo Type R 18* UT Nunchuk .370
Srixon U45 23* i95 Steelfiber
Mizuno Yoro MP-5 5-P Nippon Modus 125
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#36 Lobber

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 10:43 AM

I can hit fades or draws with the 400 LS.  Typically ball flight is straight with LS but I can maneuver at will.

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#37 3woodvt

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 01:02 PM

took an opportunity today while vacationing in FL to compare the Epic Zero vs the Ping G400LS with the stock Tour shaft in X from Ping (nice shaft by the way) against the zero with an X in the Fuji Pro.  Zero at 9* and G400LS at 7.5.
Ping launched higher at 7.5 than the Zero and was consistently straiter and avg 8 yards more carry than the Callaway offering.  Zero rolled out better and closed the overall avg to 5 yards behind the Ping.  I never tried lofting up with the Callaway as I was not a fan at all of the feel of this club.  It is very Harsh imo.  It has a dead hard feel to this head that is not appealing at all to me.  The Ping SS was better as well up 1.2 mph on avg and Balls speeds were higher with the Ping as well (+0.7 avg).  Pretty sound beating of the Epic subzero by the 400LS tech as well in lower spin, ball speeds, carry, and overall distance.

The biggest factors with Ping's win, the Ping feels so much better than the Sub zero and was much more accurate as the 7.5 Ping just went strait consistently and the sub zero has a soft fade consistent as well.  Spin avg 2100 with the LS and 2350 with the Callaway. SS avg 104 with subzero and 105 with the Ping.

Appearance is so subjective that all I can say is they both frame the ball very nicely.  I'd call this even or leave it up to each individual to see what he likes.  I'm not a fan of the green at all but the club did set up nice at address from Callaway.  I'm currently playing a Ping G LS so I have no problems with the new head.

Ping defeated the Callaway Sub zero epic in every area for this scratch golfer.  Looks like the Ping G400LS will be an Epic Killer.

Edited by 3woodvt, 26 July 2017 - 01:05 PM.

Ping G LS 9* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D3 44 3/4
Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS TourS 120 D1
Cleveland 2.0 50,**54**,59* D3
Ping Zing TR 35" Lamkin Deep Etched Chord
Srixon Z Star.
Lamkin Wrap Tech Midsize

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#38 misplacedtexan83

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 01:25 PM

Opposite for me... Epic was carrying the G400 by 10 easily and perform better in most categories.

However, G400 is a phenomenal club and launched so easy. Stunning to look at and a nice sound/feel.

PING has a winner on their hands for sure but epic killer is a stretch.

It is a must try for sure for anyone curious or bored.

9* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ XTORISON COPPER 60S ** 13.5* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ HZDRUS 65 S

20* Callaway EPIC Hybrid w/ Recoil 780 S

  5-A Callaway Steelhead Pros w/Ctaper Lite S
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#39 3woodvt

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 01:51 PM

View Postmisplacedtexan83, on 26 July 2017 - 01:25 PM, said:

Opposite for me... Epic was carrying the G400 by 10 easily and perform better in most categories.

However, G400 is a phenomenal club and launched so easy. Stunning to look at and a nice sound/feel.

PING has a winner on their hands for sure but epic killer is a stretch.

It is a must try for sure for anyone curious or bored.
True True.  Eveyone has different reactions but it was a clear win for Ping in my head to head.  I wanted to see the gains others experienced with Epic but very disappointing for me.  Not very accurate and the yardage gains were negative for me.  I feel a lot others will tire of the 5 yards here 5 yards there argument but the accuracy is the true test of a Driver and it's really not a fair fight in that regards.  No debating the Ping has the highest MOI of anything on the market by quite a bit as well.  I will be curious to see how much on the next release of that sight that measures these types of things.

For those reading I will say this.  I've played Ping for about 5-6 years now with the driver and most will have to loft down to get their increased distance results (kinda opposite of the SLDR thing a few years ago).  With a Driver this forgiving your gains will be seen with lower lofts.  I'd expect if I hit this thing in a 9.5 degree it would spin to much for the exceptional distance I get out of 7.5.  But with exceptional distance and strait ball after strait ball it's hard to see any other driver getting close to beating this one.....and I haven't even bought it yet....  If l'd loft up I'd probably never miss a fairway but then it would probably give up 10+ yards of carry.  Epic Killer for me and I expect quite a few others once they figure out they can loft down.
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Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
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#40 chisag

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 06:44 PM

View Post3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 01:02 PM, said:

took an opportunity today while vacationing in FL to compare the Epic Zero vs the Ping G400LS with the stock Tour shaft in X from Ping (nice shaft by the way) against the zero with an X in the Fuji Pro.  Zero at 9* and G400LS at 7.5.
Ping launched higher at 7.5 than the Zero and was consistently straiter and avg 8 yards more carry than the Callaway offering.  Zero rolled out better and closed the overall avg to 5 yards behind the Ping. I never tried lofting up with the Callaway as I was not a fan at all of the feel of this club.  It is very Harsh imo.  It has a dead hard feel to this head that is not appealing at all to me. The Ping SS was better as well up 1.2 mph on avg and Balls speeds were higher with the Ping as well (+0.7 avg).  Pretty sound beating of the Epic subzero by the 400LS tech as well in lower spin, ball speeds, carry, and overall distance.

The biggest factors with Ping's win, the Ping feels so much better than the Sub zero and was much more accurate as the 7.5 Ping just went strait consistently and the sub zero has a soft fade consistent as well.  Spin avg 2100 with the LS and 2350 with the Callaway. SS avg 104 with subzero and 105 with the Ping.

Appearance is so subjective that all I can say is they both frame the ball very nicely.  I'd call this even or leave it up to each individual to see what he likes.  I'm not a fan of the green at all but the club did set up nice at address from Callaway.  I'm currently playing a Ping G LS so I have no problems with the new head.

Ping defeated the Callaway Sub zero epic in every area for this scratch golfer.  Looks like the Ping G400LS will be an Epic Killer.

... I don't know how old you are, but seems like people are split on the feel of the Epic. Younger golfers don't seem to like it and older golfers seem to love it. In fact, I think it is the best feeling driver I have ever hit. Ever. And that is a lot of drives going back to McGregor M85's. I have never gotten along with Ping drivers but bought the original LS Tec because I hit it so well at the PGA show demo day and the sound was somewhat masked with a million people hitting balls. Hated it on the course and it was obviously more mental than physical but I sprayed it all over the place and sold it after one round. And I just don't think I could live with the AFA* crown of the 400 LS.

... Moot point actually as I am hitting the Epic with a Rogue Black Tour 110 as straight as any driver I have owned and longer than any driver as well. Not 5 yds but a good 10+ which is a huge and pleasant surprise for me. The irony, is I have also never gotten along with Callaway clubs and have never played any including their drivers. But when I hit the Epic at a demo day I was smitten by the sound and feel.  When I write reviews I always keep people like you in mind, because we have almost the opposite taste for sound and feel so I am always careful to attempt to describe the dense/solid/persimmon like feel and add those that like a more explosive sound/feel may not like the feel/sound of a driver like the Epic.

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Edited by chisag, 26 July 2017 - 07:10 PM.

10.5* Epic Rogue Black Tour 110  60s
17.5* Aeroburner Yardbird Kuro Kage 70s
19.5* Cobra King Utility Rogue Black 85hs
21.5* RBZ Tour Altus 85HYs
5-pw Cobra King Forged Tour Recoil Prototype 95's
48* Nike Forged Combo Recoil 110's
54/60 Nike Forged/Engage Recoil 110's
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#41 MtlJeff

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 06:45 PM

Heck the Ping G LS Tec replaced the Epic SZ for me. So if the G400 can't then it's a step back for Ping :)

Granted, the G wasn't longer but good lord Pings are forgiving.
Ping G LS Tec 9 w/Tour 65
Callaway XR Pro 14 w/Diamana D+ 80
Ping G20 Hybrid 17 w/S300
Callaway Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
Callaway MD Forged 52,56,60 w/S200
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#42 misplacedtexan83

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 07:44 PM

View PostMtlJeff, on 26 July 2017 - 06:45 PM, said:

Heck the Ping G LS Tec replaced the Epic SZ for me. So if the G400 can't then it's a step back for Ping :)

Granted, the G wasn't longer but good lord Pings are forgiving.

:swoon: :swoon: :swoon:

Jeff you are playing great golf right now, so you know whats best for your game.. At least you got to find out if you like it not for free :taunt:

9* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ XTORISON COPPER 60S ** 13.5* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ HZDRUS 65 S

20* Callaway EPIC Hybrid w/ Recoil 780 S

  5-A Callaway Steelhead Pros w/Ctaper Lite S
Callaway MD Forged 54/10 *** Callaway MD3 58/11 W Grind *** Callaway MD3 64/08 C grind
Low Tide Rip Curl w/UST Frequency Filtered (2.0*, 72 lie, 36in)


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#43 MtlJeff

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 07:52 PM

View Postmisplacedtexan83, on 26 July 2017 - 07:44 PM, said:

View PostMtlJeff, on 26 July 2017 - 06:45 PM, said:

Heck the Ping G LS Tec replaced the Epic SZ for me. So if the G400 can't then it's a step back for Ping :)

Granted, the G wasn't longer but good lord Pings are forgiving.

:swoon: :swoon: :swoon:

Jeff you are playing great golf right now, so you know whats best for your game.. At least you got to find out if you like it not for free :taunt:

I'll probably put the SZ back in the bag at some point.....i am a ho after all.

And it wasn't totally free! It cost me 3 vacation days from work :)
Ping G LS Tec 9 w/Tour 65
Callaway XR Pro 14 w/Diamana D+ 80
Ping G20 Hybrid 17 w/S300
Callaway Apex Pro 4-PW w/S300
Callaway MD Forged 52,56,60 w/S200
Odyssey Works Versa 1W Tank

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#44 misplacedtexan83

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 07:59 PM

View PostMtlJeff, on 26 July 2017 - 07:52 PM, said:

View Postmisplacedtexan83, on 26 July 2017 - 07:44 PM, said:

View PostMtlJeff, on 26 July 2017 - 06:45 PM, said:

Heck the Ping G LS Tec replaced the Epic SZ for me. So if the G400 can't then it's a step back for Ping :)

Granted, the G wasn't longer but good lord Pings are forgiving.

:swoon: :swoon: :swoon:

Jeff you are playing great golf right now, so you know whats best for your game.. At least you got to find out if you like it not for free :taunt:

I'll probably put the SZ back in the bag at some point.....i am a ho after all.

And it wasn't totally free! It cost me 3 vacation days from work :)

3 well deserve vacation days ;)

As I told a few people.. Callaway is going to have to do something special to outperform themselves..

Sorry OP...NOW back to the PING Discussion..

Now back to the G400... it really is a nice offering from PING.

9* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ XTORISON COPPER 60S ** 13.5* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ HZDRUS 65 S

20* Callaway EPIC Hybrid w/ Recoil 780 S

  5-A Callaway Steelhead Pros w/Ctaper Lite S
Callaway MD Forged 54/10 *** Callaway MD3 58/11 W Grind *** Callaway MD3 64/08 C grind
Low Tide Rip Curl w/UST Frequency Filtered (2.0*, 72 lie, 36in)


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#45 3woodvt

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:09 PM

View Postchisag, on 26 July 2017 - 06:44 PM, said:

View Post3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 01:02 PM, said:

took an opportunity today while vacationing in FL to compare the Epic Zero vs the Ping G400LS with the stock Tour shaft in X from Ping (nice shaft by the way) against the zero with an X in the Fuji Pro.  Zero at 9* and G400LS at 7.5.
Ping launched higher at 7.5 than the Zero and was consistently straiter and avg 8 yards more carry than the Callaway offering.  Zero rolled out better and closed the overall avg to 5 yards behind the Ping. I never tried lofting up with the Callaway as I was not a fan at all of the feel of this club.  It is very Harsh imo.  It has a dead hard feel to this head that is not appealing at all to me. The Ping SS was better as well up 1.2 mph on avg and Balls speeds were higher with the Ping as well (+0.7 avg).  Pretty sound beating of the Epic subzero by the 400LS tech as well in lower spin, ball speeds, carry, and overall distance.

The biggest factors with Ping's win, the Ping feels so much better than the Sub zero and was much more accurate as the 7.5 Ping just went strait consistently and the sub zero has a soft fade consistent as well.  Spin avg 2100 with the LS and 2350 with the Callaway. SS avg 104 with subzero and 105 with the Ping.

Appearance is so subjective that all I can say is they both frame the ball very nicely.  I'd call this even or leave it up to each individual to see what he likes.  I'm not a fan of the green at all but the club did set up nice at address from Callaway.  I'm currently playing a Ping G LS so I have no problems with the new head.

Ping defeated the Callaway Sub zero epic in every area for this scratch golfer.  Looks like the Ping G400LS will be an Epic Killer.

... I don't know how old you are, but seems like people are split on the feel of the Epic. Younger golfers don't seem to like it and older golfers seem to love it. In fact, I think it is the best feeling driver I have ever hit. Ever. And that is a lot of drives going back to McGregor M85's. I have never gotten along with Ping drivers but bought the original LS Tec because I hit it so well at the PGA show demo day and the sound was somewhat masked with a million people hitting balls. Hated it on the course and it was obviously more mental than physical but I sprayed it all over the place and sold it after one round. And I just don't think I could live with the AFA* crown of the 400 LS.

... Moot point actually as I am hitting the Epic with a Rogue Black Tour 110 as straight as any driver I have owned and longer than any driver as well. Not 5 yds but a good 10+ which is a huge and pleasant surprise for me. The irony, is I have also never gotten along with Callaway clubs and have never played any including their drivers. But when I hit the Epic at a demo day I was smitten by the sound and feel.  When I write reviews I always keep people like you in mind, because we have almost the opposite taste for sound and feel so I am always careful to attempt to describe the dense/solid/persimmon like feel and add those that like a more explosive sound/feel may not like the feel/sound of a driver like the Epic.

* Carton Action Figure Top  :derisive:
Almost a Senior, that should give you an idea.  Started when I was 11.  Not really feeling the need to give out my history lesson on persimmons on this thread but hey if it gives you that feeling (which for me it's not even remotely close to....I'd agree with your assessment but change it to 'dense but dead feel') then good for you.  Callaway is a good company and according to them they are the #1 selling driver for 2017, again who cares, to my point the Epic felt horrible and dead harsh....Ping felt solid and muted....oh well hope you keep hitting it strait as it seems that's the clubs Achilles heel as most lose it right, right, right.  I'd guess with your hcp you'd probably hit most drivers fairly strait as I do but for me it's about consistency of accuracy and it was no comparison on my limited sample.  For me the Ping outperformed Epic zero in every category except framing the ball which I'd call it equal.  To each his own and not trying to hurt anyone's feelings just reporting my facts and the additional fact I'll save 100.00 bucks on a 400LS that beat the "epic" in every category.  I know I'm happy about that.   I'm not trying to rain on anyone parade that bought epic, if I was I'd be over on Epic threads thrashing away, just trying to post on the Ping Thread for those interested in this gem....now if Ping could just deliver.  I did see a full rack of Epic's at GG hear in Clearwater...guess the momentum is fading on that driver but I'm sure Callaway will have another one out before long.

Edited by 3woodvt, 26 July 2017 - 08:21 PM.

Ping G LS 9* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D3 44 3/4
Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS TourS 120 D1
Cleveland 2.0 50,**54**,59* D3
Ping Zing TR 35" Lamkin Deep Etched Chord
Srixon Z Star.
Lamkin Wrap Tech Midsize

15

#46 misplacedtexan83

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:12 PM

3woodvt..

Well said.. Im actually enjoying a discussion where mud aint getting sling and we are just adding to the discussion.

Golfers are lucky nowadays, so many OEMs are producing top notch stuff!

Edited by misplacedtexan83, 26 July 2017 - 08:12 PM.

9* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ XTORISON COPPER 60S ** 13.5* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ HZDRUS 65 S

20* Callaway EPIC Hybrid w/ Recoil 780 S

  5-A Callaway Steelhead Pros w/Ctaper Lite S
Callaway MD Forged 54/10 *** Callaway MD3 58/11 W Grind *** Callaway MD3 64/08 C grind
Low Tide Rip Curl w/UST Frequency Filtered (2.0*, 72 lie, 36in)


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#47 3woodvt

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:19 PM

View Postmisplacedtexan83, on 26 July 2017 - 08:12 PM, said:

3woodvt..

Well said.. Im actually enjoying a discussion where mud aint getting sling and we are just adding to the discussion.

Golfers are lucky nowadays, so many OEMs are producing top notch stuff!
I'd agree some great drivers out there.  M1 is great and obviously there is validity to the jail break tech as there is no doubt ball speeds increase.  Callaway has made a bunch of money since January on that release and glad so many have gained with it's tech.  for whatever reason it just didn't do it for me...maybe the next version will be different.  With Ping's issues on releasing the LS version I may not even buy.....nah I'm sure I'll upgrade just because of the SS increase and slight increase in ball speeds I saw over my current set up.

Edited by 3woodvt, 26 July 2017 - 08:19 PM.

Ping G LS 9* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D3 44 3/4
Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS TourS 120 D1
Cleveland 2.0 50,**54**,59* D3
Ping Zing TR 35" Lamkin Deep Etched Chord
Srixon Z Star.
Lamkin Wrap Tech Midsize

17

#48 misplacedtexan83

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:22 PM

View Post3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 08:19 PM, said:

View Postmisplacedtexan83, on 26 July 2017 - 08:12 PM, said:

3woodvt..

Well said.. Im actually enjoying a discussion where mud aint getting sling and we are just adding to the discussion.

Golfers are lucky nowadays, so many OEMs are producing top notch stuff!
I'd agree some great drivers out there.  M1 is great and obviously there is validity to the jail break tech as there is no doubt ball speeds increase.  Callaway has made a bunch of money since January on that release and glad so many have gained with it's tech.  for whatever reason it just didn't do it for me...maybe the next version will be different.  With Ping's issues on releasing the LS version I may not even buy.....nah I'm sure I'll upgrade just because of the SS increase and slight increase in ball speeds I saw over my current set up.

You aren't the first and won't be the last. However, you were smart and try them head to head.


9* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ XTORISON COPPER 60S ** 13.5* Callaway EPIC SZ w/ HZDRUS 65 S

20* Callaway EPIC Hybrid w/ Recoil 780 S

  5-A Callaway Steelhead Pros w/Ctaper Lite S
Callaway MD Forged 54/10 *** Callaway MD3 58/11 W Grind *** Callaway MD3 64/08 C grind
Low Tide Rip Curl w/UST Frequency Filtered (2.0*, 72 lie, 36in)


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#49 WarEagleGolf

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:24 PM

Stupid Ping and their stupid delays.  I will wait, patiently.   And if it doesn't come in on the new date, I'm gonna burn this mofo down....c'mon pookie.  Let's go to the range and hit our 'old' Ping.
PING G400 LST Fujikura XLR8 51 9.0*
Callaway XR16 Pro Fujikura XLR8 61 16*
Callaway 19* Hybrid Fujikura Pro Series 73
PING S55 3 iron Recoil 110 F4
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PING Glide 50* SS
Titliest Vokey SM6 54/58 S Grind
PING Vault Anser2

19

#50 chisag

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:38 PM

View Post3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 08:09 PM, said:

View Postchisag, on 26 July 2017 - 06:44 PM, said:

View Post3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 01:02 PM, said:

took an opportunity today while vacationing in FL to compare the Epic Zero vs the Ping G400LS with the stock Tour shaft in X from Ping (nice shaft by the way) against the zero with an X in the Fuji Pro.  Zero at 9* and G400LS at 7.5.
Ping launched higher at 7.5 than the Zero and was consistently straiter and avg 8 yards more carry than the Callaway offering.  Zero rolled out better and closed the overall avg to 5 yards behind the Ping. I never tried lofting up with the Callaway as I was not a fan at all of the feel of this club.  It is very Harsh imo.  It has a dead hard feel to this head that is not appealing at all to me. The Ping SS was better as well up 1.2 mph on avg and Balls speeds were higher with the Ping as well (+0.7 avg).  Pretty sound beating of the Epic subzero by the 400LS tech as well in lower spin, ball speeds, carry, and overall distance.

The biggest factors with Ping's win, the Ping feels so much better than the Sub zero and was much more accurate as the 7.5 Ping just went strait consistently and the sub zero has a soft fade consistent as well.  Spin avg 2100 with the LS and 2350 with the Callaway. SS avg 104 with subzero and 105 with the Ping.

Appearance is so subjective that all I can say is they both frame the ball very nicely.  I'd call this even or leave it up to each individual to see what he likes.  I'm not a fan of the green at all but the club did set up nice at address from Callaway.  I'm currently playing a Ping G LS so I have no problems with the new head.

Ping defeated the Callaway Sub zero epic in every area for this scratch golfer.  Looks like the Ping G400LS will be an Epic Killer.

... I don't know how old you are, but seems like people are split on the feel of the Epic. Younger golfers don't seem to like it and older golfers seem to love it. In fact, I think it is the best feeling driver I have ever hit. Ever. And that is a lot of drives going back to McGregor M85's. I have never gotten along with Ping drivers but bought the original LS Tec because I hit it so well at the PGA show demo day and the sound was somewhat masked with a million people hitting balls. Hated it on the course and it was obviously more mental than physical but I sprayed it all over the place and sold it after one round. And I just don't think I could live with the AFA* crown of the 400 LS.

... Moot point actually as I am hitting the Epic with a Rogue Black Tour 110 as straight as any driver I have owned and longer than any driver as well. Not 5 yds but a good 10+ which is a huge and pleasant surprise for me. The irony, is I have also never gotten along with Callaway clubs and have never played any including their drivers. But when I hit the Epic at a demo day I was smitten by the sound and feel.  When I write reviews I always keep people like you in mind, because we have almost the opposite taste for sound and feel so I am always careful to attempt to describe the dense/solid/persimmon like feel and add those that like a more explosive sound/feel may not like the feel/sound of a driver like the Epic.

* Carton Action Figure Top  :derisive:
Almost a Senior, that should give you an idea.  Started when I was 11.  Not really feeling the need to give out my history lesson on persimmons on this thread but hey if it gives you that feeling (which for me it's not even remotely close to....I'd agree with your assessment but change it to 'dense but dead feel') then good for you.  Callaway is a good company and according to them they are the #1 selling driver for 2017, again who cares, to my point the Epic felt horrible and dead harsh....Ping felt solid and muted....oh well hope you keep hitting it strait as it seems that's the clubs Achilles heel as most lose it right, right, right.  I'd guess with your hcp you'd probably hit most drivers fairly strait as I do but for me it's about consistency of accuracy and it was no comparison on my limited sample.  For me the Ping outperformed Epic zero in every category except framing the ball which I'd call it equal.  To each his own and not trying to hurt anyone's feelings just reporting my facts and the additional fact I'll save 100.00 bucks on a 400LS that beat the "epic" in every category.  I know I'm happy about that.   I'm not trying to rain on anyone parade that bought epic, if I was I'd be over on Epic threads thrashing away, just trying to post on the Ping Thread for those interested in this gem....now if Ping could just deliver.  I did see a full rack of Epic's at GG hear in Clearwater...guess the momentum is fading on that driver but I'm sure Callaway will have another one out before long.

... As I said, I am not a Callaway fan so I certainly took no offense. And my local Chicago PGA SS has about 7-10 Epics in the used section so someone isn't happy with it. I don't think I have spent more than a few minutes on any Epic driver threads. I did post a pic somewhere of mine with white paint fill of the green which reminds me of my Fly Z I had in the bag for almost 3 years and it goes well with my Rogue Black. But truthfully I am still surprised to find an Epic in my bag as I have pretty much played Cobra and TM driver's for the last 10 years or so. My miss is a draw so the Epic has almost eliminated that shot and when I miss with it, I miss right but playable right. Not a fade but a straight push.

... I hit the new 400 in the PGA SS and really liked it. As you and others have said, there are just so many great drivers out there right now and something for everyone. Everything about a driver ends up being personal. I hated the LS because it sounded so bad to my ears and then hit it more crooked on the course than any driver I have played. Clearly mental as I was hitting it with an amazingly consistent trajectory at the PGA Show where the sound was not as obvious. Not that you will need it, but good luck with your 400.

10.5* Epic Rogue Black Tour 110  60s
17.5* Aeroburner Yardbird Kuro Kage 70s
19.5* Cobra King Utility Rogue Black 85hs
21.5* RBZ Tour Altus 85HYs
5-pw Cobra King Forged Tour Recoil Prototype 95's
48* Nike Forged Combo Recoil 110's
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#51 3woodvt

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 09:17 PM

 chisag, on 26 July 2017 - 08:38 PM, said:

 3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 08:09 PM, said:

 chisag, on 26 July 2017 - 06:44 PM, said:

 3woodvt, on 26 July 2017 - 01:02 PM, said:

took an opportunity today while vacationing in FL to compare the Epic Zero vs the Ping G400LS with the stock Tour shaft in X from Ping (nice shaft by the way) against the zero with an X in the Fuji Pro.  Zero at 9* and G400LS at 7.5.
Ping launched higher at 7.5 than the Zero and was consistently straiter and avg 8 yards more carry than the Callaway offering.  Zero rolled out better and closed the overall avg to 5 yards behind the Ping. I never tried lofting up with the Callaway as I was not a fan at all of the feel of this club.  It is very Harsh imo.  It has a dead hard feel to this head that is not appealing at all to me. The Ping SS was better as well up 1.2 mph on avg and Balls speeds were higher with the Ping as well (+0.7 avg).  Pretty sound beating of the Epic subzero by the 400LS tech as well in lower spin, ball speeds, carry, and overall distance.

The biggest factors with Ping's win, the Ping feels so much better than the Sub zero and was much more accurate as the 7.5 Ping just went strait consistently and the sub zero has a soft fade consistent as well.  Spin avg 2100 with the LS and 2350 with the Callaway. SS avg 104 with subzero and 105 with the Ping.

Appearance is so subjective that all I can say is they both frame the ball very nicely.  I'd call this even or leave it up to each individual to see what he likes.  I'm not a fan of the green at all but the club did set up nice at address from Callaway.  I'm currently playing a Ping G LS so I have no problems with the new head.

Ping defeated the Callaway Sub zero epic in every area for this scratch golfer.  Looks like the Ping G400LS will be an Epic Killer.

... I don't know how old you are, but seems like people are split on the feel of the Epic. Younger golfers don't seem to like it and older golfers seem to love it. In fact, I think it is the best feeling driver I have ever hit. Ever. And that is a lot of drives going back to McGregor M85's. I have never gotten along with Ping drivers but bought the original LS Tec because I hit it so well at the PGA show demo day and the sound was somewhat masked with a million people hitting balls. Hated it on the course and it was obviously more mental than physical but I sprayed it all over the place and sold it after one round. And I just don't think I could live with the AFA* crown of the 400 LS.

... Moot point actually as I am hitting the Epic with a Rogue Black Tour 110 as straight as any driver I have owned and longer than any driver as well. Not 5 yds but a good 10+ which is a huge and pleasant surprise for me. The irony, is I have also never gotten along with Callaway clubs and have never played any including their drivers. But when I hit the Epic at a demo day I was smitten by the sound and feel.  When I write reviews I always keep people like you in mind, because we have almost the opposite taste for sound and feel so I am always careful to attempt to describe the dense/solid/persimmon like feel and add those that like a more explosive sound/feel may not like the feel/sound of a driver like the Epic.

* Carton Action Figure Top  :derisive:
Almost a Senior, that should give you an idea.  Started when I was 11.  Not really feeling the need to give out my history lesson on persimmons on this thread but hey if it gives you that feeling (which for me it's not even remotely close to....I'd agree with your assessment but change it to 'dense but dead feel') then good for you.  Callaway is a good company and according to them they are the #1 selling driver for 2017, again who cares, to my point the Epic felt horrible and dead harsh....Ping felt solid and muted....oh well hope you keep hitting it strait as it seems that's the clubs Achilles heel as most lose it right, right, right.  I'd guess with your hcp you'd probably hit most drivers fairly strait as I do but for me it's about consistency of accuracy and it was no comparison on my limited sample.  For me the Ping outperformed Epic zero in every category except framing the ball which I'd call it equal.  To each his own and not trying to hurt anyone's feelings just reporting my facts and the additional fact I'll save 100.00 bucks on a 400LS that beat the "epic" in every category.  I know I'm happy about that.   I'm not trying to rain on anyone parade that bought epic, if I was I'd be over on Epic threads thrashing away, just trying to post on the Ping Thread for those interested in this gem....now if Ping could just deliver.  I did see a full rack of Epic's at GG hear in Clearwater...guess the momentum is fading on that driver but I'm sure Callaway will have another one out before long.

... As I said, I am not a Callaway fan so I certainly took no offense. And my local Chicago PGA SS has about 7-10 Epics in the used section so someone isn't happy with it. I don't think I have spent more than a few minutes on any Epic driver threads. I did post a pic somewhere of mine with white paint fill of the green which reminds me of my Fly Z I had in the bag for almost 3 years and it goes well with my Rogue Black. But truthfully I am still surprised to find an Epic in my bag as I have pretty much played Cobra and TM driver's for the last 10 years or so. My miss is a draw so the Epic has almost eliminated that shot and when I miss with it, I miss right but playable right. Not a fade but a straight push.

... I hit the new 400 in the PGA SS and really liked it. As you and others have said, there are just so many great drivers out there right now and something for everyone. Everything about a driver ends up being personal. I hated the LS because it sounded so bad to my ears and then hit it more crooked on the course than any driver I have played. Clearly mental as I was hitting it with an amazingly consistent trajectory at the PGA Show where the sound was not as obvious. Not that you will need it, but good luck with your 400.
Best wishes as well.  A lot of good stuff today.  AKA I've never been happier with my irons since my switch back in Dec to the 965's yet I found myself looking at Mizuno 900's and Apex Pro's today at GG while meandering.  Not serious about buying but they both looked good as well.  Happiest messing around with all the putters...wish I had more money for disposable income but the college years are upon my family.
Ping G LS 9* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D3 44 3/4
Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS TourS 120 D1
Cleveland 2.0 50,**54**,59* D3
Ping Zing TR 35" Lamkin Deep Etched Chord
Srixon Z Star.
Lamkin Wrap Tech Midsize

21

#52 Lobber

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Posted 28 July 2017 - 11:14 AM

5 rounds on my LS Tec and it's really impressive. The biggest difference betweeen the Ping and my Epic SZ is forgiveness with Ping being the winner. Not giving up anything in distance but definitely hitting the ball straighter and not losing as much on off center hits. Side by side with same shaft and loft settings LS 400 Tec is better for my game.  Most likely will be taking SZ back for store credit and applying it to a set of G irons. Been considering game improvement irons and Ping has got my attention

22

#53 3woodvt

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 03:22 PM

Anyone compared the 8.5 vs the 10 with the LST?
Ping G LS 9* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D3 44 3/4
Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
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#54 G-Bone

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 03:26 PM

When comparing G400 LST against GBB Epic SB, LST won in all but one category.

I was fit into both drivers using Trackman:
SZ at 8 degrees,12 weight forward and Tour AD DI-6 shaft.
LST at 7.5 degrees, hot melt in heel and Tour AD BB-6 shaft

LST gave me 3mph more club head speed, that equated to 10 yards in the air.

LST spun slightly more, so it rolled out less than SB - total distance gain with LST, 7 yards.

If SB dispersion pattern was a silver dollar, the LST was a dime.

The one place SB beat LST was sound and feel.  For me, SB is a 10, LST is a 7, and last years G LST was a 2 (on a scale of 1-10).

Results: After a solid eight month run with SB in the bag, Ping G400 LST with BB-6 is the new champ and firmly in the bag!
PING G400 LST Driver 7.5º ~ Tour AD BB-6
TaylorMade M2 Fairway (2016) 16.5º ~ Tour AD GT-7
Callaway XR Pro Hybrid 20º ~ Tour AD GT-75 UT
Callaway XR Pro Hybrid 23º ~ Tour AD HY-85
Epon by Endo AF-503 Irons 5–PW ~ Project X 5.5 (Hard Stepped +1)
Titleist Hand Ground by Bob Vokey Raw SM6 51.13 F (Heal & Tour Grind) ~ Project X 5.5
Titleist Hand Ground by Bob Vokey Raw SM6 57.09 M (Tour Grind) ~ Project X 5.5
Titleist Hand Ground by Bob Vokey Raw SM6 63.09 M (Tour Grind) ~ Project X 5.5
Titleist Scotty Cameron Circle T Del Mar Buttonback Select Tour Prototype (A026140) ~ 34"
Titleist Pro V1 (2017) ~ #45

24

#55 3woodvt

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 03:28 PM

 G-Bone, on 31 July 2017 - 03:26 PM, said:

When comparing G400 LST against GBB Epic SB, LST won in all but one category.

I was fit into both drivers using Trackman:
SZ at 8 degrees,12 weight forward and Tour AD DI-6 shaft.
LST at 7.5 degrees, hot melt in heel and Tour AD BB-6 shaft

LST gave me 3mph more club head speed, that equated to 10 yards in the air.

LST spun slightly more, so it rolled out less than SB - total distance gain with LST, 7 yards.

If SB dispersion pattern was a silver dollar, the LST was a dime.

The one place SB beat LST was sound and feel.  For me, SB is a 10, LST is a 7, and last years G LST was a 2 (on a scale of 1-10).

Results: After a solid eight month run with SB in the bag, Ping G400 LST with BB-6 is the new champ and firmly in the bag!
thanks for the data and comparisons.

Ping G LS 9* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D3 44 3/4
Srixon F65 13.5* Miyazaki 6X  D2 43
Srixon F45 16* Graphite Design AD-GP 7X D2 42
Srixon Z945 4-PW KBS TourS 120 D1
Cleveland 2.0 50,**54**,59* D3
Ping Zing TR 35" Lamkin Deep Etched Chord
Srixon Z Star.
Lamkin Wrap Tech Midsize

25

#56 J-Tizzle

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 04:42 PM

I can't give specifics like everyone else has, as I've only hit the G400 LST demo at the range.

I will say I swapped the Rogue 110 60s out of my G30 LS and hit the G400 8.5* set at 9.1* (slightly closed face).  I thought the driver was excellent from what I could tell, was carrying it at least 10 yards past where I was getting my G30 to end up at, which is exciting for me.  I did notice that the G400 launched a few degrees higher than the G30 to my eye, so I actually changed my preorder from the 10* to the 8.5*.  I figure getting the Xtorsion in the G400 will probably raise the height up a little more as well, so that combined with the higher launch, would be similar to getting the G30 in the 10.5*.  We shall see, last I heard was the expected ship date is late August, which I'm not a huge fan of, but I'm a huge fan of anything Ping, so I'll live.
Ping G400 8.5* LST (eventually) - Ping i25 14* - Ping Anser 17* - Adams 9031 23* - Ping I200 5-W - Ping Gorge 2.0 50*, 56* (@ 55*), 60* - Bobby Grace Let's Face It.  

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#57 pearsonified

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 06:27 PM

This thread sorta veered off the rails into a "G400 vs. Epic" battle, and I can't resist chiming in on the feel of both drivers.

Because of the jailbreak technology, the face on the Epic feels HARD. In fact, I can't think of another driver I've hit in the past 3 years that has a feeling anywhere close to the Epic.

To me, the Epic is like hitting a ball with concrete rather than a trampoline.

The G400, on the other hand, has a very acoustic, "shelled" feeling on pure strikes that we are all probably used to by now. Similar-feeling drivers include the AeroBurner, SLDR, G (with the G400 being a clear improvement), BioCell+, and the RBZ.

Because of its massively lower center of gravity and carbon crown, the 2016 M2 feels a lot like the Epic to me, but the Epic is clearly an improvement on this type of driver design.

Honestly, I think once you hit 170mph+ ball speeds, the Epic feels so hard relative to other drivers that it becomes a yuge negative. That said, it offers impressive ball speed retention all over the face, and it is definitely a solid club.

I can't get over the acoustics, tho. But this is a G400 thread, and acoustics are one of many areas where the G400 shines.
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Callaway XR Pro 20º •• Matrix Ozik Altus X
Adams CMB 4-G (22º-50º) •• Various DG X100 weights
Vokey SM5 54º •• DG S400
Vokey SM5 60º •• DG S400
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27

#58 chisag

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 07:14 PM

 pearsonified, on 31 July 2017 - 06:27 PM, said:

This thread sorta veered off the rails into a "G400 vs. Epic" battle, and I can't resist chiming in on the feel of both drivers.

Because of the jailbreak technology, the face on the Epic feels HARD. In fact, I can't think of another driver I've hit in the past 3 years that has a feeling anywhere close to the Epic.

To me, the Epic is like hitting a ball with concrete rather than a trampoline.

The G400, on the other hand, has a very acoustic, "shelled" feeling on pure strikes that we are all probably used to by now. Similar-feeling drivers include the AeroBurner, SLDR, G (with the G400 being a clear improvement), BioCell+, and the RBZ.

Honestly, I think once you hit 170mph+ ball speeds, the Epic feels so hard relative to other drivers that it becomes a yuge negative. That said, it offers impressive ball speed retention all over the face, and it is definitely a solid club.


... This just shows how subjective "feel" really is. The Epic to me feels like a wooden baseball bat and the G400 feels more like an aluminum bat, albeit a much thicker walled bat than the G30. The Epic does not feel hard to me just very, very dense with little to no give and I agree it does not have the trampoline feel almost any other drivers I have hit exhibited. But I absolutely love that feel as it kinda reminds me of persimmon drivers. Otoh I felt the Aeroburners face seemed extremely hard but not that dense feel the Epic has and I never warmed up to it. Even when hit well, it always felt like somehow I did not hit to well. I have heard others gush over the feel and performance. Go figure.

... This is why I think OEM's have such a difficult job designing club heads. Here are two guys with one hating the feel of the Epic and the other thinking it is the best feeling driver they have ever hit. Game be crazy.
10.5* Epic Rogue Black Tour 110  60s
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#59 Lobber

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 07:30 PM

 pearsonified, on 31 July 2017 - 06:27 PM, said:

This thread sorta veered off the rails into a "G400 vs. Epic" battle, and I can't resist chiming in on the feel of both drivers.

Because of the jailbreak technology, the face on the Epic feels HARD. In fact, I can't think of another driver I've hit in the past 3 years that has a feeling anywhere close to the Epic.

To me, the Epic is like hitting a ball with concrete rather than a trampoline.

The G400, on the other hand, has a very acoustic, "shelled" feeling on pure strikes that we are all probably used to by now. Similar-feeling drivers include the AeroBurner, SLDR, G (with the G400 being a clear improvement), BioCell+, and the RBZ.

Because of its massively lower center of gravity and carbon crown, the 2016 M2 feels a lot like the Epic to me, but the Epic is clearly an improvement on this type of driver design.

Honestly, I think once you hit 170mph+ ball speeds, the Epic feels so hard relative to other drivers that it becomes a yuge negative. That said, it offers impressive ball speed retention all over the face, and it is definitely a solid club.

I can't get over the acoustics, tho. But this is a G400 thread, and acoustics are one of many areas where the G400 shines.

My intent in posting was not to create an Epic vs G400 battle.  It was simply to share my experience with my imperfect swing, identical shafts, driver setting and the same ball on the same course without any other variables (other than that imperfect swing).  I think both are great drivers but I do thing the G 400 gives me a measure of forgiveness that is higher than the Epic SZ.    So if I have to go with one it will be a tough call but as of today Ping 400 LS Tec gets the nod.  Of course that could change as fast as the weather!

29

#60 3woodvt

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Posted 31 July 2017 - 07:55 PM

 pearsonified, on 31 July 2017 - 06:27 PM, said:

This thread sorta veered off the rails into a "G400 vs. Epic" battle, and I can't resist chiming in on the feel of both drivers.

Because of the jailbreak technology, the face on the Epic feels HARD. In fact, I can't think of another driver I've hit in the past 3 years that has a feeling anywhere close to the Epic.

To me, the Epic is like hitting a ball with concrete rather than a trampoline.

The G400, on the other hand, has a very acoustic, "shelled" feeling on pure strikes that we are all probably used to by now. Similar-feeling drivers include the AeroBurner, SLDR, G (with the G400 being a clear improvement), BioCell+, and the RBZ.

Because of its massively lower center of gravity and carbon crown, the 2016 M2 feels a lot like the Epic to me, but the Epic is clearly an improvement on this type of driver design.

Honestly, I think once you hit 170mph+ ball speeds, the Epic feels so hard relative to other drivers that it becomes a yuge negative. That said, it offers impressive ball speed retention all over the face, and it is definitely a solid club.

I can't get over the acoustics, tho. But this is a G400 thread, and acoustics are one of many areas where the G400 shines.
I agree 100%.  It is subjective though.

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