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side saddle putters - what putter are you using?


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#211 hardpan1

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Posted 11 July 2017 - 04:09 PM

View PostBigEx44, on 10 July 2017 - 05:55 PM, said:

Oh man - my DF putter is really coming on now!!
I played 18 today and broke 80 for the first time in my life by shooting a 78.
Strongly contributing to that score was the fact I only had 29 putts today.
I was money inside of 8' and lagged really well.  Not a single 3 putt.
I think I'm falling in love!

As long as we're bragging :)  I looked at my stats for last 20 rounds, last ten being side saddle...first 10 conventional putting, averaged 34.1, after switching last 10 average is 31 even...just wait till I get me a DF!  Used the STX today for 31 putts, three putts are pretty much a thing of the past.


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#212 PGATourDriven

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Posted 12 July 2017 - 06:04 AM

If anyone can give me a quick comparison between the DF and the Juan putt that would be greatly appreciated. I have the Juan putt and like it. But I have been hearing great things about the DF putter. I would like others opinion on it before I drop $450+ on a SS putter. If it's remotely close to the Juan putt then I can save some money. Also I wish there were some SS certified putter coaches or a PGA professional that would teach the proper mechanics to the SS stroke. Thank everyone in advance for any information.
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#213 bluedot

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Posted 12 July 2017 - 07:45 AM

View PostPGATourDriven, on 12 July 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

If anyone can give me a quick comparison between the DF and the Juan putt that would be greatly appreciated. I have the Juan putt and like it. But I have been hearing great things about the DF putter. I would like others opinion on it before I drop $450+ on a SS putter. If it's remotely close to the Juan putt then I can save some money. Also I wish there were some SS certified putter coaches or a PGA professional that would teach the proper mechanics to the SS stroke. Thank everyone in advance for any information.

The biggest difference is that the head of the JuanPutt is MUCH heavier than the DF.  There are advantages and disadvantages both ways, I think, so that it comes down to personal preference, but that is the big difference certainly.

When I ordered my DF, I spoke with them about increasing the head weight, but they weren't very enthusiastic about it because their lie angle balancing is THE technology that makes the putter unique, and I think they felt like extra head weight would make that more difficult.  That said, I think that earlier in this thread, somebody posted that they had gotten DF to make them a side saddle putter that DID have more head weight.  If you can track that down, you might PM them for the details.

But really, I do think the difference between the JuanPutt and the DF is just a personal preference thing.  I was concerned when I ordered the DF that the lighter head would be a problem on long putts; that has not been a problem at all.  I love the way the DF "flows" thru the stroke, but the weight of the JuanPutt on short putts is helpful, too.

Bottom line is that both are really, really quality items, though very different.  I've tried the GP, two versions of the Bobby Grace Let's Face It, and an STX, and for my money the JuanPutt and the DF are clearly the two best premium putters on the market for side saddle at this point.  Really, it just comes down to what you prefer for the head weight.

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#214 BigEx44

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Posted 15 July 2017 - 01:53 PM

View Postbluedot, on 12 July 2017 - 07:45 AM, said:

View PostPGATourDriven, on 12 July 2017 - 06:04 AM, said:

If anyone can give me a quick comparison between the DF and the Juan putt that would be greatly appreciated. I have the Juan putt and like it. But I have been hearing great things about the DF putter. I would like others opinion on it before I drop $450+ on a SS putter. If it's remotely close to the Juan putt then I can save some money. Also I wish there were some SS certified putter coaches or a PGA professional that would teach the proper mechanics to the SS stroke. Thank everyone in advance for any information.

The biggest difference is that the head of the JuanPutt is MUCH heavier than the DF.  There are advantages and disadvantages both ways, I think, so that it comes down to personal preference, but that is the big difference certainly.

When I ordered my DF, I spoke with them about increasing the head weight, but they weren't very enthusiastic about it because their lie angle balancing is THE technology that makes the putter unique, and I think they felt like extra head weight would make that more difficult.  That said, I think that earlier in this thread, somebody posted that they had gotten DF to make them a side saddle putter that DID have more head weight.  If you can track that down, you might PM them for the details.

But really, I do think the difference between the JuanPutt and the DF is just a personal preference thing.  I was concerned when I ordered the DF that the lighter head would be a problem on long putts; that has not been a problem at all.  I love the way the DF "flows" thru the stroke, but the weight of the JuanPutt on short putts is helpful, too.

Bottom line is that both are really, really quality items, though very different.  I've tried the GP, two versions of the Bobby Grace Let's Face It, and an STX, and for my money the JuanPutt and the DF are clearly the two best premium putters on the market for side saddle at this point.  Really, it just comes down to what you prefer for the head weight.

I am the one who got them to make me a heavier DF putter.  I have a bit of the tremors in my hands (inherited from my dad!) and so I need the extra weight to help steady the putter.  I got it with the head at a weight of 500 grams.  It took some convincing, but they (Bill and his club maker) eventually realized they could add the weight to the shaft.  Then they didn't have to mess around with weights on the putter head.  And it is fully lined balanced like all their putters.  A great putter!

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#215 kenstl

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:10 AM

I have a confession, I have played my last two rounds with my BG LFI putter using it face on for putts outside of 8' and traditional style inside 8' lol!  The putter sets up well for both styles.  Probably a honeymoon period, but it will be my process for the next few rounds.

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#216 PreppySlapCut

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 08:48 AM

I'm going to list my Bobby Grace LFI in the bst.
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#217 BigEx44

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Posted 27 July 2017 - 05:20 AM

View Postkenstl, on 26 July 2017 - 08:10 AM, said:

I have a confession, I have played my last two rounds with my BG LFI putter using it face on for putts outside of 8' and traditional style inside 8' lol!  The putter sets up well for both styles.  Probably a honeymoon period, but it will be my process for the next few rounds.

Interesting.  That's the opposite of what most people will do who are "blending" the styles.  Most will use the sidesaddle method for the shorter putts and then go traditional for the longer lag putts.

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#218 hardpan1

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Posted 29 July 2017 - 09:26 AM

View PostPreppySlapCut, on 26 July 2017 - 08:48 AM, said:

I'm going to list my Bobby Grace LFI in the bst.


Haven't found the LFI in the bst, yet :)  left or right handed?

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#219 PreppySlapCut

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Posted 29 July 2017 - 09:05 PM

View Posthardpan1, on 29 July 2017 - 09:26 AM, said:

View PostPreppySlapCut, on 26 July 2017 - 08:48 AM, said:

I'm going to list my Bobby Grace LFI in the bst.
Sorry I haven't been home.  RH 42"


Haven't found the LFI in the bst, yet :)  left or right handed?

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#220 kenstl

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Posted 30 July 2017 - 10:20 AM

View PostBigEx44, on 27 July 2017 - 05:20 AM, said:

View Postkenstl, on 26 July 2017 - 08:10 AM, said:

I have a confession, I have played my last two rounds with my BG LFI putter using it face on for putts outside of 8' and traditional style inside 8' lol!  The putter sets up well for both styles.  Probably a honeymoon period, but it will be my process for the next few rounds.

Interesting.  That's the opposite of what most people will do who are "blending" the styles.  Most will use the sidesaddle method for the shorter putts and then go traditional for the longer lag putts.

I know, kind of backwards.  I actually started to face on putt because I was missing shorter putts or putts that I felt like I should be making on a more consistent basis.  It is probably insight to my cranial cavity causing most of the issues :).  I will say I have never putted traditional style, with a "mallet" putter the size of BG LFI, but I have found it to be very easy to align and consistently stroke 5' putts with it that way.  We will see how my next few rounds go.  I played yesterday and had 34 putts, so not the greatest showing.  I left 3 birdie putts from inside 12' short.

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#221 hardpan1

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Posted 18 August 2017 - 11:13 PM

Got my DF side saddle putter, 2+hrs practice green and one round so far...adjusting to hand position that is stable to putt on the arc, not sure there...but, this is a great putter, easy to align (which is big with me), distance control is very good...43" LH 79* , great roll also...because maybe it's not as heavy as my other putters, I do have to make sure to follow through and then it's Good

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#222 kenstl

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 02:03 PM

I have recently went back to my Seemore putter and have had some success.  I love my face on LFI for short and lag putts, but I have been disappointed with my ability to make 7' - 15'.  I am close many times, and I know no one makes a high percentage of those putts, but I am not cashing in at all.  

I may be selling my B Grace LFI if anyone has interest.
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#223 Ripper212

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Posted 11 September 2017 - 03:51 PM

View Postkenstl, on 11 September 2017 - 02:03 PM, said:

I have recently went back to my Seemore putter and have had some success.  I love my face on LFI for short and lag putts, but I have been disappointed with my ability to make 7' - 15'.  I am close many times, and I know no one makes a high percentage of those putts, but I am not cashing in at all.  

I may be selling my B Grace LFI if anyone has interest.

Don't give up yet. I've gone back and forth a few times but bottom line for me is that I'm much more comfortable with sidesaddle for 3-6' putts. For me that's the critical range. Don't make many 7-15 footers but neither do most of the pros.

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#224 bluedot

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 09:08 AM

View Postkenstl, on 11 September 2017 - 02:03 PM, said:

I have recently went back to my Seemore putter and have had some success.  I love my face on LFI for short and lag putts, but I have been disappointed with my ability to make 7' - 15'.  I am close many times, and I know no one makes a high percentage of those putts, but I am not cashing in at all.  

I may be selling my B Grace LFI if anyone has interest.

I've written this many times on threads about face on, but you should be careful about not falling into the mindset that every putt is a referendum on the validity of the putting method itself.  All of us that putt this way went to face on in the hopes of making more putts of ALL lengths, so there is a natural tendency when you miss to think that it hasn't worked.

So here is my free advice, likely worth exactly what you are paying for it.

1. Somehow or other, keep careful stats about your putting and see what is actually happening.  This needs to be over a long period of time to have any validity; otherwise, your putting stats tend to reflect ball striking way, way too much.

2. If you don't have one, get an indoor putting carpet and practice in what Juan Elizondo calls a "pristine environment".  If one method or the other suits you best, it'll show up there, without intervening issues like bumpy greens, wind, etc.

There is a lot that I don't know about life and golf, but I believe 100% that facing the hole and putting with one hand is a better way to putt; I just don't think it's arguable.  My advantage is that I'm a stats freak and have my putting numbers going back many, many years to compare before and after, AND that I just don't give a rip what ANYBODY thinks of the way I putt.

That said, it ain't for everybody.  It takes a pretty serious commitment to make the change permanently, AND to not be threatened by the reaction of other golfers to what you are doing.  Randy Haag estimates a year to become fully comfortable and proficient with it; I'm not sure that it takes THAT long, but it ain't a magic trick.

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#225 Ripper212

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 10:34 AM

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 09:08 AM, said:

View Postkenstl, on 11 September 2017 - 02:03 PM, said:

I have recently went back to my Seemore putter and have had some success.  I love my face on LFI for short and lag putts, but I have been disappointed with my ability to make 7' - 15'.  I am close many times, and I know no one makes a high percentage of those putts, but I am not cashing in at all.  

I may be selling my B Grace LFI if anyone has interest.

I've written this many times on threads about face on, but you should be careful about not falling into the mindset that every putt is a referendum on the validity of the putting method itself.  All of us that putt this way went to face on in the hopes of making more putts of ALL lengths, so there is a natural tendency when you miss to think that it hasn't worked.

So here is my free advice, likely worth exactly what you are paying for it.

1. Somehow or other, keep careful stats about your putting and see what is actually happening.  This needs to be over a long period of time to have any validity; otherwise, your putting stats tend to reflect ball striking way, way too much.

2. If you don't have one, get an indoor putting carpet and practice in what Juan Elizondo calls a "pristine environment".  If one method or the other suits you best, it'll show up there, without intervening issues like bumpy greens, wind, etc.

There is a lot that I don't know about life and golf, but I believe 100% that facing the hole and putting with one hand is a better way to putt; I just don't think it's arguable.  My advantage is that I'm a stats freak and have my putting numbers going back many, many years to compare before and after, AND that I just don't give a rip what ANYBODY thinks of the way I putt.

That said, it ain't for everybody.  It takes a pretty serious commitment to make the change permanently, AND to not be threatened by the reaction of other golfers to what you are doing.  Randy Haag estimates a year to become fully comfortable and proficient with it; I'm not sure that it takes THAT long, but it ain't a magic trick.

Very well said. And let's not forget the other big advantage of this method - you don't have to keep buying every new hot putter that comes out in the hope that the next one will actually work!


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#226 bluedot

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 11:37 AM

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 10:34 AM, said:

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 09:08 AM, said:

View Postkenstl, on 11 September 2017 - 02:03 PM, said:

I have recently went back to my Seemore putter and have had some success.  I love my face on LFI for short and lag putts, but I have been disappointed with my ability to make 7' - 15'.  I am close many times, and I know no one makes a high percentage of those putts, but I am not cashing in at all.  

I may be selling my B Grace LFI if anyone has interest.

I've written this many times on threads about face on, but you should be careful about not falling into the mindset that every putt is a referendum on the validity of the putting method itself.  All of us that putt this way went to face on in the hopes of making more putts of ALL lengths, so there is a natural tendency when you miss to think that it hasn't worked.

So here is my free advice, likely worth exactly what you are paying for it.

1. Somehow or other, keep careful stats about your putting and see what is actually happening.  This needs to be over a long period of time to have any validity; otherwise, your putting stats tend to reflect ball striking way, way too much.

2. If you don't have one, get an indoor putting carpet and practice in what Juan Elizondo calls a "pristine environment".  If one method or the other suits you best, it'll show up there, without intervening issues like bumpy greens, wind, etc.

There is a lot that I don't know about life and golf, but I believe 100% that facing the hole and putting with one hand is a better way to putt; I just don't think it's arguable.  My advantage is that I'm a stats freak and have my putting numbers going back many, many years to compare before and after, AND that I just don't give a rip what ANYBODY thinks of the way I putt.

That said, it ain't for everybody.  It takes a pretty serious commitment to make the change permanently, AND to not be threatened by the reaction of other golfers to what you are doing.  Randy Haag estimates a year to become fully comfortable and proficient with it; I'm not sure that it takes THAT long, but it ain't a magic trick.

Very well said. And let's not forget the other big advantage of this method - you don't have to keep buying every new hot putter that comes out in the hope that the next one will actually work!

I actually had one of my regular group ask me about this Sunday morning; "How many companies make these putters?"  I thought about it and said three, with Directed Force sort of being a hybrid.  GF, JuanPutt, and Bobby Grace are the entire market, one model each.  (Not counting some of the stuff you see on Ebay, which might be quite good, for all I know.)

It also saves me a lot of time, in addition to temptation, when I'm in Golf Galaxy or the PGA Superstore; no need to even go over to the putting area.

BTW, I spoke with P.R. Dionne, who makes the GP putter, a week or so ago.  He said that he thinks Grant Waite is about to start using his putter on the senior tour.  Why some of the seniors that were anchoring haven't already done this is something of a mystery to me; they are already putting with one hand, and now with the top hand not anchored.  Facing the hole makes SO much sense that it amazes me nobody has taken the plunge; it has to be the stigma involved, at least in part.  He also said that he still thinks DeChambeau will go back to it at the beginning of a season after an off season of being able to practice with a conforming putter design.  We'll see about that one...

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#227 Ripper212

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 11:48 AM

Interesting too that there is so little instructional information available as opposed to the amount of stuff you can read on conventional putting. Seem to be fewer variables involved. For me it's mostly a matter of getting repeatable ball position - too far forward or back can cause misses left or right. I use the BG LFI and I think I have better results holding it at the set lie angle - inconsistent strikes when trying to hold it completely vertical.

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#228 J-Tizzle

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 01:14 PM

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 11:48 AM, said:

Interesting too that there is so little instructional information available as opposed to the amount of stuff you can read on conventional putting. Seem to be fewer variables involved. For me it's mostly a matter of getting repeatable ball position - too far forward or back can cause misses left or right. I use the BG LFI and I think I have better results holding it at the set lie angle - inconsistent strikes when trying to hold it completely vertical.

Agreed.  I tried holding the putter out infront of me kinda how Juan says to do, then step in behind it and I really struggled for a consistent ball position.

I got a lot better really making sure my ball is aligned on my intended line, then i set my feet and just hold the putter in my right hand only (bottom hand) and let it hang as vertical as possible.  This has helped me make sure the putter is straight up and down, then adjust my feet as necessary.  This also helps make the set up a bit more consistent.
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#229 Ripper212

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 12 September 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 11:48 AM, said:

Interesting too that there is so little instructional information available as opposed to the amount of stuff you can read on conventional putting. Seem to be fewer variables involved. For me it's mostly a matter of getting repeatable ball position - too far forward or back can cause misses left or right. I use the BG LFI and I think I have better results holding it at the set lie angle - inconsistent strikes when trying to hold it completely vertical.

Agreed.  I tried holding the putter out infront of me kinda how Juan says to do, then step in behind it and I really struggled for a consistent ball position.

I got a lot better really making sure my ball is aligned on my intended line, then i set my feet and just hold the putter in my right hand only (bottom hand) and let it hang as vertical as possible.  This has helped me make sure the putter is straight up and down, then adjust my feet as necessary.  This also helps make the set up a bit more consistent.

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

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#230 kenstl

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 02:24 PM

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 12 September 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 11:48 AM, said:

Interesting too that there is so little instructional information available as opposed to the amount of stuff you can read on conventional putting. Seem to be fewer variables involved. For me it's mostly a matter of getting repeatable ball position - too far forward or back can cause misses left or right. I use the BG LFI and I think I have better results holding it at the set lie angle - inconsistent strikes when trying to hold it completely vertical.

Agreed.  I tried holding the putter out infront of me kinda how Juan says to do, then step in behind it and I really struggled for a consistent ball position.

I got a lot better really making sure my ball is aligned on my intended line, then i set my feet and just hold the putter in my right hand only (bottom hand) and let it hang as vertical as possible.  This has helped me make sure the putter is straight up and down, then adjust my feet as necessary.  This also helps make the set up a bit more consistent.

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I have used the LFI in a non vertical position varying from flat on the ground to half way to vertical on the angled edge.  I too found that completely vertical caused issues with me hitting my line.  My biggest issue with all of the face on styles / putters is that I struggle with getting to a set up position ((feet, ball position (both to the right and how much in front or on the side), shaft angle)) that I can consistently repeat.  I always feel that my misses have just as much to do with an inconsistent set up as it does with the my stroke error.  

I have kept putting stats over the past few years.  My numbers are more even / less variation with the face on putting, but I don't have rounds where I go really low like I can have when I get hot with the regular putter.  I also avoid 3 putts for the most part with the face on, which tends to get rid of the larger variances.  My GIR this year is 54%, so 9-10 per round is the norm, I average 33 putts with two lows of 26 and 28, the rest are in the 30's over the 20 rounds this summer.  I live on a course so I usually get a couple of nights a week where I go out and chip / putt for an hour and am trying to get to the point where I am under 32 putts a round.  That would be combination of one birdie, 50% on up and down on missed GIR, assuming my GIR do not improve.  I feel like I am leaving a couple of strokes on the table with my putter, we'll see.

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#231 bluedot

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 03:13 PM

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 12 September 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 11:48 AM, said:

Interesting too that there is so little instructional information available as opposed to the amount of stuff you can read on conventional putting. Seem to be fewer variables involved. For me it's mostly a matter of getting repeatable ball position - too far forward or back can cause misses left or right. I use the BG LFI and I think I have better results holding it at the set lie angle - inconsistent strikes when trying to hold it completely vertical.

Agreed.  I tried holding the putter out infront of me kinda how Juan says to do, then step in behind it and I really struggled for a consistent ball position.

I got a lot better really making sure my ball is aligned on my intended line, then i set my feet and just hold the putter in my right hand only (bottom hand) and let it hang as vertical as possible.  This has helped me make sure the putter is straight up and down, then adjust my feet as necessary.  This also helps make the set up a bit more consistent.

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I think he's saying that he makes sure that his right arm is hanging as vertical as possible, rather than the putter shaft.

I think with any of the face on putters except the GP, trying to hold the putter itself with the shaft vertical makes it tough to get consistent contact.  The GP putter is made to be used in a vertical position, but the trade-off, of course, is that the head is much smaller and much lighter.

I'm really not sure the extent to which the angle of the shaft between vertical and 10* matters; I'd love to see a study on it.  IF my right arm is in the correct position, it seems to me that it will go straight back and straight forward with no manipulation even if the shaft is at a 10* angle.  The only function of the shaft being vertical seems to me to be to put the top hand over the bottom hand, and I'm yet to be convinced that this position matters.  That said, I intend to work some with my GP this winter to see; I haven't used it in a couple of years since I first started, and I'm a little bit curious now that I've been at this awhile.

In regard to ball position, I think that this is one of the two fundamentals of face on that have to be obeyed, and figuring it out and then developing a preshot routine that gets ball position right take some time.  The other one is the feeling of the putter continuing down the line after contact to avoid a "pop" stroke; that gets rid of a lot of the benefits of the facing position lets the ball get offline much more easily.

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#232 J-Tizzle

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Posted 12 September 2017 - 04:40 PM

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 12 September 2017 - 01:14 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 11:48 AM, said:

Interesting too that there is so little instructional information available as opposed to the amount of stuff you can read on conventional putting. Seem to be fewer variables involved. For me it's mostly a matter of getting repeatable ball position - too far forward or back can cause misses left or right. I use the BG LFI and I think I have better results holding it at the set lie angle - inconsistent strikes when trying to hold it completely vertical.

Agreed.  I tried holding the putter out infront of me kinda how Juan says to do, then step in behind it and I really struggled for a consistent ball position.

I got a lot better really making sure my ball is aligned on my intended line, then i set my feet and just hold the putter in my right hand only (bottom hand) and let it hang as vertical as possible.  This has helped me make sure the putter is straight up and down, then adjust my feet as necessary.  This also helps make the set up a bit more consistent.

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I think he's saying that he makes sure that his right arm is hanging as vertical as possible, rather than the putter shaft.

I think with any of the face on putters except the GP, trying to hold the putter itself with the shaft vertical makes it tough to get consistent contact.  The GP putter is made to be used in a vertical position, but the trade-off, of course, is that the head is much smaller and much lighter.

I'm really not sure the extent to which the angle of the shaft between vertical and 10* matters; I'd love to see a study on it.  IF my right arm is in the correct position, it seems to me that it will go straight back and straight forward with no manipulation even if the shaft is at a 10* angle.  The only function of the shaft being vertical seems to me to be to put the top hand over the bottom hand, and I'm yet to be convinced that this position matters.  That said, I intend to work some with my GP this winter to see; I haven't used it in a couple of years since I first started, and I'm a little bit curious now that I've been at this awhile.

In regard to ball position, I think that this is one of the two fundamentals of face on that have to be obeyed, and figuring it out and then developing a preshot routine that gets ball position right take some time.  The other one is the feeling of the putter continuing down the line after contact to avoid a "pop" stroke; that gets rid of a lot of the benefits of the facing position lets the ball get offline much more easily.

Correct, I don't necessarily mean its 90* (but I will say, its easier to do with the LFI since the face is shorter than the Juan, for example), but that I just get it in a position where it feels more straight back and straight through.  When I used a Juan I felt like I couldn't get the putter in enough of an upright position to where it felt like I was swinging it on an arch, if that makes sense.  The LFI feels much more straight back and through.

I am interested in trying a GP putter if I can find one for a decent price.  But I'll be honest, I haven't heard great things about the feel of the putter and that its incredibly unforgiving since the face is so shallow.  But I'm sure over the winter I'll get bored and buy one of those or the IceBlock putters or whatever they're called.
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#233 BigEx44

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 05:19 AM

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:



You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I think he's saying that he makes sure that his right arm is hanging as vertical as possible, rather than the putter shaft.

I think with any of the face on putters except the GP, trying to hold the putter itself with the shaft vertical makes it tough to get consistent contact.  The GP putter is made to be used in a vertical position, but the trade-off, of course, is that the head is much smaller and much lighter.

I'm really not sure the extent to which the angle of the shaft between vertical and 10* matters; I'd love to see a study on it.  IF my right arm is in the correct position, it seems to me that it will go straight back and straight forward with no manipulation even if the shaft is at a 10* angle.  The only function of the shaft being vertical seems to me to be to put the top hand over the bottom hand, and I'm yet to be convinced that this position matters.  That said, I intend to work some with my GP this winter to see; I haven't used it in a couple of years since I first started, and I'm a little bit curious now that I've been at this awhile.


I've putted with both a vertical and non-vertical shaft at setup.  I prefer the non vertical because the putter does feel more stable.  If someone is going to putt with a vertical shaft - I think it's also critical to have a putter face with 0 degrees of loft.  Otherwise, any loft is going to push your putt slightly right unless you're making some unconscious manipulations.  The GP putters have 0 degrees of loft.

As far as long putts go - I played a PGA course yesterday (Oak Hill in Rochester NY): had 29 putts including at least 4 bombs from outside 20 feet.  I was certainly unusually "hot" with my putter (a DF), and it helped that I was playing on pristine greens and had a caddy giving me perfect reads - so making long putts with sidesaddle is certainly doable.

I've been putting sidesaddle for 5 years now.  Will never go back.  And have gotten to the point I don't even think about it anymore (relative to what others may think).  I have a putting setup in my cellar and am constantly comparing my sidesaddle stroke to a more traditional stroke (and broom stroke).  My sidesaddle is more accurate and more repeatable - not even close.

Sidesaddle putting rocks!!

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#234 J-Tizzle

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:04 AM

View PostBigEx44, on 13 September 2017 - 05:19 AM, said:

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I think he's saying that he makes sure that his right arm is hanging as vertical as possible, rather than the putter shaft.

I think with any of the face on putters except the GP, trying to hold the putter itself with the shaft vertical makes it tough to get consistent contact.  The GP putter is made to be used in a vertical position, but the trade-off, of course, is that the head is much smaller and much lighter.

I'm really not sure the extent to which the angle of the shaft between vertical and 10* matters; I'd love to see a study on it.  IF my right arm is in the correct position, it seems to me that it will go straight back and straight forward with no manipulation even if the shaft is at a 10* angle.  The only function of the shaft being vertical seems to me to be to put the top hand over the bottom hand, and I'm yet to be convinced that this position matters.  That said, I intend to work some with my GP this winter to see; I haven't used it in a couple of years since I first started, and I'm a little bit curious now that I've been at this awhile.


I've putted with both a vertical and non-vertical shaft at setup.  I prefer the non vertical because the putter does feel more stable.  If someone is going to putt with a vertical shaft - I think it's also critical to have a putter face with 0 degrees of loft.  Otherwise, any loft is going to push your putt slightly right unless you're making some unconscious manipulations.  The GP putters have 0 degrees of loft.

As far as long putts go - I played a PGA course yesterday (Oak Hill in Rochester NY): had 29 putts including at least 4 bombs from outside 20 feet.  I was certainly unusually "hot" with my putter (a DF), and it helped that I was playing on pristine greens and had a caddy giving me perfect reads - so making long putts with sidesaddle is certainly doable.

I've been putting sidesaddle for 5 years now.  Will never go back.  And have gotten to the point I don't even think about it anymore (relative to what others may think).  I have a putting setup in my cellar and am constantly comparing my sidesaddle stroke to a more traditional stroke (and broom stroke).  My sidesaddle is more accurate and more repeatable - not even close.

Sidesaddle putting rocks!!

It has really made a difference in my game as well.  My home course has perfect greens and typically pretty fast and thats just built for side saddle.  I do struggle with slower greens when I feel like I have to hit the ball more than just letting the putter do the work.

I'm about done for the season (one scramble left this weekend), but I will be making a guide for side saddle putting practice this winter.  I wish I had kept the Juan Putt track that came with that putter, but I guess a 2x4 will work just as well for a straight line.
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#235 Ripper212

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 08:24 AM

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 13 September 2017 - 08:04 AM, said:

View PostBigEx44, on 13 September 2017 - 05:19 AM, said:

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I think he's saying that he makes sure that his right arm is hanging as vertical as possible, rather than the putter shaft.

I think with any of the face on putters except the GP, trying to hold the putter itself with the shaft vertical makes it tough to get consistent contact.  The GP putter is made to be used in a vertical position, but the trade-off, of course, is that the head is much smaller and much lighter.

I'm really not sure the extent to which the angle of the shaft between vertical and 10* matters; I'd love to see a study on it.  IF my right arm is in the correct position, it seems to me that it will go straight back and straight forward with no manipulation even if the shaft is at a 10* angle.  The only function of the shaft being vertical seems to me to be to put the top hand over the bottom hand, and I'm yet to be convinced that this position matters.  That said, I intend to work some with my GP this winter to see; I haven't used it in a couple of years since I first started, and I'm a little bit curious now that I've been at this awhile.


I've putted with both a vertical and non-vertical shaft at setup.  I prefer the non vertical because the putter does feel more stable.  If someone is going to putt with a vertical shaft - I think it's also critical to have a putter face with 0 degrees of loft.  Otherwise, any loft is going to push your putt slightly right unless you're making some unconscious manipulations.  The GP putters have 0 degrees of loft.

As far as long putts go - I played a PGA course yesterday (Oak Hill in Rochester NY): had 29 putts including at least 4 bombs from outside 20 feet.  I was certainly unusually "hot" with my putter (a DF), and it helped that I was playing on pristine greens and had a caddy giving me perfect reads - so making long putts with sidesaddle is certainly doable.

I've been putting sidesaddle for 5 years now.  Will never go back.  And have gotten to the point I don't even think about it anymore (relative to what others may think).  I have a putting setup in my cellar and am constantly comparing my sidesaddle stroke to a more traditional stroke (and broom stroke).  My sidesaddle is more accurate and more repeatable - not even close.

Sidesaddle putting rocks!!

It has really made a difference in my game as well.  My home course has perfect greens and typically pretty fast and thats just built for side saddle.  I do struggle with slower greens when I feel like I have to hit the ball more than just letting the putter do the work.

I'm about done for the season (one scramble left this weekend), but I will be making a guide for side saddle putting practice this winter.  I wish I had kept the Juan Putt track that came with that putter, but I guess a 2x4 will work just as well for a straight line.

Have you ever tried the LFI armlock style for the longer putts?


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#236 J-Tizzle

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:18 AM

View PostRipper212, on 13 September 2017 - 08:24 AM, said:

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 13 September 2017 - 08:04 AM, said:

View PostBigEx44, on 13 September 2017 - 05:19 AM, said:

View Postbluedot, on 12 September 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 12 September 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

You don't find any issue holding the LFI vertical? Not sure I get consistent online roll that way with heel off the ground.

I think he's saying that he makes sure that his right arm is hanging as vertical as possible, rather than the putter shaft.

I think with any of the face on putters except the GP, trying to hold the putter itself with the shaft vertical makes it tough to get consistent contact.  The GP putter is made to be used in a vertical position, but the trade-off, of course, is that the head is much smaller and much lighter.

I'm really not sure the extent to which the angle of the shaft between vertical and 10* matters; I'd love to see a study on it.  IF my right arm is in the correct position, it seems to me that it will go straight back and straight forward with no manipulation even if the shaft is at a 10* angle.  The only function of the shaft being vertical seems to me to be to put the top hand over the bottom hand, and I'm yet to be convinced that this position matters.  That said, I intend to work some with my GP this winter to see; I haven't used it in a couple of years since I first started, and I'm a little bit curious now that I've been at this awhile.


I've putted with both a vertical and non-vertical shaft at setup.  I prefer the non vertical because the putter does feel more stable.  If someone is going to putt with a vertical shaft - I think it's also critical to have a putter face with 0 degrees of loft.  Otherwise, any loft is going to push your putt slightly right unless you're making some unconscious manipulations.  The GP putters have 0 degrees of loft.

As far as long putts go - I played a PGA course yesterday (Oak Hill in Rochester NY): had 29 putts including at least 4 bombs from outside 20 feet.  I was certainly unusually "hot" with my putter (a DF), and it helped that I was playing on pristine greens and had a caddy giving me perfect reads - so making long putts with sidesaddle is certainly doable.

I've been putting sidesaddle for 5 years now.  Will never go back.  And have gotten to the point I don't even think about it anymore (relative to what others may think).  I have a putting setup in my cellar and am constantly comparing my sidesaddle stroke to a more traditional stroke (and broom stroke).  My sidesaddle is more accurate and more repeatable - not even close.

Sidesaddle putting rocks!!

It has really made a difference in my game as well.  My home course has perfect greens and typically pretty fast and thats just built for side saddle.  I do struggle with slower greens when I feel like I have to hit the ball more than just letting the putter do the work.

I'm about done for the season (one scramble left this weekend), but I will be making a guide for side saddle putting practice this winter.  I wish I had kept the Juan Putt track that came with that putter, but I guess a 2x4 will work just as well for a straight line.

Have you ever tried the LFI armlock style for the longer putts?


I have not tried it for that, but I've tried armlock and it is the most uncomfortable style ever for me.  I don't see how people do it at all, lol.
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#237 Ripper212

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:28 AM

Me too but the LFI actually works pretty well for that. Only use it that way for long lags or putts from the fringe

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#238 J-Tizzle

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 12:32 PM

View PostRipper212, on 13 September 2017 - 10:28 AM, said:

Me too but the LFI actually works pretty well for that. Only use it that way for long lags or putts from the fringe

I might need to play around with it some.

I know off the fringe I actually straddle my line and let me tell you, I see why they made that illegal, because its as close to cheating with a putter that you can get.
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#239 bluedot

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 05:45 PM

You guys will like this:

So today, I get paired up with three guys I didn't know; on the FIRST green on my FIRST putt, the ball isn't more than a few feet off my putter face before one of the guys (who, btw, turned out to be a MAJOR ****** all day!) said very loudly, "Is that even legal?"

I said it was; that you couldn't straddle or anchor, and he replied, "I thought they outlawed that with Mr. Snead!"  Now I'm just a little irritated, and I told him he needed to read some golf history and the Rules, to which he said that he had a good source for that sort of information.  I told him that his source was s**t if he didn't know that rule, and he said, "Aw, I'm just busting you a little, man."  I'd met him five minutes earlier...

He proceeded to shoot a million, and probably had 45 putts; I loved every one of them!

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#240 Ripper212

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 06:21 PM

View PostJ-Tizzle, on 13 September 2017 - 12:32 PM, said:

View PostRipper212, on 13 September 2017 - 10:28 AM, said:

Me too but the LFI actually works pretty well for that. Only use it that way for long lags or putts from the fringe

I might need to play around with it some.

I know off the fringe I actually straddle my line and let me tell you, I see why they made that illegal, because its as close to cheating with a putter that you can get.

Damn. I forgot you could do that!


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