[eyezlee]

I'm thinking that both Phil and Tiger played Mr. Finchem. It appears that they sat down together and looked at the points system and figured out how to work it so they could still get their rest and make the Tour Championship.

Next year they need to start all points at zero after the second tournament if they want full participation....

[tpariff]

I think the solution is easier than that. Instead of offering a $10 million annuity, put the $10 million in cash at the 1st tee of the 1st round of the Tour Championship. These guys were all fired up when they first heard about the FedEx Cup and the $10 million. However, once they found out it is paid as an annuity, they lost some interest.

If you put the cash out there on the 1st tee or 18th green like they do at the World Series of Poker final table, it will give these guys something real to play for...not some retirement bonus that they won't see for a couple more decades.

Just my opinion, of course.

[mcputter]

eyezlee, on Sep 4 2007, 10:06 PM, said:

I'm thinking that both Phil and Tiger played Mr. Finchem. It appears that they sat down together and looked at the points system and figured out how to work it so they could still get their rest and make the Tour Championship.

Next year they need to start all points at zero after the second tournament if they want full participation....

tpariff, on Sep 4 2007, 10:13 PM, said:

I think the solution is easier than that. Instead of offering a $10 million annuity, put the $10 million in cash at the 1st tee of the 1st round of the Tour Championship. These guys were all fired up when they first heard about the FedEx Cup and the $10 million. However, once they found out it is paid as an annuity, they lost some interest.

If you put the cash out there on the 1st tee or 18th green like they do at the World Series of Poker final table, it will give these guys something real to play for...not some retirement bonus that they won't see for a couple more decades.

Just my opinion, of course.

I doubt that Tiger & Phil sat down to plan anything together and I think it's been established that the $10 million is not an annuity but a real payment that's put into the winner's retirement plan this year, which yes, cannot be accessed til retirement, but could grow to $30 or $40 million by that time.
Having said that: (1) fix the FEDEX schedule so that it's realistic for the best players to play in every event, (2) eliminate the pro-ams for these events so that they're treated like major championships, (3) make every player play in every event or they're out, and (4) the money should be paid out at the conclusion of the Tour Championship in regular dollars whether it's on a table by the 18th green or direct deposited into their bank accounts.

[emc]

Remember as well that the President's Cup is straight after the TC, I don't think any of the guys want to be burnt out for Jack

[andrew420d]

Great point about the President's Cup

[scotton]

When did they decide not to make it an annuity? So now they are putting an actual $10 mill into an account instead of the $380,000 or whatever it was?

[brettcra]

scotton, on Sep 5 2007, 09:59 AM, said:

When did they decide not to make it an annuity? So now they are putting an actual $10 mill into an account instead of the $380,000 or whatever it was?

It's paid as an annuity, but it's $10 million into an account now. Not sure where you got $380,000 from.

[brettcra]

eyezlee, on Sep 4 2007, 10:06 PM, said:

Next year they need to start all points at zero after the second tournament if they want full participation....

That would only make things worse. If points are reset after the first two tournaments, the players at the top would have no incentive to play the first two. They'd already have enough points to qualify for the top seventy. Woods, Mickelson, etc. would not have played either of the first two events.

[scotton]

brettcra,
there was another thread that led me to believe that the money wasn't placed into the account until the player retired, which would make the value of the money today around $380,000 depending on the players age and if the player's initials were TW. In other words if you invested $380,000 today, in 25 years when Tiger or whoever retires it would be worth $10M.

Either way it's kind of pathetic playing for a retirement fund. Is there really a rash of old pro golfers out there pan-handling and living in flop houses?

[brettcra]

scotton, on Sep 5 2007, 10:47 AM, said:

brettcra,
there was another thread that led me to believe that the money wasn't placed into the account until the player retired, which would make the value of the money today around $380,000 depending on the players age and if the player's initials were TW. In other words if you invested $380,000 today, in 25 years when Tiger or whoever retires it would be worth $10M.

Either way it's kind of pathetic playing for a retirement fund. Is there really a rash of old pro golfers out there pan-handling and living in flop houses?

And there is an interesting article on Yahoo sports that says Tiger could end up with as much as a billion dollars in his retirement account. It assumes he wins 7 Fedex Cups, keeps winning other tournaments at the same pace as he is now, and his retirement account earns 9% per year. Unbelievable!

[evanpar]

My proposed changes to the FedEx format:

1. Deduct 1000 points for a missed cut.

2. Deduct 1000 points for a no show. Same as a missed cut.

3. Add 1000 points for low score of the day, 900 for second low, etc for best 5 or 10 low scores each day. This way if you make the cut on the number you have something to play for other than money.

All 3 suggestions will get some significant movement in the point standings.

Evanpar

[john77]

evanpar, on Sep 5 2007, 07:04 AM, said:

My proposed changes to the FedEx format:

1. Deduct 1000 points for a missed cut.

2. Deduct 1000 points for a no show. Same as a missed cut.

It's nice to see the members of the Tim Finchem marching and chowder society are active here today.

[john77]

emc, on Sep 4 2007, 10:47 PM, said:

Remember as well that the President's Cup is straight after the TC, I don't think any of the guys want to be burnt out for Jack

Great point...

Commissioner Finchem needs to get the focus off what is best for him and onto what is best for the tour... he needs to L-I-S-T-E-N to Phil and Tiger...

[scotton]

It seems ridiculous that golf now has a "play off" that no one seems to care about, yet we still can't figure out how to have a college football playoff for a true national title? Maybe Finchem needs to go work for the NCAA. I would appreciate it if he would change the PGA Champ. back to a match play event before he leaves.

[j0npeterson]

there's no prestige for winning the fed-ex.

i hate to say it, but even for a $10 million in cash they're going to do what they want. they play to win. after all, 10 million would only be a down payment on Tiger's yacht.

[Joe Schmoe]

4 words. Double Elimination Match Play.

By staying in the winners bracket you get to play less matches. Plus it gives the better golfers more advantage.

[shallowdivots]

A four week playoff stretch for golf is just STUPID. Most players don't play four weeks in a row because they have family's! If you want to have a playoff the best way to do it is a match play tournament if you lose your done. Winner takes ALL!

[j0npeterson]

Joe Schmoe, on Sep 5 2007, 10:29 AM, said:

4 words. Double Elimination Match Play.

By staying in the winners bracket you get to play less matches. Plus it gives the better golfers more advantage.

i like this one.

[jdkfla]

They are both spoiled,pampered and not in touch with reality. They can't work 7 weeks in a row. That is lame. It's GOLF, not boxing. Last weeks tournament was GREAT TV, but with the top players taking weeks off it is a joke. I think Tiger and Phil are being selfish. The tour needed them to play every week and now the entire system is worthless. Phil needs to see his kids go to school, give me a break. My job makes me miss alot of things, you're supposed to man up and do it.

[coreyt]

I actually like to wake up in my own bed and kiss my children goodbye before school. But I could see how these golfers should put that aside to make us happy or would that make me selfish? I think players would play in all 4 events if there was a break and more money went to their charities.

[john77]

jdkfla, on Sep 5 2007, 03:44 PM, said:

They are both spoiled,pampered and not in touch with reality. They can't work 7 weeks in a row. That is lame. It's GOLF, not boxing. Last weeks tournament was GREAT TV, but with the top players taking weeks off it is a joke. I think Tiger and Phil are being selfish. The tour needed them to play every week and now the entire system is worthless. Phil needs to see his kids go to school, give me a break. My job makes me miss alot of things, you're supposed to man up and do it.

This may be the most self-serving post I've ever seen here.

[alcap26]

How about we just go back to playing some damn golf and screw this fedex cup! I liked the old system so much better.

[john77]

alcap26, on Sep 5 2007, 06:06 PM, said:

How about we just go back to playing some damn golf and screw this fedex cup! I liked the old system so much better.

I like the idea... but it won't happen because it would cause PERMANENT INJURY to commissioner Finchem's ego!!!

[Hawkeye03]

Did anyone else read this article on Yahoo! http://sports.yahoo....g...o&type=lgns
It appears the 10 mil goes into their retirement account now. So if Tiger won, his 10 mil would be worth 123 million when he turns 65. The article basically says if tiger wins 7 fed-ex cups he could have 1 billion in a retirement account. Crazy!

[johnu]

Hawkeye03, on Sep 5 2007, 09:37 PM, said:

Did anyone else read this article on Yahoo! http://sports.yahoo....g...o&type=lgns
It appears the 10 mil goes into their retirement account now. So if Tiger won, his 10 mil would be worth 123 million when he turns 65. The article basically says if tiger wins 7 fed-ex cups he could have 1 billion in a retirement account. Crazy!

Based on other articles and player reactions, it sounds like the author has confused the Fedex deferred annuity with the Tour retirement plan where players get an immediate chunk of money put into their accounts.

This is the same sleight of hand that state and national lotteries use where they say you are going to get 10 million, but it is is paid out over 20 or 25 years. In this case, it is even worse since you can't even start to collect until the later of 45 or tour retirement. It's a way to make people think that the prize is really great, but the reality is far different.

[johnu]

jdkfla, on Sep 5 2007, 04:44 PM, said:

The tour needed them to play every week and now the entire system is worthless.

Have you considered that the whole system was worthless before the start of the playoffs?

[emc]

How about leave the 1st 3 weeks the same, make the tour championship 32 players and matchplay. Matchplay over 4 weeks and 4 courses would be waay too boring but with 32 players, even if Tiuger goes out 1st round you'll still have a host of big names. Plus there'll be some cinderella stories of guys having 3 great weeks to get there, then in matchplay everything is an even matchup

[vikingjunior]

Like Phil and Tiger are really worried about money.

[larrybud]

alcap26, on Sep 5 2007, 10:06 PM, said:

How about we just go back to playing some damn golf and screw this fedex cup! I liked the old system so much better.

Regardless of the way points are calculated, how anyone can not have a positive reaction to the FedEx cup after seeing Phil, VJ and Tiger playing together for the first two day, I don't know. You'll NEVER get that matchup in a regular tournament.

Not only that, we might get to see it again in a week!

[sheppy335]

jdkfla, on Sep 5 2007, 07:44 PM, said:

They are both spoiled,pampered and not in touch with reality. They can't work 7 weeks in a row. That is lame. It's GOLF, not boxing. Last weeks tournament was GREAT TV, but with the top players taking weeks off it is a joke. I think Tiger and Phil are being selfish. The tour needed them to play every week and now the entire system is worthless. Phil needs to see his kids go to school, give me a break. My job makes me miss alot of things, you're supposed to man up and do it.

I think phil did man up, he went to see his kids off to the first day of school. I will also be late to work or take the day off for me kids going to school the first time. That is what real men do!

[d0n]

Maybe if some of the other players would have won a little more in the season or when it counted, Phil and Tiger wouldn't have the opportunity to take off. Either way this golf is no different than any of the other pro sports - it's all about money. There would be no 10 million or any million or fedex cup or even televised golf if fans and golf fanatics weren't willing to shell out money for gear, clothes, equipment, cars, or whatever else the PGA and it's sponsors are making money off of. If you're the best in your pro sport you can do just about anything you want to with the exception of dog fighting.

[jdkfla]

sheppy335, on Sep 6 2007, 04:21 PM, said:

jdkfla, on Sep 5 2007, 07:44 PM, said:

They are both spoiled,pampered and not in touch with reality. They can't work 7 weeks in a row. That is lame. It's GOLF, not boxing. Last weeks tournament was GREAT TV, but with the top players taking weeks off it is a joke. I think Tiger and Phil are being selfish. The tour needed them to play every week and now the entire system is worthless. Phil needs to see his kids go to school, give me a break. My job makes me miss alot of things, you're supposed to man up and do it.

I think phil did man up, he went to see his kids off to the first day of school. I will also be late to work or take the day off for me kids going to school the first time. That is what real men do!

I am not saying you never take off work for family, but everyones job has times that you can't miss even if you wanted to. The tour gives these players riches beyond belief and the system would have worked with full participation. Phil could have flown home on his private jet, spent time with his family and still played this week. I will watch golf with or without Phil/Tiger, but I am in the minority. Real men live up to their responsibilities, the TOUR will keep his children rich for ever, and the Tour needed him and he dropped the ball.

[shallowdivots]

Phil's #1 priority is not the Tour it is his FAMILY!! And I would be willing to bet that Phil makes more money off the course than he does on.

[jdkfla]

He makes money off the course because he has the tour to showcase his skills.

[shallowdivots]

I guess we will just agree to disagree. But I can tell you my kids come second to nobody PERIOD!

[mattlewis]

i'm still trying to figure out what it matters. golf is on TV. i watch it on the weekends. i could care less if it's a fedex cup. if tiger isn't in it, i watch somebody else. why do any of you guys give a big rats butt about how it works out?

personally, i'm kinda glad i got to "see" phil, veej and tiger play in the same group 2 days, and phil and tiger in all 4. i could care less that tiger skipped the week before and phil is skipping the week after. it's like a bonus as far as i'm concerned, cause if it wasn't for this deal, we wouldn't have seen either one of them at all until the TC.

and i could double care less about the payout. these guys are NOT playing for the money at this point.

[Baller]

I haven't watched any of this at all. To me, this is taking away from the guys below the 125 money line. What do they do for 4 weeks, how will the bubble guys have a chance to earn a living for next year? These four weeks should be about finding someway to have a playoff which includes some tour status for those guys. That would be more exciting to watch, hell the top playes don't want to play anyway, and the bubble guys don't want to go back to Q-School!

[KF_Tower]

sheppy335, on Sep 6 2007, 03:21 PM, said:

jdkfla, on Sep 5 2007, 07:44 PM, said:

They are both spoiled,pampered and not in touch with reality. They can't work 7 weeks in a row. That is lame. It's GOLF, not boxing. Last weeks tournament was GREAT TV, but with the top players taking weeks off it is a joke. I think Tiger and Phil are being selfish. The tour needed them to play every week and now the entire system is worthless. Phil needs to see his kids go to school, give me a break. My job makes me miss alot of things, you're supposed to man up and do it.

I think phil did man up, he went to see his kids off to the first day of school. I will also be late to work or take the day off for me kids going to school the first time. That is what real men do!

Couldn't have said it better myself!
Thanks for reducing the amount I was going to have to type!!

[mosesgolf]

Phil made approx $30 mil last year and Tiger $90mil. It's probably going to be higher in 07 and going forward. IMO, the FEDEX Cup is really not that important to them. And if Tim really pisses off one of these guys, they'll just play 2 out of 4 instead of 3 out of 4.

[Swingtheclub]

First point

Tiger and Phil are not the only ones that took a week off or dissed the commissh

Ernie did Verplank did and Ernie made some comments.

Both Phil and Tiger make the tour as much money as the tour makes them if not more.

The bottom line is they work for themselves and they work when they want too.

If I had that kind of money I damn sure would.