How come all the recent posts that have any referance to BSG are quickly locked up? Being someone who used to spend 100% of my golf related websurfing on BSG in the last several years and now in the last 1/2 year or so I have spent 99.99% of my golf surfing on here because this is a site where everyone can share their opinions and not be afraid of censorship, a rude verbal beat down, or worse if you go against the grain of the kool aid drinkers over there. When I didnt know any better I thought BSG was the nuts till the weird behavior of the powers that be over there became more and more frequent to the point where I couldnt really beleive anyhting that was said over there because it was either said to sell something or to azz kiss the supreme beings on there... I have never been one to azz kiss so I looked for a new home. What was most refreshing over here was the cool people that ran this site, there was no hidden agenda over here like I felt over there. I felt like over there was like living in Cuba.. if you cross the big guys path then .. off with your head!!!! Please dont let this site go that way... as long as people are telling the truth let them speak... when they speak of that other site it just shows everyone how lucky we are to have this site. Im not looking to ruffle feathers here but I like hanging on this site for what it is and love to see other people feel the same way I do about the "communist golf forum". Freedom of speach is the American way baby!!!!

I hear ya. I think the Mods here think it's best to not even mention the other site because mud slinging tends to get started pretty quickly. I can't blame them either.


In before the lock!

Ty,

I would say many, if not the majority of members here don't know about or care about BSG.* When GolfWRX was founded, we decided to take the high road and not air dirty laundry or allow the attacking of people or other sites as all it does is bring out the ugliness of people. I have records of sites that have attacked us, slandered us to other members of the golfing profession and attempted to sabotage relationships. Do we talk or acknowledge them? No. Because we don't want this place to go negative. There are plenty of other places for that. There are only two websites that we are on bad terms with and that is all I will say about that. BSG is a business, its their website and they can do with it as they please. Don't bring the ugliness here as it has nothing to do with WRX or what GolfWRX is about. I've read the threads on the other boards and frankly, I'm highly dissappointed that those threads have degraded to the extent that they have. Its not something I would expose my child to or a decent community.










*Reid(PitBull808) can verify this as he greets all member

Gx... Dont get me wrong I am not trying to bring in any ugliness here. Just not sure why a forum of all adults cant discuss things as adults do. Heck I think any discussion makes this site look better because it makes you realize that this is "by golfers for golfers"... not "by salesmen for golfers" like "other sites". Like I said not trying to stir the pot just thinking out loud. Beleive me I appreciate this site as it gives me hours of reading each and every day...although my wife wishes your site would crash and burn .. ... I cant figure out why she feels that way ... Like I said I guess I look at open discussion on the topic more as a validation of this place more than a slamming of the Ozik-Nazi's. Peace

Im glad the mods have agreed to stick to discussing golf and not other sites. True sign of maturity. Also Ty please think twice before using words like the one tied to Ozik. It has many negative meanings to many different people.

If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all.

The fact that there are so many outcasts here says a lot. In fact, it probably says enough. Constantly complaining and tossing stones simply makes you, and the site that allows it, look pretty bad.

Personally, I like both sites just fine. But that is merely a personal opinion. If you don't like one or the other, don't spend time there.

Nick... was a spin on the "soup Nazi" from Seinfeld... nothing more nothing less... just the " No soup for you guy" reminded me of some guys on other sites...lol


Head... wasnt tossing stones at anyone was just curious as to why the censorship. It wasnt a matter of saying nothing "nice" just curious as to why it was taboo.

The problem is that there are over 50k unique viewers of this site every month. The community is comprised of Men, Women, and kids of all ages. Spirited, adult, and intelligent discussion is encouraged and welcome. Blowing off or teeing off on inviduals or sites is not. We have many topics that touch on BSG practices but we don't believe there is any redeeming value in crusading against them. They have their niche and they've been successful to some extent.

We don't allow their pics to be posted here because they will not allow ours to be posted on their site. We do that out of "mutual respect" if you can call it that. I don't think you were stirring it up and you raised a valid question. We speak to our Industry Sponsors and people "connected" every day. We know what the real stories are and that fact is, they will not talk about in public and we think that that model is the correct one.

Gx... good enough. I will never mention them on here again. Thanks for making this place what it is.

Ty,

No worries. As others have said. The fact that this, "rip off" , site has been here for over a year, is supported by many Industry leading OEMs, and has a great percentage of people in which this is their first site, means a whole lot to us. Don't turn us into the CaddyShack sequels.

Here comes the Judge Smails.

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I pretty much stay out of these threads as far as replying to them. As a Moderator unfortunately I dont' have the option of skipping over topics that I'm not interested in.

I have one thought concerning BSG. I don't care about what they do there. I'm here at GolfWRX. I came here as a Charter Member, immediately liked the atmosphere and fresh reviews with no spin. I knew the founders well from BSG and I knew they all had day jobs and basically were fanatics like me. Soon after I was offered the oppurtunity as a Moderator and although I was still a member as well as "Insider" there, I knew I was happier here. The community was fresh. The reviews were honest. The site wasn't bashing brands because the "known" members hated them. The maturity level was higher and golf was the only focus of the board. With the growth of our site, we've recieved new members from across the globe as well as forums. Thousands of new viewers visit our site of the first time and join up. For many of them, this is their first experience with a golf forum. I'd like to think if it was my first time, I could read and learn about equipment and participate in a healthy discussions without having to sift through mudslinging.


This is GolfWRX. In my opinion the best source for all my golf information and also a place where I have met virtually through the internet a great bunch of people. Lets stay positive and concentrate on golf, equipment and our love of the game.

ALRIGHT NOW I'M GONNA STIR THE POT!! How the heck does one imbed you tube on here??? You must tell... as it could bring some of these threads to life..lol

Consider me one to be happily associated "over here" with the "outcasts" after having been on the wrong side of the banfest.

Your time will come, just wait.

Paste in the youtube code. Then look for Post Options above File attachements. Set "HTML On" with either option.

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I've been dinged "over there" before. I didn't think it was fair, but I did try and remember who pays the bills and let it go. I've also been treated very well by some of the members "there."

I just try and take each site for what it is without too many expectations. That way I am delighted with what I actually get out of them. It is, in the end, only the internet.

Ty, I suspect the "taboo" is due to the fact that too many "I'm not bashing" threads turn into bashing threads - even if the original author had good intentions. Just a guess though...

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HAHA.. thanks Gx for the tip... You are da man!!! I couldnt resist this one as it reminded me of a foursome of golfwrx'ers playing behind the boys from the other site..lol I didnt say what site so please no haters..

There are a lot of people on this site (and I see a lot of them currently in this thread) that could tell stories that would disgust you if you knew. On the flip side of that coin, there is an equal or greater number of members of both sites. The internet golf community is small and I see familiar names over the multiple sites that I frequent.

While I can't speak directly for WRX, the feeling that I have gotten from the site is that they want to be above the drama that is over there. Yes, the "other site" has gotten crazy. Yes, there is some stuff that I never thought that I would see over there. But it's their site to run, even if they choose to run it into the ground.

As I said in a previous thread, the best part of this site is the membership. The people bring the information here without bias or the ulterior motive of sales. I appreciate that more and more as I read reviews and spend more time on this site. It is definitely a direction that the "other site" has not chosen to travel.

If you like the way this site is run, give them your time and support their sponsors and B/S/T section. If you do not like the way another site is run, don't even give them the courtesy of your IP hit. When the sales dry up and the forum is dead, your point will have been made.

I have seen these threads get closed and the moderators have always said why. They get ugly and fast. The fact that they take the time to explain themselves is more of a courtesy that other sites give. Plus this site's "View New Posts" and "Search" functions actually work.

Again, my thanks to GolfWRX and the way that you run the site. It is a welcome change from the place that I used to call home.

There's a thing called etiquette. That's what is missing in all of the other sports. You call a penalty on your self. You right down the right score. You don't pick a fights with the other members of your foresome. You still don't talk when you buddy is three putting.

I love this site. It's one place where I don't have to worry about needing to have internet filters.

Mods, keep up the good worlk.

To be honest it was only a couple of days ago when we started talking about BSG that I even figured out what the other site was. As far as I am concerned, there are no other sites than WRX. I usually spend something like 5-6 hours a day on here surfing in between being on hold at work and pretending to be working...If it can keep me intrigued that long, I would say that things are going quite well here.

BTW, I refer as many people as possible to this site. Most of them are blown away at how readily available tour equipment is on here. And it is always cool to be the guy with the scoop on the new equipment (THANKS EVERYONE!)

While I admire your professionalism and courtesy, BS g is not a traditional golf forum.

A traditional forum invites open discussion according to established rules. Its sponsors provide goods and services to members. The forum operator is able to care for his members and sponsors in a fair and equitable manner.

In the BS g model, the operator is a provider of goods and services and uses the forums to feed its business. From reports, members are either banned, posts deleted, or threatened with banishment if they post content that is not in the best interests of the online retailer that is BS g. From posts on various forums, banishments are sometimes applied against people who have not violated posted rules of their forum/business.

The BS g type of business model requires a high degree of ethics and professionalism because of the inherent conflicts. I won't comment on BS g's practices -- but there are 600+ posts in one thread on another forum, and several threads on other forums that have generated 100+ posts and counting. And they are overwhelmingly unfavorable to BS g.

Unlike GEA, GO, WRX or GD, BS g is more like a hybrid forum/internet retailer and therefore is a legitimate target for the consumers of its products and services and subject to complaint in this and other forums.

BS g runs a different model where they become a legitimate target for complaint - their product is not only the forum but they are a retailer. This is the path they have chosen. Todd evidently thought that having a "forum" would protect him from complaints on other forums by other forum owners. It did work for a time. He wants it both ways. He is a retailer who wants no one to complain about his product and services on other forums.

You just can't have your cake and eat it, too. If someone has a complaint against Golf Galaxy, Watts, Dunn, or any retailer - you can post it here. The same is true of BS g. If they want to sell, and the forum is part of their product, then they must take the good with the bad. It is the path they chose.

Swingman, your message is clear and understood. Golfwrx is and always has been above the fray, and I am thankful for that.

I am thankful, too, for the professionalism shown by GolfWrx. But a lot of people ask, why is BS g an issue on a golf forum?

It's because they seem to be more of a retailer with discussion forums that are censored by them even though posts are within their rules.

I just wanted to give a justification on why, at least as a retailer using forums to generate business, they are a legitimate subject of discussion.

Thanks.

I agree w/ you Keith. I'm glad to be here.

Why close threads? Double-edged sword...

Golfwrx.com was developed for a few reasons. Being "pure" for golfers. Being unbiased as well as the most "high tech" website that technology can provide. We wanted to develop that Ultimate web site for all of us "golfers" to call home.

Lets face it. Once we get hooked in these sites it is hard to get away isn’t it? I was hooked soon after I joined Golf Opinions. I can still remember reading JoshWhit 's reviews and looking at PRad's Firesole Forged bag. Hooked for life. Golf Opinions is still solid as the day I joined. Nothing but the upmost respect for them. Then BSG came in play, and soon after GO had the server issues that put them down for a while.

I spend a lot of time on these websites. A lot of time posting, lurking, reading, adding Pictures, etc. I needed to believe in whom I was supporting. I needed to believe in the community I found myself part of. Yes I found myself part of it in a major way. Spending the time, adding value as a member is giving. Like myself, I talked to many other that found themselves not proud of their affiliations, and were looking for something different. At the end of the day I felt it was time to develop a place that we could all be proud of, that had the vision to take it to the next level. A place we could all be proud of. All of us could be part of something special.

We worked hard to modify software’s, and develop the right look. To create a strong vision "values" with long lasting "rules" that would last the test of time. We are confident that we have done a good job with all of our Members, and Moderators help. We listened to feedback and made the changes that you were looking for. Ryan and I risked 10's of thousands of dollars to build what we have here and it is time to shine. Our pace is incredible, and the membership feedback has been positive.

All that being said we see threads open up like this we are torn. Double edged sword. While we feel it is healthy to educate the members from "other" sites about the opinions of so many, we are real close to violating one of our "values" (written rules).


Link to Rules

-No personal attacks on anyone.
-No threads or posts bashing of other forums or their members.

While we want the truth to se exposed and the freedom of speech to be allowed these threads by their nature are confrontational. That is the balance. Ryan (gxgolfer) said it well.

I hope you all understand we try to allow as much as we can until the drama becomes all too much. We are here for other reasons, and proud of it.





At the end of the day posts like yours keeps the community strong. Resolution. Thanks for being so cool Ty. Glad your here.



Reid-
Very well written. As I have said to you on the phone and in my PM thanks again. You show the members and me the meaning of "lead by example". A true touch of class you are Reid. True touch of class. Everything this site stands for. Class, honesty, integrity, and just like Reid has- a serious obsession for the game.




Coming from you stage it means a lot. Seeing the veteran members choose GolfWRX over another means a lot. Shows that we are doing something right. It is our passion.




No thank you. Our members are what makes this place what it is. The fact that you clicked the reply button and took the time makes all the difference. The more I read the more excited I am getting. We pride ourselves here as a golf community with a "gentlemans club" feel. Take the high road stuff. We love this game. Golfwrx was built by golfers for golfers. We are not here for $, we are here for our obsession.

And I agree with you Eric... I'm glad to be here too.

As we all continue to enjoy and read these entertaining threads, we should stop and celebrate the fact that a forum such as GolfWrx exists just for the reason that we are all allowed to be here to not only enjoy the wide variety of opinions and points of view of the members, but also the fact that the management of the website has the patience, temerity and high-minded ideals to provide this arena of free exchange of ideas. After all, isn't that why Al Gore invented the Internet. ;-)

I am excited because this may be the one forum that I don't get banned from.

I too used to be a frequent visitor of the other site until today when iI decided to look at GO (sorry if i shouldnt mention other sites) and saw a post by Springbok (who is also a member here and was banned over "there"). Springbok offered some of the most insightful posts there were over there. That coupled with the fact that numerous other members were banned I decided enough was enough and came over here. Many of those banned members, I see, have moved over here. I now look forward to reading their posts and insight here at GolfWRX.

Count me as one of the guys who got tossed! Big Hitter said the greens in Vegas run 13 all the time. Coach dared Big Hitter to prove it. Big Hitter does not like to be challenged especially when somebody knows what they are talking about (or at least more than Big Hitter). Coach got tossed till 2024. Coach has another logon and IP address, but seriously I waste enough time on golf, why waste it with people who are shallow and close minded.

I am a member of both sites, but I don't really post over there anymore. I do all my posting here now and I love this site. It amazes me to see how many people say they were banned over there. I didn't realize it was that easy to get banned and it was even more of a surprise to see that a Mod was banned.

I think we should all do everything we can to keep this site running as good as it does. This site has so much potential and has nowhere to go but up!!

I've been banned from there for as long as I can remember and all I did was ask about Nomad Golf, and listed a site that sold PX shafts. Todd sent me an e-mail saying I was soliciting sales for a company without paying the advertising fees. LOL Love it o over here a ton more.

Tha's my 2 cents and now I'm broke

-CHRIS-

Doesn't take much to get banned then does it?

Oh well. At least we have GolfWRX.com! If it wasn't for this place I would get so much work done and that would just be a shame.

Come on admins. You gotta allow this one. It's just waaaaay to funny.

http://forums.prospero.com/golfequip/messages/?msg=210690.1

Look I don't know everything thats going on with the two of you,I've read your posts and "his" and just don't do something here to get youself banned trying to burn bridges because I've always enjoyed your pics and insight on stuff that matters.Be cool and you'll be here forever any chance for some Shark Shootout pics?

I dont hang out at golfwrx much -- and not much at BSG either (GCA is more my taste). However, a valuable service is being performed when a CREDIBLE site (Golfwrx) can air reasonable and accurate perceptions of an IN-CREDIBLE site (BSG).

Those guys are ripping off the public as much as any busted deal on GEA or counterfeit clubs on Ebay. They immediately hide the evidence (Wishon affair) after lying about it, and are so paranoid they now pull offensive comments within a few (2-3!) minutes.

It seems there are a large number of younger "kids" on that site that groove on being near their definition of "golf cool". The events of the past few weeks can only help to open their eyes, SHOULD THEY GET NEAR ANY OTHER CREDIBLE SITE such as Golfwrx.

To your credit, this site apparently keeps the threads even if locked.

I'll be back!

Also an Ex-BSG member here. I was banned after 3 years for no good reason. Oh well their loss. I won't sling mud and don't think anyone else needs to but a thread like this can help others understand what some sites are all about and make them realize that they are not alone in the way they were treated.

I only feel sorry for the younger kids that are being swindled out of their money by other sites.

I don't know how anyone can support a site that is run by liars and con-men. Why would you associate yourself with people like that? He can't even own up to his own words, even when there are screen shots of exactly what he said. If I was his father, I would be ashamed that I raised a son with no honesty or integrity.

I heard from another member on this site that i played golf with that his buddy lost his job at a big OEM because of Todd at BSG.

Apparently the person was posting information that was conflicting with BSG stated info on both sites and BSG used the member information and sent it to the OEM stating that the employee was posting confidential information.

One thing led to the other and the member was let go.

I guess they will go to all lengths and stoop to all depths to make sure their false information is not revealed or second guess to effect their PROFITS.

I was disgusted when I heard this and it ruined my round as I was thinking about it for the final 9 holes.

THAT IS JUST NOT RIGHT!

If you choose to believe them then so be it, but its nice to visit this site and see a dose of reality.

I dont care for there Bully know it all attitude.

I am glad the membership here is growing as we are getting some great members that will undoubtly help this site grow with their insite and knowledge. The thing is I am seeing more and more people that were at the other site and not only were they members, but it seemed as if they were very notable members of the site and now they are here because of being banned or a falling out.

to all here i say hi...i am known as clnconcpts on the other sites... i can say i enjoy what i read here.this site has onlys been real...i do look at all of the forums out there..thanks to all for such a good site.

Without trying to bash anyone, I don't feel like this site "pushes" product in the face of evidence the product is inferior to other offerings from OEMS. In addition, I feel the tolerance for dissenting views - presented in a respectful manner - at this site is refreshing.

This is a chilling post. DClown has been e-mailing me at work, specifically referencing the company I work for, and trying to lure me into responding to the things he says regarding the company. I guess now I know why. Thank goodness I never responded to him (regarding the work comments)

WOW! Can't say I'm surprised but I never thought he would take it that far.

I find it refreshing this site....

I am amazed everyday of the people who have "Transferred" because of all the crap.

I thought it is a classy touch though of Reid personally sending a PM.

I also was not worried about my identity over there or here, so I am "Lefty19"

Nice to see ALOT of guys here... another site has lost valuable people.
Guys who I respect and never had to worry about the old P&D"PUMP AND DUMP" tricks to flip a buck.

I am not the biggest poster or one who gets to hit alot of clubs but I like to think it is honest aand I believe in Integrity.

David

If this is what he is actually trying to do to you Deon then that is dirty and I lose any small amount of respect I had for them. I would just keep ignoring his e-mails.

[/quote]


This is a chilling post. DClown has been e-mailing me at work, specifically referencing the company I work for, and trying to lure me into responding to the things he says regarding the company. I guess now I know why. Thank goodness I never responded to him (regarding the work comments)
[/quote]

If that was his intention...that's just flat evil.

I'm a member there, but don't visit anymore. Once I saw the prices they were charging....after I regained my composure from laughing my butt off, I realized it was kind of a spider web for flies.

No thanks, I'd be embarassed to pull anything lime green out of my bag.

I'd feel like a sheep.

BSG seems to have crashed completely RIP

Fellas,

Please keep this factual and not 2nd or 3rd hand info. First hand info from personal experiences. Again, please not mud slinging.

210690.1

Check it out Tom Wishons posts on BSG. Priceless.

From Tom Wishon to Todd aka Bighitter.
"Enough, I'm done - going back to my work and will recommend that Todd get a copy of Common Sense Clubfitting to see if there is something in there that might help him learn a little more about this great craft of clubmaking and fitting."

I just fell off my chair laughing after reading that.... Hilarious