Curious who's at fault here, let me know how the situation could've been handled differently or who was in the wrong.


So, I used to caddy at a local country club in Berkeley, Ca. I put in hours of waiting, and face time to try and establish a relationship with some of the members. It got to a point where I only got one caddy job a week...at best. There were two, "favorites" amongst the shop pros, who got "everything". All the loops, all the benefits and all the respect. Needless to say there was constant turmoil in the caddy shack due to the unrelenting favoritism.

Mondays were, "Caddy Day". Caddies had access to the course for playing privelages. The story begins on a Monday, "Caddy Day". I met up promptly at noon with three other caddies. The country club lacked a sufficient driving range, and caddies weren't allowed there anyways. Before my round I dropped a couple of balls on the tee and hit my 9 iron down the fairway about 150 yards. No divot, no strays. It was an effort to "get loose". That's when it happened.

Mr. Superintendent came barrelling down the #1 fairway right at me, in a utility cart. He stopped about 5-8 feet infront of me and "went off". He was cursing up a storm, pointing his finger and yelling as loud as his heart would let him. His defining statement was, "you're F'N up the tee box, hitting a F'N iron on a par 4" My defining statemnt was, "it's a par 5, and I'm not even taking out a divot". Superintendent took this as an insult and felt it necessary to kick me off the course for the day.

Long story short, there was about 10 more minutes of cursing back and forth during which the Superintendent rallied his barn yard buddies for support. The superintendent was pointing at me and snickering like a 8 year old who had just stolen my lunch money! Unfortunately for me the guy had 30 years invested in the Country Club and they'd probably back any of his actions even if he shot someone!

I made a decision to speak my mind during the altercation considering all the factors of my employment, finances, and wasted time.....the job wasn't worth it. In the end my idea was that the Country Club is a joke, and I had already wasted so much of my life there trying to, "get out" that I wasn't going to let some; unhappy, over weight, never been laid, ugly, foreflushing, no good, brainless, hopeless, d!(Kless guy push me around....and take it.

Any thoughts?

probably would have wound up doing the same thing as you. i used to caddie, and been in a some situations similar. (whered id loop once at the course, try to play and they try to kick me off kinda thing.) in your case the super obviously overreacted. you hate your job, people there suck, and youre not getting paid. frankly im surprised you stayed this long.

bad bosses are a dime a dozen. while losing your job sucks, learning when to walk away is just as important.

I personally don't see the harm in what you did, and I know I would have went off on the guy in the way you did. Even if you had taken a divot, divots on a tee box just happen sometime. A guy I know takes beaver pelts out of the ground with this driver practice swing.

I think it was time to move on anyway.

Thanks. By the way your profile photo is great! It was time to move on. It makes me laugh, genuinely, when I run into people on golf courses, or at our local skins game that also used to caddy there and they say, "what happened?, I heard you got kicked out". Honest to god, I love to hear that. It's gossip, in our country, at its best.

I probably would have then proceede to tee off a few wegde shots , just to show him what a divot was.

I used to work at a country club and would get slack for playing from the back tees, they really had no reasoning other than to say,"your not that good", funny that i shot 2 over that day

Well if you do not loose your opportunity to play there on Mondays', I would find an old driver that you do not care about and tee it up on #1 and take the biggest divot known to man. I am talking about the mother load of divots, just for him. There is not a tee at my home course that does not have a divot on it even all the par fives. My point is divots are apart of the game, and everyone takes a divot every now and then even when you dont want to. Like on par fives.

...so he's one of your best buddies then ???....

Seriously, I think it sounds like you've been quite reserved.....!! If it had been me, the nine iron might have been sticking out his arse.....!!!

I can't take all the credit for that expression. "Clark W. Griswold" helped me a little. Truth is that most of the caddies have had a similar situation with this jerk, and most of their opinions are similiar of him.

I would simply talk to your pros or director. your not tied to that job so if they dont have some sort of aggreeance with you then F them

Leaving ANY job with that kind of an atmosphere is the right thing to do. Certain Country Clubs have been/will be snobby forever. It just kind of goes with the territory when Money and/or Influence leads to 'position' or 'exclusivity'. While I'm the last person to begrudge anyone their income or position, it doesn't mean that I have to suffer fools!
Jackasses are Jackasses no matter what stratum of society they come from.

I am a bit shocked that you even brought these questions up period.

First off, Caddies @ a Private Club are "lucky" to have any privileges to the Members course or courses, but there are some course that do offer Caddies, and or Employee Monday as that special day.

If I was in your position I would never do anything that might get me thrown this special once a week golf day at that club. This day is know as a "perk", and like all perks, if you abuse it, you will loose it.

Maybe at the time you did not think that it was any big deal by doing what you did, but take a moment and just think if your buddy invited you to a high end private club and you walked out on the first tee and dropped a few balls in front of the members and hit a few 9 irons on the deck of this opening par 4. He would be going off on you and the other two members would be asking him to tell you to leave, it's that simple.

Now for the Sup, he was out of line by his actions towards you. He needed to drive up to the tee, call you over and tell you that if he ever saw you doing one thing that you should not be doing again that he will report you to the Caddie Shack and ask for you to be removed from the club. The course is his baby, so I can see a bit of anger from his side, but he handled it wrong as did you getting back into his face. A simple I am sorry and understand that I made a mistake by doing what I did and that Monday's are a privilege for Caddies and not a right.

It is also clear from the start that you had a chip on your shoulder about the caddie situation (which did not help in this situation).......either stick out and move up the ladder, or quit if you don't like the politics around you.

Now can you understand my opening sentence?

Oh yea.......I am not a member at a Private Course either. I did grow up on one and get invited as a quest often. I learned since I was young Jr Golfer have little privileges at CC's and I also learned to never to abuse what privileges I did have at these "Private" course even to this day.

TMBob

at the course i used to be a member of, the longest par 3 measured a whopping 170 yards...on one par 3, there is a tee box for a different hole a few yards straight back of the back tees on the par 3. So i decided to go hit 2 or 3 balls from that tee to the par 3 (mind you im literally like the only person on the course and its dusk)...im not taking any divots at all and each ball hit the tiny green which is actually pretty tough from even the regular tees. The greenskeeper comes walking by angrily and tells me stop...i react nicely, say sorry, and tell him i just wanted to practice from longer range since there arent any long par 3s...and he backs off a bit but says ill screw up the divot patterns...all the while theres not a divot to be seen on the box from me or anyone else. So i was kinda pissed since i was a member, nobody was around, and i wasnt taking any divots. Anyways its funny...last year they renovated the course a bit and one of the changes was that par-3's tee box and the adjacent on that i was hitting off of. They pretty much made it one large tee off area with different tiers so they can mix up the tee's on both holes for different looks...so now the back tees on the par 3 are from where i was hitting from. just thought that was kinda funny and ironic...maybe i influenced that a bit

Just wondering which course you are talking about. Claremont perhaps?

Bushwood?

i think thats always hilarious when someone calls someone else a "foreflushing _______", lol. just makes me laugh for some reason. i probably would've done the same thing as you OP. you'll get a better job now

I suppose you know what you did was wrong just that the guy overreacting was what you took offense/personal to?

if so then I agree the guy was a jerk to yell and curse at you and could have told you in a nicer way that you are not suppose to use practice shots with your short irons in the teebox of a par 4/5.

Is the super being a jerk? yes. Should you have been practicing by hitting 9 irons off of the tee box? NO....YOU WORK THERE, YOU ARE NOT A MEMBER THIS GUY HAS EVERY RIGHT TO BE UPSET. Think about it, people will hammer you if you take a divot with a practice swing let alone hitting practie shots off of the fist tee with a 9 iron. I know you didn't take any divots, but you're a caddie and you can't even practice proper etiquette. That's where the problem is, its not your works fault this one is on you.

end thread

Yeah.
1) You aren't a member.
2) You aren't a guest.
3) This "privilege" is not a "right". They don't have to let caddies do anything but sling a bag around the course every day.
4) What the hell were you doing warming up on the course? Practicing on the course, with the exception of match play and other special situations, is a rules violation.
5) Grow up. Regarding...

This is the kind of tirade that a 10 year old goes on after he's been caught doing something he shouldn't be doing but doesn't want to take responsibility for it.

Man up and accept the consequences for your actions.

-mini

Lots of interesting comments and viewpoints here. Personally, I don't like my opponents to "hit practice shots" on the first tee regardless of where I'm playing. Tee boxes get chewed up enough in the course of regular play. You shouldn't have done it, period.

As for working in that environment, I don't understand why you stayed there to begin with. No loops = wasted time.

As for engaging the super in a ten minute tirade... don't. What did that accomplish? It's like wrestling a pig in the mud. You both get dirty and the pig likes it.

You're assuming too much. One loop every week is hardly something that I should cherrish. I'm a scratch handicap and the members were starting to request me with regularity. The problem is the fact that jerk, in authoritive positions fail to treat, lower totem pole employees with any respect. In the end I made a decision, to speak my mind. I'm a grown man, not a child. Telling me to, "grow up" is out of line. Your input is not welcome. The service that caddies provide to country clubs is priceless. The benefit of having a caddy at any golf course is something all courses should consider. Some caddies dedicate their lives to the trade. You're assuming that I just wondered in off the streets looking for a loop. Get real. Hitting a couple of extra balls is not out of line. Don't believe me?, look the % of positive responses compared to your one ridiculous response in this thread! Perhaps you should grow up, as you're out numbered.

minitour has it all right two posts up.

You aren't a member. Playing, for you, is a privilege. Even at that, you were violating the rules of golf.

If you were a Supterintendent, you'd have the same expectation, unless, of course, you weren't a good one.

WW

Sounds like both of you were wrong, but at least you went out in a blaze of glory.

Oh No He Didnt

For, "slander" purposes I will not respond with a name. However I can't think of any other CCs in Berkeley. So, FYI, if you're planning on attempting the caddy trade up there, know this; (1) ALL THE MEMBERS ARE LOCKED IN WITH CADDIES or FAVORITES, (2) YOU WILL NOT GET RESPECT FROM ANYONE, (3) THEY HAVE PUSH CARTS, GOLF CARTS AND 30 CADDIES ALREADY (do the math). Peace.

Don't assume that all caddies are looser, bumbs who deserve to be stepped on in life. Regardless of your job, postion, or popularity there is a certain respect you give others in this world. Had I been "off course" the superintendent was exibiting behavior, from the get go, that would have warranted some missing teeth! Furthermore this was a practice round, and there was no driving range access. It wasn't the U.S. Open or anything, when I'm working on specific facets of my game I don't pay much attention to the "rules of golf".

Great Metaphor, I'm going to use that someday.

So? That means it's okay to act like a 3 year old and not take responsibility for your actions?


1) Handicap is irrelevant to caddying. Just because you can play doesn't mean you can caddy and if you can caddy that doesn't mean you can play.
2) If they were requesting you, you would have been on their bag. Rule number one for any industry is don't piss off your customers. Members are your customers. You make them happy. Period.


Sounds to me like you fail to treat the superintendent and the course conditions with any respect going off the way you did.


That's fine, but there are consequences for your actions.


Then you need to act like it.


If you really did go off like you stated in the OP, then no it is not.


You asked for it. If you can't handle the truth, you shouldn't ask for it. The truth only hurts if it should.


You won't find me arguing there.


No. Not at all. I'm assuming that you think you're entitled to warm up on the course prior to play on "caddy day", which the club doesn't even have to give you the opportunity to participate in. If they wanted to allow you the opportunity to warm up, they'd allow you range access.


On the first tee, yes it is. One, it's poor etiquette, two it's against the rules.


So because they agree with you, that makes them right. I see.


No, I learned respect a long time ago. That's something you haven't learned yet. It's not your fault though, you really do need to have an ounce of maturity to understand that respect is a two way street. You don't give any, you don't get any...you don't give any.

-mini

You're a crack up JACK!, go find someone else you don't know and talk SH!+! I'm really not interested in anything you have to write.

Of course not. Because you only wanted someone to agree with you. In the future, I'd recommend the local watering hole. The bartenders are going to tell you what you want to hear 99% of the time, which is what you want.

If you don't want to take any responsibility for your actions on the course (which are irrelevant to how they treat you when performing your job and how many loops you get) that's fine, but quit looking for sympathy.

If you didn't want input then you shouldn't have asked...


-mini

There are always two sides to every story. I'm guessing we would get a very different version from the super. But, I'll take the OP at his word and comment on it as written.

You were out of line hitting balls off the tee to warm up. And it's irrelevant that you were a caddy. It would be out of line for a member, the super, a guest, head pro, and whomever else. It's not an agregious offense punishable by death or anything, but it is out of line. Which leads to my next point. The super clearly overreacted. It should have been handled quietly and professionally and it appears neither of those happened. And once again, being a caddy is not relevant. He should have treated a caddy with the same respect as any other player.

I do have to agree with the fact that if they wanted to provide a place for you to warm up then they would have offered the range to you. All in all I think that the Super should have asked you to simply not do it agian. Its his course after all.

Maybe next time you can stop at a local driving range, just to aviod it all.

Thank you. You know, when I opened up to the community with the posting this is the kind of response I was looking for. Logical, positive and relavent. I may not agree with what you say, but at least your candor is appropriate. I understood the minute I left the course that I was guilty of wrongs, but I don't care who you are, what your popularity is or where you work, cursing and attacking anyone is out of line. Had I not been attacked with agression I most certainly would have reacted differently. In the end it was a major lesson learned.

My thoughts are you were in the wrong. You don't use the first tee to warm up by hitting practice shots. You may be a scratch golfer and can hit 9 irons without divots, but if everyone tried this, the tee box would be a mess. If he did not stop you, what is he supposed to say to a member who tries the same thing and takes a few divots when the member says "but you let the caddies hit warm up 9 irons on the first tee?"

He was a jerk and maybe it is a crappy place to work, but you were still in the wrong.

That is the best one I've heard this weekend! Thank you, sir, I'm going to use that sometime

I understand your point of view, thank you. Personally I'd love to see that Superintendent treat a member the way he treated me that day. That'd be a YouTube hit for ever!

+1

Sorry to the op but I'm with mini on this one, you were out of line and disrespectful, you ask for others thoughts and now that you have them you don't like it so your going to tell us off and being outnumbered doesn't make you wrong......

You should get that memeber that likes you to take like 20 practice shots and see what the super says lol

you forgot bug eyed and the sack of monkey s*** he is

Count me in with mini. I have NEVER seen anyone hit practice shots on the first tee. My guess is the superintendent was SHOCKED to see the OP doing this and simply overreacted.

What came first, the chicken or the egg??? If the OP doesn't hit practice shots from the 1st tee, then the superintendent has no reason to overreact, simple as that.

The super unnecessarily went off and acted like a bully - everyone agrees. He had reason to be mad but handled it poorly.

But think about this. You yourself stated that you committed a minor infraction with the 9 iron shots and you said something to the effect of "lesson learned". So I guess that his piss poor manner was effective , no ?

If I complained on a website or to my wife every time someone overreacted to something I did or said, I would drive myself nuts. Favoritism in the workplace ?!? Welcome to planet earth my friend; there's a 10$ cover and the drinks are watered down. Enjoy the show.

golow™

Your cover was only $10, thats not fair mine was $50. Someone must like you more than me, not to mention i wasnt even offered drinks.!!

Perhaps I am the only one who saw the original posters true request here. I believe that request was for you to post only if you agree with his childish reaction to the super's equally childish reaction to the breach of ettiquette displayed by the OP. Anyhow, good luck to you in finding a new job, and being in the golf business, let me give you a litte advice...

Golf jobs are hard to come by, so obey the rules, respect the course, and by all means, RESPECT THE GAME. Bragging about your handicap and then also bragging about a childish outburst are not acceptable. I agree with Mini on this one...you have some growing up to do. THe good things about mistakes is that you can learn from them. Also, please close the other thread where you are bashing Mini for being a hater...that too is childish.

Yeah, have to just say that not everyone candy coats things for you some agreed and some didnt, but dont expect everyone to hold your hand.

I do agree that the superintendent overreacted, but you shouldn't have been practicing off the tee in the first place. I know you didn't take a divot off the tee box, but the simple fact that you were hitting practice shots off the tee shouldn't have happened.

What if you did take a divot out by mistake on one of your shots? Then the super's reaction probably wouldn't have been as much of a shock, and this thread probably wouldn't even exist right now.

I have to agree with the rest of the posts who stated that hitting 9 irons off the first tee is plain wrong. The super was wrong to over react but two wrongs do not make a right. I am on the greens committee at my club. It is sometimes difficult to "coach" people to respect the course and remain cool headed but I try. As for 9 irons off the first tee, I got know problem with a 9 iron off the 1st tee as long as that is your first shot and then you proceed to that location to play your 2nd shot.

min-tour is 100% accurate on this one.

Go to the club next "Caddie Monday."

Ask the Superintendent if he'll hear your apology.

Look him in the eye.

Tell him you were wrong and ask him if there's anything you can do to make up for it. Do it.

Don't ask for or take back the job.

Shake his hand and leave.

Live your life having learned a lesson and regained your integrity.

Just wondering: Don't good players generally take divots with nine irons?

WW

Not necessarily. Some folks are just pickers.