Full Version: What is Equitable Stroke Control?
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Just like the title says what is it? Somebody referenced it in another post about a different subject and I am stumped!!! Todd
It is the USGA's way of not letting a disaster hole where you blow up ruin your score to the point of artificially inflating your handicap. In a roundabout way it theoretically stops sandbaggers from blowing up on purpose to post a high score.
Basically, for posting purposes (not scoring with your friends/others), it sets a maximum score you can take on any one hole based on your course handicap.
If you are a single digit handicap, you can't take more than a double bogey on any one hole when posting.
At 10 - 19, maximum score is 7
20 - 29, max is 8
30 - 39, max is 9
40 or more, max is 10
Basically, for posting purposes (not scoring with your friends/others), it sets a maximum score you can take on any one hole based on your course handicap.
If you are a single digit handicap, you can't take more than a double bogey on any one hole when posting.
At 10 - 19, maximum score is 7
20 - 29, max is 8
30 - 39, max is 9
40 or more, max is 10
ESC is in regard to your handicap (HCP). When you reach certain levels in your HCP, you are only allowed to post a certain number of strokes on any given hole. This is to prevent blow-up holes from inflating your HCP. For example, I play to about a 26 HCP right now. My ESC is an 8. I cannot post a score with any hole that is greater than 8. If I shoot a 10, I can still record it as 10 on my card, but when I put it in for my HCP, I have to knock it down to an 8.
http://www.usga.org/playing/handicaps/surv...sters/ESC_9.pdf
http://www.usga.org/playing/handicaps/surv...sters/ESC_9.pdf
When most of y'all say what you shot does that include ESC or the actual number of strokes? Todd
QUOTE(skinny99 @ Jun 20 2008, 02:03 PM) 
When most of y'all say what you shot does that include ESC or the actual number of strokes? Todd
It's pretty rare that I make anything more than a double anyway...
Now, that's not to say I'm not capable of putting up doubles in a hurry
Usually my ESC and my "real" score are the same. Only once or twice did I card a 9 (my ESC is 8). At that time, I'm not sure what I told people I shot. We're talking about a 1 stroke difference, though between the two scores.
QUOTE(skinny99 @ Jun 20 2008, 05:03 PM)
When most of y'all say what you shot does that include ESC or the actual number of strokes? Todd
Your actual number of strokes is what you shot. If you shot 110, but posted a 105 due to ESC, you still shot a 110.
I hate playing with people that pick up once they reach double bogey because "That's the highest I'm allowed to take", and then claim they shot 82. It's not the highest they're allowed to score, just the highest they can post. It's not the same thing.
QUOTE(krustyburger @ Jun 21 2008, 07:54 AM)
QUOTE(skinny99 @ Jun 20 2008, 05:03 PM)
When most of y'all say what you shot does that include ESC or the actual number of strokes? Todd
Your actual number of strokes is what you shot. If you shot 110, but posted a 105 due to ESC, you still shot a 110.
I hate playing with people that pick up once they reach double bogey because "That's the highest I'm allowed to take", and then claim they shot 82. It's not the highest they're allowed to score, just the highest they can post. It's not the same thing.
Ditto.. I get what they are doing but I've played with a guy when it's just the two of us and will limit his scores.. Over a beer after the round, he says he's happy with his score when I know it's 5-10 strokes higher..
Not a lot of "good" golfers will agree with me I'm sure... But I think ESC is very unfair to crappy golfers such as myself!
I mean, I get the concept of sandbagging, but what about a golfer who is just inconsistant?
I think my handicap is the limit 40.something, but unlike most people, I score everything except OB's to the rules. And the only reason I don't score OB's perfectly, is because it's kind of an unfair rule for weekend golfers. I mean, in a tourny you have fore caddies and tons of people that can see your ball and where it lands. Also, you could just go back to the tee if you found out you were OB. But that's just not practical on a muni course. So at this point, I have been adding an extra stroke to account for the distance penalty. But some have said I should be adding 3 ...one for OB and two for playing from the wrong area. Again, that doesn't seem super fair for most of us who don't have people watching their balls down the fairway. I mean, I hit provisionals 99% of the time when I think my ball could be out, but there are times when I just have no clue (especially when playing a course I have never played...or played much).
Anyway, my point is... I EARNED THAT 140... sure it's awful and why even have a handicap, but that's my score and that's golf. So if I shoot 12, 15, 11, 13 on 4 holes... well, I can't count 11 strokes and my score looks like a 129. Ok, am I sandbagging... no! I just suck. But I earned that sucky score.
Now, that being said, I'm fine with ESC and I will abide by it...I just don't think it's fair. It really rewards the consistant golfer. Also, it makes it hard for me and my friends to compete for money as I know I'm losing strokes. I mean, why would I bet (other than being sick in the head and love gambling) on myself when I know I'm starting by giving the other players strokes. If I shoot a 110, 120, 130, 140 for an average of a 125...but I can't really say that as I may have to lose 20 storkes off those scores so they look like a 110, 118, 123, 129 for an average of 120! So I'm starting off 5 strokes down and that's just to hit my ESC average...that doesn't take into account the fact that if they do better than their handicap that I have to keep pace.
Well, enough of my complaining... I just got my handicap last month and I was surprised by the whole ESC deal.
I mean, I get the concept of sandbagging, but what about a golfer who is just inconsistant?
I think my handicap is the limit 40.something, but unlike most people, I score everything except OB's to the rules. And the only reason I don't score OB's perfectly, is because it's kind of an unfair rule for weekend golfers. I mean, in a tourny you have fore caddies and tons of people that can see your ball and where it lands. Also, you could just go back to the tee if you found out you were OB. But that's just not practical on a muni course. So at this point, I have been adding an extra stroke to account for the distance penalty. But some have said I should be adding 3 ...one for OB and two for playing from the wrong area. Again, that doesn't seem super fair for most of us who don't have people watching their balls down the fairway. I mean, I hit provisionals 99% of the time when I think my ball could be out, but there are times when I just have no clue (especially when playing a course I have never played...or played much).
Anyway, my point is... I EARNED THAT 140... sure it's awful and why even have a handicap, but that's my score and that's golf. So if I shoot 12, 15, 11, 13 on 4 holes... well, I can't count 11 strokes and my score looks like a 129. Ok, am I sandbagging... no! I just suck. But I earned that sucky score.
Now, that being said, I'm fine with ESC and I will abide by it...I just don't think it's fair. It really rewards the consistant golfer. Also, it makes it hard for me and my friends to compete for money as I know I'm losing strokes. I mean, why would I bet (other than being sick in the head and love gambling) on myself when I know I'm starting by giving the other players strokes. If I shoot a 110, 120, 130, 140 for an average of a 125...but I can't really say that as I may have to lose 20 storkes off those scores so they look like a 110, 118, 123, 129 for an average of 120! So I'm starting off 5 strokes down and that's just to hit my ESC average...that doesn't take into account the fact that if they do better than their handicap that I have to keep pace.
Well, enough of my complaining... I just got my handicap last month and I was surprised by the whole ESC deal.
777, I wouldn't worry about it if I was you. I didn't worry about it when I was routinely scoring 110 to 130 a couple years ago. I wasn't keeping a handicap then, however. I didn't start keeping one until just recently when I started flirting with breaking 100 on a consistent basis. If you are worried about being perceived as a sandbagger, I think you are worrying about a non-issue. Your playing partners will know after the first few holes that you are a legitimate high handicapper.
As for your betting thrills, maybe you and your friends could work out betting handicaps for you. I am assuming that you bet among yourselves and not with other random people. Recognizing that your handicap is being exceptionally influenced by ESC and therefore puts your at a disadvantage, you could increase your handicap for betting purposes by the average difference between your ESC scores and the corresponding gross scores. In your example, you would increase your handicap by 5 strokes from a 40 to a 45.
As for your betting thrills, maybe you and your friends could work out betting handicaps for you. I am assuming that you bet among yourselves and not with other random people. Recognizing that your handicap is being exceptionally influenced by ESC and therefore puts your at a disadvantage, you could increase your handicap for betting purposes by the average difference between your ESC scores and the corresponding gross scores. In your example, you would increase your handicap by 5 strokes from a 40 to a 45.
QUOTE(777twist @ Jul 1 2008, 08:25 PM)
Not a lot of "good" golfers will agree with me I'm sure... But I think ESC is very unfair to crappy golfers such as myself!
I mean, I get the concept of sandbagging, but what about a golfer who is just inconsistant?
I think my handicap is the limit 40.something, but unlike most people, I score everything except OB's to the rules. And the only reason I don't score OB's perfectly, is because it's kind of an unfair rule for weekend golfers. I mean, in a tourny you have fore caddies and tons of people that can see your ball and where it lands. Also, you could just go back to the tee if you found out you were OB. But that's just not practical on a muni course. So at this point, I have been adding an extra stroke to account for the distance penalty. But some have said I should be adding 3 ...one for OB and two for playing from the wrong area. Again, that doesn't seem super fair for most of us who don't have people watching their balls down the fairway. I mean, I hit provisionals 99% of the time when I think my ball could be out, but there are times when I just have no clue (especially when playing a course I have never played...or played much).
Anyway, my point is... I EARNED THAT 140... sure it's awful and why even have a handicap, but that's my score and that's golf. So if I shoot 12, 15, 11, 13 on 4 holes... well, I can't count 11 strokes and my score looks like a 129. Ok, am I sandbagging... no! I just suck. But I earned that sucky score.
Now, that being said, I'm fine with ESC and I will abide by it...I just don't think it's fair. It really rewards the consistant golfer. Also, it makes it hard for me and my friends to compete for money as I know I'm losing strokes. I mean, why would I bet (other than being sick in the head and love gambling) on myself when I know I'm starting by giving the other players strokes. If I shoot a 110, 120, 130, 140 for an average of a 125...but I can't really say that as I may have to lose 20 storkes off those scores so they look like a 110, 118, 123, 129 for an average of 120! So I'm starting off 5 strokes down and that's just to hit my ESC average...that doesn't take into account the fact that if they do better than their handicap that I have to keep pace.
Well, enough of my complaining... I just got my handicap last month and I was surprised by the whole ESC deal.
I mean, I get the concept of sandbagging, but what about a golfer who is just inconsistant?
I think my handicap is the limit 40.something, but unlike most people, I score everything except OB's to the rules. And the only reason I don't score OB's perfectly, is because it's kind of an unfair rule for weekend golfers. I mean, in a tourny you have fore caddies and tons of people that can see your ball and where it lands. Also, you could just go back to the tee if you found out you were OB. But that's just not practical on a muni course. So at this point, I have been adding an extra stroke to account for the distance penalty. But some have said I should be adding 3 ...one for OB and two for playing from the wrong area. Again, that doesn't seem super fair for most of us who don't have people watching their balls down the fairway. I mean, I hit provisionals 99% of the time when I think my ball could be out, but there are times when I just have no clue (especially when playing a course I have never played...or played much).
Anyway, my point is... I EARNED THAT 140... sure it's awful and why even have a handicap, but that's my score and that's golf. So if I shoot 12, 15, 11, 13 on 4 holes... well, I can't count 11 strokes and my score looks like a 129. Ok, am I sandbagging... no! I just suck. But I earned that sucky score.
Now, that being said, I'm fine with ESC and I will abide by it...I just don't think it's fair. It really rewards the consistant golfer. Also, it makes it hard for me and my friends to compete for money as I know I'm losing strokes. I mean, why would I bet (other than being sick in the head and love gambling) on myself when I know I'm starting by giving the other players strokes. If I shoot a 110, 120, 130, 140 for an average of a 125...but I can't really say that as I may have to lose 20 storkes off those scores so they look like a 110, 118, 123, 129 for an average of 120! So I'm starting off 5 strokes down and that's just to hit my ESC average...that doesn't take into account the fact that if they do better than their handicap that I have to keep pace.
Well, enough of my complaining... I just got my handicap last month and I was surprised by the whole ESC deal.
If your average score is 120, then you are well above the maximum handicap anyway, so ESC isn't even coming into play for you.
In any case, your handicap isn't supposed to be your average, it's supposed to be your potential. Believe it or not, you have the potential to score a 10 or less on every hole, even if you haven't done it yet.
Also keep in mind that although you may be losing money now due to your handicap, once you start improving, you will be near impossible to beat. It's much easier to knock 5-10 strokes off of a 36 handicap than it is from a 15 handicap, and it takes a while for your handicap to adjust. So keep on improving, and you will soon be winning every week.
If you have no handicap, but want to start submitting scores towards one, do you fall in to the 40+ group until you have a handicap? Even if you know you'll be well below a 40 handicap?
I know in the long run, it won't matter. I'm just curious.
Edit. Found the answer in this thread http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=175262 which was right below this thread, doh.
I know in the long run, it won't matter. I'm just curious.
Edit. Found the answer in this thread http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=175262 which was right below this thread, doh.
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