What to do?, politely decline or play? Options

[lo-down]

So...I used to get the chance to play golf ALL the time...3-4 times a week, sometimes 36 holes a day. Since I've been out of college (2 years now) and have this thing called a job...I'm lucky to get out once a week.

There are some guys at my work...my bosses, who are nice guys, but they pick their favorites....Being the young guy in the office I, of course, want to put a good impression on with these guys and get in good with them as much as possible...

Now the delimma...I play to a 6 and when I get out to play I take it seriously because my rounds are so few and far between it seems. Well, my bosses have started to ask me to play with them...on a weekly basis...

Many would love this...but these guys are straight up HACKERS to the fullest term...no disrepect here...but they always ride (something I hate) and play the LONGEST rounds ever (sometimes up to 5.5 or 6 hours). They have no eitquette...just a lot of money and they think that takes them a long way on the course. They talk in my backswing, when I'm putting, etc. Trust me it's just bad...

They continually ask me for advice...which I give to my best ability, only out of respect though...mind you I am NOT a teacher and trust me...these swings make you cringe every time they take a hack.

I mean, I tell myself it's just golf and that I should take advantage of being the guy who gets invited to play with the bosses every week...but I'm starting to see a decline in my game...I get to the point where I cannot take my round serious as if I would playing with a few of my home town buddies.

Do I decline politely or play and suck it it...mind you-this round that I play with these guys means that I don't get the chance to play on other occasions due to being so busy with other things right now.

[markponi]

You have to play if it is your bosses. Seeing how good you are will get you a lot of attention in your office. If they do things that aren't kosher, make jokes about it. If these guys are real DBs, forget golf, quit your job and work for people who are less DBish. Also, if they are rich, are you getting to play nice courses?

And you don't have to play everytime. Alternate between them and your friends.

This post has been edited by markponi: Jun 11 2009, 11:35 AM

[Smooth spin scot...]

Do you have to commit to it weekly, or every now and then...If yes, then just go out and have fun. If it helps your career in anyway it could be a good thing. Maybe they will notice your etiquette, tips etc and it will make them better golfers. It could be worse...You could be sitting in a boardroom with these clowns.

[kitsoasis]

If they're nice guys but not very well behaved on the course, then I think it's not such a bad thing. Just take it as socialising first and golf second.

[lo-down]

I do play nice courses, some better than others...mostly on their dime...which makes it hard for me to go play by myself and play...

However, the few chances that I get home back to VA to play with my home town buds, I don't play nearly as well as I used too...so I just don't know how far to let it go before my game shows drastic signs of declining.

The guys aren't really D-Bags...I do work on a tradedesk, so it's pretty crass at times...

[Diesel]

i'd politely decline, cause it can't lead to anything except headaches... if they are as bad as you say, and you play to a 6 and take your game seriously, i wouldn't put myself through that heartache... especially a 5.5 hour round... no thanks...

[tpariff]

Play, and understand exactly what it is - business golf. There's a BIG difference between business golf and "real" golf (for lack of a better term). It all starts with your mindset. Don't get all pumped up about playing and don't act like it's a qualifier for the US Open. Just show up and hit a few warm up balls and a few putts. Enjoy their company and the opportunity to interact with them away from the office.

They probably want you to play so they can get free advice. That's a GOOD thing!

It's a hard thing to do. Trust me, I've been in the same situation whether it's one like yours or playing in a scramble with a bunch of 25 handicaps who hit it 210 on a good day. Just try to roll with it and enjoy the time outdoors.

Kevin

[BugsyinNC]

If they are DBs on the course they are probably DBs in business. I'd start looking for another job. Life is too short to work and play with people you don't like.

You have to play if it is your bosses. Seeing how good you are will get you a lot of attention in your office. If they do things that aren't kosher, make jokes about it. If these guys are real DBs, forget golf, quit your job and work for people who are less DBish. Also, if they are rich, are you getting to play nice courses?

And you don't have to play everytime. Alternate between them and your friends.

[tftimm]

I agree with the comment about being a good golfer at the office, it does help you and it will draw good attention. I play with some guys through work and I have learned to take it easy and have fun. I play in a group every other weekend or so and play for money. That is when I concentrate. Playing for the hell of it with the guys has helped my money games because I have learned how to really relax.

They have probably seen you at your best and worst. Hackers like to play with good golfers, watching you is entertainment for them. Crack jokes, have a beer with them, don't take it to seriously. They WANT you there and keep that in mind. Help them as best as you can, compliment them, don't be a show off, they will be impressed with EVERYTHING you do.

If you have the time, do it, relax, who cares if you shank it, talk in your backswing, walk through your line. They will appreciate you playing with them.

[DefConOne]

i echo what some of the others say. if they are nice fellow, who cares how they play? if they are db's than i wouldn't want to play with them.

[Large David Hamm...]

They do say you play to the level of your competition. But when you go from 4 rounds a week to 1, you'll have a hard time maintaining the same handicap, regardless of your index. To paraphrase the old cliche, "if you break 100 mind your game, break 80 and mind your business." Part of that is just, "welcome to working".

I'd be much more pissed about the etiquette and time. If they want advice, don't limit it to their hack swings...give 'em a little etiquette and pace advice, disguised as gentle ball-breaking. They're obviously receptive to your advice. As you know them better, finesse it a little...and enjoy the expensive courses.

If it's unbearable, join them less often...gently.

[Pepperturbo]

Interesting dilemma; I have to wonder about you; not in a bad way, just wonder about what your priorities are.

I get it, they are hacks… then consider this vantage point… I am President of a company. What would you do if the President invited you for a game of golf at his club, and the President played to 1.2 and two others playing are Presidents, and had similar skills; and you’re a “6”?

Would you accept? Would you be concerned about the level of our play? Would you be concerned about how you’d fit in or be seen at my club? Would you be concerned that we’re all Presidents and over fifty, and if invited enough times your handicap might be going up because we play them down, by all the rules, the tees are 7000yd 75/145 and we play for $$$? And, we like to talk trash and joke around too.

What’s most important – the manner in which colleagues see you and your career, or what happens to your “6”? Sounds like the whole process can have some subtle learning influences; and just maybe you’ll determine which direction your career is going and how important that career is verses a “6”.

This post has been edited by Pepperturbo: Jun 11 2009, 11:57 AM

[flaun]

I would suck it up and play. Golf is fun and you can play it any time. Work is important, especially in this economy. Sorry, but paying the bills is way more important than golf.

I would take advantage of this opportunity to learn to play business golf. Which includes schmoozing, and lots of conversation. You are not trying to shoot a low score, you are trying to build relationships that will carry you further in your career.

Also, use this as an opportunity to challenge yourself. Learn to play with the distractions. It will make you that much tougher of a competitor. If you can learn to tune out their poor golf manners, you will be a better player for it.

Would you rather be stuck in the office for long hours or outside playing a game? You are getting a leg up on those not playing golf with the bosses.

[Baxpin]

Interesting dilemma; I have to wonder about you; not in a bad way, just wonder about what your priorities are.

I get it, they are hacks… then consider this vantage point… I am President of a company. What would you do if the President invited you for a game of golf at his club, and the President played to 1.2 and two others playing are Presidents, and had similar skills; and you’re a “6”?

Would you accept? Would you be concerned about the level of our play? Would you be concerned about how you’d fit in or be seen at my club? Would you be concerned that we’re all Presidents and over fifty, and if invited enough times your handicap might be going up because we play them down, by all the rules, the tees are 7000yd 75/145 and we play for $$$? And, we like to talk trash and joke around too.

What’s most important – the manner in which colleagues see you and your career, or what happens to your “6”? Sounds like the whole process can have some subtle learning influences; and just maybe you’ll determine which direction your career is going and how important that career is verses a “6”.

My boss could play to a +3 as far as I'm concerned, but if he doesn't know how to behave on the course I'm out. Obviously it's different if he wants me to entertain guests on the course, or have a "business" round, but as far as joining their regular 4-some......count me out.

[tommyjewell-1994]

i would play with them. i mean, your job pretty much depends on the way you treat them, if you're nice enough. who knows, you might get promoted or something like that.

[Large David Hamm...]

PS- Phenomenal thread!! Good for everyone to read and think about! Kudos, OP. Good luck too. Just wanted to say that...love GolfWrx, for threads like this. Good stuff!

[lo-down]

wow...ask for advice and you shall receive...

I have no disrepect for these guys...and don't mind playing a round or two with them every so often...

However, I'm 23 years old and I understand the importance of real life and work and would never jeopordize my job/future...

I was more or less asking for advice...not really saying that my "6" as you like to call it is going to fluctuate. And yes my handicap is a 6...actually a 6.1 if you're asking...and this was not a way to show off that I'm a decent golfer...just a way to show the different range of golfers that these guys are...

For the guy who said welcome to the world of work...

I'm starting to realize that it's definitely not the college life!!!!!

[Pepperturbo]

If I invite an employee that plays golf to play with my friends and he declines for what ever the reason ... he would have declared his position regarding a few topics.

You've heard how someone plays 18 holes of golf is a reflection of how they handle life. Interesting - you'll work and take a paycheck from someone that you seemingly don't like, yet not play golf with him because you've decided he doesn't know how to behave on the golf course.

[Pure745]

Play with them for sure! The worst day on the golf course is better than the best day in an office (unless you're in sales an close a big deal).. maybe don't play with them weekly, but golfing is such a great networking tool.. I use it for business as well for my clients, its a great platform for young professionals to network w/ the big-wigs.

It could be worse, your freinds could be the DB's where you'd actually like playing w/ your bosses better.. that would suck.

[falken19150]

1000000% play with them. I'm speaking from personal experience in the corporate world:

1) This economy sucks - They will be less willing to fire one of their buddies as opposed to some joe schmo
2) Opportunity - One of these times they will invite you out and there will be clients involved. If you can establish a rapport with a client on the golf course it will make your job that much easier when you get back to the office.
3) $$$ - If you are that good then you should be able to take some money off these hacks. Set up some friendly games like WOLF or something like that. Give them strokes etc. Who cares, it will be fun to take some cash from them, but do it in a nice way.
4) Out of the office - If you can get out of the office to play golf then DO IT!

I never turn down an opportunity in life. You never know where things can go, whether its good or bad who cares. At least you gave it a shot and figured out something for yourself as opposed to letting life dictate your choices.

[howdyho]

Are you trying to be like Sergio Garcia and blaming everything else but yourself for not playing as well as you did before?

[Pepperturbo]

wow...ask for advice and you shall receive...

I have no disrepect for these guys...and don't mind playing a round or two with them every so often...

However, I'm 23 years old and I understand the importance of real life and work and would never jeopordize my job/future...

I was more or less asking for advice...not really saying that my "6" as you like to call it is going to fluctuate. And yes my handicap is a 6...actually a 6.1 if you're asking...and this was not a way to show off that I'm a decent golfer...just a way to show the different range of golfers that these guys are...

For the guy who said welcome to the world of work...

I'm starting to realize that it's definitely not the college life!!!!!

Please accept these poignant words of wisdom…

Do you think because these guys are obnoxious they'd never discover and read this board, moreover connect the dots … you're a trader of sorts, 23, 6 index and their 3 hack bosses that invite an underling to play with them from their office.

You say you'd never jeopordize your job/future. Let me ask this... what do you think they would do if they read your posts.

This post has been edited by Pepperturbo: Jun 11 2009, 12:37 PM

[CowtownTexas]

wow...ask for advice and you shall receive...

I have no disrepect for these guys...and don't mind playing a round or two with them every so often...

However, I'm 23 years old and I understand the importance of real life and work and would never jeopordize my job/future...

I was more or less asking for advice...not really saying that my "6" as you like to call it is going to fluctuate. And yes my handicap is a 6...actually a 6.1 if you're asking...and this was not a way to show off that I'm a decent golfer...just a way to show the different range of golfers that these guys are...

For the guy who said welcome to the world of work...

I'm starting to realize that it's definitely not the college life!!!!!

I have a few thoughts on this. The first would be that your game is suffering because you aren't playing much anymore, not because you're playing with bad players. Now, I can understand if their behavior on the course is leading to your bad play, but is it really that bad?

Playing golf with your boss isn't the same as your buddies and I can completely relate to that. I play alot of business golf, but I've started to use those rounds for practice. I do the same thing with scrambles. I'm typically one of the better players in the group, so I just find things to work on. It becomes about making the shot and not making a score. Might not work for you, but it works for me.

One other thing I think I should point out is that you might want to hide the fact that you're a trader from Fort Worth. You haven't lived here long (at least I take that from your post), but this is the worlds biggest small town. I know you're a trader, you're just out of college, 23, and you're from Virginia. With that info I could figure out who you work for in about 10 minutes and it's highly likely that I know your bosses. I wouldn't do such a thing, but you have to be a bit careful when you post stuff on here.

Since you're in Fort Worth and work on a trade desk, I'd imagine your bosses are members of country clubs since it's relatively cheap to join one here. I'd suggest you do the same. It'll help your game and give you an excuse to not play with your bosses assuming they are members of other clubs. An excuse like "I'd join you, but I've got so much invested at XCC that I feel like I need to use it". I used to use that excuse all the time with a boss I couldn't stand (had nothing to do with his golf) when I was your age. You can get a junior membership at most of the local clubs for a pretty low price. I know Colonial has a waitlist for juniors and that Shady Oaks isn't accepting applications, but I've heard that Ridglea and Mira Vista are running all kinds of specials both for juniors and resident members.

Lastly, if you think work has affected your game game, just wait for marriage and kids. My handicap was similar to yours when I was single, but marriaged got me up to a 10 and parenthood has taken me to 12. It's not bad though as I still get out 5-7 times a month, I just never practice.

This post has been edited by CowtownTexas: Jun 11 2009, 12:41 PM

[lo-down]

These guys aren't scum bags of the earth, Pepper...maybe I wasnt clear enough when I said eitquette...I meant GOLF etiquette...they're very nice guys, but lack golf eitquette...trust me I try my best to subtly try to give them advice on this...but for a 23 year old it is a little intimidated telling my SVP to not talk while somebody is swinging/putting....

I think that I'll definitely take the advice of the ones who say play on occassion and give it a run to see how it goes...

Sorry if this is a rant...I just played with them yesterday and experienced one of the 5 hour rounds on a wide open course, etc...so it's all new in my head. By no means am I trying to sound better than these guys...I was just a bad experience yesterday and I couldn't imagine that on a weekly basis. The main reason I asked this question was to more or less see what others would say and I appreciate all the responses...

Basically my delimma was do I sacrifice my 1 round of the week with the bosses, or do I venture elsewhere? I'm hoping that this isnt a weekly deal with the bosses, but it has been for the past 3 weeks and after each round they talk about the next...so we'll see.

Thanks again for the replies.

[lo-down]

Good advice Cowtown...

I know...just ranting about the whole situation because it's so fresh in my head...

I'm by no means trying to get on any sort of tour or play any major competition golf...I guess the 23 year old competitor in me wants to stay as good as possible for as long as possible...maybe it's just a pride thing...

Thanks again

[tjy355]

Ah... the proverbial rock and a hard place, and you sir, are stuck in between! The unfortunate reality is that your job could well be affected so you have to be quite careful how you approach it.

Probably not a good idea to just announce you will not be playing with them any longer. If you really can't stand them, you will need to make the break gradually.

On the other hand, you could parlay the experience into a better position. Sad to say but that is the way things work. I'm sure they like to play with you because you are the better golfer. As someone else pointed out, you can use that to help school them in better etiquette. Some bosses only like suck-ups but most managers appreciate someone who can take charge and give direction. Do it in the right way and it could be beneficial to your career.

[tpariff]

lo-down, it sounds like the rounds with the bosses are during the week. May I ask how this interferes with your "normal" rounds? Do you normally play during the week by taking days off? Or do you have a flexible schedule? Just asking because it seems to me the business golf should be extra since it's during the week. You should still be able to play golf on the weekends with your friends.

I do give you credit for posting this question and asking for advice. Most 23-year olds think they know everything and don't want advice from others. I was 23 once (15 years ago) and thought I had the world by the short hairs.

Kevin

[devlbasher]

wow...ask for advice and you shall receive...

I have no disrepect for these guys...and don't mind playing a round or two with them every so often...

However, I'm 23 years old and I understand the importance of real life and work and would never jeopordize my job/future...

I was more or less asking for advice...not really saying that my "6" as you like to call it is going to fluctuate. And yes my handicap is a 6...actually a 6.1 if you're asking...and this was not a way to show off that I'm a decent golfer...just a way to show the different range of golfers that these guys are...

For the guy who said welcome to the world of work...

I'm starting to realize that it's definitely not the college life!!!!!

Please accept these poignant words of wisdom…

Do you think because these guys are obnoxious they'd never discover and read this board, moreover connect the dots … you're a trader of sorts, 23, 6 index and their 3 hack bosses that invite an underling to play with them from their office.

You say you'd never jeopordize your job/future. Let me ask this... what do you think they would do if they read your posts.

Pepper...I agree with your first and last posts and think they are both good perspectives to have. The second post I'm not so sure about. I'm hoping you make allowances for someone that is unable to play with you when invited. If someone had a family vacation planned and you asked them to go play golf and they declined, that seems a reasonable reason to skip the outing, provided they convey their gratitude for the invitation.


as to the OP's question, I do have to echo the other posts advice. Its business. Its work. Don't look at it as golf, look at it as work on the golf course. Better than most work, but still work. It doesn't sound like they're bad guys by the things you've said, just uneducated as to the ettiquite of the game. Some other people have mentioned cracking jokes and stuff to give a reason to mention the ettiquitte...i'm not sure thats a good idea. It depends on your relationship with your boss and how easily they get embarrassed. if they seem open to it, then you might want to, but I'd tread lightly there...remember, its work, not golf.

oh, just to add, just saw cowtowns post below too, thats some good advice. to be fair to you, it seems like you like your bosses and haven't said anything bad about them personally, just their golf habits, but you just wanna be careful. all the best man!

[lo-down]

tpariff-

well my normal rounds are during the week...I'm in the process of a move, so my weekends are pretty full...along with travel/spending time with my fiancee.

I get off at 3, so that does allow me to get out right after work...I usually set up Wednesdays or Thurs as my days to play...I try to practice as much as I can on off days...

Thanks again for the advice... I definitely will use much of it.

[Pepperturbo]

After school I lived in NYC and my first job was a supervisor over P&S comparisons department in a large brokerage house. I know what high energy brokers and traders act like...

You have a lifetime to play good golf. Career and where it takes you should be your first priority. You can always get the index back later in life when you have more control over your career, more money and free time.

I can’t play my best golf but can post respectable scores in the mid 70's while playing with hacks and goof offs. You can do it to... Look upon it as a personal learning experience.

Every now and again I play golf for $$$ with a group of mid-hi "hackers" if you will; all good guys. They break all the rules of golf, and goof off, talk trash; and without thinking talk during my swing, putt, walk in my line, and the rounds are typically over 5hrs. Because I am the low index player 3 tee groups play off my ball; so I am the giver of way too many stokers. At first I struggled and paid out a lot of $$$, now I collect the winnings more then pay. I've come to look forward to those rounds and remind myself of the personal challenge, play good golf and still have fun. If I can't play golf to my standards, I can have fun.

[Pepperturbo]

wow...ask for advice and you shall receive...

I have no disrepect for these guys...and don't mind playing a round or two with them every so often...

However, I'm 23 years old and I understand the importance of real life and work and would never jeopordize my job/future...

I was more or less asking for advice...not really saying that my "6" as you like to call it is going to fluctuate. And yes my handicap is a 6...actually a 6.1 if you're asking...and this was not a way to show off that I'm a decent golfer...just a way to show the different range of golfers that these guys are...

For the guy who said welcome to the world of work...

I'm starting to realize that it's definitely not the college life!!!!!

Please accept these poignant words of wisdom…

Do you think because these guys are obnoxious they'd never discover and read this board, moreover connect the dots … you're a trader of sorts, 23, 6 index and their 3 hack bosses that invite an underling to play with them from their office.

You say you'd never jeopordize your job/future. Let me ask this... what do you think they would do if they read your posts.

Pepper...I agree with your first and last posts and think they are both good perspectives to have. The second post I'm not so sure about. I'm hoping you make allowances for someone that is unable to play with you when invited. If someone had a family vacation planned and you asked them to go play golf and they declined, that seems a reasonable reason to skip the outing, provided they convey their gratitude for the invitation.


as to the OP's question, I do have to echo the other posts advice. Its business. Its work. Don't look at it as golf, look at it as work on the golf course. Better than most work, but still work. It doesn't sound like they're bad guys by the things you've said, just uneducated as to the ettiquite of the game. Some other people have mentioned cracking jokes and stuff to give a reason to mention the ettiquitte...i'm not sure thats a good idea. It depends on your relationship with your boss and how easily they get embarrassed. if they seem open to it, then you might want to, but I'd tread lightly there...remember, its work, not golf.

oh, just to add, just saw cowtowns post below too, thats some good advice. to be fair to you, it seems like you like your bosses and haven't said anything bad about them personally, just their golf habits, but you just wanna be careful. all the best man!

I would NEVER fire or negatively categorize someone for rejecting an invite of golf if they had prior commitments; we all have those; but, at a certain juncture I will notice and review the big picture.

[midasmulligan200...]

Play, and understand exactly what it is - business golf. There's a BIG difference between business golf and "real" golf (for lack of a better term). It all starts with your mindset. Don't get all pumped up about playing and don't act like it's a qualifier for the US Open. Just show up and hit a few warm up balls and a few putts. Enjoy their company and the opportunity to interact with them away from the office.

They probably want you to play so they can get free advice. That's a GOOD thing!

It's a hard thing to do. Trust me, I've been in the same situation whether it's one like yours or playing in a scramble with a bunch of 25 handicaps who hit it 210 on a good day. Just try to roll with it and enjoy the time outdoors.

Kevin

YES. You're out of college now, it is good that you play to a 6, but "business golf" has almost nothing to do with "real" golf ... you have to seperate them in your mind.

I play both kinds ... I have for years. I run a corporation now, and have to play a lot of business golf, not only with clients, but I'll also sponsor entire tournaments at trade conferences.

Indeed, I use golf for all sorts of reasons ... for instance, give me 18 holes with someone, and I can tell you a lot about their personality. Great insight to have on clients ... and I know full well many of them are doing the same thing ... assessing.

I even often take new employees (or potential employees) out to play. Shows me a lot how they handle stress, and even more importantly, how well they adapt to social situations.

Long and the short of it is that what I'm trying to learn (about people) when I'm playing business golf with people has nothing at all to do with the sport of golf. Rather, a round of golf creates a very specific sort of social and business environment that a smart businessperson can take advantage of in a hundred different ways. (Probably why golf is so well known as a sport played by a suprisingly large number of people in big business).

From the perspective of "real" golf (i.e., golf as a sport you're good at), business golf probably seems like almost a drag. However, from the perspective of business ... business golf is much more difficult. In fact, it takes quite awhile to understand the nuances of how to best make use of the environment. The fact that you are actually good at the sport of golf is really just the 101 of business golf.

My first thought when I read your post was "Is it possible that this guy really doesn't understand what an incredible career opportunity he's been handed?" You're just starting your career ... and you've been offered continual, ongoing (pretty much weekly) access to the senior members of your company in a relaxed, social setting ... and you're troubled because your golf game is starting to suffer a little?

My friend, I'm really hoping your eyes have been opened a little by the others that have spoken in this thread. Time to get real about life. A major career gift has been dropped in your lap. Don't be fussing about the slightly distasteful wrapping it has come in, rather, fully understand your good fortune, and be creative about how best to make use of it ...

This post has been edited by midasmulligan2000: Jun 11 2009, 02:52 PM

[twgolf]

Not to beat a dead horse, but with today's economy and the jobless rate where it is, I would love for my bosses to ask me to play golf with them on a weekly basis. I don't care if they are hacks or not.

1. This would go a long way for your job security
2. Great way to build a relationship for your future and networking
3. It's free golf at nice courses
4. Don't know if you are married, but it is a great excuse to golf for the wife because it's job related!

[lo-down]

Excellent post midas...good eye opener...This 23 year old certainly has a new look at the whole situation...

Exactly what I was looking for when I posted the question. Thanks alot guys.

[Mr.B]

wow...ask for advice and you shall receive...

I have no disrepect for these guys...and don't mind playing a round or two with them every so often...

However, I'm 23 years old and I understand the importance of real life and work and would never jeopordize my job/future...

I was more or less asking for advice...not really saying that my "6" as you like to call it is going to fluctuate. And yes my handicap is a 6...actually a 6.1 if you're asking...and this was not a way to show off that I'm a decent golfer...just a way to show the different range of golfers that these guys are...

For the guy who said welcome to the world of work...

I'm starting to realize that it's definitely not the college life!!!!!

Please accept these poignant words of wisdom…

Do you think because these guys are obnoxious they'd never discover and read this board, moreover connect the dots … you're a trader of sorts, 23, 6 index and their 3 hack bosses that invite an underling to play with them from their office.

You say you'd never jeopordize your job/future. Let me ask this... what do you think they would do if they read your posts.

Those aren't poignant words of wisdom, you're jumping all over this kid for no good reason. He never said these bosses were obnoxious or anything similar.

Sounds like you're just the sort of 'boss' who expects everyone under him to show the correct amount of obeisance, nevermind their own ethos or preferences.

OP, if you're not enjoying these outings then don't go, it's that simple. If you only want to play with people who take the game seriously for al it's etiquettes and traditions, then that's what you should do.

You just have to weigh up the pros and cons of brown-nosing (business networking) versus your own standards.

I have more respect for the man who stands on his own two feet than the guy who goes just because he thinks he has to

[cloudlx]

I say play. I am in a different situation sort of, my bosses ask me to play all the time-but- I stink and they are pretty good. Well, I don't stink, I play to a 15 and these guys are easily 5 to scratch. They make me feel a little self conscious about my game. I play anyways, I figure they wouldn't keep asking me if they didn't like having me around.

[Señor Rafa]

Keep playing with them, you've already said you don't really mind their company and they don't annoy you. I've played with golfers before who are not particulary great, but they just like to have some fun playing golf - not take it so seriously like I do playing in tournaments etc...

Also, compromise with your personal playing time with friends and playing with your boss and co-workers. Don't feel you're entitled to play with them each time, just say you've got other things arranged that day/

[stage1350]

Play with them, and establish yourself as a good golfer as well as a polite individual. You might get lucky and have the "early weekend" round on a Friday after lunch and still be home by 6. Or get an invite to help entertain a client or be the "a" player for a charity scramble.

My executives do entertain clients as well as play in a group together. I always jump at the chance to fill out a foursome, especially if they want to happen during work hours.

[Alefty]

It wouldn't be a good idea to continually refuse the invitation! Just have fun with it. I.E, give them tips in their backswing and see if they keep talking through yours. Set a good example but give and take BS in equal amounts.

[dbren1]

So...I used to get the chance to play golf ALL the time...3-4 times a week, sometimes 36 holes a day. Since I've been out of college (2 years now) and have this thing called a job...I'm lucky to get out once a week.

There are some guys at my work...my bosses, who are nice guys, but they pick their favorites....Being the young guy in the office I, of course, want to put a good impression on with these guys and get in good with them as much as possible...

Now the delimma...I play to a 6 and when I get out to play I take it seriously because my rounds are so few and far between it seems. Well, my bosses have started to ask me to play with them...on a weekly basis...

Many would love this...but these guys are straight up HACKERS to the fullest term...no disrepect here...but they always ride (something I hate) and play the LONGEST rounds ever (sometimes up to 5.5 or 6 hours). They have no eitquette...just a lot of money and they think that takes them a long way on the course. They talk in my backswing, when I'm putting, etc. Trust me it's just bad...

They continually ask me for advice...which I give to my best ability, only out of respect though...mind you I am NOT a teacher and trust me...these swings make you cringe every time they take a hack.

I mean, I tell myself it's just golf and that I should take advantage of being the guy who gets invited to play with the bosses every week...but I'm starting to see a decline in my game...I get to the point where I cannot take my round serious as if I would playing with a few of my home town buddies.

Do I decline politely or play and suck it it...mind you-this round that I play with these guys means that I don't get the chance to play on other occasions due to being so busy with other things right now.

You played lots of golf in college and are frustrated that work stops you playing as much golf as you like? HELLO, WELCOME TO THE REAL WORLD! Pretty much everyone I know wants to play more golf but work/family gets in the way.

Sad fact. Money does take you a long way on the golf course, or pretty much wherever you want to go for that matter. Very little in today's society cannot be bought.

If I had an offer to spend 6hrs of work time a week playing golf with my boss, I'd do it. Being liked is never a bad thing.